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  1. #1
    timedjumpoff is offline Working Hunter Premium Member
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    In today's world of the politically correct, i.e., smart kids being forced into classes with slow-learning kids; no winners or losers in certain youth activities, no racial profiling even when it jeopardizes our safety, etc., etc., how will this affect the horse world?

    Will judges be barred from favoring one breed over another? Will Arabs have to be given equal consideration with TB'd/WBs in the hunter ring? Will striding have to be flexible, to be fair to every size horse? Will all the jumps have to be a size that any horse can jump? Will ribbons and prize money be considered harmful to the losers' self-esteem? Will everyone in a class be considered a winner (as in leadline)? Will the high-priced riding attire be banned in favor of a standard uniform for all? Will stables/trainers be required to do a certain number of "pro-bono" lessons? Will new affirmative action initiatives be mandated or quotas imposed?

    Sounds crazy, but it's a concept that's gradually become part of American life. Is the horse world immune? Should it be?

    [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_confused.gif[/img]
    "WHINNYING" IS EVERYTHING!!



  2. #2
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    In today's world of the politically correct, i.e., smart kids being forced into classes with slow-learning kids; no winners or losers in certain youth activities, no racial profiling even when it jeopardizes our safety, etc., etc., how will this affect the horse world?

    Will judges be barred from favoring one breed over another? Will Arabs have to be given equal consideration with TB'd/WBs in the hunter ring? Will striding have to be flexible, to be fair to every size horse? Will all the jumps have to be a size that any horse can jump? Will ribbons and prize money be considered harmful to the losers' self-esteem? Will everyone in a class be considered a winner (as in leadline)? Will the high-priced riding attire be banned in favor of a standard uniform for all? Will stables/trainers be required to do a certain number of "pro-bono" lessons? Will new affirmative action initiatives be mandated or quotas imposed?

    Sounds crazy, but it's a concept that's gradually become part of American life. Is the horse world immune? Should it be?

    [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_confused.gif[/img]
    "WHINNYING" IS EVERYTHING!!



  3. #3
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    no breed should be favored over another, and Arabs should be given equal consideration...

    Everything else you mentioned is just silly IMHO.
    Remember...though eagles may soar, weasles never get sucked into a jet engine.

    Soar like a weasle my friend.



  4. #4
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    As long as the natural superiority of the Morgan is recognized, the others should be judged on a strictly PC basis.

    In fact, if 5 horses clear the jumps and one crashes the course into splinters, the crasher should win the class lest his self-esteem be damaged.



  5. #5
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    Arabs that move like true hunters will be given a fair chance in shows. If they move like traditional arabs, they will do better at arab shows.

    No one is going to enter their horse in a jump height that the horse cannot safely jump. That's why there are so many divisions.

    *EMMA*



  6. #6
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    It is, and will always be a SPORT. There are ALWAYS winners and losers. Even at the Olympics, a bastion of PC-ness, someone wins the gold and others don't. That is just a silly thought! Leadliners all get blues because they are too little to understand, we, as adults and juniors, should be TAUGHT to accept losing AND winning with equal grace and treat our horses well no matter how we ride!!! We should strive to better our OWN experiences, NOT compare ourselves with others. The ribbons mean nothing in the end if you aren't learning and improving!

    Aqha Clique
    Can you stress-fracture your brain?



  7. #7
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    there are several 'examples' in your question that have zero to do with so-called political correctness and it gets rather tiresome to see these issues lumped under that catch-all category.

    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> In today's world of the politically correct, i.e., smart kids being forced into classes with slow-learning kids; <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Example #1: this is an issue of school budgets, not political correctness. Schools no longer have adequate funding to conduct special classes for bright students and the answer to these budget constraints is mainstreaming. It's less expensive to have fewer classes, fewer teachers, and fewer special programs. The plain truth is that the "smart" kids can get stimulation and learning on their own while the "slower" have few if any options but to get it from the public schools.

