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  1. #1
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    Default PointTwo is once again reprimanded for misleading advertisements

    British Advertising Standards Authority Upholds Hit-Air Complaint Against Point Two [COTH]

    The full Adjudication Report, from the Advertising Standards Authority: ASA Adjudication on Point-2 Equine Ltd

    The short version: Hit-Air registed two complaints about an ad PointTwo ran with misleading statements about its competitors, both complaints were upheld by the ASA.

    As a result:
    The ad must not appear again in its current form. We told Point-2 to take care when making claims about their competitors' products in future to ensure they are not misleading or denigratory and to ensure they hold adequate substantiation for their claims.
    Last year, it was a different issue: PointTwo rapped for 'misleading' advertisements. ASA Adjudication Report here.

    Seriously, Point Two?



  2. #2
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    It's really too bad.

    You would think that with all the rider endorsements etc.. that Point Two enjoys, they wouldn't feel the need to engage in false/misleading advertising.

    Of course it doesn't come as a surprise to those of us on this BB who were promised research data by Point Two that was never delivered.

    It bothers me, I suppose, because safety equipment is involved, and one just expects a bit more integrity from manufacturers of air vests,( or parachutes , seat belts, car seats for infants, etc...) than from (for instance) makers of greeting cards...



  3. #3
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    So Point-Two is not only misrepresenting their OWN product, but also those of their competitors?

    Honestly, if these things were shown tomorrow to have iron-clad data demonstrating they're the best thing since penicillin I would not buy one from this company.
    Click here before you buy.



  4. #4
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    Default

    I quit believing Madison Avenue when my PF Flyers failed to make me run faster and jump higher. I think I was 8.



  5. #5
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    Default

    This explains why the P2 rep has never returned here. There is so much mis-representation of the product. Typical of folks who may know business and marketing but not what it is they are selling. (Regretfully, the same thing happens in the medical field with sales reps).

    Reed



  6. #6
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    I am officially disgusted by that company. Pretty soon we'll see infomercials with Ron Popeil and canned applause.

    Yet somehow their blind following increases in numbers. Must be the Kool-aid.
    "Drawing on my fine command of the English language, I said nothing" - Robert Benchley
    Cotton would fight.
    http://buildingthegrove.blogspot.com/



  7. #7
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    Default

    Or because the masses do not do further research. They see the top riders using them and that is good enough for them.
    I am on my phone 90% of the time. Please ignore typos, misplaced lower case letters, and the random word butchered by autocowreck.




  8. #8
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    I mentioned this before but some marketing expert is opening a Point Two store in town. There was a big write up in the local paper, and it was FULL of misinformation. Including some grandiose claims about it preventing neck trauma. It was sort of a fear-mongering piece.

    I'm trying to keep an open mind about this stuff. I really am. But I wonder if this company is setting itself up for a huge lawsuit.
    Brothers and sisters, I bid you beware
    Of giving your heart to a dog to tear.
    -Rudyard Kipling



  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by RAyers View Post
    This explains why the P2 rep has never returned here. There is so much mis-representation of the product. Typical of folks who may know business and marketing but not what it is they are selling. (Regretfully, the same thing happens in the medical field with sales reps).

    Reed
    The sales rep didn't need to come back here, in order to provide the information. He/she stated that the Director of Point Two would have the data posted on their website, in this thread from last year: http://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/sh...=323742&page=9.

    Originally Posted by Deltawave
    Can we get a link to the actual published research data on the Point-Twos, with materials and methods, definitions of forces, injuries, etc. etc?
    Originally Posted by Point Two USA
    Deltawave: Absolutely! The director of P2 has assured me that we will have the test results, what was tested, how it was tested and who did the testing on our website within 2 weeks.
    The only reasonable explanations are: 1) they don't have any data, or worse yet; 2) the data that they have, does not support the claims.

    They can bring in all the hired gun consultants they want, but if they can't produce clear data to support the product, it is just a lot of BS.

    JER: Thanks for your work the last few days. Really appreciate the fact based approach and clear presentation.



  10. #10
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    They don't have to have data if people are buying their product. Or, more importantly, if highly visible riders are wearing their product.

    In fact, it reduces their marketing costs significantly!

