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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Nov. 9, 2007
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    Default how does this bit work? (waterford butterfly flip)

    hi, just saw an image on a website for bits and i've never seen a bit like this before--- i'm not interested in it, i'm just kind of curious as to how it works cause i can't quite figure it out

    http://www.horsebitbank.com/images/b...ts-feature.jpg

    what are the hooks in the rings for? what are the smaller rings for (on each side) and what does the butterfly piece do?

    thanks
    (|--Sarah--|)

    Blitz <3 & Leap of Faith <3



  2. #2
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    May. 9, 2005
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    Chattanooga, Tennessee
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    Default

    I'll second the question. That thing is confusing looking!



  3. #3
    Join Date
    Feb. 3, 2009
    Location
    NY
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    309

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by superpony123 View Post
    hi, just saw an image on a website for bits and i've never seen a bit like this before--- i'm not interested in it, i'm just kind of curious as to how it works cause i can't quite figure it out

    http://www.horsebitbank.com/images/b...ts-feature.jpg

    what are the hooks in the rings for? what are the smaller rings for (on each side) and what does the butterfly piece do?

    thanks
    Woah that is strange hahaha no clue!! It looks like maybe a fancy gag but with a strange mouth peice



  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jan. 28, 2003
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    Hollywood, but not the one where they have the Oscars!
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    8,678

    Default

    its a waterford-tongueplate-baucher...lol
    "You can't really debate with someone who has a prescient invisible friend"
    carolprudm



  5. #5
    Join Date
    Aug. 2, 2009
    Location
    Osteen, FL
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    Default

    Wow- what a combination- I used this bit while in England riding for Tim Stockdale who has an endless bit collection.

    The butterfly flip bit- keeps the horse from being able to put their tongue over the bit.
    The Waterford mouthpiece- allows the bit to collapse on the horse's tongue and mold to the shape of the mouth. To pro- it's a custom fit, the con- it's constantly on the tongue.
    The bottom ring and boucher top loop- gives the effect of a gag
    The top ring gives the straight boucher effect- like a plain snaffle with a slight poll pressure.

    Hope this helps.
    Ryu Equestrian & Facebook Page
    Breeding Horses Today, for the Equestrian Sport of Tomorrow.
    Osteen & Gainesville, Florida.



  6. #6
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    Nov. 9, 2007
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    NJ
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MCarverS View Post
    Wow- what a combination- I used this bit while in England riding for Tim Stockdale who has an endless bit collection.

    The butterfly flip bit- keeps the horse from being able to put their tongue over the bit.
    The Waterford mouthpiece- allows the bit to collapse on the horse's tongue and mold to the shape of the mouth. To pro- it's a custom fit, the con- it's constantly on the tongue.
    The bottom ring and boucher top loop- gives the effect of a gag
    The top ring gives the straight boucher effect- like a plain snaffle with a slight poll pressure.

    Hope this helps.
    interesting! thanks
    (|--Sarah--|)

    Blitz <3 & Leap of Faith <3



  7. #7
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    Jan. 28, 2003
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MCarverS View Post
    Wow- what a combination- I used this bit while in England riding for Tim Stockdale who has an endless bit collection.

    The butterfly flip bit- keeps the horse from being able to put their tongue over the bit.
    The Waterford mouthpiece- allows the bit to collapse on the horse's tongue and mold to the shape of the mouth. To pro- it's a custom fit, the con- it's constantly on the tongue.
    The bottom ring and boucher top loop- gives the effect of a gag
    The top ring gives the straight boucher effect- like a plain snaffle with a slight poll pressure.

    Hope this helps.
    well thats what i said...lol
    "You can't really debate with someone who has a prescient invisible friend"
    carolprudm



  8. #8
    Join Date
    Oct. 31, 2001
    Location
    West of insanity, east of apathy, deep in the heart of Texas.
    Posts
    15,934

    Thumbs down

    Rotating "butterfly" reminds me of some of the older bits that are designed to prevent the horse from getting its tongue over the bit. The Waterford mouthpiece would prevent leaning on the bit, and the gag cheeks would prevent the horse from lowering its head too much and getting behind the bit, a common problem with Waterfords.

    One stop training, that all takes place in a horse's mouth.

    Ecchhh.
    In loving memory of Laura Jahnke.
    A life lived by example, done too soon.
    www.caringbridge.org/page/laurajahnke/



  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb. 17, 2010
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    Purcellville, VA
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    Default

    When I first saw this bit, it reminded me of something a client used on her horse....we called it "The Home Depot" bridle



  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jul. 31, 2007
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    Default

    I like it's baroque prettiness-- unclosed hooks and all.

    Quick question: Do the butterfly wings or spoons come off the bit in a flexible way or are the "stems" stiff? If they are stiff, it seems to me that these help produce the gag action-- they hold the bit at a fixed angle in the horse's mouth. This would produce the leverage between hand (or the bottom of the bit) and the poll.

    I haven't explained it well, but do you see what I mean?

    I also assume the hooks on the rings aren't closed for aesthetic reasons. They still do the job of keeping the reins at a fixed spot on the rings.

