[foggybok]

I agree with others who have said that if people aren't smart enough to investigate the groups to which they donate - shame on them. It is pretty clear from the HSUS website what they do. If people want to donate to their local animal shelters, they can do so very easily. It is disingenuous to suggest that all HSUS donors are misled or stupid. I would gather that most of their donors care about humane treatment of all animals, not just the homeless cats and dogs in their own community

So you are saying my parents (and a lot of other kind generous people) are stupid? Sorry, that is BS..... Yes, we all bear some responsibility to investigate before we donate, but the advertisements, brochures and even the name of the organization ARE quite misleading.... Thing is, most people WILL investigate before plunking out big money, but send 25, 50 or 100 dollars to the "Humane Society", well, they probably don't go much further than writing the check...and HSUS counts on it...THEY KNOW this. Soft hearted folks can get drawn in... That one commercial on TV makes me tear up when I see it, so the use of it to gather funds for HSUS makes my blood boil.....

Are all donaters duped? Of course not. There are many people that support the HSUS platform. I have no problem with those people giving funds.... Are a significant number of people misled? Absolutely yes!

And yes, I DO care about humane treatment of all animals, as do my parents....but they no longer support HSUS.......

[Bluey]

Those who suggest that all national animal welfare groups are against all use of animals are simply using scare tactics. That works with some, but not with most rational people. Basic humane treatment of all animals is a worthy goal, and does not = animal rights or ending all "use" of animals. Local rescues are great, and I both donate to and volunteer at them. They have a different agenda from groups who work for humane treatment of ALL animals, not just pets. I think that plenty of HSUS supporters have their eyes wide open, they just don't frequent this message board or forum, which is visited by a number of folks who seem to feel threatened by any type of animal welfare legislation because it could conceivably infringe on the way they choose to "use" their animals.

I think it is still clear that you don't know what the HSUS is.

You should have read here from the start and you may become a bit more informed, before posting what you did.

[Guilherme]

So you are saying my parents (and a lot of other kind generous people) are stupid? Sorry, that is BS..... Yes, we all bear some responsibility to investigate before we donate, but the advertisements, brochures and even the name of the organization ARE quite misleading.... Thing is, most people WILL investigate before plunking out big money, but send 25, 50 or 100 dollars to the "Humane Society", well, they probably don't go much further than writing the check...and HSUS counts on it...THEY KNOW this. Soft hearted folks can get drawn in... That one commercial on TV makes me tear up when I see it, so the use of it to gather funds for HSUS makes my blood boil.....

Are all donaters duped? Of course not. There are many people that support the HSUS platform. I have no problem with those people giving funds.... Are a significant number of people misled? Absolutely yes!

And yes, I DO care about humane treatment of all animals, as do my parents....but they no longer support HSUS.......

There is a BIG difference between stupid and ignorant. We are all ignorant of something (quantum mechanics, the Theory of Relativity, how to make good waffles, etc.). The cure for ignorance is knowledge. The cure for stupidity is the grave.

We've all been taken by some charlatan a time or two. Anyone who says otherwise is a liar. But anyone who does not subscribe to the old Chinese proverb "Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me" falls into that "stupid" category.

Ron White said it best.

G.

[D_BaldStockings]

If buyer beware were the only caveat, there would be no legal sanctions for fraud, misrepresentation, bilking, etc., etc.

There would be no Bernie Madoff schemes prosecution and no Enron question.

People believe.
Especially when the guilt card is played as misdirection to exert pressure.


The current HSUS bought a name with great brand value association and have banked on that for over 2 decades.
They have been very careful to assert the concept that legal change restricting use and increasing penalties for existing laws -of their choosing is the best way to be pro animal welfare and lobbying for legal change -of their choosing is the best way to be pro animal welfare.

AND disagreement with their: -lobbying is the best, No more ownership, no breeding, don't help people help their animals but always remove and warehouse -one generation and out- position
(like maybe we ought to go physically help animals in need or encourage/reward good owners, encourage inviting pets into communities instead of restricting them out, expand opportunities to interact with animals in urban environments, promote training as well as health initiatives, etc., etc.)

- is by extension anti animal welfare.

Of course it doesn't pass any logic test of what ANIMAL welfare is as opposed to LOBBYIST welfare, but fundraising and position taking is emotionally driven and logic can go hang. Pathetic puppy pics will open wallets of even jaded and suspicious, burned people because they want to do something right.

HSUS has the 'biggest speaker system and brightest stage lights' in the room, no one else is being heard or seen and they won't be until someone pulls the (money/power) plug.

[Alagirl]

If buyer beware were the only caveat, there would be no legal sanctions for fraud, misrepresentation, bilking, etc., etc.

There would be no Bernie Madoff schemes prosecution and no Enron question.

