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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jun. 27, 2003
    Posts
    6,030

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    This may or may not be stirring the pot but anyway....It seems I am not the only one out there that is frustrated by my choices in hunter stallions this year. Are we lacking them in this country? Are we more focused on producing jumpers & dressage horses? The inspections & stallion tests are obviously geared toward jumpers & more so dressage horses, which ia a whole other ball of wax.

    I'll agree that we do have some really good producing hunter stallions, but they seem so few & far between. The stud fees keeps going up year after year or they offer no LFG after your mare has reached a certain age, etc. I could go on... I can think of one stallion whose fee has jumpes $1200 in ~2 years, yet his foals have yet to prove themselves because they are not of riding age yet. To me that's somewhat greedy.

    Am I missing something here or have I lost my mind? (The few of you that know me here are not allowed to answer the latter part. http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_c.../icon_wink.gif) I know that the mare also is a huge part of the equation too, but that's not what I am talking about. It seems that when I find a stallion I really like, I always find out something that turns me off to him, such as he & his babies are hot, he produces clubby feet, the SO is a PITA to work with, or he's smaller than advertised, etc. I'm not asking for suggestions here because I think I have it narrowed down. I'm just really frustrated & want to know if others are too. The few people I've talked to seem to be feeling the same way. http://chronicleforums.com/images/cu...ilies/sigh.gif



  2. #2
    Join Date
    May. 19, 2005
    Location
    Carroll County, Maryland
    Posts
    24

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    Might be a bit biased... but you might want to check out Coromino. Coromino himself competes as a jumper and cross trains in dressage and I believe with his jump, movement, and temperament he is an excellent choice for hunter breeding. He produces lovely youngsters, with great conformation, disposition, and athleticism. Feel free to ask others what they think of Coromino offspring, and if after you do you are interested, look us up. Oh, and BTW, his stud fee is under $1000 LFG.
    Thank you! http://www.heritagemanorfarm.com
    Amy M. Stika
    Heritage Manor Sporthorses
    ...Warmblood Stallions, Breeding & Sales...
    ROUTINIER, COROMINO, AND RHYTHM & BLUES



  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jul. 18, 2001
    Location
    Here and there
    Posts
    5,498

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    In a word: YES.
    Not all who wander are lost.



  4. #4
    Join Date
    Sep. 15, 2005
    Location
    near historic Gettysburg PA
    Posts
    2,681

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    our fourth generation American homebred Warmblood stallion is doing dressagee but he has an incredible history of hunters in his background, including some of the top in the US, ya just gotta read our fine print to learn that http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_c...icon_smile.gif and he is 950 including booking fee.. They are out there, happy hunting!
    here are pictures of his sister at 4 years old
    Beaujagold
    Beaujagold
    "It's not how good you ride, It's how good your horse covers for you." -Kristan
    Magic Rose Farm- home of Beste Gold & Hot Shot
    Beste Gold & Offspring on Facebook
    Magic Rose Farm Warmbloods on FB



  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr. 29, 2003
    Location
    Hartford, Wi. 53027
    Posts
    2,734

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    You might consider Ironman, he is known for his fabulous disposition, his babies are great tempered just like him, he does NOT produce clubby feet or any other defects. This year he is ranked 3rd in the U.S. for Hunter Breeding.
    http://www.ironmanonline.com
    Nancy
    Home of Ironman: GOV, BWP, RPSI, CSHA, AWR, ISR Oldenburg, CWHBA, CSHA, CS, and PHR.
    www.ironmanonline.com



  6. #6
    Join Date
    Feb. 2, 2001
    Location
    FL
    Posts
    1,696

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    I may be completely wrong, but it seems like so many of the hunter stallions that seem promising as show horses end up getting sold and gelded. I can think of four or five from around the time I had my stallion that were gelded (my boy was sold and gelded in 1999) and I know of a few since that time as well.

    Out of curiosity, what do you look for when you look for a hunter stallion? Offspring showing hunters? The stallion showing hunters? Just general movement, jump, conformation, temperament? Only approved stallions?

    I would think that trying to breed to WB approved hunter stallions would make the choices even more limited.



  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb. 22, 2000
    Location
    Keswick, VA
    Posts
    7,871

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    Yes. I completely agree with you. A good hunter stallion is very, very hard to find.
    I may be too picky, but I too tend to find irredeemable turn-offs in a lot of the stallions geared toward the hunter market. Or in their offspring.
    Or, the marketing itself is to blame. WHY is it that a lot of stallion owners promote their horses as the sire of a particular horse that could only send prospective breeders running the other direction? If you stand a hunter stallion, you should have some idea of the goals of the discipline, right? And, some of the horses marketed towards the hunter breeders are in no way suitable for the hunter ring or for the production of hunters.
    I think it's hard to breed for a hunter, as there are so many factors that one has to take into account, and that has a lot to do with the lack of suitable stallions as well.