    I do like the unique combination of flexible bit plus gag. That's funky and may be just the ticket for some horse out there.
    The armchair saddler
    Politically Pro-Cat



  11. #11
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    Dec. 2, 2002
    Location
    Berlin, Germany
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ESG View Post

    One stop training, that all takes place in a horse's mouth.

    Ecchhh.
    This is clearly not a bit marketed for use by amateurs. The type of rider that is educated enough to use this bit effectively, I'm sure, would not be aiming for "one stop training that all takes place in the horse's mouth".

    For what it's worth, I think bitting is an extremely personal science that is different for every horse. While I've never come across a horse that would necessarily benefit from this type of bit, I would assume there are some out there. It's easy to be quick to judge from a picture how severe the action of a bit is or how lazy it is to use it, but without having seen or experienced how a particular horse goes in this type of bit or others, I wouldn't be so quick to put in my two cents.
    Here today, gone tomorrow...



  12. #12
    Join Date
    Aug. 31, 2004
    Location
    VA
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    4,345

    Default

    When I have seen bits with tongue things like that, they rotate 360 degrees around the mouthpiece. Like a bead on a string? Does that make sense?
    -Grace



  13. #13
    Join Date
    Aug. 2, 2009
    Location
    Osteen, FL
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    Default

    Yeah the butterfly flip tongue pusher downer thingie :-) does rotate, so if the horse tries to lift it's tongue, the pusher downer thingie goes with it if that makes sense.
    Ryu Equestrian & Facebook Page
    Breeding Horses Today, for the Equestrian Sport of Tomorrow.
    Osteen & Gainesville, Florida.



  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jan. 9, 2010
    Location
    Milton, FL
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    517

    Default

    Wow! That's my recommendation for "wide world of weird bits!"
    Steppin Not Dragon "Bella"
    Top Shelf "Charlie"
    Check out the Military + Horses fb page!



  15. #15
    Join Date
    Sep. 22, 2008
    Location
    NC
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    Default

    I have a horse that would probably go well in a bit like this. He loves his waterford mouthpiece and it helps with his tendency to lean on the bit and want the rider to support his fore. However over fences he gets strong and needs more than just a simple snaffle for brakes. So instead of having two bits, something like this would allow me to work on both issues in one ride easier than before.

    He doesn't need the funny butterfly tongue thing though.... that's just funny looking

    We actually looked at getting him this bit, which has a similar action
    http://www.dragonflysaddlery.co.uk/l...+Universal+bit



  16. #16
    Join Date
    May. 4, 2008
    Posts
    170

    Default

    It looks like a decoration! Maybe I should put it on my Christmas tree next year...
    "It's about the horse and that's it" - George Morris



  17. #17
    Join Date
    Mar. 11, 2006
    Location
    Eastern Washington
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    Default

    Interesting! I have quite the collection of bits and never have seen one like this. Thank you for explaining its use.
    Unbridled Oaks - Champion Sport Ponies and Welsh Cobs

    Like us on Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/unbridledoaks



  18. #18
    Join Date
    Nov. 1, 2005
    Location
    The Prairie
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    Default

    The website is called Bespoke Bits....maybe it was designed and named for the jumper Butterfly Flip (I think that was Malin Baryard's horse). Or maybe the horse was named after the bit lol...

    I understand the Waterford part, the spoon part and the boucher part...I still don't understand what the open hooks inside the bit ring do? Or is that just a decorative embellishment?
    "Because it's 2015"



  19. #19
    Join Date
    May. 2, 2008
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    Hampton, VA
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    Default

    Ok, very pretty bit, and I understand what people are saying about the mechanics of how it works. But that butterfly part made my gag reflex kick in!
    "Beware the hobby that eats."
    Benjamin Franklin



  20. #20
    Join Date
    Oct. 31, 2001
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    West of insanity, east of apathy, deep in the heart of Texas.
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    Cool

    Quote Originally Posted by FrenchFrytheEqHorse View Post
    This is clearly not a bit marketed for use by amateurs.
    Umm, I don't see anything that says "for professional use only" on that photo. What's to stop an ammy from buying one?

    The type of rider that is educated enough to use this bit effectively, I'm sure, would not be aiming for "one stop training that all takes place in the horse's mouth".
    I wouldn't let the type of rider that would use this bit near a horse of mine. A competent rider/trainer not only doesn't need a bit like this, but would run like hell from it.


    For what it's worth, I think bitting is an extremely personal science that is different for every horse. While I've never come across a horse that would necessarily benefit from this type of bit, I would assume there are some out there. It's easy to be quick to judge from a picture how severe the action of a bit is or how lazy it is to use it, but without having seen or experienced how a particular horse goes in this type of bit or others, I wouldn't be so quick to put in my two cents.
    Well, that's your opinion and you're entitled to it. And sorry, but you can definitely get an accurate idea of how severe a bit will be, from its design. No one looks at a spade bit (which the "butterfly" part of this bit resembles, and functions similarly to), and thinks, "Oh, what a great bit to put on my dressage horse!". Think about it.
    In loving memory of Laura Jahnke.
    A life lived by example, done too soon.
    www.caringbridge.org/page/laurajahnke/



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