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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jun. 30, 2005
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    2,185

    Default Cryptorchid ~ Any Success Stories?

    I have an opportunity to get an amazing horse (lots of professional training and very talented) but he is a Cryptorchid that can at times act very studdy. Surgery to get the undescended testicle was unsuccessful because it was attached to the stomach wall.

    Does anyone have success stories in handling cryptorchids?
    RIP Sucha Smooth Whiskey
    May 17,2004 - March 29, 2010
    RIP San Lena Peppy
    May 3, 1991 - March 11, 2010



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb. 23, 2009
    Location
    Texas Upper Gulf Coast
    Posts
    375

    Default

    My gelding Biscuit was/is Cryptorchid but his surgery was successful in retrieving the errant testicle. He had no trouble recovering from the surgery nor does he have any studdy behaviors.

    When I first got my former horse and boarded him, there was a gelding there that was "proud" cut. He was a handful...herding the horses around, constantly mounting and penetrating a mare and kept her constantly on the run. I would have kept him separated from mares at the very least but they just kept turning him out with the others.

    Wish I had more information for you but those are the only two that I have personal knowledge of.



  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec. 31, 2000
    Location
    El Paso, TX
    Posts
    12,538

    Default

    Basically you have a stallion that may experience pain depending on where the other testicle is. I wouldn't want to be leaving the ground at the base of a jump, and have something cause a twinge of acute pain in the horse.



  4. #4
    Join Date
    Apr. 13, 2011
    Posts
    48

    Default

    In humans they have had some success with HCG hormone therapy.
    You may ask your vet if it's possible or if he could be part of a study for hormone therapy, which is usually low cost or free. My vet had success with the depo (progestrin) shot for naughty geldings but didn't think it worked well for mares. It's a once a month shot I think( not sure) about $50.
    He may mature a bit out of the studdish behavior, once he's separated from mares but if he's really a great horse who acts a little studdish, granted you can handle him, I'd just try to manage it as best as possible.



  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar. 20, 2010
    Location
    Bucks County, PA
    Posts
    1,696

    Default

    I rode at a Dressage barn where there were stallions, including a cryptorchid Belgian/TB. The crypt made the stallions seem like geldings. He was so studdish and would rear when there were mares around, whether you were on his back or leading him. His situation was that same as yours--surgery was unsuccessful. I know he mounted mares that were being ridden while he was ridden. He was so strong there was nothing his owner could do. He had to be ridden alone in a covered round pen, but he would still act up even if he could smell a mare. I hope your guy is not as bad as Sundance. Good luck!



  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr. 19, 2011
    Location
    Madison, GA
    Posts
    2,784

    Default

    Basically you would be buying a stallion and would have to take all the same precautions. Are you up for that?

    On a funny side note, we have a local horse festival a couple of weeks ago and someone was describing a cryptorchid rescue horse over the loud speaker and how they needed to raise money for his surgery. Well the actual announcer asked the girl who was talking about the horse what a cryptochid was... over the loud speaker... which led to a really funny explanation over the loud speaker to about a hundred non horsey people as to what exactly a cryptorchid is



  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jan. 21, 2010
    Posts
    2,170

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    My oldest is a unilateral cryptorchid, but we did not find out until a decade after I bought him (via blood tests). I always thought he was just a brat of a beefcake pony. And it could be just a very strong pony personality, as most of his misdeeds can be misconstrued as naughty pony problems.

    We've never had dangerous stud behavior, or "classic" stud behavior. The pieces clicked when we had him at a hospital for joint injections when he was 18 and a mare and foal walked in and he went bonkers. That was the only classic stud-like behavior we had ever seen him exhibit.

    He's now 25 and a rockstar.



  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun. 17, 2010
    Posts
    559

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    Owned one once, but he never had any interest in mares, previous owner had tried to breed him unsuccessfully. He was basically just a gelding for me. Hope your situation works out for you.



  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jul. 5, 2007
    Location
    Beside Myself ~ Western NY
    Posts
    6,756

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    I hate to get one accidentally. I wouldn't sign up for getting one on purpose.



  10. #10
    Join Date
    Mar. 8, 2004
    Location
    Baltimore, MD
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    I have plenty of experience with crypts but not with one that was unable to be gelded. I had one whose errant testicle was all the way up by his back so it was more or less a colic surgery to get it out but they did get it out. I would not want one that was unable to be removed. If you really want the horse maybe get a second opinion from a top surgeon about removing it. I find it hard to believe they couldn't figure out some way to do it.



