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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul. 6, 2000
    Location
    Alvin, TX
    Posts
    1,050

    Default Only "family members" can videotape/photograph you at show?

    I just read this in our Regional Championship Prize list and wondered if it's been there all along and I just didn't see it - and if anyone in other parts of the country have this 'rule.'

    It basically says that unless you get 'written permission' from the show's videographer and/or photographer, only 'family members' may video/photograph you.

    Can they really do that? I understand that no other PROFESSIONALS could perform those services, as they do have 'official' show videographer and photographer - but really? You cannot have friends videotape or photograph your rides?



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb. 11, 2002
    Posts
    1,383

    Default

    Even if that is a rule, who is going to know if it's a family member or not? Just tell them it's a cousin--LOL!



  3. #3
    Join Date
    May. 20, 2005
    Location
    Desert Southwest
    Posts
    6,259

    Default

    There you go!

    At our Championships, the place was swarming with professional videographers and photographers -- and amateurs, too! During several rides, there were easily a half dozen people standing along the rail with cameras. Maybe waiting for their friend's next ride, maybe photographers for the show or a local newspaper.

    Who knew? A fancy tripod and telephoto lens MIGHT be a tipoff, but lots of folks have fancy equipment and they're not necessarily pros.

    Certainly the official show photographers and videographers had enough to do without checking on the ammy photogs around.

    Silly rule. I usually purchase videos and/or photos anyway. Usually different angles, better shots, so the pros are not being hurt by the friends/family with cameras.



  4. #4
    Join Date
    Apr. 25, 2007
    Location
    Pinehurst,NC
    Posts
    476

    Default

    I'm the FAMILY member that is NOT allowed to vidieotape my grandaughter...On the debeut of her first big show with her first really nice show pony, I was given the responcibility and privilege of taping her.... Not Only hadn't I thought about the audio being recorded as well and unaware that my RAILBIRD COMENTARY of "Sit up!" ...Oh, that's nice." "Looking good!"..."More leg.", but when I proudly had waited to hear..Thank you for taping,Grandma!" as we all gathered round to view the tape...I had filmed the WRONG littlr girl and pony!!! GO directly to EYEGLASS WORLD!! Do not pass go and colect VIDEOGRAPGHER COMPLIMENTS!!!
    "Success comes in cans, not in cannots!"



  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar. 4, 2010
    Posts
    1,723

    Default

    My husband is a pro in every way except using photography to make a living. Has a degree in it, has probably spent more on cameras than I have on horses, etc etc. How would they police that? They must have an excess of volunteers if someone has the time to go around and check credentials!

    Yep, silly rule.



  6. #6
    Join Date
    May. 20, 2005
    Location
    Desert Southwest
    Posts
    6,259

    Default

    Oh, EasyStreet, that's too much!



  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov. 17, 2001
    Location
    Bryan,Texas
    Posts
    2,261

    Default

    cyndi,

    That silly rule has been in place for a few years now. Many people ignore it and have their family members video them as they have been doing all year long. Or they may splurge at Championships and let Robin video them.

    I wouldn't waste my time and energy worrying over it.



  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jan. 3, 2006
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    781

    Default

    I suspect that it has more to do with Child Protection laws that exist in most sports regarding the inappropriate filming/photographing of children. Having something in the program that says "only family members" means that show organisers can throw out anyone who does not have the permission of the family to shoot the kid.



  9. #9
    Join Date
    Oct. 1, 2002
    Posts
    176

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by DressageOP View Post
    Now, at Arabian shows, people with pro-equipment who are not authorized to be on show grounds are fined $ 1500 and removed from the grounds.
    At Canadian Arabian Nationals there were BIG signs.......AMATEUR photographers only.
    As an Arabian person who shows up with a "pro" looking Camera at Canadian and US Sport Horse Nationals, I have NEVER heard of this, nor have I been questioned.

