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  1. #241
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    Quote Originally Posted by quietann View Post
    Not quite the same.

    An Appendix QH is still a QH, can show as a QH , and be used for QH breeding, no matter how much TB blood it has.
    A total travesty, IMO.

    An Anglo-Arab is NOT an Arab, cannot show as an Arab, and cannot be used for breeding Arabs.
    Correct. but they can be shown as a half arab and there are special classes just for them.

    Please note in my post I did not say HOW they were registerable, just that they were.
    Keith: "Now...let's do something normal fathers and daughters do."
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  2. #242
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    Oct. 22, 2009
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    Quote Originally Posted by kinscem View Post
    I think the poster who said their dads Oldenburg doesn't have any TB in his blood, well if the poster is sure of that than the horse is probaly a nice horse coming from Oldenburg region of Germany... a plow horse? Nothing wrong with that, without plow horses we would not be where we are at now.
    \
    I'm sorry, but this is so ridiculous, it's funny I can assure you my dad's AO horse is not a plow horse, nor does he descend from a plow horse (at least not in the last 100+ years)

    I would think that on a *whole*, a WB is more likely to be quality, purely because they can't be registered just on pedigree. Sure there are crappy "WB's" out there, but they probably aren't inspected! Any idiot can breed crappy TB to crappy TB and get an even crappier TB and still have it registered. There a lot of *very* nice TB's out there, but there are also a lot of crappy ones. Just go to a low-end track ad you will see plenty of examples of 'just keep breeding, maybe we'll get lucky and one of them will run fast!' I think many people who dislike TB's have probably been exposed to the crappy ones and not had the opportunity to see what a gorgeous, sound, impressive athlete a good TB is.

    Also, TB's (especially straight off the track) are usually much cheaper than WB's at a similar stage in training. So, they can attract the wrong kind of people- ie. people who are too cheap to lesson, have never owned a horse, want to 'rescue' a horse etc. Take a green, hot from track fitness and feed horse (of any breed) and put it in the hands of someone who has *no* business with a green horse (or any horse for that matter), and you get a lot of people's idea of a 'neurotic, dangerous, scrawny' TB. The same thing would happen if these types of people bought a young, green, WB, but that happens less often, purely because of price. Whereas the TB's that end up in homes with people who know what they're doing, become the athletic, solid citizens raved about by TB fans.

    Note to anyone who is considering labelng me a TB 'hater', 4 of the 5 horses I've owned have been OTTB's, (the other a grade QH). I've also ridden and seen many, many other TB's. Some have been fancy some have been horrible movers. Some have been triers, other's have zero work ethic. Some were lazy, others hot. Some athletic, others couldn't find their way out of a wet paper bag. Same goes for the QH's, WB's, and every other breed I've seen, met, or ridden.
    My current boys are wonderful and I wouldn't trade them for anything, even if one does move like a jackhammer and the other jumps like a deer Both are wonderful triers (although one is a bit neurotic), but that's not because they are TB's. It's because I like to ride a horse with a work ethic, so I bought horses that were triers (neither were directly off the track when I bought them).
    .



  3. #243
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    Isn't the Oldenburg a registry and not a breed? So a horse can have several different breeds and still register it as an Oldenburg. Many years ago that was considered a grade horse. Not a put down to the Oldenburg just curious



  4. #244
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    I believe the only warmblood breed is the trakehner, they have a closed stud book ALL the others are registeries therefore mutts in my book... Just my opinion... We have an oldenburg mare mom is a tb and dad is the oldenburg.but many different breeds, oops! Registries in there....
    Is it being said that every warmblood is a nice horse? I think not... There plenty of small.time.breeders you just never see them... Remember the stud fees are much lower and since it is AI much more available then the tb... Even if the stud fee is not to high of has to be live cover to be registered..
    Mai Tai aka Tyler RIP March 1994-December 2011
    Grief is the price we pay for love- Gretchen Jackson
    "And here she comes. Is it a bird? Is it a plane? No, it's ZENYATTA!"



  5. #245
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    Jun. 18, 2007
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    The two horses I've shown are a registered Arab and a OTTB (my current horse). The Arab's movement and jump were spectacular and the pair of us beat many, many WBs--won EVERY hack class we entered. People asked me all the time what breed my horse was--I proudly said an Arab and I got lots of "really!"s The time and training you put into a horse makes all the difference.

    I have a new OTTB mare who is an amazing girl! As a five year old, she is going to be my mount at a George Morris clinic in November. She's taken a lot of work, but the payoff is amazing. I much prefer my free, forward, confident mare to my friends imported wb gelding who spooks at everything, bucks her off regularly and is ALWAYS behind the leg.

