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  1. #41
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    So I guess the news is its a good thing this old man's barn is shut down, however still think the loose dog park is an accident waiting to happen.



  2. #42
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    Man...those were some interesting reviews...sounds like a fun place to ride.

    Anyway, if someone's loose dog wants to sniff my horse's leg, my horse can happily cave his doggie skull in or try for a field goal, both actions deserved and with my blessing. I don't feel sorry for the dog, I worry about my horse/mule being hurt by the dog.

    I had a dog-killing mare (2 corgis and yes, I warned the idiot owner) and a fox-killing mule (1 fox)...life's tough sometimes.

    Owners have warped ideas of their dog's qualities (kind've like some parents belief their kids are "speshul")...if the area isn't fenced, keep the dog on a leash. If a dog is loose and comes up barking at a person, it deserves whatever the person can get into their hands...remember, the definition of diplomacy is the ability to say, "Nice doggie" while you search for a rock to brain it.

    I'm not willing to be hurt so someone's "fur person" can discover it's wild side. Of course, I'm evil...Neighbors cats kept coming over to crap in my flower beds, "but it's natural" the owner said. OK, got out my Havahart trap, caught a few of the pussies and added some skunk musk to their coats....Phewee! Welcome home stinky!
    "Sic Gorgiamus Allos Subjectatos Nunc"



  3. #43
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    Trakehner, well said! You've always been one of my favourites for the no nonsense logic!
    COTH, keeping popcorn growers in business for years.

    "I need your grace to remind me to find my own." Snow Patrol-Chasing Cars. This line reminds me why I have horses.



  4. #44
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    Jun. 20, 2008
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    I think generally the law accepts that a human can usually much easier control a 10-150 lb animal compared to 700 - 1100 animal. Law enforcement should realize that horses are animals of prey - therefore when they feel or sense danger their instinct is to FLEE. Dogs are not prey animals. There are LEASH laws for a reason. My horses are all used to dogs too but it is one thing to have a dog wandering around horses in or around the farm - no problem, or if you're out on a trail and the dogs are leashed.. .It's another thing to have them come bolting out of the woods and chase your horse.

    I myself obey leash laws for several reasons - 1) I don't want my dog to run away 2) I don't want my dog attacked by other dogs 3) I don't want my dog to get hurt 4) I want my dog.

    I've been trail riding for years in Ireland - the folks I ride with there have plenty of dogs who follow us along.. however, whenever we come across property where there are dogs we are given an alert by the guide to beware of dog(s) and all the while guide is yelling to dog - Back stay back dog stay back. Most of them are some kind of herding dog and the last thing he wants is for that dog to start herding, nipping at feet.

    Most states, if not every state, have leash laws in public including parks - the exception would be DOG PARKS no so much as to get horses in trouble but so your free running dog doesnt' attack another dog, bite kid and so on.

    So as far as Im concerned I'm with the horses on this debate; however this particular stable sounds like it deserves being closed.



  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Louise View Post
    This is a hack stable, where people with absolutely no experience riding can come and have a trail ride on a "pretty horsie." They can't be expected to have the knowledge to handle some of the experiences horse people take for granted.

    On the other hand, I did some Googling, and found a couple of reviews.
    http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUserR..._Colorado.html

    Sounds like an "interesting" wrangler.



    Somehow I am not the least bit surprised. Seems everytimethe story is too sad for words it is (like that tear jerker from my youth)

    Now I want to know why he is blaming the doggies...



  6. #46
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    Apr. 15, 2008
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    Quote Originally Posted by bizbachfan View Post
    So I guess the news is its a good thing this old man's barn is shut down, however still think the loose dog park is an accident waiting to happen.
    I agree. I would not go to that park if there are no leash requirements. All I need is someone's big dog approaching my dogs who are leashed ...... While there are many well behaved dogs, there are too many dog owners who are clueless and they have no control over their dogs on a leash, much less off leash. Dog parjs with no leash requirements should be fenced and I would not go to them either.....

    We already had an incident locally where someone's small dog was killed at the dog park by a larger (not much larger) dog!!



  7. #47
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    Jun. 3, 2010
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    I think all that really needs to be said about this is that it is a PUBLIC park. Unless in a designated and FENCED area, your dog should be on a leash. Respect the other people around you. That includes horses, riders, walkers, joggers, bikers, and everyone else you would encounter at a park. I dont expect all dogs to stand quietly around horses. Heck, my dog has gone after one of my horses, so he doesnt come to the barn, but he would be on a short leash, at my side, if we were at the park and there were horses around us.

