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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug. 14, 2004
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    Default Best Rubinstein son to cross with Wolkentanz I mare?

    ok, now i have moved on to doing research on breeding my Wolkentanz I xtb (Sir Ivonson) mare to a WB.

    I *really* like Rubenstein, and as son, Rotspon...

    anyone have any input on Rotspon or any other super good Rubenstein son that would cross well with a Wolkentanz mare?

    goal: dressage horse - not a large one tho (ie i would love to stay around 16h)



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb. 1, 2003
    Location
    VT
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    645

    Default

    I have had 3 Rotspons (out of 3 different mares) - all were huge - tall & substantial.



  3. #3
    Join Date
    Nov. 5, 2000
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    10,301

    Default

    Here are a few NA based Rubinstein-line stallions that are on the Oldenburg (GOV) roster.

    by Rubinstein I
    Regazzoni
    Rosenthal
    Rubignon
    Rubino Belissimo
    Rubinus
    Ruffian

    by Rohdiamant
    Rodioso
    Routinier
    Royal Prince

    by Rotspon
    Rapture R
    Rasta

    Some of these guys may be taller than want you are looking for, but there are some that are on the smallish side.



  4. #4
    Join Date
    May. 1, 2008
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    643

    Default

    What about Riccione? Love him. Judy Yancy has his semen.



  5. #5
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    Jul. 5, 2002
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    FL
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    Default

    My favorite R-line stallions at the moment are Royal Prince and Blu Hors Romanov. My best mare is a Wolkentanz I from a Rohdiamant/ Freiherr dam.



  6. #6
    Join Date
    Oct. 21, 2003
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    8,701

    Default

    Rubignon and Rubino Bellisimo are both local, you could go see them. I have met both, and seen offspring of both. One I really, really liked in person, one not so much.



  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul. 20, 2007
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    Rising Sun, MD
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    3,820

    Default

    Here is my Regazzoni out of D-line mare
    Rossignol

    He has the absolute sweetest personality and is incredibly willing
    “While the rest of the species is descended from apes, redheads are descended from cats.” Mark Twain



  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar. 11, 1999
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    Clayton, CA USA
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    5,158

    Default

    I have seen Rascalino in person, along with Rotspon, and although I loved them both, Rascalino is now at the tippy-top of my short list of stallions I want to breed to. Royal Blend, another Rotspon son, is there as well, but I'm not sure about his frozen.
    Mystic Owl Sporthorses
    www.mysticowlsporthorses.com



  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jul. 5, 2002
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    FL
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    Default

    While I admire the stallions Rotspon, Rascalino, and Royal Blend, I question how strongly they stamp their offspring. I have less personal experience with Royal Blend, but I have used both Rotspon and Rascalino and have also observed many of their offspring from a variety of mares. They seemed very variable in many traits - especially size, movement and type. Rascalino does seem to stamp very strongly when it comes to temperament and personality. All that I have known have been extremely easy, kind, smart, willing to please and friendly.

    I prefer a stallion that can be counted on to stamp more strongly when it comes to size, gaits and type. That is why I recommended Royal Prince and Romanov. In my experience, they both seem to be very strong as transmitters.

    Also, wanted to add that I have been very impressed with the Rubino Bellissimo and Rubignon offspring that I have seen.

    As always, this is just my own experience and opinion.



  10. #10
    Join Date
    Oct. 21, 2003
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Home Again Farm View Post
    I prefer a stallion that can be counted on to stamp more strongly when it comes to size, gaits and type. That is why I recommended Royal Prince and Romanov. In my experience, they both seem to be very strong as transmitters.
    I just have to say that I agree with this and with the comment about Royal Prince! I wasn't going to say it, because I am not a breeder so what the hell do I know really...but when shopping I loved all the videos I have seen of the Royal Prince offspring, and you do start to see them and KNOW they are by Royal Prince don't you? It is so strange how some stallions just stamp their offspring so much, others don't at all and they seem to be a hodge podge.

    If you like the Royal Prince offspring you have a good chance of getting what you want I would think. I for one really like them as they seem to be nice all-around types which is my preference.



  11. #11
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    Jul. 5, 2002
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    FL
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    PP, when I as at Hilltop last year, I was struck by how easily I could pick out the RP kids and by how similar they were to my own. It really was amazing.



  12. #12
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    May. 24, 2007
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    Lubbock, TX
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    I don't know much, either. But I bred my anglo-trak mare to Routinier, and I have the smartest, most trainable colt EVER. He's a joy to be around (and a really nice mover!). Of course, I bred specifically FOR that temperment. But for Ammys, his offspring ROCK.
    --Becky in TX
    Clinic Blogs and Rolex Blogs
    She who throws dirt is losing ground.



  13. #13
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    Jul. 5, 2002
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    FL
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kairoshorses View Post
    I don't know much, either. But I bred my anglo-trak mare to Routinier, and I have the smartest, most trainable colt EVER. He's a joy to be around (and a really nice mover!). Of course, I bred specifically FOR that temperment. But for Ammys, his offspring ROCK.
    Kairoshorses, that is what the R-line is most known for IMO. Almost all the R-line stallions that I know stamp that temperament and trainability, rideability. That is why I treasure my R-line girls so much.



  14. #14
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    Mar. 13, 2007
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    Portland, OR
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    If you are not totally stuck on the R line, Donnerhall is another way to go in regards to temperament. I have a yearling Dauphin filly with the best temperament and movement. I wormed her the other day in her pasture with no halter, she's such a nice filly to deal with. She is also on the small side, as Dauphin does not seem to produce tall. He would be a nice cross onto a Wolkentanz mare. Dauphin has very good scores in the Hanoverian yearbook.