  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jun. 30, 2005
    Posts
    2,185

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    Thanks for the replies!! The owner cannot handle him because they are beginner riders and that is why they are selling him. I know this horses breeder and trainer and they never had any problems with him and they had him for several years. However they know how to handle stallions.

    I have never owned a stallion but I have been around lots of them and I understand how they need to be handled. I am just not sure if I want to deal with it but this is a very nice horse............
    RIP Sucha Smooth Whiskey
    May 17,2004 - March 29, 2010
    RIP San Lena Peppy
    May 3, 1991 - March 11, 2010



  12. #12
    Join Date
    Sep. 24, 2008
    Posts
    1,671

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    I have never owned a stallion but I have been around lots of them and I understand how they need to be handled. I am just not sure if I want to deal with it but this is a very nice horse............
    Being around stallins does not equate to knowing how to handle one. I've been around and handled them for a long time and I STILL screwed up about a month ago and could have been seriously injured if he wasn't such a good boy.

    Add the general "attitude" that a lot of crypts have and there is no way I'd take one. Because they are "geldings" most of them never had the early training in behaviour that a stallion needs in order to learn that people rule. IME, they have been let get away with things that owners would never let a "real" stud do....and they become bratty, big and pushy because of it.

    I'd look at it as having a horse who you have to treat as a stallion without the upside of being able to breed. Not a decent trade-off to me.

    The idea of adhesions has also been mentioned.

    I could go on, but you get the idea.
    Best of luck, but plan to spend your time together being ultra-on guard, rather than just enjoying all that great training someone has put on him. Could be a real exercise in frustration for both.

    NJR

    PS...
    Thanks for the replies!! The owner cannot handle him because they are beginner riders and that is why they are selling him. I know this horses breeder and trainer and they never had any problems with him and they had him for several years. However they know how to handle stallions.
    What the heck were the experienced breeder/trainers thinking to sell a rig to a beginner horseperson?
    Your beliefs don't make you a better person, your behaviour does.



  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jul. 16, 2003
    Location
    Guthrie, OK
    Posts
    1,602

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    The testicle can't be attached to his stomach. Testicles are behind/near the kidneys. That is behind the stomach.

    General anesthesia and major abdominal surgery will be needed if the testicle truly is that far in his abd. Some places are having luck with laproscopic removal but I am not knowledgeble in that area to even open my mouth any more than that.

    Horse needs to be seen by a SURGEON, ie a vet with DACVS behind his name.

    I know some crypts can be good horses. So can some stallions. Alot of it is how they are raised and handled. But others are just plain bad.

    Unless you are absolutely in love with this horse and have the money for surgery, I would pass.

    Just my 2 cents.



  14. #14
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    Jul. 5, 2007
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    Beside Myself ~ Western NY
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    6,756

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    Sounds like he went into surgery, and the testicle was irretrievable. I had a colt who was a crypt, and the vet warned me they could get in there and still have to leave the testicle.



  15. #15
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    Jun. 30, 2005
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    Quote Originally Posted by SmartAlex View Post
    Sounds like he went into surgery, and the testicle was irretrievable. I had a colt who was a crypt, and the vet warned me they could get in there and still have to leave the testicle.
    I was told that they did surgery and the testicle was adhered to his stomach and it was too risky to remove it without damaging the stomach. I did not question it any further than that because at that point they hadn't decided to sell him.
    RIP Sucha Smooth Whiskey
    May 17,2004 - March 29, 2010
    RIP San Lena Peppy
    May 3, 1991 - March 11, 2010



  16. #16
    gizmo Guest

    Default

    Hmmmm...sounds like my horse story. I find it amazing that the original breeder would even try to buy this horse for themselves only to re-sell to an unsuspecting Non Pro. Could it be possible that this same horse was purchased along with a mare that came complete with acute laminitus but that is another issue all it's own. Several thousands of dollars have been spent on this "gelding" that we purchased not to mention what the horse has had to go through. I also find it amazing that someone who did not assist in the actual surgery is willing to dispute the fact that the dislodged testicle has not reloacted itself in the intestine. There is another surgery that possibly could have be done but that would literally involve laying his intestines out on the surgical table in an attempt to locate and remove the floating testicle, however small it may be. In being an unsuccessful surgery, the horse now runs the high risk of gaining a blockage and will therefore likely die from colic. Should he not colic he has cancer to look forward to. Hormone therapy has only prolonged the inevitable and has proved to be disappointing. This horses HCG levels remain at the lower end of the sperm count but they are definitely stallion numbers range. This horse has been in professional training for the last year and the trainer has been incredibly supportive through this entire ordeal. It is a miracle that no one has gotten hurt as his behavior has become upredictable..... Can't tell me they didn't know?