    This guy shouldnt have to close his barn, or not be able to run his business, because people arent respecting the park rules. Unfortunatly, though, he's the one who willget sued if someone gets hurt, not the dog owner.



  8. #48
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    Oct. 14, 2004
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    Connecticut
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trakehner View Post
    Man...those were some interesting reviews...sounds like a fun place to ride.

    Anyway, if someone's loose dog wants to sniff my horse's leg, my horse can happily cave his doggie skull in or try for a field goal, both actions deserved and with my blessing. I don't feel sorry for the dog, I worry about my horse/mule being hurt by the dog.

    I had a dog-killing mare (2 corgis and yes, I warned the idiot owner) and a fox-killing mule (1 fox)...life's tough sometimes.

    Owners have warped ideas of their dog's qualities (kind've like some parents belief their kids are "speshul")...if the area isn't fenced, keep the dog on a leash. If a dog is loose and comes up barking at a person, it deserves whatever the person can get into their hands...remember, the definition of diplomacy is the ability to say, "Nice doggie" while you search for a rock to brain it.

    I'm not willing to be hurt so someone's "fur person" can discover it's wild side. Of course, I'm evil...Neighbors cats kept coming over to crap in my flower beds, "but it's natural" the owner said. OK, got out my Havahart trap, caught a few of the pussies and added some skunk musk to their coats....Phewee! Welcome home stinky!
    Quote Originally Posted by Equilibrium View Post
    Trakehner, well said! You've always been one of my favourites for the no nonsense logic!
    Totally agree Equilibrium!



  9. #49
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    Sep. 11, 2008
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    Snohomish, WA
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    ROFLMAO - I bet they kept the cats in - at least for a while!!!

    I'm not willing to be hurt so someone's "fur person" can discover it's wild side. Of course, I'm evil...Neighbors cats kept coming over to crap in my flower beds, "but it's natural" the owner said. OK, got out my Havahart trap, caught a few of the pussies and added some skunk musk to their coats....Phewee! Welcome home stinky



  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by AliO View Post
    I think all that really needs to be said about this is that it is a PUBLIC park. Unless in a designated and FENCED area, your dog should be on a leash. Respect the other people around you. That includes horses, riders, walkers, joggers, bikers, and everyone else you would encounter at a park. I dont expect all dogs to stand quietly around horses. Heck, my dog has gone after one of my horses, so he doesnt come to the barn, but he would be on a short leash, at my side, if we were at the park and there were horses around us.

    This guy shouldnt have to close his barn, or not be able to run his business, because people arent respecting the park rules. Unfortunatly, though, he's the one who willget sued if someone gets hurt, not the dog owner.
    apparently this park has no leash non fenced areas close to the horse stable.



  11. #51
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    Don't know about CO but in TN a dog must be "under control." This does not mean on a leash, it means under the control of a human and responding to that human. If a dog "slips" this control the dog owner is responsible for any damage.

    I'll bet if somebody took a look at the off-leash rules there would be something about controlling the dog and what happens if the dog causes damage. Of course I wouldn't bet much.

    While I agree that dog owners have a duty to control their dogs riders have a duty to control their horses. The "fly in the ointment" in this case is that is sounds like you're talking about a "trail riding concession" and, by definition, most of the riders will be of low to no skill at handling a fractious horse. Training a horse to ignore a dog nipping at its heels will be a challenge by itself; put an unskilled rider on the horse and the program is essentially a "non-starter."

    If the rider is at least of average skill and the horse is steady then give the horse its head and it will likely be too bad for the dog. I've seen 200 pound humans launched by a kicking horse. A 50 lb. dog should fly some distance and the landing will be most unpleasant for the dog.

    While I sympathize with the stable owner he's likely fighting a loosing battle 'cause there are a lot more dog owners than horse riders.

    G.



  12. #52
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    I think there is still more to the story...



  13. #53
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    The park is now fencing in the off-leash areas. This is an article from Dec:
    http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_16962023

    However, the trail guy still isn't satisfied. Although it does seem that some dogs were a problem, and I'm glad the off-leash area is getting fenced in, it doens't seem like the dogs were the whole reason for his failing business. Now he's going with "oh noes, they're fencing away some of the trails".

