The Chronicle of the Horse
MagazineNewsHorse SportsHorse CareCOTH StoreVoicesThe Chronicle UntackedDirectoriesMarketplaceDates & Results
 
Page 1 of 8 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 145
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan. 26, 2012
    Posts
    291

    Default Horse Boy Dressage - What??

    You know, I think that equine therapy for disabled kids is great, but this guy is a marketing fool going crazy on the success of his book and documentary "The Horse Boy." He's teaching grand prix movements and airs above ground to grade quarter horses and formerly lame warmbloods of uncertain origin? From seeing him ride in the documentary, ug. [edit] He's capable of being the equivalent of a Spanish Riding School head rider in four years? [edit] He should be shown to what he is, but then one would be accused of not being sensitive to the plight of the disabled.

    I'm sorry, but this man has really gotten my ire up. I'm sorry. I feel sorry for these horses, and the uneducated who donate.

    https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphot...58938905_n.jpg
    https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphot...42046638_o.jpg
    http://www.horseboyworld.com/about/our-horses.html
    http://www.horseboyworld.com/about/trainers-team.html
    https://www.facebook.com/horseboyworld/photos_stream
    Last edited by Moderator 1; Sep. 29, 2012 at 03:00 PM.



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Apr. 21, 2008
    Location
    Somewhere in Texas YEEHAW!
    Posts
    850

    Default

    Although I agree the whole thing looks ridiculous, why are you so offended that he is using grade or unpedigreed horses (and FORMERLY lame? so what?) horses for doing dressage? I had no idea that only Warmbloods of the highest pedigree are allowed to do dressage higher than intro level!
    OTTB CONNECT
    FB group for all things related to non racing Thoroughbreds.. Click here to join ~~~> OTTB CONNECT



  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan. 6, 2011
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    1,329

    Default

    [edit] The website is killing me from the descriptions of the people and horses. Coolest person to walk this planet? Kill me now please.

    Great they are helping kids. Kudos to them.

    What is this horse boy crap anrways?
    Last edited by Moderator 1; Sep. 29, 2012 at 02:55 PM.
    I am on my phone 90% of the time. Please ignore typos, misplaced lower case letters, and the random word butchered by autocowreck.




  4. #4
    Join Date
    Oct. 10, 2007
    Location
    down south
    Posts
    5,060

    Default

    Done
    Last edited by rabicon; Oct. 10, 2012 at 07:56 AM.
    Horses aren't our whole life, but makes our life whole



  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb. 18, 2012
    Location
    knee deep in Oregon mud
    Posts
    659

    Default

    I admit that I have never heard of this, and I didn't exactly scour the website, but where does it make mention that the quarter horses are grade? Nowhere does it say that they are unregistered, and heck, even if they are grade at least they have some training on them. I know of more than a few registered animals that you can't put intermediates on, let alone beginners or the developmentaly disabled.

    What was killing me is that in a lot of their pictures there were kids riding without helmets. I mean jeez, these kids are already going to have a hard enough time dealing with autism, so lets add the possibility of a traumatic brain injury to the mix.
    It is only through labor and painful effort, by grim energy and resolute courage, that we move on to better things.
    Theodore Roosevelt



  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jan. 30, 2010
    Location
    Alberta
    Posts
    3,625

    Default

    Having done some intro lessons to autistic kids, I think this program could be great for the kids...and the parents. I also understand why some may not be wearing helmets; their tactile senses vary and it can be hard to convince some of them to do some things (such as wear riding helmets).

    I didn't really understand the facebook picture with the two girls laying down though. Maybe we are missing something from it?

    [edit]
    Last edited by Moderator 1; Sep. 29, 2012 at 03:00 PM.



  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jan. 26, 2012
    Posts
    291

    Default

    I wrote a really long response on my phone, which died right before I was about to send.

    I'm sorry about the "grade" designation. I've been irritated. What I meant was that most quarter horses or QHx or thoroughbreds, for that matter, don't have the conformation for the maximum collection that grand prix and haute ecole requires.

    The man, the horse boy's father, is training horses to grand prix and haute ecole movements? He hardly has the collective wisdom of centuries as the Spanish Riding school top riders do. On the facebook page, there is a picture of a woman with an insecure seat doing a levade (sort of) on a 17 hand PRE - which he notes has a swayback. Doing haute ecole movements with a conformationally disabled horse? Really?

    Riding double doing tempi changes?

    Kids riding double with no helmets next a kid jumping on a trampoline.
    http://www.horseboyworld.com/images/...1equipment.jpg

    Canter in place, controversial in itself, with the added unbalancing effect of a second person, albeit a child? How fair is that to the horse?
    http://www.horseboyworld.com/images/...collection.jpg

    Public outing, putting what seems like members of the public on these horses, riding double with clogs and no helmets.
    https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphot...98396865_n.jpg
    Oh, and side reins (Vienna reins) attached to the top ring of a pelham?

