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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan. 30, 2007
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    3,228

    Default Difficult JRT

    I'm posting this on behalf of a friend of mine who isn't a COTH member; hopefully I have enough useful info to help her find an answer!
    Scenario: Friend is an experienced pet owner (horses, several large and small breed dogs, cats; daughter is a vet tech). Her 6 month old JRT was neutered 2.5 weeks ago (she's had him for 4 months). Friend works from home, so is able to spend a lot of time with her pets. Her dogs are occasionally crated in her business, but are comfortable with it - these are for short periods while she is busy with clients. The rest of the time they individually have the run of the shop, or come into the house. When I saw JRT as a puppy he was happily napping in his crate, and came out to play.
    As he is getting older, JRT seems to have something to prove with other dogs (ie that he is the alpha). Her daughter brought a young bulldog home, which seems to have been the trigger for some surprising behaviours. He is wonderful with people, but will become very aggressive with certain other dogs; he gets along well with some, but is ready to fight with others (owner has had to intervene on more than one occasion). Also dislikes neighbour's puppy as well, so I don't think it's a territorial issue alone. He is also reactive to things from what she has told me - she said the wrong noise will shake him up.
    So, what suggestions can you offer for her? SHe is very open to obedience classes, but would like some additional idaeas that she can work on until she finds the right trainer.
    Much appreciated!
    Dee
    Founder of the I LOFF my worrywart TB clique!
    Official member of the "I Sing Silly Songs to My Animals!" Clique
    http://wilddiamondintherough.blogspot.ca/



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar. 8, 2004
    Location
    Baltimore, MD
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    Default

    Pretty sure Napoleon complex is in their dna. As long as she is the ultimate alpha and the dog respects that it probably is what it is.



  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan. 24, 2008
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    1,755

    Default

    It's like the bumper sticker says-they're football shaped for a reason.

    Just kiddng, (for the most part). But, as far as mine are concerned, I don't say it unless I 100% mean it. That means being committed to backing it up.

    I love my two, and I will never live without one, but they are big dogs in little bodies, and they will expand to fill the space allowed to them.



  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb. 22, 2010
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    574

    Default

    Sounds like every Jack I've ever known and trained!

    Has she contacted the breeder for info. and help? A good breeder can be a wealth of information, they know their dogs and their lines. They've lived with them and know how to train and handle them.

    Does your friend know about NILF? Nothing in Life is Free. Basically it means your dog should work for a living. Our dogs have a roof over their heads, food served regularly, toys, attention, etc. and most of the time all they have to do is be house trained and look cute!

    Tell your friend to think of her dog as a family member that moves back in, they need to pull their weight. Perhaps they pay rent, or help out with groceries, cooking, cleaning, mowing the yard, etc. You wouldn't allow them to lay around on the sofa all day while you waited on them!

    Here is some info. on NILF: http://www.nextdaypets.com/directory...ing%7E148.aspx
    Proud Native Texan!
    owned by 3 Cardigan Corgi's + 3 wonderful horses!



  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr. 1, 2008
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    4,830

    Default

    bunches of things she can do. NILF as suggested above, Relaxation Protocol, Look At Me and levels training.



  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jun. 20, 2000
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    Full time in Delhi, NY!
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    Default

    This dog is NOT getting the right kind of training. He definitely needs the NILF method, but even so it sounds like a bad fit. Relaxed family vs need to control JRT. When there isn't a firm Head of Household, a male Jack will frequently try to run the household.

    This will sound strange, and may not work if the pup was taken from his mom at 6 weeks before his dam could teach him proper dog behavior, but the owner should try dragging the pup by his tail (carefully!) when she's playing on the floor with him. His dam would've done that, and it should reinforce the 'who's in charge here' memory.

    I had to take a puppy back (at about the same age) when the husband left and the house was leaderless. The only one the puppy respected (the only one who could get him to go into his crate) was the 3 yo son ("Cwate Boomer CWATE!") because he (being a baby) frequently pulled the puppy around by the tail.

    But as for aggressive behavior towards other dogs, consistent work with a trainer will help, but he may never be happy living in a multiple dog household.
    ~Kryswyn~ Always look on the bright side of life, de doo, de doo de doo de doo
    Check out my Kryswyn JRTs on Facebook

    "Life is merrier with a terrier!"