People believe.
Especially when the guilt card is played as misdirection to exert pressure.


The current HSUS bought a name with great brand value association and have banked on that for over 2 decades.
They have been very careful to assert the concept that legal change restricting use and increasing penalties for existing laws -of their choosing is the best way to be pro animal welfare and lobbying for legal change -of their choosing is the best way to be pro animal welfare.

AND disagreement with their: -lobbying is the best, No more ownership, no breeding, don't help people help their animals but always remove and warehouse -one generation and out- position
(like maybe we ought to go physically help animals in need or encourage/reward good owners, encourage inviting pets into communities instead of restricting them out, expand opportunities to interact with animals in urban environments, promote training as well as health initiatives, etc., etc.)

- is by extension anti animal welfare.

Of course it doesn't pass any logic test of what ANIMAL welfare is as opposed to LOBBYIST welfare, but fundraising and position taking is emotionally driven and logic can go hang. Pathetic puppy pics will open wallets of even jaded and suspicious, burned people because they want to do something right.

HSUS has the 'biggest speaker system and brightest stage lights' in the room, no one else is being heard or seen and they won't be until someone pulls the (money/power) plug.

Actually it's animal RIGHTS...not welfare.

We are all for welfare....but I can't do nothing with the HSUS kind.

[greygirls]

What about this group, supposedly based in Switzerland? I just saw an Internet news article about their undercover video at the rodeo in Reno--shocking horses.

http://www.sharkonline.org/

I think we're seeing a trend here--organizations that raise money from donations by tugging at the heartstrings of people who think they are helping to end abusive practices or do some good--but their money goes nowhere except into some unknown pocket.

My question re the SHARK video and others on their site was how can they possibly do anything about any of this stuff?

It's kind of like the organization that Anderson Cooper spotlighted that supposedly raised money for US veterans--who never saw a dime. Some veterans groups received some weird junk from the organization, but no money. The money went to some strange company in NYC. Congress is supposedly investigating.

Wonder how pervasive this kind of scam is? Now I more fully understand the whole PETA and Humane Association thing....

[rustbreeches]

SHARK videos are narrated by a guy who was a trophy fisherman for years. As near as I can tell, they don't actually do anything to help animals, they just like to post videos with often factually incorrect info to stir the pot

[Ravencrest_Camp]

http://youtu.be/XTrhQd9GHlE

New HSUS appeal for funds.

[AlterNetReality]

http://youtu.be/XTrhQd9GHlE

New HSUS appeal for funds.

That...
Is...
Awesome... :=)

[D_BaldStockings]

Actually it's animal RIGHTS...not welfare.

We are all for welfare....but I can't do nothing with the HSUS kind.

After a tedious re-reading of the HSUS site, I agree that it is not welfare. And that is one of the most disappointing aspects of HSUS.

HSUS is for tougher laws. And that is about the extent of it.

Welfare, means well-being or financial aid to promote that well-being; like the well known US Welfare programs that provide financial aid to people.

Before welfare, we had all sorts of not so wonderful things going on in this country, such as people dying of starvation and neglect, grade-school age children working full time shifts in factories, etc., etc.

Why people think legislation without welfare finances in the case of animals is going to solve the neglect/abuse problem I can't fathom.

HSUS sets itelf as a national agency - as though it has affiliation with and endorsement by the US Government as the Top Level Animal authority on any welfare or humane issues.

It does not and is not, slick advertising to the contrary.
It is simply another independent business, huge and wealthy, though it may be.

We should not be giving them the power they so clearly crave.

[jumpnow]

Folks-I am resurrecting this old thread and asking for assistance. I watched an episode of Ellen Degeneres yesterday. She had the head of HSUS on and was promoting their good works. bleah.

I went to her website and could not find a contact button. Any ideas on how to get to Ellen to let her know the dark side of HSUS?

She does so many good things and promotes animal welfare and rescues. Someone on her team dropped the ball on this issue.

[LauraKY]

HSUS was on Ellen to make known the Tennessee legislature's attempt to pass Ag Gag rules. Many of us are against Ag Gag rules.

Like HSUS or hate them, at least they have helped in two investigations now in the the TWH soring mess.

[D_BaldStockings]

HSUS was on Ellen to make know the Tennessee legislature's attempt to pass Ag Gag rules. Many of us are against Ag Gag rules.

Like HSUS or hate them, at least they have helped in two investigations now in the the TWH soring mess.

I wouldn't doubt that there are others who helped in investigations that HSUS seized publicity and built funding drives on -remember Hurricane Katrina pets?

I also don't understand why it is a bad thing to turn over evidence to law enforcement within a very short time period? Cold evidence trails hamper investigation into crime. Once that video was filmed, there was no need for more evidence, was there?
If people wanted to stop the abuse they would have turned it in.

