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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Mar. 9, 2006
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    Lucama, NC
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    Default Video from Show Yesterday

    OK, ging to stick my neck out and post this video from yesterday! This is my App stallion again, I am riding him this time. First show on him (for me) in 5 years. We showed at MacNairs in Raleigh under Janine Malone, who is not a "generous" judge so I feel our scores were quite accurate. Basically we rode TR 2 with a 61.07% and TR 4 with a 59.20% (this video is TR 4, TR 2 was better but didn't get it videoed). OVerall, he wasn't best in this test, had some "agumentative" moments, as he was getting tired. I realize that my reins are TOO LONG (judge oddly didn't say anything, but I am!) ANd this is causing some loss of connection. My "bad habit" which is much worse when I get in the show ring! ANyways, got lots of 7', 6's and a few 5'. Overall she felt the canter work better than trotwork. Stretchy circle needs more work. He is more "up" now than he was this summer, not "curling over" and even when I DO have reins shorter he is not curling up with me. THe footing was BAD, he warmed up in the covered GREAT but there was literally standing water in this arena and the stonedust was packed, so no spring at all. He didn't really like that much. Aanyways, here goes:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9JNF0A7jH_8

    AS usual he was totally quiet and many people commented on his wonderful, happy disposition!



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar. 18, 2007
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    333

    Default

    Looks great!I would have scored him higher. He looks like a lot of fun to ride and also like he could do a hunter round!



  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun. 26, 2004
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    2,296

    Default

    Brave of you to post a video. Nice horse, very compliant and quiet. Good for you for getting back out there to show, and a good partner to do it with.

    Some things to work on-

    1. look up! you look down and hunch your shoulders, sit back and up, look ahead. Then you can sit into the horse.

    2. You need to make a connection with the bit, your reins are very inconsistent, sometimes they have a droop in them, and then they don't, the constant on and off makes the trot look quite irregular. He almost takes uneven steps at times, and I think it is the intermittent connection doing this. Also, in your transitions the lack of connection and being on the bit really shows- in the transition he suddenly feels the reins, and resists (throwing head up in up and down transitions). The transition thus is disruptive, rather than improving the gait. When he and you are consistently on the bit, the transitions will come from seat and legs, and move "through" the horse.

    3. Stretchy circle- must have connection and be on the bit for the horse to stretch down and into the contact, following the reins out and down. (do not widen hands, judges hate this)



  4. #4
    Join Date
    Oct. 13, 2006
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    3,505

    Default

    Ditto to most of the above nice comments.

    After seein this horse in video so often I can't help but really want to see him start to have good solid connection.

    You could shorten your reins quite a bit and have your hands far more closer to his mouth. He still is fine for this level, but he should start to train a bit above it now yes?

    I'd like to see him lifting his neck and really working from behind a bit more, since you have been working on his connection for a while.

    I don't like how long (time wise) he has looked hunterish (my opinion and takes nothing from the lovelyness of the horse )



  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar. 9, 2006
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    Lucama, NC
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    Default

    THe main reason he hasn't progressed "faster" is lack of time to really work on it. He has had sporadic training over several years, which doesn't lend itself to progressing, obviously. He was with a good trainer for a few years but the goal was eventing (which he didn't like) and his dressage work was lacking. My goal is to make him more of a priority now, instead of him always being on the "back burner". It is really too bad I could not get any video of the clinic I rode him in earlier this month as that work was SO good. But you both made excellent points that I KNOW I have to work on, connection (a lot of it my issues) and my bad "rounded" back and shoulders! Still I am lucky to get three rides a week in right now with short days and all the famr work and lessons I teach! I do have some bad habits, mostly from riding fairly young horseson a long rein. And I have posture issues, some of which is due to several back suregeries and a bad hip, but hey, we all have to work thru those things! I was mad at myself when I looked at the video, as I have been working him more on shorter reins and trying to correct that bad habit and he responds VERY well when I do. Some of the irregularity in the steps was VERY bad footing, literally there were "holes" with water in the at places where horse after horse had ridden tests that day. I did get 7's on canter transitions and canter work consistently in both tests, But the trot I am not really driving him enough behind and giving him a good steady connection in front.



