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  1. #1
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    This will not be a thread bashing them. It will not be about needing to use the auto release.

    That being said, what I do want to bring up is this.

    In pics of them on their eq horse, they have amazing equitation. Their legs are tight, they are centered and balanced, and they look great. When you see pictures of them on their hunters, they are jumping ahead, pinching with their knees, their legs are WAY back, and they are laying on their horses neck.

    Now having horrible equitation does not make your horse jump better.

    WHY DO THEY DO THIS? Any explanations from our top junior riders?

    Go Get 'Em Tiger!!!
    see ya



  2. #2
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    This will not be a thread bashing them. It will not be about needing to use the auto release.

    That being said, what I do want to bring up is this.

    In pics of them on their eq horse, they have amazing equitation. Their legs are tight, they are centered and balanced, and they look great. When you see pictures of them on their hunters, they are jumping ahead, pinching with their knees, their legs are WAY back, and they are laying on their horses neck.

    Now having horrible equitation does not make your horse jump better.

    WHY DO THEY DO THIS? Any explanations from our top junior riders?

    Go Get 'Em Tiger!!!
    see ya



  3. #3
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    Is equitation only for equitation classes? And if so, what's the point? [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_confused.gif[/img]

    SillyHorse

    ~ PRIDE: It's amazing what you can accomplish when you don't have any
    Quote Originally Posted by Linny View Post
    Those martingales were so taut, you could play Ode to Joy on them with a comb



  4. #4
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    A good eq horse is a splinter-belly flat-backed jumpin' machine who doesn't jar the rider that much, hence it's easier to maintain a nice solid position.

    A good hunter, on the other hand, should be a round back-crackin' ba-boom-basculing jumpin' bean - and just try keeping correct pretty angles over a 3'6" jump on that!

    My simplistic, but ALWAYS humble [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img] opinion.



  5. #5
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    I think alot of eq riders imitate the exagerated style many top hunter riders use. When I look through the pages of COTH for hunter pics, I'm amazed that some of these riders aren't jumped off! I know they may be effective but they look awful. I think alot of jrs imitate that look as soon as they leave the eq classes.

    Resident racing historian
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    F O.B
    Resident racing historian ~~~ Re-riders Clique
    Founder of the Mighty Thoroughbred Clique



  6. #6
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    How about this?

    SillyHorse

    ~ PRIDE: It's amazing what you can accomplish when you don't have any
    Quote Originally Posted by Linny View Post
    Those martingales were so taut, you could play Ode to Joy on them with a comb



  7. #7
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    At the Garden last year, I saw a couple "big name pros" just about fall off in the hunter classes.

    I was sitting with a couple of other BNP's and we were all appalled... Granted, I was sitting with JUMPER people [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif[/img] [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif[/img]
    co-author of 101 Jumping Exercises & The Rider's Fitness Program; Soon to come: Dead Ringer - a tale of equine mystery and intrique! Former Moderator!



  8. #8
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Get-Em-Tiger:

    WHY DO THEY DO THIS? Any explanations from our top junior riders?
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    As my coach often says - "Your horse mimics your ride."

    That said, if I am soft and relax (albeit loose) my horse will jump soft and round and be relaxed in his jump.

    Look how a good hunter jumps and look how a good Eq. horse jumps - two totally different phenomenons. An Eq. horse jumps flatter to serve a purpose - so that the rider can equitate/pose better. It's harder to equitate on a back-cracker (though many greats like Conrad Homfeld, Greg Best and Joe Fargis have been able to do it.)

    If Emily Williams were to ride down to a 4' oxer on Strapless as if the mare were an equitation horse - would she get as good of a jump out of her as if she stayed loose and forward while galloping down to the jumps on a loopy rein - I HIGHLY doubt it.

    So going back to my original statement, "Your horse mimics your ride." [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]



  9. #9
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    but there is a world of difference between Kathy Kusner, one of our sport's all-time most talented and gifted athletes, and your average "Big Eq Kid."

    FYI I can't open your .bmp attachment but assume it's the famous pic of KK jumping Untouchable over 7" at Hickstead in the 60s. A stellar example of how to do it right at the highest levels, and certainly the form and style that all of us amateurs should strive for.

    VT's point about the type of ride you are giving the horse is interesting, as well.