There is nothing saying a copy couldn't still be held and then sold to the media 18 months later if the legal arm of society sits on it's --.

I am all for not letting problems get dismissed.

Think, though.
IF there is abuse, waiting to prove Serial abuse is more harmful to ONE animal; catching the problem before 18 months go by and many, many more animals are harmed.
Many animals harmed vs. one.

Easy pick.

[Riding at 90]

Animal rights and animal welfare go hand in hand. I dont class an organization that funds itself, takes no part in either rights or welfare and euthanizes animals rather than re home them as being anything other than what they are. The political wing of PETA same as Sin Fein is the political wing of the IRA.

[LauraKY]

Animal rights and animal welfare go hand in hand. I dont class an organization that funds itself, takes no part in either rights or welfare and euthanizes animals rather than re home them as being anything other than what they are. The political wing of PETA same as Sin Fein is the political wing of the IRA.

I think you're on the wrong thread. This one is discussing HSUS.

[AlexS]

I went to her website and could not find a contact button. Any ideas on how to get to Ellen to let her know the dark side of HSUS?

http://www.ellentv.com/be-on-the-show/10/

[7arabians]

I'll just bet Jennm dvr'd the program and is replaying it to see if her puppeteer leader gave her any secret instructions!
Sadly, we actually have American citizens who claim they should not have to report crimes which they have surreptitiously taped! What are they thinking?
Truth be told, the Waynester and his acolytes are upset because the tapes are their most profitable fundraising ploy. Have to pay Wayne's exhorbitant salary, benefits and retirement plan!
All this hubbub about the ag-gag bills, when people should be made aware that most of the 'abusers' in any of their tapes are actually fellow rara's who were placed in the plant/farm in advance of the 'taper' who 'just happens to catch abuse on tape' then the conspirators quit, hold their tape ransom to the highest bidder and let their little chortling sleeper cells like jenn shout their praises on every board on the internet.
In reality, less than 2% of these so-called tapes are legitimate proof of abuse. Thus the lack of prosecutions. In the few cases where they were true representations, the rara's allowed the abuse to continue for months and years before selling their tapes. These rara groups should be locked up next to the abusers, as they assisting it!!!

[7arabians]

I wouldn't expect any mea culpa from Ellen. She will sway with the breeze of Wayne's breath, as her very survival depends upon it! Ellen's chosen lifestyle is on the triumverate of hollywood's most ravenously defended lifestyles. The other two, 'animal rights' and 'pro-choice' are their heart points. They can tell you how much to feed your horse, but you can't protect the unborn child in their womb!! We are seeing the very core of our society torn asunder. Rara's are just one part of the dark underbelly of society and we must fight them and their false prophet Wayne at every opportunity!
Wayne's well-oiled machine has the lame-stream media in their pocket. He has a veritable army of attorneys fighting in every state to remove our dominion over animals in tiny steps.
We must be ever-vigilant to thwart these attempts in the bud. One success was removing one of Wayne's supporters from the AHA rescue/rehoming committee. We prevented so much more damage by sending that person back to their pasture!

[Fairfax]

Several of us are criticized for "slipping" slaughter into our posts. Do you now see how contaminated ???? meatballs turn into help us fight slaughter...Received this today from HSUS



Horsemeat Found in Meatballs, Lasagna, More

Dear Leo,

It's disturbing. It started earlier this year when grocery store chains in Europe were found to be selling frozen “beef” products made of horse meat. The scandal spread across Europe as about five percent of beef products—everything from hamburgers to meatballs—tested positive for horse DNA.

The test results are shocking, but don’t even account for another problem—the dozens of veterinary drugs commonly used to treat horses that are banned from the food chain, and the lack of any tracking mechanisms when horses are scooped up from random sources and put into the horse slaughter pipeline.

But, now more than ever, there’s hope to prevent this problem from spreading to the U.S. New federal legislation has been introduced, the Safeguard American Food Exports (SAFE) Act, to protect consumers from toxic horsemeat and end the cruel slaughter of America's horses as well as their export for slaughter abroad. Help us pass this legislation to permanently prevent slaughterhouses from re-opening in the U.S.

[Bluey]

Oh, I know, lets make everyone walk any place they need to go, or better yet, ride a horse and ban driving, so no one will ever again drive drunk and kill someone, as happens so many times a day in the USA, the carnage!

Not only that, it will give so many of those unwanted horses a job, no more unemployed horses ending up in slaughter, kill two birds with one ban.

The HSUS never missed a chance to make hay while the sun is shining on them, do they.

What happen to common sense?
If someone is breaking laws and regulations there to regulate any process, does it not make sense to prosecute them for it, not ban the process?