  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug. 14, 2001
    Location
    Back were I belong :)
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    1,808

    Default

    If the footing was THAT bad why did you ride? sheesh. I see a horse that needs to be ridden, not carting around a passenger. time after time we have been shown the same video's of the horse. If you really are serious about this horse doing dressage, get a trainer on him. If not, keep him a hunter.
    Proud Member of the Opinionated Redhead Club! RIP my dear Avery ~3/21/1995-9/21/2011~

    Extreme Cat!!! 2006 OTTB
    Magic Cat - Final Demand



  7. #7
    Join Date
    Oct. 13, 2006
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    3,505

    Default

    Understood shawnee

    I think for what level he is at, he is pretty hot stuff, but now I am eager to see what else he can do lol.

    My appy was far too hunterish for far too long, and it took some serious intervention to get me in gear and really make the "transformation".

    Because of that experience, and the amazing change from flat horse without steady connection, I am always encouraging others to make the move! Lol

    I just dont want you to get discouraged and think that this horse is a hunter type horse and so he cant get the nice roundness of elementary connection started this early. I fell for that with three horses until I realized that they were not working half as hard as I was.



  8. #8
    Join Date
    Oct. 24, 2005
    Location
    Pullman, Washington
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    2,253

    Default

    Something that you may have already been aware of, but haven't mentioned, is his response to your driving aids. If your heal and knee are coming up, he isn't listening, and needs to be touched with the whip so he respects your calf.



  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jun. 7, 2006
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    8,549

    Default

    I think he is completely adorable with a great work ethic and a good basic foundation and when is said and done you did a fine job of demonstrating that, even if the reins were a little long here or the heel was a little up there. That happens to all of us and it is the overall picture that counts.

    From personal experience those are my position bug-a-boos too (probably they are MOST PEOPLE'S, right everyone?) and as for the reins I thought I was never going to make it a whole 20m circle without having to re-shorten. It is so frustrating!!!

    Two things that an instructor said to me really helped me improve:
    1.) your reins should be short enough that a half-halt "arrives" from the squeeze of your fist without getting anything past the wrist (ie the elbow) involved
    2.) keep more horse in front of you than behind you. This image will help you ride more from the back seat with your shoulders 'away' from him and your hands out in front rather than leaning over your hands. In my teaching I have found this instruction accomplishes both the "shoulders back" and the "shorten your reins" AND the "leg long" direction in one, and puts the picture together more effectively.

    Again, this is not intended as a critique, it is just something that helped me work through the same issues. (So, now I sometimes hear I am leaning too far back and I reshorten my reins all the time when they are three inches too long instead of letting them get all the way to nine inches too long. )



    Your horse is adorable, he is happy to work for you which is the most important thing, and both of you are doing just fine.

    I for one enjoy your videos and would love to see more.



  10. #10
    Join Date
    Oct. 24, 2005
    Location
    Pullman, Washington
    Posts
    2,253

    Default

    Picking up where meupatdoes left off....

    With my own horse and I, I have noticed that if I sit up on her and ride around for the most part ignoring her, and focusing on a position that invites her to be forward/round/pushing to the bit, that will come MUCH easier than focusing on her to be pushing to the bit. It's almost like it gives her room to find that correct work and it feels GOOD at that point, rather than being against me in her body.



  11. #11
    Join Date
    Aug. 8, 2007
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    1,230

    Default

    The footing wasnt that bad. They do tend to over water the ring. The only bad places I saw (I rode 3 tests in that arena) were at both quarter lines close to A but not on the rail. Those small places were pretty bad, but the rest of the arena was pretty nice. The footing in nicer in the covered, but again, they do always over water. I have to say that this is my only complaint about this facility. It truly is a lovely place and the shows are very well ran.

    Janine is not a very forgiving or generous judge as stated, but she is fair.

    I didnt see your ride in person, I was warming my horse up, but the video is nice. I remember him a few months ago when he did first 1, and this test is nicer. The trot work does need more work. Your reins need to be more consistent, some times they are bouncing b/c of the slack, sometime they arent. There were some really nice moments in the canter. An overall good test and well behaved stallion. Congrats!



  12. #12
    Join Date
    Mar. 18, 2007
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    333

    Default

    When I say hunter it's a compliment. It means the horse is a quiet, relaxed but interested, balanced mover you could ride for hours. Isn't that a good thing in a Training Level test? Aren't these good qualities to take up the levels? I would rather see a longer intermittently connecting rein with a nicely flexed poll than a horse overly "curled" with a tight, death grip rein.

    I think you look great on him and I could watch a bunch more videos, too. Congrats on getting back in the show ring with that cutie!