  17. #17
    Join Date
    Jun. 30, 2005
    Posts
    2,185

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    Gizmo ~ you have a PM
    RIP Sucha Smooth Whiskey
    May 17,2004 - March 29, 2010
    RIP San Lena Peppy
    May 3, 1991 - March 11, 2010



  18. #18
    Join Date
    Apr. 10, 2008
    Posts
    660

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    Quote Originally Posted by Diamondindykin View Post
    I was told that they did surgery and the testicle was adhered to his stomach and it was too risky to remove it without damaging the stomach. I did not question it any further than that because at that point they hadn't decided to sell him.
    I'm going to second Meghan - get a second opinion from a veterinarian that is a specialist in equine surgery (ie. John Doe, DVM, DACVS) it is extremely difficult to reach much of the stomach from the abdomen of a horse during surgery (even if you have it waaaay oepn) and it is extremely unlikely that a testicle would be adhered to the stomach since like Meghan says they are usually (ie. 99.999999% of the time) found between the kidneys and the scrotum.

    Did they mean it was adhered to the bladder?

    The only horse I have known that was a cryptorchid that two testicles were not found on was an OTTB that had likely been previously gelded with the cryptorchid testicle removed and the descended one left behind. The owner had purchased him off the track and needed to geld him for the boarding barn - he was encouraged to pursue hormone testing to determine if there was still a testicle in the abdomen, but I don't think he did since the horse looked (and acted) like a gelding.

    I might look into the story a little more, but doesn't sound like an issue I would want to take on since you could be looking at significant $$ (and rehab time after major abdominal surgery) to resolve it.



  19. #19
    Join Date
    Nov. 6, 2009
    Location
    Silvana, WA
    Posts
    950

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    I had a paint gelding that was a cryptorchid, he'd already had surgery by the time I bought him. He was my first horse as a grown-up and I didn't know when I bought him - found out later from the breeder after I tracked her down. I bought him as a trail horse. Yeah, I loved him, but most other horses and people didn't.

    He was a bit studdy and a bit socially inept since he hadn't had his surgery until he was 4 and was kept isolated as a stallion until then. Generally he was a pissy, unhappy, fairly unfriendly and uncooperative horse. If he hadn't died of a torsion colic I likely would have sold him. Wouldn't buy one again.

    Plus, FWIW, I'm pretty sure I know the horse you're talking about. There's no way I'd take on his issues as a non-pro. He's a bit too unpredictable and "hormonal" for me and much better suited to being a horse with a full time JOB.



  20. #20
    gizmo Guest

    Default surgery

    Thank you all for your imput. What you all may not know is that Gizmo was re-gelded last year, unsuccessfully and we have had three veterinary clinics two of which are equine specialists working with us since we brought him home from the previous owners/breeders/trainers. Stump removal, tissue samples, blood work, all sent off for testing post surgery. The equine surgeon is an equine specialist and a top surgeon in her field. She had explored all of the above areas that you have all mentioned. I have to add that when we first brought Giz home it was obvious even to our neighbors that something was wrong with him. She did not even know the horse but immediately set up a 10 foot barrier fence between him and her mares. Because of this blog we realized the previous owner was encouraging her non pros to purchase this unpredictable horse. We were frightened for her and anyone else that might be mislead or mistified by his striking looks and past memories of a sweet little colt that the previous owners once had. Because of this we have contacted our surgeon and have decided to give it one more try. This is a colic type surgery and will require another 90 days of stall rest and rehab. This is only giving him and us a 50/50 chance that our Vet can locate the testicle or that he will survive the surgery, but my husband loves this horse and they are both worth the risk. Without the surgery his quality of life is tortured at best and he deserves to be a happy healthy horse. My Cowboy and Gizmo thank you. D



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