    Seriously, is someone going to pay a "fine" from a horse show? Yeah, right!
    Elaine Ward



  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb. 4, 2010
    Posts
    184

    Default

    I know a few ammy photographers who were told by the pro photographer at a few shows to stop taking photos of people. Even if the ammy was not selling them and only taking them of their friends/family...



  11. #11
    Join Date
    Mar. 4, 2010
    Posts
    1,723

    Default

    It's a public event. The show committee can set the rules,but if someone wanted to push it, I do really think such a ban would be unenforceable. I am really sympathetic to the plight of show photographers - they are experiencing the same slowdown of business as other photographers now that digital cameras are everywhere and everyone thinks they are a professional - talk to anyone who does a lot of weddings, for example. As I mentioned above, however, it would be very very difficult to separate the amateurs from the pros based on their equipment.

    I do think show committees need to think about the possible consequences of throwing out an exhibitor's spouse, mom, or dad because they happen to be there taking pictures. Not only will they possibly lose the revenue from losing exhibitors, but it would be an ugly PR event.

    I think the rule probably keeps the wildcatters who might come in and undercut the pros under control. I would be interested in hearing about any shows that actually did try to enforce this rule.

    I know a few ammy photographers who were told by the pro photographer at a few shows to stop taking photos of people. Even if the ammy was not selling them and only taking them of their friends/family...

    I asked my husband what he would do if this happened to him, and his response was pretty blunt and brief as in telling the person to put it where the sun don't shine. I would complain to the show management - after all, this person is not an official - and then I would never ever buy a single shot from them and make sure all my fellow exhibitors did the same. Again, not a very smart move.



  12. #12
    Join Date
    Aug. 20, 2007
    Posts
    214

    Default

    I host schooling shows and try to have a professional photographer. I have had local people come and photo rides and then put them on the web for sale. They usually don't ask anyone's permission. The problem that I see is that they don't always know the 'rules' for not distracting the horses. And there is no control over how they plan to use the photos. I hate it for the pro that I have contacted because it is less money that they can earn. But...if I don't have a photographer then riders are disappointed. I do not give out the contact info of the riders to the non-invited photographer, so that does limit some of what they can do. It is an issue I don't have a good answer for.
    One photographer I have used says that he does alot of children's ballgames and that the photography is monitored there because of the privacy issue. Parents don't want just Anyone photographing the children.



  13. #13
    Join Date
    May. 5, 2009
    Location
    Location: Indiana, but my heart is in Zone II
    Posts
    2,636

    Default

    Ridiculous. And just a sidenote- my friend for the last 3 years in a row took MUCH BETTER PICTURES than a pro at Devon, who sorry- did not take one good photo of my horse or any of my customers. I would not have paid them a cent.
    Come to the dark side, we have cookies



  14. #14
    Join Date
    Dec. 26, 2007
    Posts
    48

    Default

    I've paid some serious money for photo CD's and gotten nothing but garbage, real garbage (and learned a lesson) about one or two "professional" photographers over the last season. I don't think that just because we show, we should be held hostage to people who cannot take good photos. Just because someone proclaims to be a professional doesn't make them good & that's when I'm more than happy to have my husband use my big camera to take photos.



  15. #15
    Join Date
    Apr. 6, 2010
    Location
    San Diego, CA
    Posts
    2,084

    Default

    When I was doing my campaign for worlds we used the show photog (mind you this was well before digital cameras and video cameras were popular for the masses.) Any schooling shows great grandpa and grandmother were designated the task. (Mom sat with her eyes closed and counting hail marys dad was helping me with horse.)

    Now with DD showing I take the pics and vids at the schooling shows and I will approach the professional (If I can find them) at the recognized shows. I have buisness cards that I will write DD's number on and drop to the photog. It usually has what shots I want and what tests she is riding on it. That way I can get back to the child and the pro has the info he/she needs to get me the pics. I am by no means a professional and as DD wants to start catch riding when she is older I like the professional shots to use as a resume. Bonus the owners of the horses she rides generally like the pro's shots much better than mine.

