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  1. #1
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    Default Coat color--Brown in JC TBs

    Genetically what is brown?

    I've just looked in Wikipedia, and now I'm wondering if many JC browns are just dark liver chestnut.
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  2. #2
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    Mar. 24, 2010
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    Does JC list horses as just brown? My guy's papers say dark bay/brown, and I don't remember seeing a horse listed as brown only.
    My horse is a dressage diva so I don't have to be.

    Quote Originally Posted by katarine
    If you have a fat gay horse that likes Parelli, you're really screwed



  3. #3
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    Jul. 3, 2007
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    Default

    I had a dark bay/brown mare. Genetically EEAta.



  4. #4
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    Dec. 13, 1999
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by vineyridge View Post
    Genetically what is brown?
    The Agouti gene has 4 presentations - a (not affecting anything), A (bay), At (brown) and A+ (wild bay).

    I've just looked in Wikipedia, and now I'm wondering if many JC browns are just dark liver chestnut.
    TJC may well call a dark liver "brown", but mostly I think they get it right in the "dark bay/brown" category.

    The genetically black horse (E?aa) who has brown hairs on him usually gets listed as "dark bay/brown" though, which is a shame.

    Quote Originally Posted by netg View Post
    Does JC list horses as just brown? My guy's papers say dark bay/brown, and I don't remember seeing a horse listed as brown only.
    Just "brown" is not an option presented
    http://www.jockeyclub.com/registry.asp?section=3#color

    Just "dark bay/brown" as per your horse.
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  5. #5
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    Apr. 12, 2002
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    Texas
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    Default

    I've been told that my guy is brown, but we refer to him as the dark liver baynut. He has the agouti gene look, but his dark points are brown, not black and his mane and tail fade out to blonde very quickly with plum cherry highlights.

    https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-W...cobubblesa.jpg
    Rhode Islands are red;
    North Hollands are blue.
    Sorry my thoroughbreds
    Stomped on your roo. Originally Posted by pAin't_Misbehavin' :



  6. #6
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    racetrack - more pictures? A tell-tale area will be his pasterns. If they are reddish in tint, whether light or dark, he's chestnut (liver in this case)
    ______________________________
    The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances. - ET



  7. #7
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    Mar. 17, 2003
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    Racetrack - handsome boy! He looks dark liver to me. What were his parents?

    One of Cy's Tb sons has been tested and is brown. Pretty sure that Cy's half brother is as well.
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  8. #8
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    Has Cyriz been tested himself? I know he surely looks black, but having seen a "oh he HAS to be black" but tested brown horse, I don't make that assumption any more LOL
    ______________________________
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  9. #9
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    Nov. 28, 2000
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    Ontario, Canada
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    Just wondering, is 'seal brown' genetically different from 'brown'?
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  10. #10
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    No, seal is just a shade of brown, just like mahogany is a shade of bay.

    There are other factors, untestable at this point, which determine shade.
    ______________________________
    The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances. - ET



  11. #11
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    Oct. 3, 2002
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    Default

    At one time they used to register horses as just brown ~

    Seattle Slew




  12. #12
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    JB - Cyriz has been tested. He's hetero. black. I'm pretty sure his mom, Dance Account, whom PTF and I had the pleasure of owning at the end of her days, was dark brown...like espresso, almost black but just not.
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  13. #13
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    Apr. 12, 2002
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    Thanks!

    Sorry, I forgot about this thread. Here are some more pics of Basco (JC reg as Squillion). I call him Basco because he reminds me of chocolate syrup..lol.

    That photos was taken in summer and he was a bit faded, but I have tons of others to post.

    http://i439.photobucket.com/albums/q...orses1/266.jpg

    http://i439.photobucket.com/albums/q...5-16-09024.jpg

    http://i439.photobucket.com/albums/q...s1/pony023.jpg

    https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/phot...eat=directlink

    https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/phot...eat=directlink
    Rhode Islands are red;
    North Hollands are blue.
    Sorry my thoroughbreds
    Stomped on your roo. Originally Posted by pAin't_Misbehavin' :



  14. #14
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    Mar. 24, 2010
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    Default

    Very interesting - I would definitely call Basco chesnut! I'm curious how he'd test.
    My horse is a dressage diva so I don't have to be.

    Quote Originally Posted by katarine
    If you have a fat gay horse that likes Parelli, you're really screwed



  15. #15
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    I'm still on the fence - not entirely convinced of liver. His pasterns really don't have a red hue to them like I'd expect.

    This picture especially
    http://i439.photobucket.com/albums/q...5-16-09024.jpg

    would seem like it would HAVE to have shown red highlights on his lower legs.

    I'm not saying he's not liver, his pedigree certainly doesn't help LOL But I'm just not convinced, yet, that he's not brown.
    ______________________________
    The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances. - ET



  16. #16
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    Apr. 14, 2001
    Location
    Fort Collins, CO
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    Quote Originally Posted by nasalberry View Post
    At one time they used to register horses as just brown ~

    Seattle Slew

    Seattle Slew was registered as "Dark Bay or Brown" according to the Jockey Club:

    http://www.equineline.com/Free-5X-Pe...ts_indicator=Y

    Data on PQ is all user entered and may or may not be accurate.



  17. #17
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    yep, exactly, pedigreequery is not the official JC site. Storm Cat was also a dark brown, listed on pedigree as "br" but listed on equineline as "dark bay or brown"
    ______________________________
    The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances. - ET



  18. #18
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    Do you need better pictures JB? Like closer up on his legs? I can take some this weekend if you let me know what you need.
    I will say his points are more brown than red, but in person people refer to them as reddish, so I'm no help at all..lol.
    Rhode Islands are red;
    North Hollands are blue.
    Sorry my thoroughbreds
    Stomped on your roo. Originally Posted by pAin't_Misbehavin' :



  19. #19
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    LOL, no need to go out of your way. I just find these guys very very interesting because they are just not blatantly one way or the other.

    If you're up to some pics for grits and shiggles, then sure - some close up of his lower legs in bright, but not glaring light, and some of his ears, particularly the backs of them (looking at the tips in particular, but show the whole ear), it would be pretty interesting.
    ______________________________
    The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances. - ET



  20. #20
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    Apr. 14, 2006
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    Years ago the JC simplified the registration decisions by combining two of the most problematic colors. They made one choice of "Dark Bay or Brown" and "Gray or Roan". Their only interest is identification, not genetics!! Same reason you see very few registered "Black" horses. Too much trouble. If the track identifer finds one red hair the papers go back to JC for a change.
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