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  1. #1341
    Join Date
    Jun. 11, 2007
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    2,846

    Default

    Whew. Just spent two days reading this thread, but I finished it ... cover to cover!

    I have no bone in this fight but wanted to add this:

    Gray Fox Farms
    Jill Burnell
    Redwine

    I wish everyone involved a positive outcome [and a negative one for Jill]. Sad situation, all around.
    Proud owner of Gus & Gringo.
    See G2's blog
    Photos



  2. #1342
    Join Date
    Jan. 30, 2003
    Location
    GA
    Posts
    1,051

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Sonesta View Post
    Laurierace, you seem to be confused as to how you get the DNA parental verification done.

    You have the mare and the offspring. Just pull some mane hairs (with root bulbs attached), send them to UCDavis with a request that the offspring's DNA be compared to the mare's and the purported sire (Redwine) and give you a report as to whether or not the sire is Redwine.

    Not difficult at all - nor expensive. $40 for the parental check. Maybe a tad more if they have to do the mare's DNA to do the comparison.

    Jockey Club need have nothing to do with it.
    Thank you, Sonesta! This was a question I asked earlier.

    eta - rats!
    Last edited by Roisin; Aug. 28, 2012 at 08:10 PM. Reason: read further posts



  3. #1343
    Join Date
    Mar. 8, 2004
    Location
    Baltimore, MD
    Posts
    20,363

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TWF View Post
    THIS works a long as the owner of the horse(mare or stallion) signs this release....Been there done that.

    To:
    The Jockey Club
    821 Corporate Drive
    Lexington, KY 40503-2794
    Phone: (859) 224-2700
    Fax: (859) 224-2710

    Re: Blood type and/or DNA test results - Cigar

    I grant my permission for the release to the (NAME OF REGISTRY HERE ) the blood-type and/or DNA test results for the 19XX TB Stallion:
    Cigar by Palace Music
    out of Solar Slew by Seattle Slew


    Purpose: Identification of offspring

    This request is made on behalf of:
    American Breeder
    Hill Rd
    Anywhere, USA

    Signed_______________________ Date______________________
    Yeah for some reason they kept saying I had to sign a change of ownership form first which I wasn't willing to do because she is now and always was mine since the day she was born. Not sure what the mistake was but they have since figured it out and are cooperating.
    Last edited by Laurierace; Aug. 28, 2012 at 08:45 PM.



  4. #1344
    Join Date
    Aug. 22, 2012
    Posts
    147

    Default FYI

    Quote Originally Posted by COTHalter44 View Post
    I think I recall reading somewhere that before JB became a stallion owner, there were multiple outside stallion owners that she never paid for breedings. Can anyone confirm? Just wondering how many babies may have been produced with "stolen" semen.
    I have sort of answered my own question thanks to those that were willing to share privately. There is somewhere in the neighborhood of 5-10 foals that were produced via "stolen" semen. As in shipments that she paid one stud fee on (or not at all) & inseminated multiple mares. I have counted 5 foals definitely, but it sounds as if there are a handful more. Now, if she registered those foals, she must have falsified the breeding certificates too.

    Keep in mind this happened before she became a stallion owner, so 5 or more years back. Won't share names as that is not really my place to do so.



  5. #1345
    Join Date
    Jul. 19, 2007
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    277

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by COTHalter44 View Post
    I have sort of answered my own question thanks to those that were willing to share privately. There is somewhere in the neighborhood of 5-10 foals that were produced via "stolen" semen. As in shipments that she paid one stud fee on (or not at all) & inseminated multiple mares. I have counted 5 foals definitely, but it sounds as if there are a handful more. Now, if she registered those foals, she must have falsified the breeding certificates too.

    Keep in mind this happened before she became a stallion owner, so 5 or more years back. Won't share names as that is not really my place to do so.
    WOW, the range of complaints just keeps growing. Any chance they'll step forward and contact EquineDriver?



  6. #1346
    Join Date
    Oct. 31, 2008
    Location
    Poetry, TX
    Posts
    926

    Default

    Wow. Glad she got breedings she didn't pay for! How fitting.



