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  1. #101
    Join Date
    Jan. 4, 2007
    Location
    TX
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    40,083

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    Quote Originally Posted by robinb View Post
    I'm down in Olympia, have a couple of Arabians too. I am concerned regarding the pictures of the horses in decent weight and clean horses with clean hooves and legs coming off the trailers. That does not add up if those horses were locked in filthy stalls for months on end.

    Just read in one of the media reports that the horses are being housed at Frontier Park.
    http://www.co.pierce.wa.us/pc/abtus/...ks/pkfront.htm

    Since that is a public park people should be able to view them. There should be some tell-tale signs like mud fever type scabs on especially the white legs if they were in wet mucky conditions for any period of time.

    The libs are in bed with the HSUS/PETA types and get lots of political donations from them.
    The HSUS has fingers in many pies lately.
    They found one rancher that would sue the cattlemen's association board for some slight over 20+ years ago and are helping bankroll his lawsuit.
    The same with the pork board, they found some disgruntled pig farmer that they are also helping pay for his lawsuit.

    It is all harassment, making those sued use resources fighting the lawsuits, while the HSUS keeps picking wherever they can at our rights to use animals.

    I sure hope this is one situation that, if they are involved, someone can stop them, not that it will do the rest of us any good, they have become too big, with the help of the clueless that are still not wanting to believe who they are supporting.
    Or, like that rancher and pig farmer, or some against horse slaughter here, are mercenary, will align themselves blindly with whoever will help them fight for their own cause of the moment they picked up, even if those groups offering help, in principle, are against what they really believe.

    Any time there are animal rights groups involved, there is more to the story than is evident and much we will never know.



  2. #102
    Join Date
    Mar. 4, 2012
    Posts
    43

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    Quote Originally Posted by twotrudoc View Post
    Have we met, Robin? I'm usually at the shows and know the Oly folks like Judy J, Eric & the Eros boys, even Joyce T who is closer to Yelm though.

    I'm tempted to just run up to the park (I'm right off Yelm Highway/McKenna Tanniwax Highway area.). I really do need to get my Accounting and Econ homework done though.
    Just sent you a PM. it's been over 12 years since I've done any showing. Have a young mare that I am going to get out some next year. I'm on the west side of Olympia.



  3. #103
    Join Date
    Jun. 19, 2011
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    2,874

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluey View Post
    If any of that can be proven, go to the press with it and have them check this out, as tampering with the evidence.
    If that is true, I hope some heads will roll from this set up of the doctor, if he is guilty or not.
    That is not the way to go about charging anyone!

    If you don't have proof of what you write and there was abuse there, then, well, you may be next in line, after the doctor, for presenting false accusations.
    My information was rather generic as it came from a newpaper man who is working on the story. He would not give me exact names did he did call me to ask if floating teeth was a proper term...what was the navicular function etc..I think he was double checking the information given to him by the vet.

    He also made comment that the water going into the aisle was too clean ...also...he thought that if ALL of the horses were locked away..how were the aisle ways so very clean..shouldn't there be clumps of dirty stall droppings coming off the legs, stomachs and hooves? According to him none of the asile ways were swept so there was NO debris.



  4. #104
    Join Date
    Dec. 4, 2005
    Location
    washington state
    Posts
    6,713

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    Quote Originally Posted by robinb View Post
    Just sent you a PM. it's been over 12 years since I've done any showing. Have a young mare that I am going to get out some next year. I'm on the west side of Olympia.
    PM'd ya back.

    Hope to see ya at the shows! Heritage creeps up really fast in Monroe in March! One trainer who actually usually braids has me braid there because it is so damp and cold she doesn't want to get out of bed LOL!!

    Cascade is at the Tacoma Unit, I'm going to volunteer for that one. That's in May Of course, Daffodil Spring Show at Puyallup is still the biggest and fanciest.
    The Knotted Pony

    Proud and upstanding member of the Snort and Blow Clique.



  5. #105
    Join Date
    Mar. 4, 2012
    Posts
    43



  6. #106
    Join Date
    Feb. 6, 2003
    Location
    NorthEast
    Posts
    24,477

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    Whoa...and they thought there was some deep shite in the barn.

