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  1. #1
    Join Date
    May. 7, 2009
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    1,419

    Default Smart Calm Ultra

    I am not up on my banned substances so I am looking for help. I need to put a horse on something to help with calming her. I looked at the Smartpak comparison chart and I think the Smartpak Ultra might be my best option. Can I use this on a horse and still show that horse? If I CAN"t show on this supplement what is the next best option? I DO NOT want to take the risk of being drug tested and having an issue. So if you were going to show on a regular basis what supplement would you use on a daily basis to help calm a horse that has just a bit too much forward motion and gets "worried" she is NOT spooky, she is not a freak, she is just forward and worries a LOT!!!
    Kim
    If you are lucky enough to ride, you are lucky enough.



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar. 19, 2008
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    1,938

    Default

    I don't think SmartCalm Ultra is legal, but I believe regular SmartCalm (which I use for my "worrier" and like quite a bit although it doesn't really make him any less forward) is OK.



  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun. 29, 2008
    Location
    San Diego
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    2,223

    Default

    Maybe try raspberry leaf, it seems to work well for some mare and even geldings. I buy mine in bulk for about $5 a pound, and give 1/4 cup a day. While the SmartCalm is USEF legal because it is only Vit. B (Thiamine), and Magnesium, I know here in CA the state department of agriculture does the testing, and according to the Equine Medication Monitoring Program Pamphlet they test for 'excess' levels of thiamine. Whatever constitutes an 'excess' amount of thiamine who knows. The SmartCalm Ultra has L-Tryptophan, which I have heard they can not test for because it is a naturally occurring amino acid. I have my horse on SmartCalm and have been happy with it. If you are unsure contact USEF, they are great about getting an answer for you quickly.



  4. #4
    Join Date
    Oct. 12, 2007
    Location
    California
    Posts
    128

    Default

    Actually, I believe it *is* legal...I'm a little up in the air about the presence of L-tryptophan, but I can't find anything saying it's not....

    I'm curious to know this, I added the Ultra to my next SmartPak order too.



  5. #5
    Join Date
    Sep. 15, 2005
    Posts
    950

    Default

    I wish I could order from Smartpak up here but they don't ship over the border. I'd love to try the smartcalm ultra for my mare. She sounds just like yours does Hellerkm.
    __________________________________________________ _
    Proud member of PETA: People Eating Tasty Animals!



  6. #6
    Join Date
    May. 1, 2007
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    627

    Default

    It is most definitely legal. I had a long chat with the vets at smartpak as well as scoured the banned substances list. People seem to worry about the tryptophan, as imjustjoking said, but tryptophan is a naturally occuring amino acid that animals produce regularly so it will be present in any blood draw. A standard dose of smartcalm Ultra won't alter the levels to anything that would even raise an eyebrow.



  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar. 5, 2007
    Posts
    1,704

    Default

    Instead of guessing or taking some complete strangers word for the legality of the product ( or the word of the manufacturer LOL) simply contact USEF.

    United States Equestrian Federation®
    Equine Drugs and Medications Program
    3760 Ridge Mill Drive, Hilliard, Ohio 43026
    Phone 800.633.2472
    Fax 614.771.7706
    E-mail: medequestrian@aol.com



  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb. 1, 2001
    Location
    Finally...back in civilization, more or less
    Posts
    11,712

    Default

    If you are asking if it is legal to give a supplement or medication to a horse to make it more quiet/tractable then the strict answer is - NO.

    All permitted medications are supposed to be for a therapeutic purpose, which is defined as treating and illness or injury. Giving anything with the intent of altering behavior is against the rules. Interestingly enough, the way the rule is written, it doesn't even have to WORK to be against the rules. The attempt to alter behavior puts you out of bounds.

    Of course everyone in the real world knows it goes on all the time and the real question tends to be, "what can I use for this purpose without getting set down?"

    To which I would answer, a lot of barns use Perfect Prep.

    Personally, I'd get the little sucker good and tired, either by riding it or using Mr. Longeline, or weather permitting, letting it stay out overnight.
    **********
    We move pretty fast for some rabid garden snails.
    -PaulaEdwina



  9. #9
    Join Date
    May. 28, 2002
    Posts
    2,907

    Default

    How does Perfect Prep differ from Smart Calm Ultra? Does anyone know? I have given PP to my horse at shows. Was also considering Smart Calm Ultra....



  10. #10
    Join Date
    Oct. 30, 2006
    Posts
    3,381

    Default

    IME it doesn't work anyway.
    Quote Originally Posted by barka.lounger View Post
    u get big old crop and bust that nags ass the next time it even slow down.

    we see u in gp ring in no time.