    The supplement industry has this technique down to a science . Pun intended.
    Equine Ink - My soapbox for equestrian writings & reviews.
    EquestrianHow2 - Operating instructions for your horse.



  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by SevenDogs View Post
    The only reasonable explanations are: 1) they don't have any data, or worse yet; 2) the data that they have, does not support the claims.

    They can bring in all the hired gun consultants they want, but if they can't produce clear data to support the product, it is just a lot of BS.

    JER: Thanks for your work the last few days. Really appreciate the fact based approach and clear presentation.
    I'm thinking it is this. If they had the research and it backed their claims they would be throwing it everywhere. They would be all over the fact that they have this superior product of safety.
    I am on my phone 90% of the time. Please ignore typos, misplaced lower case letters, and the random word butchered by autocowreck.




  12. #12
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    They don't have to have data if people are buying their product.
    I think they're banking, in fact, on the people who are buying their product BECOMING the "data". Why pay to do research if you can instead get people to pay to do it for you, by buying and using your product? Unlike in the supplement industry (who DOES have this method down) where anecdotes rule, there is mandatory injury reporting in eventing. Guaranteed data collection, no effort or expense required on the part of the company selling the vests.
    Click here before you buy.



  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by deltawave View Post
    I think they're banking, in fact, on the people who are buying their product BECOMING the "data". Why pay to do research if you can instead get people to pay to do it for you, by buying and using your product? Unlike in the supplement industry (who DOES have this method down) where anecdotes rule, there is mandatory injury reporting in eventing. Guaranteed data collection, no effort or expense required on the part of the company selling the vests.
    Egads....hadn't thought about it that way.

    I'm in your boat, delta. I wouldn't buy a product from this company even WITH hardcore data that showed it did all it was cracked up to be.



  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by deltawave View Post
    I think they're banking, in fact, on the people who are buying their product BECOMING the "data". Why pay to do research if you can instead get people to pay to do it for you, by buying and using your product? Unlike in the supplement industry (who DOES have this method down) where anecdotes rule, there is mandatory injury reporting in eventing. Guaranteed data collection, no effort or expense required on the part of the company selling the vests.
    Except that there is no control, in that type of data collection. There is no way to determine if a rider avoided serious injury because of the vest, or if the results would have been the exact same without the vest (or possibly better). Do those reports detail what "safety" equipment is being used (e.g. type of vest(s), helmet, etc.)?

    Now, I fully realize that Point Two is not selling based upon data. But, no one can deny that they marketing program has been successful, even though it is completely devoid of science.



  15. #15
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    Except that there is no control, in that type of data collection. There is no way to determine if a rider avoided serious injury because of the vest, or if the results would have been the exact same without the vest (or possibly better).
    Of course not! But they will package it up and make it sound good, mark my words.
    Click here before you buy.



  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by deltawave View Post
    Of course not! But they will package it up and make it sound good, mark my words.
    I don't doubt it one bit!!



  17. #17
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    PointTwo asks us to take it on faith and believe them when they say their products are 'safe' or 'safer.'

    Meanwhile, they've shot their own credibility in both feet. If they lie and mislead in their ads, where does it stop?

    At this point, why should we believe they're truthful in their marketing materials?



  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by deltawave View Post
    I think they're banking, in fact, on the people who are buying their product BECOMING the "data". Why pay to do research if you can instead get people to pay to do it for you, by buying and using your product? Unlike in the supplement industry (who DOES have this method down) where anecdotes rule, there is mandatory injury reporting in eventing. Guaranteed data collection, no effort or expense required on the part of the company selling the vests.
    EXCEPT, there is NO data from before P2 existed so they can make any claim they want and not worry about substantiation. Sure, they can try to do a paired comparison but the statistics won't work as far as I can tell - unless folks crash at the same fence in the same manner.



  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by RAyers View Post
    EXCEPT, there is NO data from before P2 existed so they can make any claim they want and not worry about substantiation.
    Well... that does seem to be their forte!



  20. #20
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    PSA: Under consumer protection laws, companies are required to have data to back up claims in advertising. Failure to do so may be an 'unfair or deceptive act or practice' under the FTC Act. The FTC does not typically act until they get a sufficient number of consumer complaints. So if you feel a company's actions are unfair or deceptive, consider taking a few minutes to complain to the FTC here: https://www.ftccomplaintassistant.gov/



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