  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb. 22, 2010
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    574

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Kryswyn View Post
    the pup was taken from his mom at 6 weeks before his dam could teach him proper dog behavior

    But as for aggressive behavior towards other dogs, consistent work with a trainer will help, but he may never be happy living in a multiple dog household.
    I agree 100%, this pup was taken from his dam and littermates at too young an age.

    Also agree that the temperament of the pup sounds like a complete mismatch for the owners.
    Proud Native Texan!
    owned by 3 Cardigan Corgi's + 3 wonderful horses!



  8. #8
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    Apr. 14, 2007
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    Pen Argyl PA
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    having previously raised and bred JRT's i can tell you, many are just dog aggressive. It's the main reason i stopped owning them. i loved them so much but could not deal with the dog aggression.



  9. #9
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    Jun. 20, 2000
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    Nezzy, I don't know how long ago you gave them up, but to my (JRTCA) mind, the only good thing about the recognition of the JRT by the AKC as the Parson and Russell terriers is that it's brought many people to the breed who do not, and will not, hunt their dogs and so even after just a few generations, the hunting instinct and the correlating dog aggressiveness is being diminished. Especially with the Russell terrier where most of the bloodlines are Australian. Since there are so many poisonous snakes in Oz, they've been deliberately breeding away from hunting for a long time.

    All the Russell breeders I know through various forums are very quick to say the reason they love these dogs are because they are so easy going. Even the one AKC Parson breeder I know, who still hunts her dogs, has breed away from aggression for over 15 years. She will not toleration aggression in her kennels.

    If you want to get another Jack, send me a PM and I'll happily recommend some breeders.
    ~Kryswyn~ Always look on the bright side of life, de doo, de doo de doo de doo
    Check out my Kryswyn JRTs on Facebook

    "Life is merrier with a terrier!"



  10. #10
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    Apr. 14, 2007
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    Pen Argyl PA
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    i was JRTCA and altho they were wonderful dogs, dog aggression was there. No thanks, i am enjoying my American Hairless Terriers now, they are a much more decaffinated version of the JRT. and no shedding.



  11. #11
    Join Date
    Feb. 6, 2003
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    Deep South
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    Default

    To get a terrier's attention you may have to get dramatic - just once, to impress on them that you are in charge and they'd better tow the line. I once threw one about 15 feet in to a creek, because she attacked my old GSP bitch. Since then it's been "Yes ma'am, no ma'am". (She is a real working terrier breed, that the KC will never get their hands on)
    I'd rather have a hunting dog, than allow the AKC to dumb them down. If you can't handle them - don't get one.
    ... _. ._ .._. .._



  12. #12
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    Jun. 11, 2004
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    Still here ~ not yet there
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pcostx View Post
    Sounds like every Jack I've ever known and trained!
    Yep! Except mine. I owned the only cowardly JRT every whelped -- for which I was actually grateful.

    I used to go to the JRT trials...they have ground races and what they call "muskrat races" in which the dogs chase a foxtail through the water (yes, JRTs LOVE swimming).

    In both cases all the dogs are muzzled. Why? Because one Jack would give another Jack the snake eye while they were swimming and before you know it the fox tail was forgotten and it was an aquatic free-for-all!

    No advice -- but training, training, training...however this "King Kong" behavior is a very common trait in JRTs.

    Once the bulldog submits, it might be alittle bit quieter in the house...I can tell you now the JRT ain't gonna back down...

    PS I have no idea if this is true or not, but a JRT breeder swore she knew a guy who used a pack of JRTs to tree bear...



  13. #13
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    May. 4, 2006
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Equibrit View Post
    To get a terrier's attention you may have to get dramatic - just once, to impress on them that you are in charge and they'd better tow the line. I once threw one about 15 feet in to a creek, because she attacked my old GSP bitch. Since then it's been "Yes ma'am, no ma'am". (She is a real working terrier breed, that the KC will never get their hands on)
    I'd rather have a hunting dog, than allow the AKC to dumb them down. If you can't handle them - don't get one.
    Right, they are what they are for a reason and they are not a stuffed toy type dog. Mine drives me crazy for that very reason but they really are supposed to be that way, why else would they be successful at fighting a fox underground? I do not tolerate my Jack starting fights and he will with a male every single time he gets a chance, so, I do not give him the chance. It is exhausting, because I do not need a high prey driven terrier at this point, I would not buy another one. When I do, I would in a heartbeat, they are hands down the best in the hunting terrier breeds, stubborn as they may be, they are extraordinarily smart.