  7. #1347
    Join Date
    Jul. 19, 2003
    Location
    Aiken SC
    Posts
    557

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by S A McKee View Post
    If you don't know the correct spelling then don't guess or ASSume that others won't either.
    So what if it has two legit spellings, the other farms have nothing to do with this mess. Are you not getting why dragging farms that have nothing to do with JB into this is a problem? Or are you that challenged?
    Hey let's add Equinedriver to the list of names that should be tagged as part of JB.
    I find it interesting that you apparently find this so offensive. I guess I looked at it the same way as people that list things on ebay or Craigslist and tag the bottom of the listing with other spellings etc that help people pull it up. A quick read of the thread, WHICH INCLUDES JILL'S NAME, would tip off anyone that was looking for one of the other Grey Fox Farms that this was not the one they were looking for...........



  8. #1348
    Join Date
    Jul. 19, 2003
    Location
    Aiken SC
    Posts
    557

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by IrishWillow View Post
    Equinedriver - can you tell us how many people have contacted you? Major similarities in the stories? Just generally, of course.
    I am in the 25 range I would guess. FWIW, starting Thurs or so, I am going to spend a few hours tracking down others mentioned from other lists and try to contact them to let them know of the file gathering and course of action we are taking and see if I can round up another 5 or 10. Undoubtedly, a file of 25 victims being sent to the Attorney General will garner much more attention that one or two.

    I am also going to contact those that have had issues with sick horses, suspected bad semen etc and give them a contact for the CA USDA and State Vet office and see if that would generate any inspections etc. I figure the more different directions we try and generate action the better our odds.

    I have also contacted a web page person I know about starting a web page that I can use to post any info about the progress.



  9. #1349
    Join Date
    Jul. 19, 2003
    Location
    Aiken SC
    Posts
    557

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by S A McKee View Post
    If you don't know the correct spelling then don't guess or ASSume that others won't either.
    So what if it has two legit spellings, the other farms have nothing to do with this mess. Are you not getting why dragging farms that have nothing to do with JB into this is a problem? Or are you that challenged?
    Hey let's add Equinedriver to the list of names that should be tagged as part of JB.
    Actually meant to add that you are more than welcome to tag my name. Hopefully it will help more victims find me. I am not ashamed of my role in this mess so do whatever you can to help them get in contact with me and forward me the information to add to the pile.



  10. #1350
    Join Date
    Aug. 22, 2012
    Posts
    147

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by kokoda View Post
    WOW, the range of complaints just keeps growing. Any chance they'll step forward and contact EquineDriver?
    That is up to them but I hope they will do so.



  11. #1351
    Join Date
    Aug. 14, 2004
    Posts
    7,540

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by equinedriver View Post
    Actually meant to add that you are more than welcome to tag my name. Hopefully it will help more victims find me. I am not ashamed of my role in this mess so do whatever you can to help them get in contact with me and forward me the information to add to the pile.
    i would be very careful if i were you.... when people get desperate they may do crazy things....

    i would also be very careful with the info you hand out, .. i would not offer anything to anyone except to the authorities....

    be careful!



  12. #1352

    Default

    The wheels of justice move slowly ... it will realistically be a while before anything occurs that would result in Jill Burnell going out of business in any way. However, equinedriver is doing a great job and it is well worth it.

    In addition to the lawsuit that is planned, the "silent hand" of capitalism should also do it's work when people just will not do business with her.

    She could also just turn things around and conduct business in a professional manner, that's also possible.



  13. #1353
    Join Date
    Oct. 13, 2003
    Location
    Eastern Pacific coast
    Posts
    3,719

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    Quote Originally Posted by Simkie View Post
    Do you EVER contribute anything worthwhile?
    Simkie...as I said to you on another thread, don't feed the troll.
    Just keep walking, and don't look down.

    Also please read the PM I sent you.
    -Amor vincit omnia-



  14. #1354
    Join Date
    May. 20, 2005
    Location
    Thousand Oaks, CA
    Posts
    923

    Default

    As the House of Cards falls, I do have some concern for all those horses. She has done her "best" but if sales drop off etc, feed bills will be more difficult to meet. Her new place doesn't seem to have any nearby neighbors. Are any COTHers willing to take a drive to see if the general health of the horses can be monitored by passerbys?



