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  1. #1
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    Apr. 19, 2009
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    Default 1936 Olympics, cross country




  2. #2
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    Or about the falls!!! Just pick them up, shove 'em back on the horse and send them on...

    Carnage at the water jump!



  3. #3
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    Funny how the sound is out of sync, so that you hear the crowd react before the horse has negotiated the obstacle!

    That is really cool.
    If you are allergic to a thing, it is best not to put that thing in your mouth, particularly if the thing is cats. - Lemony Snicket



  4. #4
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    Yes, in the past the water could be very deep. It was often part of a course design to use a natural water feature, like a river. Sometimes this created problems when rain or tides dramatically changed the depth, most notoriously at Mexico City.
    If you are allergic to a thing, it is best not to put that thing in your mouth, particularly if the thing is cats. - Lemony Snicket



  5. #5
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    Wasn't there some sort of controversy with these games in regard to the depth of the water?? I remember something about it being deeper than anticipated and only the German team knew about it which is why they mostly made it across. I could be way off base here though.
    **Friend of bar.ka**

    Fils Du Reverdy (Revy)- 1993 Selle Francais Gelding
    My equine soulmate



  6. #6
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    Yeah, there were allegations that the Germans were less than ethical in pursuit of assured gold medals. I think the consensus is that a lot of it was true.

    You'll notice that only German riders went to the extreme left of the water jump, where the water was clearly shallower and the footing solid. I've read accounts that the center and right of the water were not only deep but muddy and sticky on the bottom as well.

    The 1936 Olympics were a giant political statement by the Nazi party, very interesting social history surrounding what is already such an historic event.
    In order to think outside the box, one must first know what is in the box.



  7. #7
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    Quick note: the American "Capt. Thompson" is Col. Tommy Thompson riding the great Jenny Camp

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jenny_Camp

    "She had great success, winning the individual silver medals at both Olympics ['32 and '36] as well as the team gold at the 1932 Games. This record makes her one of only three horses to win medals at consecutive Olympic Games; the others being Mark Todd's (NZ) Charisma and Marcroix, ridden by Holland's Lt. Charles F. Pahud de Mortanges"

    In order to think outside the box, one must first know what is in the box.



  8. #8
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    Thanks for this It is wonderful. I only wish the quality of the video were better.
    "I'm a lumberjack, and I'm okay."
    Thread killer Extraordinaire



  9. #9
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    I think this is proof that we look back at the "good ol days" with rose colored glasses. I much prefer eventing as it is today, easier on the horses and on the people with smarter course design that asks questions instead of setting horse and rider up for failure, safe thinking, and inovations such as the helmet and vest!



  10. #10
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    Wow! Amazing to watch! Definitely had me gasping in horror a couple of times!!



  11. #11
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    Default

    Loved the video, thanks for posting. We've come a long way baby! Yes, those Nazi bastards probably cheated.



  12. #12
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    Mar. 18, 2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kadenz View Post
    The 1936 Olympics were a giant political statement by the Nazi party, very interesting social history surrounding what is already such an historic event.
    interesting to note that this documentary was made my leni riefenstahl: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leni_Riefenstahl. propaganda was clearly the motive here.



  13. #13
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    Apr. 21, 2012
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    Yes, I've also read/studied that the Germans cheated A LOT in these olympics. So far as it was said that they put sink holes in the water jump. My bf watched with me and said "We'll see if the German riders make it through. Well look at that. They did!"

    If even non-horsey bf can see it I also cry foul! Wonderful video though. Some wonderful riding...and some not so wonderful riding!



  14. #14
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    I was going to ask where these Olympics took place. As I was watching the water jump I thought to myself how well the Germans did through it. They mastered it. Then I thought it looked like someone took a backhoe and dug some holes in the water jump to make people fall. THEN I read everyones comments on the cheating Germans. Too funny.

    Makes you wonder how many of those riders who fell on their head really shouldn't have remounted and finished the course.



  15. #15
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    If you go to the end it says the one German who fell at the water broke his collarbone in the fall and rode the next day. If he continued and rode the next I can only imagine how many had minor concussions and head injuries that were never diagnosed.