    That rule is probably there for the Child Protection Law. I am not paranoid enough as a mom to take my eyes off my kid to see if someone else is taking pics of her as she is showing. I would however be really upset if I did find out someone was taking pics of her without my permission.
    Adoring fan of A Fine Romance
    Originally Posted by alicen:
    What serious breeder would think that a horse at that performance level is push button? Even so, that's still a lot of buttons to push.



  16. #16
    Join Date
    Jun. 7, 2006
    Posts
    8,558

    Default

    A big part of showing for me is often getting the picture. I ride sale horses and when I spend hundreds of dollars to go put a show on a horse's resume, I want a good picture.

    Thus, I bring my own camera crew.
    Period.

    I am sick and tired of photographers "missing" my round, taking crappy shots, and then trying to charge some astronomical internet rights fee.

    I guess it sucks for the photographers that digital cameras mean pretty much anyone with a little practice can take a good show pic, but I am sure that is how secretaries felt when the computer came along.

    I am happy to purchase a show picture if the photographer is reasonable about internet rights and IF THE PICTURE IS GOOD.
    But some of the photos really are terrible.
    I went to a schooling show last month where the photographer took a week to post pictures and then after all this breathless anticipation there wasn't a single usuable shot (I don't think this photographer rides.)
    I seriously developed new sympathies for the rollkur supporters who say "a picture is only a moment in time" because this photographer took photos of rides scoring 66% -70%+ that looked perfectly fine on video and got me 7's and 8's for my rider scores and picture after picture after picture you would have thought we scored a 45%, my horse was a feral brumby and I had a motorneuron deficiency.

    Meanwhile I handed my DSLR to my barn owner and rode for 20 minutes and she took about 25 shots, NOT WEARING HER GLASSES, and there were 5 or 6 really nice, usable shots which I downloaded on my computer and had available that afternoon.

    If photographers want to get more business, maybe they should spend less time trying to keep everyone out so that they can monopolize shows with high prices, crappy service and poor products and try to take better pictures than my non-photographer barn owner who left her glasses in the house.

    Honestly.
    Last edited by meupatdoes; Oct. 29, 2010 at 10:07 AM.



  17. #17
    Join Date
    Jun. 29, 2008
    Location
    San Diego
    Posts
    2,205

    Default

    I always try to have a friend or family member take photos of my classes, because I have been in large classes where the Pro Photographer didn't take one photo of me! Granted, these were in hand or flat classes, but still. Plus, my favorite part of a show is being able to share the memories with family and friends through facebook, I can't afford to purchase all of the pros photographs to post, I'd spend more on photographs of the show than of the entire show!

    That said, I always look and will purchase a few of the photos from the pro if I can.
    Proudly Owned By Sierra, 2003 APHA Mare
    In Loving Memory of Tally, April 15, 1983 - June 2, 2010



  18. #18
    Join Date
    Sep. 21, 2007
    Location
    SF Bay Area
    Posts
    1,089

    Default

    Yeah, people will have lots of cousins in that scenario. (That what we in East Germany did to get our friends, umm, family members, who happened to be in West Germany, permission from the government to visit us. ).

    In any case, the problem with our local "professional photographer/videographer" is that her work is rather not so good. Anything my friend, umm, cousin, taped on the little handheld thingy was much better. And I would have loved to have some good professional pics/videos from my first season showing.
    "Reite dein Pferd vorwärts und richte es gerade.” Gustav Steinbrecht



  19. #19

    Default

    If you folks are not satisfied with the show photographer, then you need to let show management know. You should not settle for less than pro work. That said, show photographers do not know that you want photos unless you sign up for them.



  20. #20
    Join Date
    May. 4, 2003
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    14,065

    Default

    I was selling a horse and the buyer asked if she could bring her trainer to take a second look at the horse. Trainer was riding MY horse, in MY ring, and objected to my taping her ride. Her point was that I might use the tape as a sales tool to sell the horse. It just seemed to me that people are getting too uptight about things.
    Nothing is for nothing these days...all business. They bought the horse.



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