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  1. #1
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    Default Direct from Liza Boyd - Brunello breeding not "unknown"

    I started this as a separate thread because there was so much interest in the earlier thread and, since it answers the central question, I didn't want this to be lost at the bottom or page 4 or beyond.

    I'm not involved in breeding so don't often come on this forum but the thread about Brunello's breeding caught my eye since I've been asked to write about him and his owners for a local paper and magazine. I just got off the phone from interviewing Liza Boyd during which I told her about the original "Breeding Unknown" COTH thread and asked her, "so what is the deal re his breeding?"

    Here is the story from Liza: Brunello was imported from Belgium by Liza's father Jack Towell and brother Hardin Towell in 2007. His sire was Accord II and his dam was Winnepeg, sired by Werter. Brunello was bought "off his video" by A/O rider Caroline Clark Morrison who rode him in the over 35s, with Liza also riding him for Morrison. When Morrison later took a break from riding, Liza & Jack bought him, with Janet Peterson as co-owner.

    So he has been in essentially the same hands - Liza's and Jack's - since arrival in the US and Liza says she's always identified the sire whenever she's shown Brunello. Her guess is the same as many people here have said: when he was first registered with USEF it was at a horse show and whoever signed him in didn't have the information in front of them. Liza did say that breeding didn't used to matter as much in the hunter world but she thinks they're getting better about it.

    I laughingly told Liza I could post all that on COTH and clear it right up and her response was, "that would be great." So I hope this solves the mystery!
    It's just grass and water till it hits the ground.


    4 members found this post helpful.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by GotMyPony View Post
    I started this as a separate thread because there was so much interest in the earlier thread and, since it answers the central question, I didn't want this to be lost at the bottom or page 4 or beyond.

    I'm not involved in breeding so don't often come on this forum but the thread about Brunello's breeding caught my eye since I've been asked to write about him and his owners for a local paper and magazine. I just got off the phone from interviewing Liza Boyd during which I told her about the original "Breeding Unknown" COTH thread and asked her, "so what is the deal re his breeding?"

    Here is the story from Liza: Brunello was imported from Belgium by Liza's father Jack Towell and brother Hardin Towell in 2007. His sire was Accord II and his dam was Winnepeg, sired by Werter. Brunello was bought "off his video" by A/O rider Caroline Clark Morrison who rode him in the over 35s, with Liza also riding him for Morrison. When Morrison later took a break from riding, Liza & Jack bought him, with Janet Peterson as co-owner.

    So he has been in essentially the same hands - Liza's and Jack's - since arrival in the US and Liza says she's always identified the sire whenever she's shown Brunello. Her guess is the same as many people here have said: when he was first registered with USEF it was at a horse show and whoever signed him in didn't have the information in front of them. Liza did say that breeding didn't used to matter as much in the hunter world but she thinks they're getting better about it.

    I laughingly told Liza I could post all that on COTH and clear it right up and her response was, "that would be great." So I hope this solves the mystery!
    If one relied on what was just posted, one would be just as befuddled as before. Acord II is not the same as Accord II, Winnipeg is not the same as Winnepeg, and Werther is not the same as Werter. So is he Aktino S? Most probably.

    One wonders why in all these years of the same owners, the breeding has never been forwarded to the USEF? Or is it simply impossible to correct a mis-recording after all these years?
    "I'm a lumberjack, and I'm okay."
    Thread killer Extraordinaire


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  3. #3
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    Any spelling errors are mine - I did not ask Liza how to spell the different names. But even with misspellings, would there really be two 1998 chestnut colts born out of that combination of such closely named sires/dams? sheesh.
    It's just grass and water till it hits the ground.


    2 members found this post helpful.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by GotMyPony View Post
    Any spelling errors are mine - I did not ask Liza how to spell the different names. But even with misspellings, would there really be two 1998 chestnut colts born out of that combination of such closely named sires/dams? sheesh.
    Sorry, and I didn't mean to offend, but those misspellings were present earlier in the other thread.

    And the horse is a 1997 model, not a 1998; but who is counting?
    "I'm a lumberjack, and I'm okay."
    Thread killer Extraordinaire


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  5. #5
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    a) details, schmetails - pfffttt

    b) the devil's in the details

    Vote now!


    1 members found this post helpful.

  6. #6
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    Stupid question-- can't you edit a horse's USEF registration info to add sire and dam?
    Don't fall for a girl who fell for a horse just to be number two in her world... ~EFO


    3 members found this post helpful.

  7. #7
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    Pony, thanks for confirming things with Liza! As mentioned in the other thread, my sole purpose in bringing up this topic was to try to ID the horse's bloodlines and breeder. Despite the prickly responses from some folks, it was a very useful discussion.

    I wish Brunello's owners and rider much continued success with him, and hopefully they will get his breeding info added to his USEF listing so there is a "public" record.


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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Texarkana View Post
    Stupid question-- can't you edit a horse's USEF registration info to add sire and dam?
    Or they can contact Ken Ball at USEF and he will correct it.



  9. #9
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    Speaking from personal experience, you can contact the USEF weekly for YEARS with breeding information and they won't bother to change it, even after telling you they will.

    Just saying. Been there, done that, and amazingly, it still says "unknown." The USEF is not exactly known for its efficiency


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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by supershorty628 View Post
    Speaking from personal experience, you can contact the USEF weekly for YEARS with breeding information and they won't bother to change it, even after telling you they will.

