[Rodeio]

Thanks for the replies. I used to do only EWT but started trailering in to a barn for lessons that requires all horses, even the trailered in ones, to have EWT, Rhino, Flu and IN Strangles. So now to make things easier I just do everyone with EWT, Rhino, Flu and only the two I trailer will get the IN Strangles. I did decide to split them out as usual, didn't really save me much to do a five way anyway.

[walkon]

Fair enough. I consider vaccinations as part of developing a healthy immune system. It's all in how you look at it.

Watch just one kid suffocate to death from a disease that is 99.9% preventable with a simple vaccination, you're unlikely to forget it. Most of the demographic on the COTH BB can be excused for dismissing the devastating effect that infectious diseases have had on our lives as little as 60 years ago.

I have many experiences with the negative effect of drugs and treatments I recommend every day. But gazillions more positive ones. Which is how I can justify recommending them, with a healthy respect for risk vs. benefit. The same goes for anything we do to ourselves/loved ones/animals. This is why there are safety and efficacy data numbering in the tens of thousands of individuals. So we can logically overcome our natural but irrational tendency to consider one or two experiences as a substitute for an entire universe of data.

I used to think as you do. But, I have had much more than a couple negative experiences and so much heartbreak that now I am trying something different. So far with the dogs a huge improvement. We'll see over time with the horses.
I doubt my one horse will ever recover even without further
vaccination.

As for drugs - well, I have given up on those too. I have healed most of my issues after 20 or more years of living with them with diet changes but one will always remain due to a medical treatment (that I would not have had knowing what
I know now). Drs were not able to help me improve, I have
done it on my own.

So, my experiences in life have caused me to go other ways.
But I can see your point of view because I was there once.
My husband is just starting to change due to seeing positive
results in me and our dogs.

Maybe it is a matter of going over-board on vaccines and
drugs vs using only when absolutely necessary. Learning about the development of vaccines and what is in them has really opened my eyes. There was just a recall on Rotarix
due to extensive testing done by an independent lab. I am
sure there is no testing done on horse vaccines by
independent labs. Also, why do we need a vaccine for
infants for diarrhea? So many things could cause diarrhea.

Your argument for can also be used against - seeing just
1 child die from a vaccine is too much as well.

[sid]

Early April, we give EEE/WEE/Tet/WNV (in one shot) and PHF -- except for my elderly cushinoid mare and another horse that tends to replapse with Lyme. I do their shots at least a week apart.

May - Calvenza flu

Fall - Rabies and Botulism at the same time, with the exception of the horses mentioned above. Stallion get EVA in the Fall as well, but at least a week after the other shots.

Regarding comments from those who do not vaccinate, I'm with Deltawave. If you've ever seen a horse die of tetanus (I have) or botulism (I have) -- neither my own -- you'll never forget it.

[animaldoc]

If you're splitting vaccines (I don't usually for my own horse), there's some evidence that you really need to wait like 3 weeks between vaccines - that gives the body time to respond and quiet down...otherwise it's not really any different than giving them all at the same time.

[deltawave]

Also, why do we need a vaccine for
infants for diarrhea?

Because it can kill a baby, fast.

Yes, children can die from adverse reactions to vaccines. This is why we keep track of adverse reactions on a large scale. To a mother that's lost a child from an allergic reaction, you can't possibly rationalize that the product is "relatively safe", but if 10,000 other children have died WITHOUT the treatment, well, what do you tell those mothers?

[sid]

Thanks, animadoc. That's a good thing to know.

[SkipHiLad4me]

I've always had them all done at once up until this spring. My 21 yr old gelding started having injection site reactions the past couple of years and had a horrible bout of coughing due to allergies/COPD last summer. Vet recommended changing up his vaccinations in the spring with the idea that ramping up the immune system so much by giving all those vaccines at once could make him overreactive to the allergens. So this spring, we only did Enceph/WN thanks to our rampant mosquito population. I put off his rabies til the fall and skipped rhino/flu all together. Fingers crossed that it's a better allergy year for us.

[Ghazzu]

Also, why do we need a vaccine for
infants for diarrhea? So many things could cause diarrhea.

Diarrhea is the 2nd leading cause of infectious death in infants worldwide.

Rotavirus diarrhea kills over 500,000 children under the age of 5 every year.

There have been marked decreases in infant deaths due to diarrhea in countries where the rotavirus vaccine has been introduced.

Is that enough reason?

[EqTrainer]

We vaccinate for E/W/T 2x year, rabies and WNV once a year. Spring we do rabies... 2 weeks later WNV.. two weeks later E/W/T. I start in February and give E/W/T again in August. Given our prevalence of mosquitos in spring/fall, this seems to work best.

If I have a horse who has had a *system* reaction to a vaccination I would never revaccinate that horse without a very good reason. My vet agrees. Localized reactions are less concerning, treated w/NSAIDS and heat/ice.

I am caregiving right now for a clients pony who was given rabies, E/W/T and WNV all in the same day.. pony is now mildly laminitic and overheating. To those of you who give them all at once that have not had problems - consider yourself very lucky. Since most people can give an IM shot I really don't understand why anyone would do them all in one day, it's so simple to space them out and be safer.

[fivehorses]

Rabies in february. May EWT. June WNV. September EWT.

The vet does the shots. I don't want a reaction and not have the skill or drugs to deal with it.

[Equilibrium]

This is a timely thread as I will be shipping some horses home in the fall. I am worried about bombarding their systems with stuff they have never experienced before. I will hopefully be settling in KY. But on a CEM quarantine site I saw that they give the vaccines all at once. Which I thought after a long haul might do more harm than good. But then I was thinking maybe I could start doing the vacccines here, have proof, and things might not be so bad.

Forgive me for the stupid questions but here goes. What is Calenza? Why is it necessary for a Tet shot twice yearly? We only give one shot here per year and that's Flu/Tet. What exactly should my horses be getting? I am pro vaccine even though I know people blame them for this and that. We just got done with a very nasty case of measles floating around Ireland because people decided it wasn't necessary to vaccintate anymore because the disease wasn't around. The reason it wasn't around is because people have been vaccinated.

I understand other people's view to not vaccintate, but I am firmly in the camp of trying to protect my horses and so far that plan has included vaccinatiaons and will continue to do so.

Terri