[cowboymom]

It's a long way up there and it's not a straight shot-I wouldn't feel comfortable digging around much either.

You can give her a different abx, a cc of penicillin into the muscle for three days, IIRC, check that...

good illustration:

http://www.brooklynfeed.com/2009/08/egg-bound-day-5/

[RacetrackReject]

I believe there is a sticky on it at BYC, maybe in the emergencies forum. I know there is something you can do with oil, possibly feeding it to her.

I googled and read on the USDA site that the yolk is loaded with antibodies and boosts the immunity of chickens that are fed the yolk.

[rcloisonne]

An avian vet. By the time any bird shows signs of illness, they're usually very, very sick. Don't waste your time and money on vets who specialize in mammals.

[JB]

It's a long way up there and it's not a straight shot-I wouldn't feel comfortable digging around much either.

You can give her a different abx, a cc of penicillin into the muscle for three days, IIRC, check that...

good illustration:

http://www.brooklynfeed.com/2009/08/egg-bound-day-5/

if there's an egg there, it's *right* there, as in, if someone squeezed her, it would pop out. Truly, I need to get a picture loaded that I took the other night - it's like she has "egg butt" - all right there just begging to come out :|

I believe there is a sticky on it at BYC, maybe in the emergencies forum. I know there is something you can do with oil, possibly feeding it to her.

I googled and read on the USDA site that the yolk is loaded with antibodies and boosts the immunity of chickens that are fed the yolk.

Ah, I see - makes sense that cooking it would destroy some of that. I did end up giving her a raw yolk with olive oil tonight, but it was late enough that most of her active eating desire was closing down, though she did eat a bunch of seeds and a few black beetles I caught for her

An avian vet. By the time any bird shows signs of illness, they're usually very, very sick. Don't waste your time and money on vets who specialize in mammals.

Can't find an avian vet

And the more this goes on, I am thinking she's not really sick, just feeling "bad" as in uncomfortable. When food she likes is offered, she is all OVER it. I could offer her 20 crickets and she'd snap them all up.

[ldaziens]

Again - not a vet -

But, Have you given her calcium gluconate? Apparently, it is very important to get calcium into them. It's not difficult to give birds injections. I think you definitely want to get calcium into her as it effects the muscles and ability to contract -- see 2nd link below.

Aside from getting the calcium into her, my thought would be to have her soaking in warm water w/ epsom salt AS LONG AS possible without letting the water get cool -- I'd use something like a dutch oven sized pot where her vent and abdomen would be submerged.

Then, I'd very GENTLY & slowly syringe into the vent KY Jelly a little at a time. Maybe syringe a little, massage gently a little, syringe a little, massage gently, and so on. What you wouldn't want to do is push the egg further back in, but if you can gently work lubricant all the way around the egg, that would be good. Probably as much lubing as you can do as frequently as possible is better. That egg being stuck in there kind of backs up the whole works -- including other eggs "in route", so the sooner it's resolved, the better.

I'd be keeping her in a warm steamy bathroom. There are heating pads which can do moist heat, but you need to be so careful with those not to burn the bird (or human). You can fill a tube sock with beans or rice and heat it up in the microwave and then wrap a towel around it -- in this case a wet towel for warm heat. Just check the temp to be sure not to burn the bird.

And, I would feed her wet, smooth stuff - yogurt, egg yolks, and as much olive oil as possible for the next 2-3 days -- and crush up some tums into the mushy feed. I would not feed anything hard / dry, but I would put some vitamins in her water -- either the poultry stuff from the feed store or the pet bird vitamin drops from the pet store.

Here are some more ideas -
http://www.avianweb.com/eggbinding.html
http://www.avianweb.com/Prolapse.htm

lastly, you may want to try Just Answer for an Avian Vet. In my experience, it's hit or miss.

[JB]

Thank you ldaziens, that was very helpful.

How long can I safely feed her only wet mushy stuff before worrying about the lack of grit?

[cowboymom]

Longer than it will take to resolve this-if you're feeding her soft stuff she doesn't need the grit. Grit is basically teeth and if she's having soft food she doesn't really need it. Laying pellets have grit added so she's had it right up until last week.

If you can gently work your way up the vent with lube that's good-just remember the egg is in a very thin membrane tube, it's probably *right there* but you have to go the long way around, through the tube...

Poor thing!

[JB]

Thanks cowboymom

Poor thing is going to miss her crickets Do moths count as "soft food"?

[ldaziens]

I don't think you want to do the soft foods for a long period of time, because it's not really nutritionally balanced. I would hope that with some pretty much continuous soaking and lubing that this could be resolved within 24 - 48 hours. Beyond that, you'd probably want to make a wet mash / slurry w/ Layena w/ some added calcium and olive oil.

I would not give her any seeds or bugs of any kind until she passes a few eggs normally as I think seeds can be hard on them. Crushed mealworms moistened would be the only bug I would give and only if she didn't want to eat the Layena mash.

I am really hoping she passes that darn egg -- and a couple more -- and gets her system back on track.

[JB]

Thank you again. I'll certainly post any update worth posting, which I hope will be a good one *sigh*

[Zu Zu]

Jingles & AO continue for Cindy and her family ! no colosr available nor icons ``sigh ~

[Carolinadreamin']

JB, I know of an excellent avian vet, but she's about 4 hours from you.

[ThisTooShallPass]

.

[JB]

Thanks, at least maybe I can call one. All those are minimally 2 hours from me

[Zu Zu]

Saturday Jingles & AO for Cindy !~!

Jingle Jingle Jingle & AO ~ AO ~ AO ~ Always Optimistic ~

Come on Cindy ~~~ feel better soon !

[JB]

TSC has calcium gluconate 23%

Instructions I've found for IM birds is "calcium gluconate 1% solution 0.01 - 0.02 ml/g IM"

Someone check my math?

3lb bird (maybe only 2lb, but follow me) = 454gm x 3 = 1362gm * .01ml = 13.62mL.

But if I can only get 23%, that's .59mL correct? (13.62 / 23)

[Calamber]

TSC has calcium gluconate 23%

Instructions I've found for IM birds is "calcium gluconate 1% solution 0.01 - 0.02 ml/g IM"

Someone check my math?

3lb bird (maybe only 2lb, but follow me) = 454gm x 3 = 1362gm * .01ml = 13.62mL.

But if I can only get 23%, that's .59mL correct? (13.62 / 23)

If those are the percentages in the CG and the bird weight is 3 lb, yes you are right. Do not know about overdosing/risks though.

[JB]

Well, .5mL injected tonight, into hopefully a muscle (shocked at how little there is now ) and hopefully it will do some good. I hope I don't go back down there in a couple hours and find her dead

I figured given the .01-.02ml/g range, that the amount I gave wasn't close to an OD. I just don't know what it would do if I got it in a really bad spot.

OTOH, I sure did get a good lesson in chicken anatomy! Felt all bones, felt a nice soft squishy crop, all that fun stuff

[ldaziens]

I am hoping chicken feels better or goes peacefully in the night -- I'm sorry you are going through this.

[JB]

Well, neither happened

Guess I'll call another avian vet in that list above and see what else they might recommend. It sounds like she really needs an experienced fingers up there to either get "it" out, whatever "it" is, or whatever the horrible alternative is.