  11. #11
    Join Date
    May. 7, 2009
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    1,419

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucassb View Post
    If you are asking if it is legal to give a supplement or medication to a horse to make it more quiet/tractable then the strict answer is - NO.

    All permitted medications are supposed to be for a therapeutic purpose, which is defined as treating and illness or injury. Giving anything with the intent of altering behavior is against the rules. Interestingly enough, the way the rule is written, it doesn't even have to WORK to be against the rules. The attempt to alter behavior puts you out of bounds.

    Of course everyone in the real world knows it goes on all the time and the real question tends to be, "what can I use for this purpose without getting set down?"

    To which I would answer, a lot of barns use Perfect Prep.

    Personally, I'd get the little sucker good and tired, either by riding it or using Mr. Longeline, or weather permitting, letting it stay out overnight.
    Ok, I get it, I see how the rule reads. Mare lives out, we do lunge, and she is forward but never running away or spooky AT ALL, she just "worries" I am sort of at a loss on how to totally describe this, she was abuse in a former home, she is TOTALLY broke with no real bad habits ( I assume they beat them out of her) but she is constantly tense and worried about what your going to ask for next , even though she is perfectly CAPABLE of doing ANYTHING you ask for. In all honesty I just feel bad for her, sweet personality, lovely mover, easy to ride ( if you don't mind the more forward pace ) but constantly worried that she is not doing something right. I have tired talking to her the whole time we ride I have tried shutting up the whole time we ride, I have tried small bits of work with LOTS of walking and stretching time, I have tried longer periods of work in an attempt to really tired her out. I realize this just might be her personality ( although I do think it comes from her past experiences) and my goal was just to put her mind at ease a bit. I really love her and feel bad that she thinks someone it going to mistreat her again.
    If you have any other suggestions I am open to options! thanks for the help! Oh and this is NOT one of our ponies it is a mare we brought into breed last year and she did not take, I happen to really like her ( always finding the misfits LOL!) and have kind of taken her on as a small project until we start trying to breed her again in the early spring! Although if I get her going we might skip breeding her this year and just play around with her to see how we do, I have NOT had time to ride in a long time so it would be nice to get back in the show ring this year just to mess around. If it does not work out it is NOT a huge deal I enjoy her and will just play with her at home.
    Last edited by hellerkm; Feb. 19, 2010 at 06:25 AM. Reason: spelling
    Kim
    If you are lucky enough to ride, you are lucky enough.



  12. #12
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    Dec. 28, 2001
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    over yonder
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    Default

    Not to de-rail the topic, but why do you want to breed this pony? She does not sound like she has the best temperment to pass on.
    Auventera Two:Some women would eat their own offspring if they had some dipping sauce.



  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by RockinHorse View Post
    Not to de-rail the topic, but why do you want to breed this pony? She does not sound like she has the best temperment to pass on.
    Again, NOT a pony! and she is sweet, quiet to work around, very WILLING to do her job, a good mover, and in her previous life she was ABUSED, as far as I know that is NOT a GENETIC defect. Very easy to work with on the ground, not the least bit nasty or even marey, just WORRIED that you will ask for something when you are riding that she does not expect. According to the people we got her from they could not school her changes, she WOULD NOT CHANGE, I have NO issues getting her to change, she does like to be VERY balanced when you ask and if you school them over and over and over she gets upset, she is the type of mare who likes to get it right the first time ( and she usually does) and move on. We were told she had been ridden by a very "rough" male trainer and he decided she was worthless. I find her sweet, willing and would just like to ease her mind a bit when we are working, I see nothing wrong with trying to make her job a bit more pleasurable for her. As far as breeding if she passes along all of her personality and her kindness then we will have a very nice foal, you can't fault her for the fact that she worries when someone BEAT that worry into her!
    Kim
    If you are lucky enough to ride, you are lucky enough.



  14. #14
    Join Date
    Mar. 12, 2006
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    4,343

    Default

    In all honesty I just feel bad for her, sweet personality, lovely mover, easy to ride ( if you don't mind the more forward pace ) but constantly worried that she is not doing something right.
    Maybe she just needs more mileage and riding.

    I had my mare on smart calm ultra. I ended up taking her off of it as she has settled in a lot. For reference, it was very helpful in eliminating any spooks. However, our main under saddle issue is that she can get a little tense/worried and quick when jumping. It made not one iota of difference in that arena. What has helped has been a slow, methodical approach to jumping, good flatwork, regular work. Time and patience is probably what your horse needs- sometimes it just takes a while. A long while.