    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> no racial profiling even when it jeopardizes our safety, <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Example #2: a quick survey of the law of criminal procedure would demonstrate that "racial profiling" while a hot media topic is not really the issue. The issue is the police acting outside the boundaries our laws have defined for them. Certainly a person's demeanor, dress, activities, and companions can be factors in establishing reasonable suspicion or probable cause but those elements individually (race included) cannot be the sole factor under which the police detain a citizen. Using race as the only factor is discriminatory, not politically correct or incorrect.

    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Will new affirmative action initiatives be mandated or quotas imposed? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Example #3 decisions on affirmative action programs are made a governmental level and can only (legally) be applied to government funded institutions and positions. It has no impact on either private industry or private stables, unless that private entity voluntarily wants to participate in such a program.

    In the main body paragraph, I have no issues with any of the suggested changes because I don't see any of those changes are realistic. It's not unreasonable to judge animals against a standard; if a certain horse is unsuitable for one task, it will likely be suitable for another. Horses do not hold the same status as humans and are not afforded the same considerations.

    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> No winners or losers in certain youth activities, <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    The only time I've seen this implemented is with children who are of leadline age and I fail to see how 'making everyone a winner' is going to have a long term detriment to our society.

    ****
    New York Horse Rescue



  8. #8
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    PC means (should mean) that no one has an UNFAIR advantage, due to their background- that the playing field is level.

    NOT that all the players are reduced to their least common denominator.

    Judges shoul not chose one horse over another BECAUSE of its breed, though it will often turn out that the preferred horses in a given discipline are from the same breed.

    With the introduction of "pre green", "baby green", "pre childrens", and "pre-adult" classes. they already HAVE lowered the jumps to a size any horse can jump.
    Janet

    chief feeder and mucker for Music, Spy, Belle and Tiara. Someone else is now feeding and mucking for Chief and Brain (both foxhunting now).



  9. #9
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    I can't believe you all are even taking this nonsense seriously and posting such well thought out replies.

    I had a really sassy reply all typed out then I thought why bother, since this thread is just another attempt at pot stirring.

    Yawn.



  10. #10
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    Yeah, I've seen much better pot-stirring. This one's pretty clumsy.



  11. #11
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    I agree that horse-wise, it's a ridiculous topic, but I personally get tired of reading all the human "politically correct" sentiments.

    ****
    New York Horse Rescue



  12. #12
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by pt:
    As long as the natural superiority of the Morgan is recognized, the others should be judged on a strictly PC basis.

    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I agree that this is a silly waste of time, on the other hand, pt has a point here....
    [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]

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  13. #13
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    You cannot white wash the world, nor should you try. It is an ugly place and cannot be made beautiful by throwing a couple layers of makeup and lacquer on it. A thin veneer is worse than letting the differences and ugliness show. There's no honesty in the former.

    I say let people be people and judge them for who they are. (How they think, behave and live.)

    Same with horses and judging. Everyone has a right to an opinion, and we pay the judges for theirs, so it's all subjective and political correctness would just open up our sport to more ridicule as well as more cry babies.

    It is what it is. Don't make excuses for it. If you really want to make a change, don't cover it over, expose it and change it.

    JMHO

    It's all about ME, ME, ME!!! (The only signature worthy of a real DQ.)
    "Relinquish your whip!!"



  14. #14
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    Thank you Serendipity!!

    Lettin' the cat outta the bag is a whole lot easier than puttin' it back- A Cowboy's Guide to Life
    The truth is rarely pure, and never simple. Oscar Wilde



  15. #15
    timedjumpoff is offline Working Hunter Premium Member
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    SERENDIPITY.........On most of your points I shall respectfully agree to disagree, though no need to
    get into it here. But i certainly am not in favor of most PC objectives, human or otherwise, and would be among the first to object to any of it invading the horse world.