    BTW, EB, I have to get dramatic everytime I ask this dog to do something that is not at the moment on his agenda. He is not neutered so that is likely contributing to it but he is just as driven over prey or food, and other dogs. If he sees one and is on the way to start trouble I almost have to use my "I am going to dismember you" voice before he will stop. I scare more people that way but I never, never recommend these dogs to a novice. Clancy is very handsome, dapper, endearing, cute and friendly to people. Every person I meet asks about him if they are at all interested in dogs, I always say, don't get one unless you need one.

    Kyzteke, about the bear, I would believe it. Above all else, Clancy loves a good fight and will feint and fight, and dart, and run, he used to play a game of "I am a doggie football" with my horse and once was seen swinging from his tail! Oh yes, I would use a pack of Jacks in a heartheat if I wanted to tree or pin a bear.
    Last edited by Calamber; Mar. 19, 2012 at 01:33 PM.
    "We, too, will be remembered not for victories or defeats in battle or in politics, but for our contribution to the human spirit." JFK



  14. #14
    Join Date
    Oct. 31, 2006
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    Mine is the sweetest dog with any person, except the mailman with black boots, but she is a pain with other dogs. i've had her 16 years. Tried everything. Now we just crate her when we are gone so she won't go after the other two dogs. She is covered with bite scars where she has gotten into fights with larger dogs. Now she has her own dog run and is segregated from the barn dog family. We love her but wouldn't have another one.



  15. #15
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    Jul. 13, 2008
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    I'm curious about the new addition, the bulldog, since that's also a type with a tendency toward dog-aggression. Maybe the JRT's surprising new behaviors kicked off when the new guy wasn't quite as submissive as the JRT wants/needs.



  16. #16
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    Aug. 12, 2010
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    Massachusetts
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    We have an ACD/JRT mix (eek!). She is very much like that and always has been. She is a very bossy dog. She's 14 now and was here "first", so we choose other pets based on whether they would try to challenge her or not. I don't believe there is any way we could "train" her personality out of her, our dog trainer agrees . It's bascially her way or the highway with other animals. Her demands aren't unreasonable...she must go through all doors after people, but before all other animals, no running in the house, no stealing people food, no taking her marrow bone (the only treat she cares about) and no seeking my husband's (her #1 person) attention when he comes home before she has gotten some. Otherwise, she could care less what they do and ignores them...they can eat her dinner, that's fine with her. Our younger dog knows Dale's rules and conforms 95% of the time, if she doesn't, she gets snarled at and snapped at if she doesn't back down fast enough. The young dog is more submissive, so she does not fight back when disciplined by the ACD/JRT, we HAD to get a dog that would do that or there would be constanting fighting as the older dog will NOT back down. The cats don't find the rules to be a problem at all . We don't take visiting dogs (I'll dog sit for relatives) unless they are OK with not challenging the old dog. She loves our neigborh's Pit, he acknowledged her "superiority" the day he met her and has never onced questioned her and he's the only dog she'll play with.



  17. #17
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    Jan. 30, 2007
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    Thanks all of you for your input; I've written her a summary and forwarded it on to her. She spoke today to another breeder, who mirrored a lot of what was said here. I don't konw the reason for his early weaning, but she likely rescued him form a difficult situation - she is a good egg to all of her naimals. \I've had two firiends with Jacks (one a breeder) , and I remember each of them having some pretty epic CTJ meetings with their dogs. My dear late friend had a great little dog who was a holy teror in his youth - he'd pull stunts like interruptin g a conversation by lifiting his leg on her while she was talking, or the time he chewed her seatbelt in half when she ran into a store . Miss her and the little terror - he was an amazing rat dog
    Dee
    Founder of the I LOFF my worrywart TB clique!
    Official member of the "I Sing Silly Songs to My Animals!" Clique
    http://wilddiamondintherough.blogspot.ca/



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