    Just saying. Been there, done that, and amazingly, it still says "unknown." The USEF is not exactly known for its efficiency
    Did you send a copy of the horse's registration papers to Ken?


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  11. #11
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    I know of multiple instances of ignored E-mails to this person unfortunately.


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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by DownYonder View Post
    Or they can contact Ken Ball at USEF and he will correct it.
    You can fax a copy the papers in-- I've changed pedigree/paper info this way multiple times.



  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by supershorty628 View Post
    Speaking from personal experience, you can contact the USEF weekly for YEARS with breeding information and they won't bother to change it, even after telling you they will.

    Just saying. Been there, done that, and amazingly, it still says "unknown." The USEF is not exactly known for its efficiency
    Seconded. In some cases, it's USEF that doesn't care about the breeding—not the owner/trainer.



  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tha Ridge View Post
    Seconded. In some cases, it's USEF that doesn't care about the breeding—not the owner/trainer.
    So should we all be glad that John Long is leaving soon? New President will be able to pick her own CEO.
    "I'm a lumberjack, and I'm okay."
    Thread killer Extraordinaire



  15. #15
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    As recently as two months ago, I noticed a USEF recording mistake on my horses parentage. I used the new option to speak with a representative online and the mistake was verified through records and correction was made within minutes.

    A very nice lady helped me through a painless process.



  16. #16
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    Having grown up in the hunter/jumper world since the 70s, I never saw much attention given to breeding in those disciplines until the past decade. I have known Jack since he started training. Most hunter trainers from that generation did not spend too much time worrying about breeding and registration, only performance and ability. So - with that history in mind - I really do not think this is any conspiracy to hide Brunellos breeding or past. I truly believe they just did not think it was that important because that is they way the hunters traditionally have been. I myself now breed and completely understand the importance of bloodlines and proper registration. However, the hunters used to be a world where a good trainer could take an OTTB or cute horse out of a pasture and make a nice hunter. Bloodlines were not the big deal they are now. I have the utmost respect for the Towell's, have known them for decades and have seen nothing but solid horsemanship and honest business practices from them.



  17. #17
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    I had my horse's stallion spelled correctly on the USEF forms. USEF entered it in the database incorrectly and it was a PITA and not quick to get them to fix their own mistake. And it's not some random stallion no one had ever heard of before or spelled so impossibly (Fabuleux). So... to those who say it isn't always so easy to correct USEF data-- I agree.

    And don't even ask me about the hassle when I bought my other horse and the bill of sale did not PERFECTLY match what USEF has listed as his prior owners.
    ~Veronica
    "The Son Dee Times" "Sustained" "Somerset" "Franklin Square"
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  18. #18
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    I showed a baby in the FOAL CLASS at Warrenton, where it got a ribbon. I completed the USEF recording at the show. The fact that it got a ribbon in the FOAL CLASS was not enough for USEF to believe that it had been foaled that year, and for them to give me the standard foaling year price break. They still wanted proof of the birth year. Don't get me started on the inefficiency that is USEF.


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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by GotMyPony View Post
    Any spelling errors are mine - I did not ask Liza how to spell the different names. But even with misspellings, would there really be two 1998 chestnut colts born out of that combination of such closely named sires/dams? sheesh.

    Really?? Really??

    You are "not involved in breeding' and write that you didn't ask about the spelling of the horse's sire and dam?

    And you are writing a newspaper /magazine article on this very subject?

    Oh dear.

    No wonder no one is clear as to the horses breeding.

    You , who are writing an article (and are posting here to "clear things up" ) do not know the spelling of the horses' sire and dam's names or the year of his birth?
    Last edited by skydy; Jan. 26, 2014 at 02:58 AM. Reason: Errant Commas


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  20. #20
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    Really?? Really??

    You are "not involved in breeding' and write that you didn't ask about the spelling of the horse's sire and dam?

    And you are writing a newspaper /magazine article on this very subject?

    Oh dear.

    No wonder no one is clear as to the horses breeding.

    You , who are writing an article (and are posting here to "clear things up" ) do not know the spelling of the horses' sire and dam's names or the year of his birth?

    Last edited by skydy; Jan. 26, 2014 at 02:58 AM. Reason: Errant Commas
    I am writing an article about Brunello's outstanding year because his other co-owner lives in our area. His breeding - known or unknown - was never going to be part of the article. I only read the Brunello thread on Sport Horse Breeding because it popped up and I was reading everything I could find on him for general background.

    Because I had the opportunity (already scheduled, FYI) to talk with the owner/trainer/rider of the horse, I thought it would be interesting to see if she could clarify the breeding and, if so, I would share it in the COTH thread. I thought - apparently mistakenly - that hearing what the actual owner/trainer/rider of the horse knew would be a unique addition to the "Breeding Unknown" discussion that some people might appreciate.

    His breeding is not, nor has it ever been, the focus of my article in spite of your assertion that I'm writing "on this very subject." I am writing about his performance record, his training, why he's perceived to be a fan favorite, why the co-owner is committed to owning horses for professionals to ride, etc. Who his parents were (or not) 15 years ago? No.

    If all that gets your panties in an even tighter wad - well, "oh, dear." I imagine it's a feeling you're accustomed to.
    It's just grass and water till it hits the ground.


    6 members found this post helpful.

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