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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug. 5, 2006
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    Default calling on COTHERS...help with this mystery

    Okay....here's the scenerio....my three horses go out about 16 hours a day, they are used to the heat, cold..etc.

    One does have a history of colic...had surgery in 2004 for flipped intestine.

    Routine....BO brings horses in at 6am, I ride, feed lunch turn back out around 2pm...this has been the norm for the past 3 months.

    Night of July 4th, horses went out during day instead of night, just to be safe.

    July 5th...horse with colic history...totally normal...acting normal..eating normal, nothing out of the ordinary. Turn horse out, horse lays flat out in pasture and won't get up. Call BO, call vet (had to wait for call back/holiday)...15 minutes later, horse gets up and starts acting totally normal. Vet says give 5cc's of banimine (we assume colic) and call back if not normal. Horse is totally normal. I assume that horse may have been dehydrated from being in all night on July 4th.

    Today...horse is totally normal....was normal last night in turnout, I give a bucket of alfalfa cubes and later beet pulp with electrolytes..making sure that I get fluids in this horse. About 5 gallons total while in the stall. Horse is perky, normal self.

    Go to turnout...same scenerio as day before...horse goes down, flat out (I'm talking, if you had driven by, you would have come running to get me to tell me that my horse was dead..flat out) Call vet....he says to watch horse..I do. 20 minutes later..gets up, chases my gelding off the water, goes over to drink, goes out to graze like nothing ever happened.

    At first I thought we had tying up...but vet said horse would have, had trouble walking....not the case

    Horse is passing gas when laying there and moaning....twitchign back legs. I tell vet this...he says, sounds like horse is truly sleeping.

    I have never had a horse go from a stall to a grassy field and just lay down for 15-20 minutes unless something was wrong.

    Vet is stumped, second vet is stumped....only thing I've done differently is put a good amount of Swat on the horses' faces before turning them out because the flies are very bad.

    This has always been a sleepy horse....sleeps in the crossties, never gets really worried about anything. Never thought much of it till now....now I'm wondering about narcolepsy.

    Thoughts? Opinions? Experiences with Narcolepsy? This horse is 9 and been with me since 3 months of age....never seen this before. Does this sound like possible narcolepsy?

    Thanks



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jan. 16, 2002
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    West Coast of Michigan
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    Default

    Was he inside during any fireworks? Had a couple of bad nights (no sleep) and now just wants to get outside (where he feels safer) and sleep?

    Sorry, no clever ideas, but good vitals, eating and drinking can't be all bad, I hope for his sake.
    Click here before you buy.



  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar. 31, 2010
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    151

    Default

    Have you ever seen your horse sleep in the stall? Is it possible that their stall is not comfortable/too small/too hot/whatever to lay down in, and they are truly just taking a snooze once turned out?



  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by deltawave View Post
    Was he inside during any fireworks? Had a couple of bad nights (no sleep) and now just wants to get outside (where he feels safer) and sleep?

    Sorry, no clever ideas, but good vitals, eating and drinking can't be all bad, I hope for his sake.
    Possible....but was out last night..back to normal routine.

    Yeah, I'm not stressing out over it. I think I freaked everyone else because I wasn't freaked out when it happened.



  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by BrightandClear View Post
    Have you ever seen your horse sleep in the stall? Is it possible that their stall is not comfortable/too small/too hot/whatever to lay down in, and they are truly just taking a snooze once turned out?
    True...the only thing is.....horse has never done this before..not horse's normal routine....never seen horse go down this time of day before.



  6. #6
    Join Date
    Sep. 25, 2005
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    The Land of the Frozen
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    Default

    When you say his legs are twitching and he's passing gas, does he seem content while he's doing this, or in pain?

    My crowd has developed various habits at one time or another that "weren't normal" but soon became part of their normal routine. A new pattern has to start somewhere. Mine lay all the way out flat to sleep every day. Often multiple times per day. Sometimes it's at 9 a.m., sometimes 3 p.m., and sometimes 7 p.m. Sometimes it's this pasture, or that pasture, sometimes up by the barn.