  8. #8
    Join Date
    Apr. 26, 2004
    Location
    Petaluma, CA USA
    Posts
    2,914

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    Yes. Drives me nuts. Seems like there is a whole slew of them pushing the $2500. mark and some have recently raised their rate above that.
    I guess I could start breeding to stallions that are more of an 'all around' kinda guy but then it is a harder sell when the market you are shooting for wants the tried and true hunter names.
    I will keep breeding to one or two 'traditional' hunter stallions each year but add a young up and coming stallion and one or two mares will go to popular stallions that I really like that seem like they could produce a hunter if bred to the right mare.
    I can not imagine how expensive some of these stallions will get when their first crops are competing as 4-5 year olds. I will probably need to take out a second mortgage on the farm just to pay the booking fee!

    Genevieve



  9. #9
    Join Date
    Sep. 15, 2005
    Location
    near historic Gettysburg PA
    Posts
    2,681

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    hmm gee Genevieve,, mine is up and coming! He was 2005 highest scoring stallion in all North American for American Warmblood Registry!( and one of the top few EVER! ,, He also has a great hunter family, as well as dressage http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_c...icon_smile.gif One of the top East Coast Hunter handlers just leased a very fancy mare to breed to our boy http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_c...icon_smile.gif
    "It's not how good you ride, It's how good your horse covers for you." -Kristan
    Magic Rose Farm- home of Beste Gold & Hot Shot
    Beste Gold & Offspring on Facebook
    Magic Rose Farm Warmbloods on FB



  10. #10
    Join Date
    Apr. 26, 2004
    Location
    Petaluma, CA USA
    Posts
    2,914

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    Congratulations MagicRose. Very impressive.
    Genevieve



  11. #11
    Join Date
    Dec. 8, 2004
    Posts
    486

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    I agree with your sentiments. When it boils doen to it there just don't seem to be a ton of great hunter stallions out there. I am quite frustrated this year...I like a number of stallions, but haven't had my socks knocked off by any one in particular.

    I have found myself looking more towards jumper or dressage horses that have the qualities one looks for in a hunter as well, just not the show record.

    I'm really not sure why this is, but I do agree that it seems many good hunter type stallions are being gelded and ridden by juniors.



  12. #12
    Join Date
    May. 27, 2005
    Location
    Florida, Where Ponies are Beachin\'
    Posts
    463

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    All I breed is ponies and I stand my own pony stallions but when I saw this stallion I went out and BOUGHT pony mares to breed to him.
    I currently have one small Welsh mare in foal to him and will be breeding pony mares and horse mares to him this Spring.

    Remember you heard it from me first and remember this name : Escapade. Watch for him at WEF this Winter Circuit.

    He is a black sabino with all the chrome Hanoverian by Escudo 1 out of a Graf Grannus mare.... plus..He is a great mover, fabulous jump and the sweetest of temperments (I actually collected him to breed to my pony)

    Heres a pic just taken a few weeks ago:

    Escapade
    Standing ART I DECKED OUT Dutch/Welsh Pony Stallion - Lifetime Licensed RPSI German Riding PonyBook I, WINDSONG I'M FANCY TOO Welsh Sec A & BRIERWOOD Welsh/TB
    www.adventurebeachponies.com



  13. #13
    Join Date
    Feb. 22, 2000
    Location
    Keswick, VA
    Posts
    7,871

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    Escapade. Watch for him at WEF this Winter Circuit.
    In what with whom?



  14. #14
    Join Date
    Sep. 25, 2002
    Location
    MA
    Posts
    819

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    wow, adventure beach pony- that stallion is lovely. Please tell me everything you know about him http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_c...icon_smile.gif My mare is nowhere near breeding but I love to shop! The problem I've had (in hypothetically shopping http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_c...on_biggrin.gif) is that I would want a stallion who doesn't throw anything bigger than 16.2. Many of my favorite stallions are 16.3+ (Ironman is one of them) I love that escapade is 16.2! Okay so where are the jumping pics and pedigree? Have you met him? What is his temperment like? That will be one of the biggest factors. thanks ABP! BTW your stallion and ponies are truly stunning. The pictures of the girls on the beach are awe inspiring http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_c...icon_smile.gif
    Member of the *OMG I loff my mare!* clique.