  16. #16
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    Jun. 6, 2009
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    Of course(!!!) propaganda was the motive! Not only in this Riefenstahl-“Documentary”, but for the whole 1936 Olympics! Not only in showing that we were superior, but also in pretending that we were a truly peaceful society – e.g. anything suggesting anti-Semitism had to be and was removed from the streets for as long as the “Olympic family” was in town. The stewards, heck, the waiters in the Olympic village, they were reliable NSDAP-party members - you think we tell everybody where the best spot to cross the water is?!? Ha. But actually, if the riders would have put a foot or two into it, they would have found out themselves, but...

    Those riders, athletes, heroes, they were soldiers, but not just soldiers of course, they were officers. The one who broke his collarbone was Oberstleutnant Konrad Freiherr von Wangenheim, he died in Russian confinement in 1953, and with a name and rank like his there can be no two opinions about whether he was a Nazi in 1936 or not. His team mate, Generalmajor Rolf Lippert became commander of the 5th Panzer-Division and a Ritterkreuzträger (which basically means at leat 1000 soldiers killed in one single battle but ''won'' in the end), and shot himself in April 1945 near Bielefeld - probably not because most people feel an urge to shoot themselves when they find they’re in Bielefeld, but as it’s the honourable thing to do for Wehrmachtsgeneralmajöre when *they* are back in Bielefeld. Completing the trio was Ludwig Stubbendorff, who also won individual Gold. He was a Hauptmann in 1936 and the only German Gold-medallist who was not promoted after the games. He was killed in the war very early in July 1941 at the Dnjepr - i.e. Russia and not the exactly the place where you would have found Lippert or von Wangenheim at that time. So draw your own conclusion.

    How many had minor concussions and head injuries that were never diagnosed? Well, one can only wonder, and I’m not referring to the riders. Nobody cared of course. Those kind of falls and injuries suffered from combat training, were just the usual at that time, if there weren’t any men knocked-out/collapsing/injured, then they knew that just weren’t practicing well enough. Horses? Oh well they weren't that expensive.

    As for the good old days and the Olympics, they never existed and 1936 is not way too exceptional in that matter. From the gentlemen amateurs who wouldn’t let Grace Kelly’s father take part at Royal Henley because his profession provided him with an unfair advantage (he worked as a bricklayer, the gentlemen were gentlemen), to bribing everyone and their granny to become host of the Olympics, to cleaning the sledge-slopes for Americans only in Salt Lake City, to Beijing, to disqualifying the Swedish Dressageteam 8 months after wining Gold at the London Games 1948 because Gehnäll Persson was not really an Officier but only promoted to Leutenant for as long as the games lasted - and the rules apply to everyone, you know. As for the good old days of the sports, might be just me, but funny how those actually look SOOO much easier – I think it’s not even quite close to a today’s Novice-XC.



  17. #17
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    Danny1234, the 5th Tankdivision of which Lippert became Comander late in the WWII was not a Paradeground outfit, neither was the 31st Regiment of this Division which Lippert comanded as an Oberst.
    That were hardcore battlefield frontline outfits.
    My fathers Cav united was attached to the 5th on its drive to Moskow and according to him it was not really a walk in the park.

    It was not uncomen at the end of WWII that soldiers took their lives facing defeat ans seeing the complet distruction of their country.

    As for the 1936 Olympics naturally it was a propaganda tool and naturally were the German riders informed about the water jump. Home turf advantage.

    About the jumps, Novice, well, there are more pictures and footage in the net about 36 x-c, rather wild stuff, I would say, no wonder that 50% did not finish.
    That I have no use for them, does not mean, that I don't know them and don't know how to use them.
    Caveman extraordinair



  18. #18
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    Jun. 13, 2008
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    New England
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    Default

    Thanks for posting. Loved the video, were those weeds hanging off of Japans horse when he got up out of the water

    I found this from 1976. Interesting how times change.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31dlhFlgmbA

    1936 military caps, big pinneys.

    1976 hunt caps, big pinneys.

    2012 helmets & air vest, big pinneys.
    "Looked bigger when I couldn't see him."~ Jayne Cobb



  19. #19
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    May. 15, 2012
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    1

    Default R Lippert

    Danny1234

    Just curious where you got your information. I have another source that says Lippert died of wounds received from action in the East.



  20. #20
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    Feb. 22, 2002
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    Danny & Vtonic,
    You may both be right - remember that Fieldmarshal Rommel "died of his wounds" officially but actually was forced to commit suicide by the SS.
    Brock
    Brock n. (Anglo-Saxon) badger as in Brockenhurst, Brocklebank etc www.area35.us



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