    Sweets has always been a big sleeper and will lay down anywhere to take a nap. I went out one day and she was asleep in the run in with her head UNDERNEATH a rubber mat. I lifted up the mat and she blinks her eyes and looks at me like - hey, put the sun shade back down. Scared the living *&%$ out of me.

    A couple weeks ago I was mowing one of the pastures, and she laid down in the unmowed grass, flat out and went to sleep. What horse goes to sleep with a piece of loud machinery cutting grass 100 feet away? Good grief.

    She's one of those that won't get up either! If I want to ride or need her up and moved for one reason or another, she'll just lay there and rub her nose on her leg, or flop over flat and scratch her neck on the ground and totally ignore me like -if I ignore you, will you just go away?

    So stuff like that doesn't alarm me, but I can see if it's not part of the norm that it would be alarming. Hmmm, wish I had some helpful info but I don't.



  7. #7
    Join Date
    May. 22, 2002
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    where the grass is greener
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    I have a horse, all winter, like clockwork, napped from 10:30-11am. Flat out, dead horse imitation.

    In the summer heat, I haven't seen him lie down during the day.
    Now, he falls asleep with his chin on the round bale - honestly.

    Nothing has changed, all vitals normal.

    Maybe your horse just likes to snooze in the sun?



  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jul. 7, 2007
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    150

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    Sounds to me like he is snoozing. I had a mare that was too high strung to(lie down to) sleep. She would fall asleep standing up and fall to her knees, wake up and start all over. It sounds to me like your horses sleep schedule was upset so he is "catching up". I would not worry about it.
    I also once had an old horse who loved to sleep all layed out flat- for some reason especially on the snow. People were always coming to tell me he was dead. Just needed a good sleep.



  9. #9
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    Doesn't seem to be any sort of pain...just normal sounding moans and groans.

    Okay, ya'll are making me feel better.....just a really bad place to pick to lay your arse down....at the gate!



  10. #10
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    Sep. 23, 2004
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    Holland Twp., NJ
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    Re: Narcolepsy,
    It generally does not first present itself as a horse choosing to lie down. Most folks notice the problem when the horse falls down in front of their eyes OR they notice the iconic and relatively unmistakable leg scrapes due to such falling.

    However... *IF* your horse has been dealing with a subtle case for a long time, he might have learned how to prevent damage/pain by going down by choice when he first feels the precursor to a narcoleptic attack; much the same way service dogs can be trained to detect the first signs of seizure activity in a human.

    I am ultimately disinclined to say this is a likely solution because narcoleptic sleep is not necessarily deeper then any normal sleep pattern. So narcolepsy alone wouldn't cause your horse's deep sleep and thus the difficulty you experience in trying to arouse him.

    It's definitely an interesting situation, and thankfully there doesn't seem to be any harm coming of it right now. I'll be curious to see what others suggest or opine.
    Do not take anything to heart. Do not hanker after signs of progress. Founder of the Riders with Fibromyalgia clique.



  11. #11
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    Dec. 27, 2006
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    If it helps any--my neighbor used to call me in a mild panic because she'd notice Sadie "laying down an awful lot." I'd laugh and tell her, dont worry, SHE'S LAZY! And she is, she takes naps,flat out, recumbent, standing up, sometimes she falls asleep when she's being ridden, and once she fell asleep and went to her knees while the farrier was working on her ("Uh, Sadie, just because he's holding up one of your front legs doesnt mean he can keep you off the ground if you decide to fold up the other one.")

    The OTHER horse, now, I almost never catch him copping some z's. And the one time, just this past Memorial Day, that I saw him laying down close to the barn I knew he was colicking, and so he was. He NEVER lays down where you can see him or get to him easily, only up in the field, and then seldom. But when he was hurting he made sure he was where I'd notice.

    Whereas it would not surprise me much to wake up in my own bed some morning and find Sadie in my room asking me to move over and let her get a little shut-eye....