  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jul. 11, 2006
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    1,381

    Default

    Your saddle needs to be larger. You cannot sit in the middle of the one you have on your horse now. As the results, your balance is wrong, and I do not think you will be able to make it correct with your present saddle.

    That flop of your seat in the canter will especially hinder you moving up the levels.

    I do not find your rein length so bad for Training Level. However, the inability to correctly use your balance to drive the horse to the contact is what is the problem.



  14. #14
    Join Date
    Mar. 9, 2006
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    Lucama, NC
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by PiaffePlease View Post
    The footing wasnt that bad. They do tend to over water the ring. The only bad places I saw (I rode 3 tests in that arena) were at both quarter lines close to A but not on the rail. Those small places were pretty bad, but the rest of the arena was pretty nice. The footing in nicer in the covered, but again, they do always over water. I have to say that this is my only complaint about this facility. It truly is a lovely place and the shows are very well ran.

    Janine is not a very forgiving or generous judge as stated, but she is fair.

    I didnt see your ride in person, I was warming my horse up, but the video is nice. I remember him a few months ago when he did first 1, and this test is nicer. The trot work does need more work. Your reins need to be more consistent, some times they are bouncing b/c of the slack, sometime they arent. There were some really nice moments in the canter. An overall good test and well behaved stallion. Congrats!
    No I didnt mean the footing was HORRIBLE by any means, but I was surprised when I started riding, it didn't look that wet (except for the "pond" near A) but the corner to the right of A and then down the long side over just around E was wet and had some deep pockets. My horse will go thru water, but he doesnt like it much, and the footing felt "flat". I do love MacNairs for the most part, but would love to do the tests in the covered! LOL Not an "excuse" per se, regarding the footing, I pointed out in my OP that I had a lot of things that were not good that were my own fault. But he was 'Squirrely" about the water.

    He did First 1 with Amanda this summer, this is the first time I have ridden and shown him in 5 years. Yes, Janine is fair but not generous and basically what I meant was, I felt I got "realistic" scores and comments and not "fluffed up" ones, which you sometimes see at smaller schooling shows. I would much rather get those realistic scores, so that next year when we do some recognized shows I will know what to expect. I ride a lot, but usually green or difficult horses at home, and rarely get the opportunity to truly compete anymore. However, that is now my priority, at 53 I ain't getting any younger!! What I can say about my guy is how well behaved he always is! Someone was in the warmup covered arena while Iw as warming up for the second test and she was a BEAUTIFUL rider on a lovely, but VERY spooky horse! THe horse was spooling at pigeons outside, throwing in some lovely rodeo moves (which she rode out with no problems) some of which were right in front of my guy. I could almost feel him going "WTF mom, whats that pony DOING??" Altho I will admit, he has days when he is full of himself, but normally not under saddle!



  15. #15
    Join Date
    Aug. 11, 2000
    Location
    Chantilly,va.
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    10,854

    Thumbs up it's a show, be proud!

    Remember you are SHOWING HIM; sit taller and look proud; a bit more positive of a ride; I say this in memory of all those I rode the same way OH, do I wish I could have those rides back now!
    breeder of Mercury!

    remember to enjoy the moment, and take a moment to enjoy and give God the glory for these wonderful horses in our lives.BECAUSE: LIFE is What Happens While Making Other Plans



  16. #16
    Join Date
    Apr. 30, 2003
    Location
    VA
    Posts
    1,552

    Default

    I also noticed the spread of your hands on your stretchy circle; it's a habit I've had to break as well after having worked green horses.

    I'm going to mention the same thing to you that has been told to me, and I am currently working on it. Your heel/spur is very active. If you squeeze him on with your leg (calf) and he doesn't listen, use the whip. You're going to need your spurs for lateral movements, and he'll end up dull to the spur when you really need it later on. I've noticed a big difference in my mare since I've been working on keeping my leg at the girth and using the whip more. (Keeping my knee soft and "wrapping my leg around" and down.) I've been working on making big changes from my hunter habits after PetStoreJunkie came to the farm to help me. "Tucking" my seat under while putting shoulders back is a part of this.

    He's cute, and I like that color of breeches on him.



