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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jun. 9, 2003
    Location
    Alabama
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    5,497

    Default Another Rant About Horse Shoppers

    WHY do trainers bring incompetent riders to see very green young horses? Then they act like it would be fine for them to buy the horse and they would train/oversee the process! I have a very handsome, big youngster who is fancy and scopey and quiet, but sooo inappropriate for a rider who has marginal skills not to mention any concept of riding or bringing along a very nice young horse. I breed these youngsters, do all the work from conception to starting and bringing along until sold. Hell, I bred the dam, dam's sire and own the great grandsire -- so I'm invested in their futures. The last thing I want to do is sell one to someone who will just confuse and ruin all the time I've put in. Not only that, I won't! It's just infuriating that they want the seller to be the "bad guy" if they point out these things. Does anyone else share the opinion that these trainers are unethical and unscrupulous and just want a nice horse under their guidance, especially if the client has $$$, even if they need something trained to ride? I don't want my nice young horses to be "schoolmasters". I know the right person will come along, but it's just frustrating how pushy folks can be instead of looking at horses that are suitable. Damn~!
    PennyG



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov. 2, 2001
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    Packing my bags
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    32,647

    Default

    Oh, you know the answer already:
    Lot's of paid rides for trainer on wonderful talented horse they did not need to spend money to buy. A win win - for the trainer:
    Commision, training ride, rides, mucho money...



  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar. 12, 2006
    Posts
    4,343

    Default

    Do you know the whole story? Maybe the rider wants a project and plans on handing the horse over to the trainer for awhile.
    If you only want very competent riders, then advertise as such and don't bitch when you don't get anyone looking at your horse.



  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jun. 9, 2003
    Location
    Alabama
    Posts
    5,497

    Default

    Well, Magnolia, since you haven't seen my ad, I guess you really don't know what it reads, do you? When I advertise a prospect as young, just started, green -- needs appropriate rider I think that's enough. Yeah, they want a project, but they also want to ride the horse and "learn" on it. So, I guess I can "bitch" if I so desire w/o your permission!
    PennyG



  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jul. 31, 2007
    Posts
    15,407

    Default

    I'm sure you'll get mad at me, but try to take this as neutrally as you can:

    Perhaps because you are so invested in your horses, you stand to be more disappointed at selling time than would another breeder. My point is that there are better and worse reasons to fear a novice rider.

    The good reasons: Alone, they'll offer that green on green experience that's hard on the individual animal. One bad scenario is that the horse doesn't every do anything in the show ring that gets your breeding program recognized. At worst the horse gets blamed, sold and yada, yada.

    The bad reasons: You don't like it that a trainer appears to be buying a horse for someone to pay him to train. You don't like the idea (predicted by you) that your youngster will have to become a schoolmaster PDQ and have to teach the ammy to ride.

    I don't think the "bad reasons" are properly your business. Steward your horses and certainly don't sell to the trainer who shows you he expects too much from the horse or the rider who seems afraid of the greenness your horse offers. Those are warning signs no seller should ignore. But beyond that? The business/training/lesson relationship the trainer and his client have agreed to just aren't your deal.

    Hope this helps and that I didn't miss your point.
    The armchair saddler
    Politically Pro-Cat



  6. #6
    Join Date
    Nov. 2, 2001
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    Packing my bags
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    32,647

    Default

    LOL, leave it to the COTH crowd!

    Usually they have their pitchforks ready for the trainer who urges to client to buy a horse past their competence level with all the obvious benefits for him/her, resulting in a good chunk of money usually...


    Anyhow, as breeder, you just don't produce horses, you try to produce quality.

    Does that mean the ammy does not deserve a good quality mount to putz around on the trail? No, but the breeder's bread and butter is reputation: Good horses that are visible to the public.

    On the flip side, a good horse can be easily ruined by incompetence. So horse turns bad, usually not with the trainer's mark attached, but with 'Breeder X sold me this horse' and shazam, your program takes a hit.

    And since the next thread over, or under, or sideways, deals with the evil people who sell old horses, mean old breeders who still breed, etc, insinuating that nobody is to sell a horse ever, or, if you bred it to always take it back, even if you are 100 and live in a nursing home, or your grand kids will have to....trying to minimize the chances of a horse ending up in a bad situation is only prudent and 'the business' of the breeder.



  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov. 13, 2007
    Location
    NW Louisiana
    Posts
    5,228

    Default

    I had a run-in with something very similar recently, only it was in regards to leasing a horse you own for use in beginner-type lessons. The horses in question were 3 and 4 years old, and not anywhere near the point where I would ever put a kid on them for more than pony rides. One is big and very very very green, the other is very sensitive to anything that will kill his confidence and bucks in the canter if things aren't just right.

    One of the horses is mine, so I said no way in he**. The other dumped his rider yesterday, resulting in an ambulance call.



  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun. 9, 2003
    Location
    Alabama
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    5,497

    Default

    Well, I've been breeding for 30 years and have sold primarily to ammies and happy to do so. There are many ammies who are excellent, skilled riders. However, it IS my business who I sell to and it's my decision. I've always tried to make it a practice to sell to a good match. Not someone who might match years from now but someone who matches as is. I don't care if the trainer makes $ or rides the horse. There are many ways to Rome and reasons to sell however one decides. However, these are my horses and I'll decide. I do think it's irresponsible for trainers to look at green, young horses for unskilled riders. JMHO.
    PennyG



  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar. 10, 2009
    Posts
    5,553

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Alagirl View Post
    Oh, you know the answer already:
    Lot's of paid rides for trainer on wonderful talented horse they did not need to spend money to buy. A win win - for the trainer:
    Commision, training ride, rides, mucho money...

    My thought exactly. A friend got a nice, but very green, 4YO filly with her trainer's "guidance". Friend did not throw a leg over said filly for two years. It was even longer before she was allowed to ride her filly at shows - trainer or her pro rider did all the showing, except my friend WAS "allowed" to ride her own horse in under-saddle classes. Now, she was far from being a green rider when the filly was purchased, but she wasn't quite ready to take on a green 4yo either.
    She does admit in hindsight that she let herself be taken advantage of. Part of it was that she was so starstruck by the filly that it was really hard to tell the trainer to pass and find something maybe not quite as nice, but with a few more miles.



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