  12. #12
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    Sep. 5, 2005
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    Mass.
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    Narcolepsy.
    I realize that I'm generalizing here, but as is often the case when I generalize, I don't care. ~ Dave Barry



  13. #13
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    Apr. 28, 2004
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    Saratoga Springs, NY
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    Default

    If he's deliberatly picking a place and laying down (as opposed to just randomly falling over/down asleep) then I'd go with him just taking a nap.



  14. #14
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    It starts out as a plop down to roll...which I expected (same spot, etc..and then the horse just rolls over and lays on side for many minutes.



  15. #15
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    Jan. 16, 2002
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    West Coast of Michigan
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    Default

    Could he be very vaguely sore somewhere and getting up requires just a bit more of an effort of will, so he has to gather himself up a bit before rising?

    Try pinpointing THAT. Sorry. Probably not very helpful.
    Click here before you buy.



  16. #16
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    Sep. 8, 2007
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    Wow, we had a mare at our barn in NC that did the EXACT same thing except maybe worse. She was an older mare, probably 19 or so. She would simply lay down right at the gate as soon as she was turned out. She would go into a deep sleep and start twitching hind legs and her eyes would roll around and she would shake at times. We called vet out twice thinking she was having some sort of seizure since she would not wake up. Vet said she didn't know what the horse was doing but it most likely was not a seizure and told us not to worry about it.

    The mare continued to do this for years, not every day, but most. She is still alive and well today, probably 25 years old roundabout. I still talk to her owners and she is just fine and dandy. I'll have to ask if she still does that weird thing at the gate. Is this some freaky mare thing I wonder? Mystery indeed.



  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by dwblover View Post
    Wow, we had a mare at our barn in NC that did the EXACT same thing except maybe worse. She was an older mare, probably 19 or so. She would simply lay down right at the gate as soon as she was turned out. She would go into a deep sleep and start twitching hind legs and her eyes would roll around and she would shake at times. We called vet out twice thinking she was having some sort of seizure since she would not wake up. Vet said she didn't know what the horse was doing but it most likely was not a seizure and told us not to worry about it.

    The mare continued to do this for years, not every day, but most. She is still alive and well today, probably 25 years old roundabout. I still talk to her owners and she is just fine and dandy. I'll have to ask if she still does that weird thing at the gate. Is this some freaky mare thing I wonder? Mystery indeed.
    Perhaps these two are somehow related? You'll have to find out the breeding for me. So far we have mare and NC in common.



  18. #18
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    Aug. 30, 2006
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    Williamston, NC
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    All in all I would trust your instincts. Sometimes gas or impaction has to build up to show full signs of colic. I have many horses, especially when it's warmer, that will go out and within an hour are laying flat out sleeping. One fellow has started doing this mid day. Worried me at first, but after about 4 days I decided he was simply changing his routine. I hope it's as simple as this. I know the concern you have with your horse having had colic surgery.



  19. #19
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    Mar. 20, 2010
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    You should really check your horse's heat rate when he's having an episode. To me, it sounds like how some of my horses sleep--but I don't know your horse.

    If his heart rate is elevated, he's probably in pain. If it is low, he could be sleeping.

    Narcolepsy is different. I rode a horse before he had been diagnosed and he would fall down while ridden and quick catch himself. before he fell on his side. Sometimes his knees would buckle and that would 'wake' him up. Hewould do the same thing when you handled him in general...he never just layed out in the field flat out with gas (or if he did, it was not attributed to the narcolepsy).

    Just FYI, narcolepsy can be confused with many other things, like EPM and other neurological problems.



  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by baysngreys View Post
    I have a horse, all winter, like clockwork, napped from 10:30-11am. Flat out, dead horse imitation.
    This is the routine of the majority of my crew every day. I cannot tell you how it freaked me out at first. They all took turns starting this little routine so at least one a week I was calling the vet in a lather thinking that something horrible was happening!
    I Loff My Quarter Horse & I love Fenway Bartholomule cliques

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