Pictures of Starbuck the Perlino stallion. It clearly shows that there is no difference in color to the picture of my Perlino WB filly. And it also makes clear that the pink skin and aqua blue eyes are absolutely the same as with cremellos. Only mane and tail is darker and some kind of reddish.
You are absolutely right, Starbuck is a beautiful example. But I do not own him, he is owned by Red Fox Farm in Texas http://www.redfoxfarmtx.com and was the nicest example to show what a Perlino really looks like.
Chelsea...I wondered about this myself, if the colt could be smokey cream. The only way this could be true is if the mare was not a cremello and actually a smokey cream. Unfortunately this could not be true as a smokey cream only occurs if the black horse has a cream gene from EACH parent. Cremello x palomino can still only result in cremello or palomino offspring.
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please can you tell me more about your perlino foal and the parents ?
What is the breeding of Upper Class and what have the stallion for papers ? In which association is the stallion approved ? And the mare registered ? I can not found informations of him.
Can you post more pictures of the foal as newborn foal and also as 3 years old mare or so ?
Chelsea, the filly was sold as a foal and I don't have adult pictures. The sire was an approved ZfDP buckskin stallion by Unkensee the Trakehner. He was approved 1989 and I sold him the same year I think, don't really remember as it is so long ago. He had bred two Palomino mares before he was sold. He was castrated as the new owners did not want a stallion but wanted his color and jumping potential. The filly was then born the year later and was a Perlino as he is a Buckskin and the dam Palomino, so it was possible to create a Perlino. The color was not creamy as with a cremello but like ivory and the mane and tail and also some parts of the body was shimmering silvery reddish. You can see Upper Class at this site http://www.gestuet-falkenhorst.de/stallion.htm. He was a very dark buckskin.
Here is a picture of the Oldenburg Palomino filly Praline as a one week old baby. The pinkish skin of birth is slightly going into a darker color already, but you can still see that the skin is not yet real dark. It is also the same apricot coat color as Modern Art's. I never take pictures of Palomino foals before they are minimum one week old as the pinkish skin around eyes and nose does not look so pretty then the darker skin that comes about a week later.
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Ive got to say, for what my 2 cents are worth on this discussion, Mahal - yours is a palomino foal - not a cremello and certainly not a perlino!
Here is a picture of my palomino TB - Nikita - filly at 2-3 days of age. The muzzle is still pinkish and the skin has not really started to darken yet except slightly around the muzzle.
I had never had a palomino born before this one, so I was rather confused in the beginning as to whether or not I did, in fact, HAVE a palomino!
The mane and forelock were whitish coming out, but when she dried off, they went to an apricot color, so then I wasnt sure if I had a light chestnut instead.
Then as she matured, the skin darkened, the coat darkened and the mane and tail got whiter.
Mahal - he is a lovely colt, and I am sure will be a wonderful addition to your breeding program - as a palomino and not as a perlino
[This message was edited by Spot on Apr. 07, 2003 at 08:51 AM.]
First, congtrats on a healthy foal, no matter what the color!
Second, no matter how much you want that foal to be a perlino, it CAN'T be, due to GENETICS. I read up on this last night, and for the life of me, I can't figure out why you continue to insist that your foal has defied what are "knowns" in genetics.
Your foal looks EXACTLY like the three palominos I've seen shortly after birth.
Why is color so important to you? Isn't palomino a pretty enough color? Is the foal going to be less important to you if he is not what you were hoping for?
Chelsea, chestnuts and palominos are born with pink skin and it turns dark in about 1 to 2 weeks...so the pink skin on this foal means nothing at all at birth to a week. Since the foal does not have AQUA LIGHT BLUE EYES at birth it means it is not even a cremello. The foal can only be one of two colors palomino/cremello. PLEASE GO SEE THE COLOR CHART posted in my second post on page one. Here is a close up photo of my stallion Billionair's eye, which I pulled from the IRC site to show a close up of an AQUA BLUE EYE!
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thank you Aurum to the answer about Upper Class.
Has the filly German Warmblood Papers ?
I think the best way is what Daydream Believer said: make a DNA test about his color.
I think he looks different as the two palominos who posted by aurum and Spot.
i saw at your website that Noa get 2002 a buckskin spotted blanket filly.
And I think agree with vanilla & black that not only the parants important for the foal color, also the grandparents. Atom posted there was a buckskin mare in Noas pedigree, and I think she can get a perlino or also a smoky cream.
Mahal-have your stallion also brown or dark brown ancestors in his pedigree ?
palomino and cremello are dilutes of chestnut. Chestnut is recessive. A chestnut horse can only have chestnut "base" genes or it is not chestnut. So, while a two bays can make a chestnut (they both may have a recessive chestnut gene), two chestnuts CAN NOT make a bay. Therefore, grandparent color (or any other ancester in this particular case) makes no difference since there is no way that either the sire or dam of the foal in question could have had a bay/black gene and still be the color they are.
Some things in color genetics are hard, this isn't one of them...
And chelsea, the buckskin filly that mare had last year got it's black/bay gene from it's sire Apollon, not the mare...
I have here a picture from a Kinsky Perlino he looks as yours.He has also blue eyes and is 11 years old.
The father was a buckskin stallion.
It is the same color as your nice foal with the same metallic shine http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_c.../icon_wink.gifit is the Equus Kinsky Touch and special for Equus Kinsky breed.
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Equus Kinsky Stallion in Palomino Color
that horse does look like a smoky cream and not like a perlino.
yes the filly has German Warmblood, Deutsches Reitpferd, papers.
As for genetics, NO the bucksin gene cannot skip a generation, that is total nonsense. Since the dam Noa is a cremello (and she is - I know it since I had bred her with Apollon live cover) and since Mahal is a Palomino there is no way other than Palomino or cremello. It is not a cremello because the aqua blue eyes are missing and the skin is not rose pink, so it must be a Palomino. The filly by Apollon is buckskin because Apollon is a black leopard and that is why that filly is a buckskin, not due to the dam. I also had a dark buckskin blanketed colt by Apollon out of a Palomino mare.
I don't know why it seems so complicated for people to understand genetics and to admit that cremello x palomino does not give anything as cremello or palomino at 50% each.
If one wants to bred for color it would be necessary to learn a minimum about genetics first before inventing the rules of genetics new! Otherwise they only make a fool out of themselves by insisting on something that cannot be.