  10. #10
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    Then what is the purpose of equitation? I'm not trying to be a smarta$$. I really don't understand this. If the horse goes in the desirable manner with a particular style of riding, why is that style not correct equitation? At least it's not going to win an equitation class.

    And I've never read G.M. or anyone else, for that matter, to say that lying on your horse's neck with your butt way up in the air is good riding. Yet I know most of the hunter pros ride like this.

    SillyHorse

    ~ PRIDE: It's amazing what you can accomplish when you don't have any
    Quote Originally Posted by Linny View Post
    Those martingales were so taut, you could play Ode to Joy on them with a comb



  11. #11
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Flashy Gray:

    VT's point about the type of ride you are giving the horse is interesting, as well.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Interesting good? Or Interesting bad? [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]



  12. #12
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    interesting good, its the way it is.



  13. #13
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    VT, believe it or not, as much as I appreciate your posts containing scientific data on the rituals and habitat of the Wily Mid-Atlantic Urchin [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img] - I think your observations on this thread ARE interesting.



  14. #14
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    VT- I also find your point interesting (in a good way) it intrigues me... but its no excuse to be sloppy

    look at McLain Ward on a daily basis, his equitation is always good. So is Nikki Simpson, Ray Texel, Lauren Hough, etc. and their horses are jumping at their best most of the time. Even Emily Williams, whom you use as an excellent example, usually has good equitation... Maybe its proof of perfecting the ride? They have managed to keep that good equitation while also mastering the idea of relaxing into that good position...

    I agree that a back-cracking hunter isn't going to allow you perfect equitation but I do think that good equitation can be shown on anyhorse.

    someone said something to the effect that you can't compare the big eq riders with Kathy Kusner and the like... I think they are right. Equitation is an ongoing experience and the ideal is to be so comfortable on a horse and with your position that you look the same.

    The big eq kids are learning and learning takes brain power, I agree with VTrider that if kids thought that hard about position while showing their hunters, then the hunters form wouldn't be as good.



  15. #15
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    See, I agree with you VTRider to a point. You can be soft and relaxed without being loose and jumping ahead.

    Jumping ahead and laying on the horse's neck does not make him jump better. Same goes with pinching with your knee and sending your lower leg flying back.

    I am not saying these are just like average equitation riders. These are the ones winning eq classes in Florida and at Devon. Then you see them on a picture of a hunter and they look like they are about to fall off a horse.

    I don't mind the big realease. In fact, I think eq riders need to give more of one. If you watch an eq class, the riders hands DO NOT move. They stay the same place galloping to the jump as they do over the jump. They aren't yanking their horse's mouth off, but they could atleast give a release.

    Go Get 'Em Tiger!!!
    see ya



  16. #16
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    PS- not all big eq riders are sloppy. I saw an amazing display of equitation by Maggie Jayne on Towerheads... she shows exactly how an automatic release should be done and I'm still picking my jaw up off the ground!



  17. #17
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    Since most eq horses don't have quite the effortless stride most hunters do, the ride has to be a little more forward in the eqs. Since the eq horse does not explode off the ground like some hunters do, it takes much less effort for the rider to keep up with the horse.

    So many hunters lope casually around the course, there is a big change in power when they leave the ground. The rider may have to make a big effort to keep up with the horse, and the horse's jump can dislodge the rider a bit.

    I'll tell you once more before I get off the floor don't bring me down...



  18. #18
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    Question: what is the purpose of an equitation class? To demonstrate the rider's skill in general on any given horse, or to demonstrate the rider's skill in riding hunters specifically, or something else altogether? [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_confused.gif[/img]

    Because if it's about ability and form relative to the hunt seat discipine, isn't it kind of pointless if the eq horses don't even go in the hunter classes, at least at the big-time level?

    This is a question from a not-in-the-know eventer--not being facetious.



  19. #19
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    But doing THIS (see pic) is kind of overdoing it IMHO. And yes, I'm wayyyy too active over jumps myself, even crossrails. But then again, I have 1/100th of the experience that these people have.

    ~Erin B #1
    They call television a medium. That's because it is neither rare nor well done.



  20. #20
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    wow, that's a beautiful horse..... how are the laws of physics allowing that rider to stay on though? i have no experience with hunters, so bear with me here!!

    -Liz
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