    Looks like some deep shite of epic proportions for the doctor and his wife.
    You jump in the saddle,
    Hold onto the bridle!
    Jump in the line!
    ...Belefonte



  7. #107
    Join Date
    Dec. 31, 2000
    Location
    El Paso, TX
    Posts
    12,260

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fairfax View Post
    Also...broken record here...they do NOT usually seize horses from POOR PEOPLE...they try keep them on their land...and they drag their heels. These were gone in a nano second to the fairgrounds and they are already quoting how much work, feed, money this is going to cost THAT THEY ARE GOING TO HAVE TO RECLAIM...
    Not exactly true...Pinto Piaffe didn't have money...CCH doesn't have money...for just 2 examples from this BB.



  8. #108
    Join Date
    Sep. 7, 2009
    Location
    Lexington, KY
    Posts
    16,776

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    So the good doctor was operating a pill mill. Interesting.

    So Fairfax, are you trying to say that all seizures are wrong? Or just if it's Arabians?
    "We can judge the heart of a man by his treatment of animals." ~Immanuel Kant



  9. #109
    Join Date
    Jun. 27, 2005
    Location
    KY
    Posts
    4,558

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    Quote Originally Posted by LauraKY View Post
    So Fairfax, are you trying to say that all seizures are wrong? Or just if it's Arabians?

    FF hasn't said anything about the two dozen arabians ARM just got from TN.

    Oh wait, isn't ARM one of FF's pet rescues?

    ************************
    \"Horses lend us the wings we lack\"



  10. #110
    Join Date
    Jun. 19, 2011
    Posts
    2,874

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    The seizures were trumped up and were wrong. If the D.E.A. has evidence of pill pushing and is going to make arrests for the trafficing, then they should say the impounding of the horses is within their jurisdiction.

    For them to falsify or stage the stalls, soak them with water, and proclaim the horses have not been outside for months is wrong.

    It sends the wrong message to AC and other police officers who are trying to do their job correctly and it also makes sure the courts are very dubious about any seizures.

    When a seizure is falsified and the horses are put at additional rist..then it is wrong.

    This is from a person who has examined "the evidence"

    Only a couple of thin horses and that looks like age. No evidence of standing in muck for months on end, legs and feet clean, even the white legs. The county is going to have some sick horses if they don't bed those stalls and give them hay and water. Looks like they are on sand and we know what that does when digested

    This is what the county said:

    In addition, most of the horses seemed to live their entire lives inside their stall, with no evidence of any outdoor pastures for grazing or paddocks for exercise.
    As a result, Anderson said the horses were unfamiliar with being handled by humans and were very skittish and dangerous. Hence, the transfer of the 39 to county custody took two days and required a full crew of animal control officers.


    Their Vet has disclaimed that as has the farrier and others who have been on the farm...but they continue with their stories as it impacts the public.

    Skittish and dangerous however ALL of the horses loaded into trailers or were herded into trucks.

    Here is the NEW Headline from the Mountain News Washington:

    Seizure of 39 horses in Graham reveals massive DEA drug investigation

    Nevertheless, Dr. Diller and his wife have not been charged in any criminal activity – neither for the alleged horse abuse nor the DEA’s drug allegations.

    We know police have planted evidence in other cases..we know police or government officials have falsified reports (we currently have a case back east that is going to rock the A/C/Rescue industry due to a falsified report submitted to the police) etc.



    Anderson acknowledged that many of the seized horses appear well-fed and that food and water was readily available in the Diller barns.

    However, the facilities were unsanitary, with urine-soaked straw and feces compacted up to a foot-thick in some stalls. Further, many of the horses were kept in pitch-black conditions without any light or ventilation.


    Anderson has REFUSED to answer the claim that the horses were put into the stalls prior to the "investigation". All comments were refused due to "ongoing D.E.A. investigations". Not due to animal cruelty.

    Those who have seen a couple of the horses claimed to have been in the stalls for months said NOPE...could not have happened. Hoof care, although not "perfect" does not reflect the resulting thrust and other aliaments that would have existed had the horses been in those conditions for months on end.

