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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jun. 20, 2005
    Posts
    855

    Default Question to Breeders..

    Hello All,

    I'm not sure if many of you frequent the racing forum, but if not, I have posted there about two incidents we have had this breeding season. We had four mares due to foal this year, of which two have foaled thus far. The outcomes of those two foalings are as follows:
    Mare 1: carrying her first foal. Mare ruptured uterine artery and bled out delivering her filly. Filly did survive but due to her large size, has rotated vertebrae in her neck and while she should live a comfortable life, is not expected to ever recover fully and will never be a racehorse. Her rotated vertebrae is attributed, per the vet's asserion, entirely to the foal's large size (she was in the 140-150lb range; her mother was a stout 15.1)
    Mare 2: Carrying her second foal (first with no complications);foaled a stillborn colt who was over 200lbs. Mare is understandably in rough shape but expected to recover.

    Now the common theme here is the foals were extremely large. I don't know if this is coincidence or not. The level of care these mares receive is very high and very experienced (they are boarded at a farm specializing in breeding/foaling/raising foals). However, I will say it is very "old-school" as well, which isn't necessarily a BAD thing but just thought I'd mention it. So I guess I'm kind of wondering..can this be avoided? Is it just a coincidence? How much pre-birth "work (i.e., ultrasounding, palpation, etc) is done on your mares? Was this something preventable?
    I guess I'm a little worried about the other 2. Mare 3 is carrying her 3rd foal (first two were born fine, no size issues) and Mare 4 is carrying her 8th. Would you do anything different? Keep in mind this farm foals out well over 30 mares a year..but at best, we personally are going to be at 50% this year.

    Thoughts?

    Thanks in advance!



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec. 13, 1999
    Location
    Greensboro, NC
    Posts
    36,093

    Default

    How many days were the mares at delivery?

    I'm so sorry to hear about those 2
    ______________________________
    The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances. - ET



  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun. 20, 2005
    Posts
    855

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by JB View Post
    How many days were the mares at delivery?

    I'm so sorry to hear about those 2
    Mare 1 foaled exactly on her due date. Mare 2 was a week late.

    Thanks for the kind words. Kind of a rough year so far!



  4. #4
    Join Date
    Nov. 28, 2003
    Location
    MO
    Posts
    4,582

    Default

    If the mares are foaling in the average range of "due dates" then there is probably not anything to be done. If fescue is a problem, and it were to cause a prolonged gestation, then you sometimes have foals that do grow to be very large, b/c they are carried so much longer than normal. However, that doesn't sound like the problem here.
    FWIW I don't consider a 140-150 lb foal to be abnormally large, when talking about TBs or WBs. A ruptured uterine artery is something that can happen regardless of foal size, and I've also seen the vertebral problems you describe in smaller foals, too.
    Sadly, I don't think the two cases are probably related, nor is there/would there have been anything you could have done to prevent them.

    Were the foalings attended?
    Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm."
    --Winston Churchill
    https://www.facebook.com/pages/Hills...h/112931293227
    www.HillsideHRanch.com



  5. #5
    Join Date
    Aug. 17, 2002
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    513

    Default

    WOW!! I lost all foals for 5 years until I treated them for fescue posoning ( ABC PLUS has something economical for that) and I always watch their weight and have them palpated a month before delivery. Large foals sound like over feeding but you know the people caring for them.
    Good luck!!



  6. #6
    Join Date
    May. 13, 2010
    Location
    Arkansas
    Posts
    31

    Default

    Were both foals by the same stallion? If so, could it be that this stallion produces very large foals?



  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun. 20, 2005
    Posts
    855

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Hillside H Ranch View Post
    Were the foalings attended?
    Yes. They were. Or else Mare 2 probably would have died.

    To answer Red Oaks' question: Mare 1 was bred to a horse who certainly has nice-sized foals, but he's something like 16 and I've heard nothing about other issues concerning him that way. And nice-sized, in the STB industry..generally 15.3-16.2. Mare 2's foal was by a son of Mare 1's mating and while he is younger (i believe his oldest are yearlings this year) he's about 15.3 himself so not extraordinarily big.



  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec. 2, 2002
    Location
    Waterford, VA USA
    Posts
    4,919

    Default

    I completely agree with Hillside on this....

    Your chances of having something happen during/after foaling increase directly with the number of years you've been doing it and the number of mares you foal out every year. Barring any illnesses or other bad circumstances, it is strictly a numbers game, something I have certainly learned over the years.

    Your next two mares will foal out just fine.

    Best,
    Siegi
    Siegi Belz
    www.stalleuropa.com
    2007 KWPN-NA Breeder of the Year
    Dutch Warmbloods Made in the U. S. A.



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