  15. #1355
    Join Date
    Feb. 28, 2006
    Location
    The rocky part of KY
    Posts
    9,506

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by candico View Post
    As the House of Cards falls, I do have some concern for all those horses. She has done her "best" but if sales drop off etc, feed bills will be more difficult to meet. Her new place doesn't seem to have any nearby neighbors. Are any COTHers willing to take a drive to see if the general health of the horses can be monitored by passerbys?
    If I googled the correct lot from the OP's link waaay back there in the first few of her posts there is a lane with two 10-15 acre lots and two very nice homes with shelters and horses outside. At the end of the lane is probably the original farmhouse so there are three sets of "eyes" on the one side. There is also a military training center on the other side although this is towards the back of their property. Unfortunately you can hide a lot on 30+ acres although it's pretty much a grassy plain. I haven't been to this exact spot but my commute route to work used to take me within about two miles and my old trainer had a place for a short time about four miles north. The bigger hills are more to the south IIRC.

    ETA I think it's a private lane or driveway, not a public street.
    Courageous Weenie Eventer Wannabe
    Incredible Invisible



  16. #1356
    Join Date
    Oct. 13, 2003
    Location
    Eastern Pacific coast
    Posts
    3,719

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Equine Reproduction View Post
    Actually, S A McKee makes a really valid point and did contribute something worthwhile with her post, albeit not with warm and fuzzy wording. So while you may not like his/her way of saying it, it "is" an important take home message.
    It's an important message to be sure, and one that has been brought up before on this thread.

    However, this typically sarcastic and passive aggressive comment by SA McKee, "Hey let's add Equinedriver to the list of names that should be tagged as part of JB" is actually a GREAT IDEA. That way people would read it and find out the Equinedriver is the go-to person for those who have trouble with Gray Fox Farm and Jill Burnell.
    Last edited by Mardi; Aug. 29, 2012 at 12:08 AM.
    -Amor vincit omnia-



  17. #1357
    Join Date
    Dec. 10, 2010
    Location
    nevada
    Posts
    311

    Default

    OH NO! As a dressage person I thought I wouldn't know anything about these horses, I just looked on her website and saw my daughters former jumper, her "heart horse" there! Does anyone know anything about Hawai du Moulin? Fabulous horse! We sold her to another junior rider when my daughter went to college.



  18. #1358
    Join Date
    Jun. 9, 2008
    Posts
    173

    Default Heads up! Spamdexing and Keyword Stuffing

    For what it's worth, an excessive number of repeated terms on a web page can result in search engine crawlers actually eliminating or penalizing a web page in search results. This occurs because such practices were not uncommon in the early days of the 'net with the intent of increasing the position of the page in the search engine rankings. Search engine managers realized what was happening and wrote code to prevent such practices from being successful. Most of the major search engines will consequently now penalize such practices.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spamdexing

    Regards to all,



  19. #1359
    Join Date
    Mar. 8, 2004
    Location
    Baltimore, MD
    Posts
    20,363

    Default

    That is interesting that you can use tag words too many times to get picked up by the search engines. While I agree that it is important to inform anyone who may consider breeding to one of her stallions or buy a foal or mare from her, I think we need to start right here. There are many of our "family" who are victims. If we can put an end to that it will be worth it. Then we can take on the rest of the horse world and make sure they are safe from her business practices as well.



  20. #1360
    Join Date
    Apr. 14, 2001
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    17,626

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by equinedriver View Post
    I am in the 25 range I would guess. FWIW, starting Thurs or so, I am going to spend a few hours tracking down others mentioned from other lists and try to contact them to let them know of the file gathering and course of action we are taking and see if I can round up another 5 or 10. Undoubtedly, a file of 25 victims being sent to the Attorney General will garner much more attention that one or two.

    I am also going to contact those that have had issues with sick horses, suspected bad semen etc and give them a contact for the CA USDA and State Vet office and see if that would generate any inspections etc. I figure the more different directions we try and generate action the better our odds.

    I have also contacted a web page person I know about starting a web page that I can use to post any info about the progress.

    Clap clap clap!

    Equinedriver, if you need a premium membership here to better manage the private messages people are sending you, I will buy it for you. You're doing great work I'm not at all involved with this mess, but I really appreciate your efforts.

    Just let me know. I will get in touch with the mods to see how purchasing it for someone else works.



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