    Their version of the training pyramid:
    2 weeks on rhythm
    Week 3 - Contact
    Week 4 - Suppleness

    I emailed back and forth to Rupert right after I read the book about 4 years ago. From watching the film, he is a competent seat of the pants rider, but not educated. His farm, according to him was in the works then, and he didn't have horses in haute ecole training then. Nor did his website indicate then that he did. I really think he is a sham. I feel back for parents desperate from something to help their autistic kids connect with the world. People donate money. People come to them for training in this horse boy method. Although his wife has a PhD in psychology, clearly it takes more than 3-4 years to develop a peer-reviewed method of therapy, yet they offer certification? In what? Not hippotherapy. Not therapeutic riding. Just the horse boy method. I haven't seen anything about any adult being certified in any kind of recognized therapy or counselling. Maybe some kids get a lot out of it, but I get the feeling he is making his reputation on a best selling book that was moving, but still had holes in it. He is using flash with the horse's tricks and eschewing traditional (competitive) dressage methods (and I would say almost any method) dressage with a page on his website: Why People Hate Dressage although it is not filled in yet.

    He endangers the lives of people riding and working around the horses with his lack of experience, the lack of very strong horses conditioned over time to do grand prix and haute ecole movements, incorrect use of equpiment, lack of helmets. To me his methods are exploitive.

    I think he has some videos on You Tube. I can't imagine how I'll feel after I browse them.

    I know I'm speaking to the choir here in most respects.


    1 members found this post helpful.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec. 15, 2011
    Location
    over the rainbow
    Posts
    772

    Default

    nevermind, i didnt notice the last post- is see what you mean now
    Last edited by skippy60; Sep. 18, 2012 at 06:17 PM. Reason: didnt see the last post!



  9. #9
    Join Date
    Nov. 9, 2005
    Location
    uk
    Posts
    15,268

    Default

    sure fire way of accidents about to happen hope hes got plenty of insurance



  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan. 30, 2010
    Location
    Alberta
    Posts
    3,625

    Default

    I don't see on the website that he is talking about competitive dressage, rather he is thinking of dressage in the context of helping a person/child with autism open up/connect to the world and communicate. I am a little less clear on the instruction that offers to move people up the levels to try advanced moves, but again it sounds like he is talking about non-competitive dressage, and making it seem more accessible...and dressage could help with accessibility!

    The certification program isn't acredited, but sounds similar to equine assisted therapy, which is usually taken by someone already in the therapy industry, and is an add on to their skills.

    I have seen the change in an austisic child once on a horse first hand, but the waiting lists to get into a program are long, and the programs are usually for any/all disabilities. Having something more specifically designed is intruiging.

    [edit]
    Last edited by Moderator 1; Sep. 29, 2012 at 03:01 PM.



  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jan. 26, 2012
    Posts
    291

    Default

    [edit]

    Rupert doesn't say he knows why horses help with communication, and I don't doubt that they do. I just get this ugly feeling inside that his charm is getting him somewhere in this without really knowing what he is doing from the horse side of things. His intent is suspect to me.

    Yes, dressage could use some accessibility. Will it be good for dressage if he is working horses that aren't ready for upper level movements? Is it good for the horses to be worked in these movement being ridden double? He sponsors these "playdates" out in the community getting people on the horses, but without helmets? What happens to the public image of dressage or his stress-free dressage when a child gets hurt because a fall without a helmet? For the sake of the horse and rider, does he really know enough to be training grand prix and haute ecole movements? He claims that the more collected the horse is the more therapeutic the riding is. He claims that "terre a terre" canter (in place) is the best. Is this safe for most horses to do? Is it safe to riding double as he advocates?

    Lots of questions. I'll adjust the title of the thread to "questionable."

    Ooops. I tried to change it ... but I can't figure it out ...
    Last edited by Moderator 1; Sep. 29, 2012 at 03:01 PM.



  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jul. 31, 2007
    Posts
    15,297

    Default [edit]

    [edit]

    It looks like his wife, Kristen Neff, is a prof at University of Texas. The website list Jenny Whoever as a Masters student who will be Neff's Graduate Assistant. Presumably the University of Texas pays the GA's tuition and stipend. And presumably Dr. Neff is doing research at this farm/with this program that has some merit.

    But it looks like she's also getting help with her family business, financed by her employer, U of T, no? And who does her research benefit? It looks like she has a financial stake in the research site, if not the findings.

    Most universities ask researchers to disclose other sources of income and potential conflicts of interest.

    ETA: and some copy about her book reads "Kristen's insides into...." They mean "insights." For the love of God, please tell me that the esteemed Dr. Neff didn't write that.
    Last edited by Moderator 1; Sep. 29, 2012 at 03:02 PM.
    The armchair saddler
    Politically Pro-Cat



  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jan. 26, 2012
    Posts
    291

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by mvp View Post
    Well there is one place to poke around for one.

    It looks like his wife, Kristen Neff, is a prof at University of Texas. The website list Jenny Whoever as a Masters student who will be Neff's Graduate Assistant. Presumably the University of Texas pays the GA's tuition and stipend. And presumably Dr. Neff is doing research at this farm/with this program that has some merit.