  17. #17
    Join Date
    Aug. 28, 2007
    Location
    Triangle Area, NC
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    6,707

    Default

    I'll vouch that the footing was a surprise I was not expecting.
    Here's my suggestions in order of importance
    1. Saddle: Girl, you are TALL, and its not every day I meet a rider taller than me. I think you will find riding in a larger and more shallow saddle to help greatly. It looks like you are wedged in it.
    2. Shoulders: tell tale 'guarding greenies' hunch. I like to think about bringing the bottoms of my shoulder blades together. My trainer calls it "angel wings" I think more about putting on a bra. When the bottoms of your scapula come together, your traps will naturally drop and relax, your elbows will hang, and your thumbs will come up. the tension in your forearms, and triceps, as well as rhomboids will vanish.
    3. Leg Contracting: you know this, when you bring your ankle up and contract your leg, you render everything from your crotch to ankle useless. It's like taking headphones on and off as far as communication is concerned for your horse. Devote a ride or two to "forward, dammit" you want him forward when you so much as think it.
    Like many, you carry the whip yet it never sees much action. One thing that helped VTHokie was I held her leg in the correct position and her horse had to go forward. when the minute muscles of her inner leg were exhausted, and her femur heads were screaming... magically the whip suddenly became a useful tool.

    After this week I should have my own rig, and am more than happy to play round robin eyes on the ground for each other. If you are anything like me life gets too busy to devote to lessons for yourself. Our brains know better, but our bodies without eyes forget how to instinctively implement it. Heck, you are the midway point between me and VT... we could make an afternoon of it and even crack open a bottle of wine.
    www.destinationconsensusequus.com
    chaque pas est fait ensemble



  18. #18
    Join Date
    Aug. 11, 2000
    Location
    Chantilly,va.
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    10,854

    Thumbs up good, just polish it a little

    The more I watch this, the better I like it! I am guessing that a little showmanship will go a Long way; first; three good gaits, very steady; I think the walk is his best gait as seen here; I agree about quickening his response to the leg; You can help by softening your knee and thigh ; and learning to Learn to use your leg on the "up" of the posting trot, feeling that you "shoot a ball of energy or laser light to your hands; that said, take much more time in your halt; breathe, make a definite dropping of your hand and head, count" one "two" , three head up, " four "hand back on the reins; take a breath , then, trot forward do it with authority! come through the first turn with more flow make the first three steps on the diagonal more bold; you are making a statement; "watch this judge"



    on the walk allow your lower leg to swing more with his belly; alternate sides; stroke his neck with your little fingers to encourage him to stretch; if you shorten your reins before the walk; the lengthening will be more obvious; also on the stretchy circle; You're looking good I'd like to see you again in a months' time; remember that this is your time in the ring; you've paid for it! Make the most of it!
    breeder of Mercury!

    remember to enjoy the moment, and take a moment to enjoy and give God the glory for these wonderful horses in our lives.BECAUSE: LIFE is What Happens While Making Other Plans



  19. #19
    Join Date
    Aug. 11, 2000
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    Chantilly,va.
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    10,854

    Thumbs up wine?

    did you say wine? can we make this a group effort/ project??As long as no one has to drive home after or ride;
    breeder of Mercury!

    remember to enjoy the moment, and take a moment to enjoy and give God the glory for these wonderful horses in our lives.BECAUSE: LIFE is What Happens While Making Other Plans



  20. #20
    Join Date
    Aug. 11, 2000
    Location
    Chantilly,va.
    Posts
    10,854

    Lightbulb reins again, back and brain!

    Are you making a conscious effort to keep his head "down?" A couple of emental "tricks" find a video of a horse and rider you admire, Ahlerich and Klimke comes to mind for me; Watch that carefully; notice how as the horses' neck comes up from the riders' crotch; and as the horses' forehand comes up, the riders' front does as well; the horse blossoms and so does the rider; thinking of the Centered Riding concept of"center and grow" one of my students thought of that as a flower blossoming ; a nice vibrant thought; each "center and grow" , a half halt, grows the horse , as well as the rider; as the horse grows he grows into the rider; his back, sides and topline expand; the riders' center will as well. well as thinking of the center as an anchor, drop anchor and "float the boat", your head, forward and up , the line to the anchor is your spine; so, a line, to the anchor, float the boat" as in the halt; the line attached to the anchor is pulled straight/ taut; and remains straight in he halt.i.e. don't let your back sag in the halt.
    breeder of Mercury!

    remember to enjoy the moment, and take a moment to enjoy and give God the glory for these wonderful horses in our lives.BECAUSE: LIFE is What Happens While Making Other Plans



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