  15. #15
    Join Date
    Oct. 5, 2002
    Location
    pa
    Posts
    462

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    OK, I usually don't post but I like this thread. I have 3- I Am The Game TB's. A 6 yr old gelding, Outrageous, leased out and doing the Jrs in Pa. A 4 yr old stallion, Sully's Outrageous, just off the track(3 months) and showing in the local shows(4 of them) and learning he is a show hunter(brain to die for). I believe Sully is the entire packge. Third is a 4 yr old mare, Pretty Outrageous, who will probably be bred this spring because of the demands and time going into the stallion and starting his career. I just won't have time for her. They are hunters. I've had a BNjumper wanting to buy Outrageous, he comfortably schools at 4', but he is a hunter.I bought Sully because of the lack of HUNTER stallions, and I think there is a need of lovely TB hunter stallions. There are a few really nice TB hunter stallions....A Fine Romance comes to mind...but only a handful in comparison to other disaplines. Unfortunately, the hunter breeding divisions really don't cater to having a stallion. Sully will hopefully be doing the pre-greens in the spring, but I'd love to show him in a stallion class. I've thought about writing to Ray Francis but I guess there's no demand for hunter stallion classes. I always loved watching the stallion classes and exhabitions at the Dressage shows. I think if the hunter shows became more breed oriented, we'd see more hunter stallions.



  16. #16
    Join Date
    Jun. 27, 2003
    Posts
    6,030

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    OK, first of all I did NOT ask for suggestions. A few of the stallions mentioned I would not even consider for the hunter ring. Sorry to be blunt, but it's the truth. I'm tired of the same stallions always being suggested for every discipline & every type of mare. http://chronicleforums.com/images/cu...ilies/sigh.gif

    What I asked was are we lacking a base of good hunter stallions in this country? IMO, the answer is yes.

    I may be completely wrong, but it seems like so many of the hunter stallions that seem promising as show horses end up getting sold and gelded.
    Yes I agree completely. I can think of a few off the top of my head. Storyteller, Mynos, etc. Frustrating.

    I want to use approved stallions. I want to be able to get papers on my foals if only a Cert of Pedigree to show who they are & what their bloodlines are.

    If you stand a hunter stallion, you should have some idea of the goals of the discipline, right?
    Absolutely. I think a lot of SO's that advertise their boys as being able to produce hunters when in fact they may be better suited for another discipline, still think that hunters are jumpers that couldn't cut it. That's not at all true. Also, we need to keep in mind that the majority of horses sold will be to amateurs to ride in the hunter ring. The ammys ar the ones who will ultimately spend the money. I'm not saying we shouldn't be producing pros horses either, just that the majority of good hunters sometimes have to do double duty in the ammy ring too.

    I can not imagine how expensive some of these stallions will get when their first crops are competing as 4-5 year olds.
    I don't want to know. http://chronicleforums.com/images/custom_smilies/no.gif I may have to sell something, like my husband, to pay for it. http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_c.../icon_wink.gif http://chronicleforums.com/images/cu...milies/lol.gif

    I like a number of stallions, but haven't had my socks knocked off by any one in particular.
    This has been my feeling exactly this year. http://chronicleforums.com/images/cu...ilies/sigh.gif http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_c...icon_frown.gif



  17. #17
    Join Date
    Feb. 22, 2000
    Location
    Keswick, VA
    Posts
    7,871

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    I may be completely wrong, but it seems like so many of the hunter stallions that seem promising as show horses end up getting sold and gelded
    Hmm. I can't think of any cases where I didn't think the horse was better suited to showing as a gelding, but I suppose that's personal opinion.



  18. #18
    Join Date
    Jun. 27, 2003
    Posts
    6,030

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    Interesting CB. The few I can think of that were sold & gelded I haven't seen in person, but that is more a function of my location than anything. The hunter stallions that have become geldings out here, really should have been gelded earlier IMO.



  19. #19
    Join Date
    Apr. 19, 2003
    Location
    Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    621

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    Adventurebeachponies you have a PT. http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_c...icon_smile.gif



  20. #20
    Join Date
    Apr. 18, 2000
    Location
    ~~~Virginia Horse Country~~~
    Posts
    6,855

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    I personally believe we are very fortunate to have A Fine Romance approved by the ISR/OLDNA and standing in the USA at Hilltop Farm!! What a super opportunity for hunter breeders!! Count me as one!!! http://chronicleforums.com/images/cu...s/winkgrin.gif
    And special thanks to Fred/Gail for sending her wonderful boy to the US for the convenience of all of us breeders!! http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_c...on_biggrin.gif
    http://www.talloaksfarm.net ---"Success is not final, failure is not fatal; it is the courage to continue that counts." --- Winston Churchill



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