    But it looks like she's also getting help with her family business, financed by her employer, U of T, no? And who does her research benefit? It looks like she has a financial stake in the research site, if not the findings.

    Most universities ask researchers to disclose other sources of income and potential conflicts of interest.

    ETA: and some copy about her book reads "Kristen's insides into...." They mean "insights." For the love of God, please tell me that the esteemed Dr. Neff didn't write that.
    LOL, ROTFLMAO

    I read through a few abstracts ... nothing about autism, although I suppose measuring the ability to have compassion or self-compassion in people with autism is certainly an interesting concept.



  14. #14
    Join Date
    Nov. 1, 2007
    Location
    ....in a classroom in Fl, by the ocean
    Posts
    3,765

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FLeventer View Post
    [edit] The website is killing me from the descriptions of the people and horses. Coolest person to walk this planet? Kill me now please.

    FL eventer, I am the coolest person to walk this planet. I need to send him an email, this needs to be rectified ASAP
    Last edited by Moderator 1; Sep. 29, 2012 at 02:59 PM.



  15. #15
    Join Date
    Apr. 25, 2008
    Posts
    1,797

    Default

    I did notice that it was noted on the portion of the website where each horse is discussed that some of the horses are too advanced/high strung/whatever to be ridden by any of the clientele/kids. I also didn't understand the picture of the horse rearing. How will that skill ever be helpful for any of these kids???
    Quote Originally Posted by alicen View Post
    We have no intentions of tarring and feathering anyone: this is now a thread about dipping Ryan Reynolds in chocolate.



  16. #16
    Join Date
    Jan. 26, 2012
    Posts
    291

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MunchingonHay View Post
    FL eventer, I am the coolest person to walk this planet. I need to send him an email, this needs to be rectified ASAP
    <snortlaugh>



  17. #17
    Join Date
    Jan. 26, 2012
    Posts
    291

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Carolinadreamin' View Post
    I did notice that it was noted on the portion of the website where each horse is discussed that some of the horses are too advanced/high strung/whatever to be ridden by any of the clientele/kids. I also didn't understand the picture of the horse rearing. How will that skill ever be helpful for any of these kids???
    That, according to Rupert, is a levade. And I can see how the kids would like it. But, um, I don't see how it's safe for a therapy horse.



  18. #18
    Join Date
    Apr. 11, 2010
    Posts
    200

    Default

    I am wondering if the grey in the background of this picture is the same one pictured doing the "levade". They mentioned that he is swaybacked



  19. #19
    Join Date
    Aug. 14, 2004
    Posts
    7,538

    Default

    wow.

    are you folks serious? this guy is trying to help kids and [edit]

    maybe you ought to go spend some time at an "all rounder" barn so you can see how the rest of the world works before you condemn this guy.
    Last edited by Moderator 1; Sep. 29, 2012 at 03:02 PM.



  20. #20
    Join Date
    Nov. 7, 2008
    Location
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Posts
    2,070

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by mbm View Post
    wow.

    are you folks serious? this guy is trying to help kids and [edit]
    There are unfortunately a lot of people who do in fact engage in behavior which, [edit], is pretty ethically questionable under the guise of 'helping kids' - parents of children with problems can become quite desperate and it's not always all that hard to sell them on something. So "he's trying to help!" is not really that great a defense in the grand scheme of things.

    And assuming that he does legitimately believe that he's on to something helpful with autistic children and horses, it seems like it would be a much more responsible approach to take to follow the safety guidelines of one of the major therapeutic riding groups, including stuff like wearing helmets and using side walkers where appropriate and so on. It's not like someone sat down to make those rules and said "I know, I'll say all kids should wear helmets just because I want Troxel to make more money!"

    (I know there are sensation issues for some kids with autism - maybe that means that those kids can't ride, maybe there's some kind of adaptation that can be made to the helmet to change the texture/feel, etc. I'm sure there's stuff that can be tried. ETA: And part of that would be that ALL of the adults should be wearing helmets to set the example. It's harder to convince a kid to do something he doesn't want to do when he can say 'but they're not doing it!')
    Last edited by Moderator 1; Sep. 29, 2012 at 03:03 PM.



Similar Threads

  1. Dressage horse turned trail horse . . .
    By Tiger Horse in forum Off Course
    Replies: 23
    Last Post: Apr. 20, 2012, 12:23 PM
  2. Replies: 8
    Last Post: Apr. 4, 2011, 09:19 PM
  3. Breyer Horse/Dutch Dressage Horse
    By SR Rider in forum Dressage
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: Sep. 28, 2010, 01:56 PM
  4. dressage horse in NH PLACED
    By fivestarsfarmws in forum Giveaways
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: Jul. 12, 2009, 07:16 PM
  5. My dressage horse doing her 'other' job
    By kahjul in forum Dressage
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: Apr. 22, 2009, 01:11 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
randomness