    No intentional attempt to stir the pot, but with all the recent publicity re: the dumbing down of
    classroom curiculum to benefit the lowest common denominator(a friend of mine's daughter was placed in such a class and is bored to death, yet her parents cannot afford private school and are angry their daughter is being terribly shortchanged), and the elementary school soccer/baseball
    games,etc. where 9 and 10 year olds are not allowed to be winners or losers so as not to make them overly competitive (despite the fact that they will have to be in real life later on), not to mention the lowering of physical standards in certain professions to allow the formerly unqualified to now qualify, etc.

    I understand that this is not yet an issue in the horseworld, aned hope and pray it will never become one. Yet because of its growing influence
    in so many other areas, it's not unrealistic to be concerned about our own sport. I think most of us oppose any kind of animal cruelty...but what happens when a group like PETA, can get women to stop wearing fur in the name of political correctness, then take their mission to its ultimate goal of banning animals from being used by humans for anything. Then PC becomes a major issue for all of us. Even if PETA can't get everyone to stop eating/wearing animal products,
    they can get a lot of "socially conscious" non-horse people to side with them in banning rodeos, racing, hunting....and then, of course, could the rest of the horse world be far behind?

    [This message was edited by timedjumpoff on Sep. 04, 2002 at 01:50 PM.]

    [This message was edited by timedjumpoff on Sep. 04, 2002 at 01:57 PM.]
    "WHINNYING" IS EVERYTHING!!



  16. #16
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    Sure, timedjumpoff, since affirmative action has resulted in black people now controlling all of the nation's wealth and totally monopolizing the political system, surely it's only a matter of time before hunter classes are required to admit a quota of Arabs.

    [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif[/img] [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif[/img] [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif[/img] [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif[/img] [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif[/img]

    Really, though--don't worry, I'm sure that the working classes have enough to worry about, what with trying to feed their families and pay the rent on $4.25 an hour, and getting health care without health insurance. I doubt they'll be storming the gates at Devon next spring. Your interesting little world will be safe from the masses.



  17. #17
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    I KNOW it isn't really funny but you made me laugh! I'm envisioning the masses storming the gates at Devon!!!!

    Aqha Clique
    Can you stress-fracture your brain?



  18. #18
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    TJO, the efforts of PETA to stop all human interaction with animals can hardly be called a PC cause... [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif[/img]

    I agree with Serendipity. Your points are (somewhat) valid, but not under the cliche of political correctness.

    *EMMA*



  19. #19
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    There is a simple answer to this seemingly simple question.

    It sounds crazy because it is crazy. It is NOT part of American life. We are a capitalistic society. That won't change.

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  20. #20
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    I'm confused as to why everyone seems to think that Timedjumpoff is trying to stir up an argument. Timedjumpoff do you have a history as a trouble maker?? J/K [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

    I think TJO makes some interesting points. Why do they seem silly to everyone else???

    I happened to bring up the issue of giving all lead-liners blue ribbons at a horse show a few weeks ago. I say, pin the class (like they do at Devon, Upperville, etc...) I think its fine for all of the kids to get some kind of prize but I also think that children should begin to learn at a young age how to be graceful winners and graceful losers.

    Also, don't we already see some of this blue ribbon for everyone kind of attitude spreading beyond the lead line classes? There are schooling jumper classes that give blue ribbons to all of those who have clean rounds and schooling hunter classes that give blue ribbons to all of those who score over an 80 (for example). To me these classes represent the dummying down of the sport.

    The idea of banning high priced show clothes in favor of uniforms was also brought up. Sounds a lot like what went on in the Grand Prix ring at WEF. Instead of shirts and jackets riders were asked to wear polo shirts, I believe this was in an effort to show spectators that our sport is not elitist.

    I'm certainly not a pot stirrer, quite the opposite in fact. But do think some interesting points were made in the original post.
    "Owning a barnyard animal is not as easy as it looks on the internet."-Rob and Big



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