    I love thoroughbreds, the original hunter and jumper!
    Lesmiz_07



  6. #246
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    I worked at 2 Arabian breeding farms, and my last mare was an unraced TB mare. The Arabians were far better behaved on the ground than many WB's I knew that practically ran over their owners any chance they got, and my little mare's idea of "fresh was to put her head down under saddle, lift her two hind feet about 4 inches off the ground and grunt! She knew how to buck like a bronco but NEVER did it under saddle (I'm pretty sure she knew I'd be wearing a new pair of horse leather chaps if she pulled that under saddle. Plus, she was just incredibly lazy.) I've had those comments about her too. Western people assumed with her big arse that she was a QH. English riders saw her big body, huge arse but up-hill frame and assumed she was a small WB of some sort. No one ever guessed right that she was a TB. She was also an air fern and I had to watch the amount of food she ate or she'd get fatter than a Thelwell pony loose in a grain factory. I don't know how many comments I got about how she couldn't be a TB "Because TB's just don't GET that fat!"

    *let me just say that the differences btw the ground manners on the Arabs I worked with and the WB's I knew who were meatheads on the ground were generally training related issues. What made me angry were the comments from people like that who would say they couldn't stand Arabs because they never stand still and are horrible to work with and hot and untrainable. The Arabs I worked with were national and international show-quality (some champions and reserve champions) and all stood perfectly still during clipping, bathing, grooming, vet and farrier appointments. Those perfect WB's that were being touted as more trainable? Well, I knew of at least one who had to be drugged to be clipped... Not that there is anything inherently wrong with that as some horses just don't get over certain things. My TB gelding had to be drugged to get his sheath cleaned :/ But don't call my Arabs and TB's crazy and untrainable and unhandleable when your (general) WB nearly killed the farrier last week!
    Last edited by Capall; Oct. 14, 2012 at 12:01 AM. Reason: Clarification



  7. #247
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big_Grey_hunter View Post
    I'm sorry, but this is so ridiculous, it's funny I can assure you my dad's AO horse is not a plow horse, nor does he descend from a plow horse (at least not in the last 100+ years)

    .
    Are you really sure about that?

    http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/nubert
    http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/xerxes+ii2
    http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/gruson

    Post your AO horse's pedigree and lets have a look.
    There are many,many heavy horses in WB pedigrees.TB's were used to try and obliterate the plow horse look but it still comes through from time to time.
    The WB heavy horses were general purpose farm work, drive and ride stock.



  8. #248
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    Aug. 28, 2006
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    Those horses were born 90-100 plus years ago.



  9. #249
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    Jan. 26, 2006
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    One of my favorite lesson horses was a TB. And a MARE "gasp" !! That horse taught me so much. She was super sweet and patient.



  10. #250
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    Aug. 18, 2009
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    Quote Originally Posted by ex-racer owner View Post
    I like all horses, some more than others. I am not really sure why there is such a prejudice against Thoroughbreds, especially from warmblood owners, since many of the WB registries value the "blood" and some WBs have quite a high percentage of TB blood in them . Perhaps those folks that speak against them should research their WB's ancestry....could be very eye-opening for some!
    Agreed! I've ridden TBs all my life and my first two horses were TBs. I'm ashamed to say that for a while I envied those who could afford "nice warmbloods". Thankfully I realized on my own that TBs are awesome. A few years ago I purchased a "warmblood" from my trainer, not because of her breeding but because I fell in love with her. I looked up her breeding only to discover that she is 1/8th warmblood. No wonder I fell in love!
    "But if you buy them as ponies aren't they cheaper?" - Favorite non-horse person quote.



  11. #251
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big_Grey_hunter View Post
    I'm sorry, but this is so ridiculous, it's funny I can assure you my dad's AO horse is not a plow horse, nor does he descend from a plow horse (at least not in the last 100+ years)

    I would think that on a *whole*, a WB is more likely to be quality, purely because they can't be registered just on pedigree. Sure there are crappy "WB's" out there, but they probably aren't inspected! Any idiot can breed crappy TB to crappy TB and get an even crappier TB and still have it registered. There a lot of *very* nice TB's out there, but there are also a lot of crappy ones. Just go to a low-end track ad you will see plenty of examples of 'just keep breeding, maybe we'll get lucky and one of them will run fast!' I think many people who dislike TB's have probably been exposed to the crappy ones and not had the opportunity to see what a gorgeous, sound, impressive athlete a good TB is.

    Also, TB's (especially straight off the track) are usually much cheaper than WB's at a similar stage in training. So, they can attract the wrong kind of people- ie. people who are too cheap to lesson, have never owned a horse, want to 'rescue' a horse etc. Take a green, hot from track fitness and feed horse (of any breed) and put it in the hands of someone who has *no* business with a green horse (or any horse for that matter), and you get a lot of people's idea of a 'neurotic, dangerous, scrawny' TB. The same thing would happen if these types of people bought a young, green, WB, but that happens less often, purely because of price. Whereas the TB's that end up in homes with people who know what they're doing, become the athletic, solid citizens raved about by TB fans.