    Here is another statement:

    Anderson has taken personal charge of the rescue operation and seems determined to avoid the disappointments that occurred in the county’s last large-scale horse rescue – the Darlene Wilson 40-horse episode of 2010. In this occurrence, the PCAC tried to partner with a local equine rescue organization that ultimately found itself without sufficient resources to properly care for its initial installment of twenty horses. Ultimately, the rescue group had to euthanize about ten of the horses, and eventually the PCAC had to intervene and take a handful of horses. Finally, the remaining ten horses were court –ordered to be sold.

    Sounds reasonable until a person is told the euthanization was: the horses were led up the road and SHOT.. sure..shot is euthanization but they do not want the public to read anything except "a caring group"

    Here is another tidbit I had reported BEFORE this news article:

    Such happenstance reflects the unusual mandate for the Auditor’s Office. Typically, a county auditor handles elections, real estate documentation and public licenses, such as deeds and passports. Historically, the Humane Society has handled animal control issues, especially the licensing of pets, but now the Pierce County Auditor has assumed responsibility for animal control. .


    Of course to the COTH posters who were accusing me of conspiracy...they will now just disappear as they always do...Facts ALWAYS seem to interfer with what they have to say.

    Now, Ms. Anderson and the county are enmeshed in a complex law enforcement case than spans across the accusations of animal abuse to murder, and yet, no one is charged at present with any criminal wrong-doing.

    Past experience has demonstrated that the horse abuse case will be plea bargained out and that is what the D.E.A. wants. If that case was to go to trial, it would discount the D.E.A. and jeopardize their drug case



  11. #111
    Join Date
    Jun. 19, 2011
    Posts
    2,874

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    Quote Originally Posted by luvmytbs View Post
    FF hasn't said anything about the two dozen arabians ARM just got from TN.

    Oh wait, isn't ARM one of FF's pet rescues?
    So glad you became one of my little groupies

    Don't know anything about 1 dozen Arabs from Tennessee and as I mentioned before..I have no evidence they are involved in this case so WHAT IS YOUR POINT?

    This is the definition of Groupie :

    Obsessive research and knowledge concerning the "likes/dislikes," genevation, habits, pet peeves, and other extraneous trivia concerning the idol are attributes shared among this stereotypical group of fans. This overly exhuberant fan exhibits traits such as promiscuity, daring and often irrational behavior, as well as, loss of self control when exposed to the object of their obsessions.


    I also like them to be vacuous..guess that is why I keep a few of you around.



  12. #112
    Join Date
    May. 5, 2010
    Posts
    11

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    I'm reading and talking to friends still in Pierce County and I'm getting sicker by the minute. What really hurts is that I know a number of past PCAC officers who have tried repeatedly to do the right thing. Its all local politics (this means politicians and local fat cats too). This deal has clearly degenerated as per:

    http://www.capitalpress.com/content/...tethru-0928112

    Julie Anderson knows nothing about horses, nothing about law enforcement, nothing about Animal Control. She has friends in the horse business with their own agendas which does not include the welfare of these horses.

    I can't imagine giving the county any money to support this kind of action.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  13. #113
    Join Date
    Aug. 29, 2010
    Location
    Vancouver Island, BC
    Posts
    86

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fairfax View Post
    The seizures were trumped up and were wrong. If the D.E.A. has evidence of pill pushing and is going to make arrests for the trafficing, then they should say the impounding of the horses is within their jurisdiction.

    For them to falsify or stage the stalls, soak them with water, and proclaim the horses have not been outside for months is wrong.

    It sends the wrong message to AC and other police officers who are trying to do their job correctly and it also makes sure the courts are very dubious about any seizures.

    When a seizure is falsified and the horses are put at additional rist..then it is wrong.

    This is from a person who has examined "the evidence"

    Only a couple of thin horses and that looks like age. No evidence of standing in muck for months on end, legs and feet clean, even the white legs. The county is going to have some sick horses if they don't bed those stalls and give them hay and water. Looks like they are on sand and we know what that does when digested

    This is what the county said:

    In addition, most of the horses seemed to live their entire lives inside their stall, with no evidence of any outdoor pastures for grazing or paddocks for exercise.
    As a result, Anderson said the horses were unfamiliar with being handled by humans and were very skittish and dangerous. Hence, the transfer of the 39 to county custody took two days and required a full crew of animal control officers.


    Their Vet has disclaimed that as has the farrier and others who have been on the farm...but they continue with their stories as it impacts the public.

