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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Oct. 16, 2001
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    500

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    Cartilage biologist here, just chiming in
    Quote Originally Posted by NorCalDressage View Post
    As far as I know, nothing has been shown or suggested that it is able to "rebuild" cartilage. Once it's gone, it's gone.
    YES. No matter what anyone says/writes/believes, there has been absolutely NO evidence that mammalian cartilage has any capacity to "rebuild" itself. After damage to cartilage, the very best you can hope for is formation of a cartilaginous scar tissue that is structurally and functionally inferior to true articular cartilage.


    Quote Originally Posted by NorCalDressage View Post
    https://www.kinetictech.net/pdf/Sodi...icacyStudy.pdf

    https://www.kinetictech.net/pdf/ConquerStudy_EVJ.pdf

    Yes, both of those are from Kinetic, which sells Conquer, but I didn't have the time to go searching at the moment.....
    Yes, ONE of those studies was published in a peer reviewed journal. The other was not. There is a reason. Personally, I take these "studies" with a grain of salt. Outcome measures were extremely subjective, and if the results were really that exciting/scientifically valid they would have been published somewhere besides EVJ.

    Once upon a time, I thought it would be really cool if I could work in R&D for equine joint supplement companies. Then, I realized that these companies don't actually have R&D departments because they don't actually DO any research (there are very few exceptions to this). In fact, good luck even finding a qualified scientist/nutritionist at these companies at all. IMHO if you want spend money on supplements for your horse, you'll do just as well (or better) researching and purchasing the ingredients yourself.
    *Absolut Equestrian*

    "The plural of anecdote is not fact...except in the horse industry"



  2. #22
    Join Date
    Jan. 26, 2010
    Posts
    4,961

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    Thank you Absolute! So, as a cartilage biologist (didn't know there was such a thing) what do you think is somewhat useful and somewhat a waste of money as a joint supplement for horses?

    I just got my Purebulk shipment in and I need to figure out how to dose all of this stuff. It's amazing how little space pure ingredients take! I bought 25 grams of pure biotin, which should last 500 days at a dose of 50 mg, or something like that. It's smaller than a small envelope. It cost me $80. For Biotin Plus at ValleyVet, the same dose for 240 days is $140.

    So, anyone want to help me with the math here? Chondroitin dose is about 1700 mg, maybe double dose for 3000 mg/day. I bought a kg for $93, which is 1,000,000 mg. So, at a double dose of 3000 mg/day, that's 333 days worth or 666 days (ooooh) at a normal dose of about 1500. At ValleyVet the liquid chondroitin is $34 for a liquid that lasts 34 to 256 days.

    Anyone experienced with dosing with these? I'm going to have to pull out all of my measurers and figure this out. The chondroitin says 1500 mg is 3/8 tsp., so a 1/2 tsp a day?



  3. #23
    Join Date
    Mar. 16, 2006
    Location
    Larkspur, Colo.
    Posts
    4,704

    Default

    I was just checking out the web site and noticed the "Volumetrics" link on the chondroitin sulfate page, which links to this helpful chart:

    http://purebulk.com/images/Bulk-Dens...in-Sulfate.gif

    I've been buying pure glucosamine HCL from NutraBulk and feeding my horse a gigantic dose (~18,000 mg per day). It was an experiment to see if this would replace the daily Corta-Flx and Adequan shots (the injections leave big hard lumps).

    It's been just over two months and my horse has never felt better. The last Adequan series was several months ago. At $33 per kg, this costs about $20/month.

    I also give MSM and Lubrisyn, though that's been very sporadic because I keep forgetting to take it to the barn with me. I've been using an oral HA product for years but am starting to think I may be able to drop that as well.



  4. #24
    Join Date
    Jan. 26, 2010
    Posts
    4,961

    Default

    Thanks, Larkspur. I have been calculating away, but on the labels of all of the stuff I bought it tells how many mg per tsp., so it's actually easier than I thought. Most stuff I just feed a 1/2 tsp. a day.



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