    Note to anyone who is considering labelng me a TB 'hater', 4 of the 5 horses I've owned have been OTTB's, (the other a grade QH). I've also ridden and seen many, many other TB's. Some have been fancy some have been horrible movers. Some have been triers, other's have zero work ethic. Some were lazy, others hot. Some athletic, others couldn't find their way out of a wet paper bag. Same goes for the QH's, WB's, and every other breed I've seen, met, or ridden.
    My current boys are wonderful and I wouldn't trade them for anything, even if one does move like a jackhammer and the other jumps like a deer Both are wonderful triers (although one is a bit neurotic), but that's not because they are TB's. It's because I like to ride a horse with a work ethic, so I bought horses that were triers (neither were directly off the track when I bought them).
    Actually, I'd be willing to bet that your dad's Oldenberg has quite a bit of TB in the bloodline, and probably pretty close up too. Oldenbergs on the whole usually do. If your dad's horse doesn't, I think it would be an AWFULLY heavy kind of Oldenberg. Pretty much by definition, almost all warmbloods have some heavy horses close up and some light horses close up in their pedigrees. This isn't a dig at them...that's just kind of...how most warmbloods came to be. They didn't just pop out of the sky one day in their current sporthorse form. It took a lot of careful breeding...originiating, as all horses do...from horses that are nowhere near the sporthorses we have today.

    I've personally encountered just as many crappy WBs as crappy TBs. I've also encountered really nice WBs and really nice TBs. I have not been impressed with the whole inspection-process-as-indicative-of-quality in the WB world, as I have encountered quite a few WBs that did great at their inspections but are not particularly quality horses when it comes down to their riding careers.

    And, yes, I do know some warmbloods that look like draft horses. I don't hold that against them, but some of them really do look drafty.



  12. #252
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    Quote Originally Posted by FineAlready View Post
    Actually, I'd be willing to bet that your dad's Oldenberg has quite a bit of TB in the bloodline, and probably pretty close up too. Oldenbergs on the whole usually do. If your dad's horse doesn't, I think it would be an AWFULLY heavy kind of Oldenberg.
    Not necessarily. Again, my former Oldenburg doesn't have TB until 3 generations back...and that's the only one. He is at most 1/8 TB...and he's VERY refined. Like people think he's an Arab, refined. He does have Grande on his dam's side...but that's Hanoverian and not Oldenburg. The majority of horses in his pedigree are Hanoverian, with some Holsteiner and one odd Oldenburg or so.

    Oldenburg lineage is mostly carriage horse...which were lighter to begin with that "plow" horses. The desired phenotype is a lighter, more elegant style to pull the ruling classes carriages. Yes, TBs have been used to refine and lighten, but saying it's close up or the horse is probably really heavy just isn't true regarding the Oldenburg. Other registries were often heavier (Hanoverian?) in general than the Oldenburg.
    Keith: "Now...let's do something normal fathers and daughters do."
    Veronica: "Buy me a pony?"



  13. #253
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    Sep. 5, 2007
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    I used to ride a HUGE Hano that looked like a plow horse. I was asked "what kind of draft horse is that?" frequently. But once he started moving, he was lovely. But he was that old style huge clokner head square hipped monster type. He was also 18 hands and flaxen chestnut which didn't help matters...



  14. #254
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    Oct. 1, 2012
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    I absolutely love(d) my old OTTB. So much I still get teary eyed talking about him. That horse was a "crazy", "evil" "typical TB" before I got him. At least that is what I was told. He was so wild that one day when he was laying in his stall the barn owners 7 year old daughter went in his stall, laid down on him, by his head and he stayed that way for over an hour until she woke up. At a finals show (where I had no business showing with an entire side of my ribcage broken), coming out of a combination I lost my breath and my balance. Instead of freaking out like most horses would with a flailing rider, he stopped dead in his tracks, allowed me to catch my balance, get situated and then finished his hunter circle with NO guidance from me. Many years later in a show with 100 degree heat where jackets were not excused, I had an asthma issue, became overheated and literally passed out on his back and fell off. He didn't spook at the thump, he again stopped dead in his tracks and I woke up to his nose rubbing my face. He was definitely one "crazy", "short fused" and "dangerous" TB right?!?!? Best horse I have ever owned and made me a TB junkie for life.



  15. #255
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    To each their own really. I just have to brag about how awesome my OTTB was this weekend. This was his second time hacking out and he walked off the trailer like he owned the place, went across creeks, went up and down "steps" that he's never ever see before, jumped little logs happily and didn't bat an eye at the people or barking dogs we came across. There was not one thing he spooked at all day. He acted like he had been doing this his whole life. He has the best brain, ever. I can't tell you how lucky I feel to have found him.
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