    Skittish and dangerous however ALL of the horses loaded into trailers or were herded into trucks.

    Here is the NEW Headline from the Mountain News Washington:

    Seizure of 39 horses in Graham reveals massive DEA drug investigation

    Nevertheless, Dr. Diller and his wife have not been charged in any criminal activity – neither for the alleged horse abuse nor the DEA’s drug allegations.

    We know police have planted evidence in other cases..we know police or government officials have falsified reports (we currently have a case back east that is going to rock the A/C/Rescue industry due to a falsified report submitted to the police) etc.



    Anderson acknowledged that many of the seized horses appear well-fed and that food and water was readily available in the Diller barns.

    However, the facilities were unsanitary, with urine-soaked straw and feces compacted up to a foot-thick in some stalls. Further, many of the horses were kept in pitch-black conditions without any light or ventilation.


    Anderson has REFUSED to answer the claim that the horses were put into the stalls prior to the "investigation". All comments were refused due to "ongoing D.E.A. investigations". Not due to animal cruelty.

    Those who have seen a couple of the horses claimed to have been in the stalls for months said NOPE...could not have happened. Hoof care, although not "perfect" does not reflect the resulting thrust and other aliaments that would have existed had the horses been in those conditions for months on end.

    Here is another statement:

    Anderson has taken personal charge of the rescue operation and seems determined to avoid the disappointments that occurred in the county’s last large-scale horse rescue – the Darlene Wilson 40-horse episode of 2010. In this occurrence, the PCAC tried to partner with a local equine rescue organization that ultimately found itself without sufficient resources to properly care for its initial installment of twenty horses. Ultimately, the rescue group had to euthanize about ten of the horses, and eventually the PCAC had to intervene and take a handful of horses. Finally, the remaining ten horses were court –ordered to be sold.

    Sounds reasonable until a person is told the euthanization was: the horses were led up the road and SHOT.. sure..shot is euthanization but they do not want the public to read anything except "a caring group"

    Here is another tidbit I had reported BEFORE this news article:

    Such happenstance reflects the unusual mandate for the Auditor’s Office. Typically, a county auditor handles elections, real estate documentation and public licenses, such as deeds and passports. Historically, the Humane Society has handled animal control issues, especially the licensing of pets, but now the Pierce County Auditor has assumed responsibility for animal control. .


    Of course to the COTH posters who were accusing me of conspiracy...they will now just disappear as they always do...Facts ALWAYS seem to interfer with what they have to say.

    Now, Ms. Anderson and the county are enmeshed in a complex law enforcement case than spans across the accusations of animal abuse to murder, and yet, no one is charged at present with any criminal wrong-doing.

    Past experience has demonstrated that the horse abuse case will be plea bargained out and that is what the D.E.A. wants. If that case was to go to trial, it would discount the D.E.A. and jeopardize their drug case
    could you please expain (serious question), how a plea on a horse abuse case, would affect the drug mill/trafficking case?

    and IF they staged/put the horses in the barn the night before, when they came with a warrant, why did the owner not turn the horses back out where they belonged that evening or the following morning? or were they and any associates in custody overnight?

    does anyone have info on their breeding history? not that it's relevent, i'm just curious to know if they had foals.



  14. #114
    Join Date
    Jun. 19, 2011
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    2,874

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    Quote Originally Posted by Regala View Post
    could you please expain (serious question), how a plea on a horse abuse case, would affect the drug mill/trafficking case?

    and IF they staged/put the horses in the barn the night before, when they came with a warrant, why did the owner not turn the horses back out where they belonged that evening or the following morning? or were they and any associates in custody overnight?

    does anyone have info on their breeding history? not that it's relevent, i'm just curious to know if they had foals.
    There are NO foals and no youngsters/

    We do have some major concerns. The horses are currently kept on SAND floor with no bedding. The quality of the hay, of which a sample has been acquired is of VERY LOW quality..equivalent to what most of us would bed horses in. This will have a profound effect on their weight and especially the old timers. The Doc and his wife had barrels of grain and high quality hay on their property.

    We have every reason to believe they will "starve" these individuals , The county is providing the hay and equine quality care...of which they are not qualified .

    I am hoping that the pictures taken of the horses in their confinement will be published by a local newspaper. Documentation is needed.