  15. #15
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    Jul. 23, 2007
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    New Jersey
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    920

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by hellerkm View Post
    Again, NOT a pony! and she is sweet, quiet to work around, very WILLING to do her job, a good mover, and in her previous life she was ABUSED, as far as I know that is NOT a GENETIC defect. Very easy to work with on the ground, not the least bit nasty or even marey, just WORRIED that you will ask for something when you are riding that she does not expect. According to the people we got her from they could not school her changes, she WOULD NOT CHANGE, I have NO issues getting her to change, she does like to be VERY balanced when you ask and if you school them over and over and over she gets upset, she is the type of mare who likes to get it right the first time ( and she usually does) and move on. We were told she had been ridden by a very "rough" male trainer and he decided she was worthless. I find her sweet, willing and would just like to ease her mind a bit when we are working, I see nothing wrong with trying to make her job a bit more pleasurable for her. As far as breeding if she passes along all of her personality and her kindness then we will have a very nice foal, you can't fault her for the fact that she worries when someone BEAT that worry into her!
    I commend you for helping to ease her anxiety. I have a mare who is wonderful and brave but started her career on the QH circuit where they can be rough. Unlike your mare she doesn't really worry instead she "tests" anyone new who gets on her. Nothing bad....she is 17 hands so she just makes herself bigger by sticking her head straight up in the air to see what you will do. If you don't grab her face or get intimidated after 10 minutes she is done and drops her head all on her own.
    I found with horses like her, or a worrier, consistant "good" rides *usually* will win out over TIME, sometimes lots of time.
    Like elephants, horses never seem to totally forget the bad done to them.
    Sorry I don't know which supplements work but did want to give my input.
    Adriane
    Happily retired but used to be:
    www.ParrotNutz.com



  16. #16
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    May. 7, 2009
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    Quote Originally Posted by Parrotnutz View Post
    I commend you for helping to ease her anxiety. I have a mare who is wonderful and brave but started her career on the QH circuit where they can be rough. Unlike your mare she doesn't really worry instead she "tests" anyone new who gets on her. Nothing bad....she is 17 hands so she just makes herself bigger by sticking her head straight up in the air to see what you will do. If you don't grab her face or get intimidated after 10 minutes she is done and drops her head all on her own.
    I found with horses like her, or a worrier, consistant "good" rides *usually* will win out over TIME, sometimes lots of time.
    Like elephants, horses never seem to totally forget the bad done to them.
    Sorry I don't know which supplements work but did want to give my input.
    Thanks I do agree that more time and BETTER WEATHER ( will winter ever end??) might help, although like i said she is not spooky or UP just worried and forward but not rushing or pulling. I was just wondering what other people used, if the Smartpak Ultra calm is "legal" and if there were other options. She has settled very nicely in her stall, on the cross ties, and will hack out cross country without any issues at all, leading or following, you can just feel her tense up in the ring where I assume they tried to push their point just a bit too hard ( IMO of course).
    Kim
    If you are lucky enough to ride, you are lucky enough.



  17. #17
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    May. 7, 2009
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    Default

    It made not one iota of difference in that arena

    OK off topic but I thought I was the only person who said IOTA LOL!!! great word and very over used in my house LOL!!!!
    Kim
    If you are lucky enough to ride, you are lucky enough.



  18. #18
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    Nov. 21, 2008
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    916

    Default

    Have you tried Gastroguard? I would be concerned that a worried horse could lead to stomache trouble and more worry. I've also found that many of them relax on it since they feel better.



  19. #19
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    Sep. 16, 2006
    Location
    Texas
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    770

    Default

    I have a mare that sounds similar to the OP's - not spooky, just VERY forward at times and tense. Smart Calm Ultra did diddly squat for us. What has seemed to help a LOT is raspberry leaves (Mare Magic is the same thing). I noticed a difference in 2 weeks - less rushy, more focused, less "her highness decrees..." attitude.

    You can get Mare Magic in Smartpaks if that is what your barn likes, or like someone mentioned above, it can be purchased in bulk for much cheaper, just search this board for that info.

    And no, raspberry leaves do not test.

    Good luck!



  20. #20
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    May. 7, 2009
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    Quote Originally Posted by luvs2ridewbs View Post
    Have you tried Gastroguard? I would be concerned that a worried horse could lead to stomache trouble and more worry. I've also found that many of them relax on it since they feel better.
    Problem is the ONLY time she worries is when she is in the ring, since our fields are covered in snow we can't ride in them at the moment, but if we trail ride she is GREAT, could the 3-4 hours a week we are spending in the ring cause the need for a stomach supplement? She lives out 24/7 comes into a stall for a bit when i am getting ready to tack up and is PERFECTLY fine during any activity other than riding in the ring. I never considered she might need something for her stomach as she does not worry constantly.
    Kim
    If you are lucky enough to ride, you are lucky enough.



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