  15. #15
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    Aug. 14, 2004
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    thanks for all the suggestions!

    we have Donnerschlag nearby, and i have always wanted to breed to him.... i get to see lots and lots of his babies... and while i love them, i am thinking now about something different for my mare

    In another thread folks were talking about Rosario - so i looked him up and he is a super stallion... is he still available? comments about him for a wolkentanz mare?

    also, there have been comments that some of these horses throw high knee action... comments?

    oh, and here is a pictures of my mare if this helps. she is 16h beautiful, lovely head and expression, my improvements would be shorten the back/strengthen the loin connection, and then a stronger hind leg (stifle area)

    would love comments, suggestions etc.

    http://www.facebook.com/album.php?ai...3&l=95b741f3b4
    Last edited by mbm; Dec. 23, 2010 at 01:16 AM.



  16. #16
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    Mar. 20, 2010
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    Bucks County, PA
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    Royal Prince would definitely improve your mare's straighter hind leg. I have an 09 filly by him out of a post-legged mare, and the filly's hind leg is excellent. In fact, comments at shows were "nice hind end" and "good hind leg," and I know she didn't get that from her dam!

    I have 2 mares in foal to him for next year (a Tantris and a Davignon mare), and I couldn't be more excited. He usually stamps his offspring with a beautiful head and type overall, refinement, a sloping shoulder, a correct hind end, nice gaits (particularly the walk...the trot has a lot of shoulder freedom but not a lot of knee [depends on the mare, I think]), and an easy-going, social personality. This has been my observation, anyway. I don't know that he would shorten your mare's back, though.

    Bugatti Hilltop sounds like a good match for your mare, as well. He is Bergamon - Rubinstein - Donnerhall.



  17. #17
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    Oct. 29, 2008
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    I like Royal Prince too, and have used him. I do think he sometimes throws more "hunter type" movement. Doesn't usually add size.
    If you are going dressage, some of the other R-line stallions seem great suggestions. Regazzoni has a wonderful, powerful hind end, more compact frame (good connection) and "10" temperament and rideability. Plus the lovely "R" head. He doesn't add size. His sons (eg Riccione) and daughters are a good testament.
    Rubino Belissimo and Rubignon should also give what you want, without adding size.
    Last edited by Sunnydays; Dec. 23, 2010 at 10:05 AM.



  18. #18
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    Oct. 12, 2006
    Location
    Canada
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    267

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    I bred my Warkant/Absatz line mare to Blue Hors Romanov and got a lovely colt, however he is going to be a tall boy with big bone. I don't think you will get a 16 hander with BHR. That being said, he does stamp them with lovely movement, excellent canters (he greatly improved the canter on my colt from the mares), and the temperament is easy, friendly, sociable. This colt came out super sweet and never had a devil streak to him.
    Member OMGiH I loff my mares clique!!!



  19. #19
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    Nov. 14, 2004
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    Fleetwood, PA
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    Quote Originally Posted by honeychile View Post
    I bred my Warkant/Absatz line mare to Blue Hors Romanov and got a lovely colt, however he is going to be a tall boy with big bone. I don't think you will get a 16 hander with BHR. That being said, he does stamp them with lovely movement, excellent canters (he greatly improved the canter on my colt from the mares), and the temperament is easy, friendly, sociable. This colt came out super sweet and never had a devil streak to him.
    IMHO, Romanov and Royal Prince are 2 of the best R line stallions in terms of siring consistent offspring. I think that Romanov will give you a lot of movement, with a tendency to knee action. Some Romanov's tend to be more on the bigger boned side from some mares.

    Most Royal Prince's do not have knee action, but are really free in the shoulder and have really great walks. Having seen Royal Prince a lot in person while my mare was in training at Hilltop, my observations were that he does not have knee action, but wowzas, when you ask him to extend his trot, it is AMAZING the freedom of shoulder he has. His walk is to die for and is very "safe" despite being so big. His canter is good as well. Overall, he is a really nice riding horse. I do think that you need a mare with pretty good bone to breed to Prince because he tends to lighten up the bone a bit. Also a more uphill mare is a better cross to him.

    Edited to add: I thought about a few mares that are R- and W- line crosses. One is half sister to a mare I owned (whose daughter is now in foal to RP)

    RP - Weltmeyer (the half sister to my mare)
    http://www.rollingstonefarm.com/list...gs/l0055.shtml

    RP - Wallstreet Kid (Warkant)
    http://www.rollingstonefarm.com/list...gs/l0058.shtml

    RP - Wolkentanz II (scroll down to see dam Wolkenshow and RP daughter Royal Elegance)
    http://dogwoodsporthorses.com/mares.htm
    Last edited by Edgewood; Dec. 23, 2010 at 10:42 AM. Reason: added links for W- line to RP crosses



  20. #20
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    Jul. 5, 2002
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    FL
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edgewood View Post
    IMHO, Romanov and Royal Prince are 2 of the best R line stallions in terms of siring consistent offspring. I think that Romanov will give you a lot of movement, with a tendency to knee action. Some Romanov's tend to be more on the bigger boned side from some mares.

    Most Royal Prince's do not have knee action, but are really free in the shoulder and have really great walks. Having seen Royal Prince a lot in person while my mare was in training at Hilltop, my observations were that he does not have knee action, but wowzas, when you ask him to extend his trot, it is AMAZING the freedom of shoulder he has. His walk is to die for and is very "safe" despite being so big. His canter is good as well. Overall, he is a really nice riding horse. I do think that you need a mare with pretty good bone to breed to Prince because he tends to lighten up the bone a bit. Also a more uphill mare is a better cross to him.
    Edgewood said this better than I did. I agree 100% on all points.



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