    Relevant portions from the article:

    There were times when dogs chased after horses, causing riders to fall off. Parks officials also had concerns about canines' environmental impact...The off-leash area at Cherry Creek is shrinking to about 107 acres from 125; Chatfield's dog park will hold steady at about 69 acres.

    ... But for Bob Hantschel, owner of Paint Horse Stables in Cherry Creek State Park, it may be too late.

    He said dog issues severely limited his business last summer because dogs were chasing horses and making trail rides unsafe. The fences won't make things better because many of the trails he used will be inaccessible.

    "It's too dangerous," Hantschel said. "If they get the fences up, then we're probably going to have to evaluate and see what trails we can take. I don't know."



  14. #54
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    Jun. 20, 2008
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    If it's a public stable where people with little or no experience with horses come to ride - they will have NO clue about loose dogs chasing horses. I took my horse to a show once - he's normally level headed.. The tents being demolished in front of him -all kinds of chaos with the tearingdown of show didn't phase him in the least - what sent him over the edge? An adorable 3 y/o kid WALKING... Go figure



  15. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alagirl View Post
    I think there is still more to the story...
    Quote Originally Posted by Coanteen View Post
    The park is now fencing in the off-leash areas. This is an article from Dec:
    http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_16962023

    However, the trail guy still isn't satisfied. Although it does seem that some dogs were a problem, and I'm glad the off-leash area is getting fenced in, it doens't seem like the dogs were the whole reason for his failing business. Now he's going with "oh noes, they're fencing away some of the trails".

    Relevant portions from the article:

    Though quoting myself....

    You fence the dogs off, and now he complains about the trails?



  16. #56
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    Oct. 14, 2004
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guilherme View Post
    Don't know about CO but in TN a dog must be "under control." This does not mean on a leash, it means under the control of a human and responding to that human. If a dog "slips" this control the dog owner is responsible for any damage.

    While I agree that dog owners have a duty to control their dogs riders have a duty to control their horses. Training a horse to ignore a dog nipping at its heels will be a challenge by itself

    I trail ride a lot in State Forest - Three times this week alone. I'm sure I'll get some flames, but honestly?

    Rarely do I encounter people who really have true verbal control over their dogs when they see me and my horse.

    It is mostly screaming, "Rover, Rover, get over here." And Rover keeps coming.

    I've seen owner's dragged to their knees while holding Rover's leash, because Rover is not leash trained.

    Leashed barking dogs within a foot of my mare don't bother her in the least.

    But, I totally do not agree I should train my horse to tolerate a dog nipping at her feet.

    She relies on me to keep her safe and I'll be damned if I would expect her to just stand while a dogs bites her legs and expect her to "Take it"...no way..

    Heck, would most people stand still and tolerate a dog that was nipping them? Would they expect their kids to stand while a dog was nipping at them?
    I sure in heck wouldn't.

    I encountered a bunch of cross-country skiers a few weeks ago with about 3-4 loose dogs and thought, "Okay, I'm dead." Skiers, plus dogs?
    Grabbed my Ultrasonic Dog Repellent out of my pouch just in case.
    But the dogs were perfect and so was my mare. I stopped to let them all pass and realized one of the skiers was a stable owner that lived close by. I assume that was the reason the dogs just walked by us. Used to horses.

    Now those are the dogs I love!



  17. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guilherme View Post
    Don't know about CO but in TN a dog must be "under control." This does not mean on a leash, it means under the control of a human and responding to that human. If a dog "slips" this control the dog owner is responsible for any damage.

    .
    As a dog owner, I love that rule...my dog is under control at all times. I can stop her in her tracks while she's chasing a squirrel or whatever. She is totally obedient. I can take her with me on trail rides without worrying about other dogs / wild life / other horses, as she'll just ignore them.

    Problem is...a lot of dog owners *think* they have their dog under control, when in reality they do not. So I understand why so many states have leash laws. It's just easier to enforce.


    We also often ride in a public park and meet dogs off or on the leash. No problem.

    In the winter we ride on the beach, where people walk their dogs. There is usually no problem. Except one time when a dog chased us and just would not be caught. I hope the owner will have learned a lesson - put that particular dog on the leash BEFORE he sees horses...!!
    Ottbs - The finish line is only the beginning!



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