    I have heard about a possible exchange IF the property is seized but at the current time it is only "theory".

    Many times D.E.A. or other agencies will seize children telling the parents if they do not cooperate they will be TAKEN AWAY FOREVER....I don't know...but history does repeat itself on a regular basis. Rarely is it about ... the horse



  15. #115
    Join Date
    Aug. 29, 2010
    Location
    Vancouver Island, BC
    Posts
    86

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    you've heard about a possible exchange of what if the property was seized? sorry, but you're being a bit cryptic.

    again, why, if the DEA "staged" this, did the owners not put the horses back where they were normally kept? why did they leave them overnight and the next day in a flooded, filthy barn?

    where they are housed now looks like they have bedding. hope they are getting proper care.

    i can't see them starving the horses as "evidence" to prove neglect, as the charges aren't related to lack of feed.



  16. #116
    Join Date
    Jun. 30, 2011
    Posts
    483

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    Regala,
    Obviously, you are trying to use reason to make this situation make sense. The problem is that we have documented too many various seizures where actions were completely unreasonable.
    For instance, as Fairfax has mentioned, the Vess case showed that the 'rescuers' purposely withheld feed in an attempt to 'preserve the evidence' which resulted in additional weight loss.
    During transport, we documented that Berryletta V. (in her upper 20's) was loaded into a 4-horse trailer with FOUR young colts during a 6-degree night and driven 25 miles to a fairground in the next county. Of course, she slipped on the unpadded floor and went down. The 'rescuers' heard and felt the mare fall, but kept trucking. When they reached their destination, Berryletta V., was mortally wounded by being trampled by the 4 colts the whole way there. And of course, she was dragged out and left to suffer for hours until a vet was finally called in the morning to end her suffering.
    In seizure after seizure, we are seeing the 'rescuers' run to the media screaming 'this is the largest seizure in the history of _____' It is as if they are looking for the "next big seizure" and are willing to do anything to find it.
    Has anyone questioned how the auditor has come up with that $40,000 figure so quickly? What is she basing that on?
    Who knows whether the doctor was running a pill mill. With the Feds involved, anything is possible. But does anyone believe that once the DEA notified the locals about these horses, they weren't going to seize them no matter what? Anderson had little choice but to go with the flow and hope for the best. Don't disregard the info from the vet and farrier. These horses would never have been seized if not for the DEA who undoubtedly made their desires very clear to Anderson. They will impact a suspect in any way they can to force a plea bargain and avoid a trial. Nearly all of the 'pill mill' cases are being plea-bargained. It is amazing how much damage this case has caused and nobody has even been charged with anything yet!



  17. #117
    Join Date
    Jun. 19, 2011
    Posts
    2,874

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    I heard this morning that the county has made offers on the property previously to no avail. They would like to acquire it for a "waste" disposale area for the county.

    Their offers have been rebuffed by the Dr and his wife.

    Is this relevant? Who knows. But from all accounts, Anderson, from the county has NO equine experience nor do the "other professionals" that transported the horses.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  18. #118
    Join Date
    Aug. 29, 2010
    Location
    Vancouver Island, BC
    Posts
    86

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    fairfax, you say this was "staged" and the dea put the horses in the filthy, flooded barn. why did the owners leave them overnight and the next day, rather than return the horses to their normal stalls/barn/pasture?



  19. #119
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    Jun. 19, 2011
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    When the law officials tell you to stay away from your barn or you will be arrested and put in jail, you do that.

    That is the M/O for police, A/c, Rescues...heck..on the Vess case we even had an off duty police officer telling Robin he would drag her ass to jail if she called ANYONE.

    He has since been fired...but that is what these people have been allowed to get away with.



  20. #120
    Join Date
    Sep. 11, 2008
    Location
    Snohomish, WA
    Posts
    3,891

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    100 acre parcel in Graham is .........becoming rarer.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fairfax View Post
    I heard this morning that the county has made offers on the property previously to no avail. They would like to acquire it for a "waste" disposale area for the county.

    Their offers have been rebuffed by the Dr and his wife.

    Is this relevant? Who knows. But from all accounts, Anderson, from the county has NO equine experience nor do the "other professionals" that transported the horses.



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