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  1. #21
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    its in my family, the type II. At least one of my uncles died from it.

    its not always weight related, as has been stated, but being overweight sure doesn't help.

    Metformin for me produced MORE stress as I had horrible side effects at the tiniest doses and really couldn't function because of the nausea it caused even on only half a tab of the smallest size.

    The research I read says that probably the reactive hypoglycemia of one's younger years is the early phase of the same illness- not that the hypoglycemia causes the diabetes. Also the reactive hypoglycemia leads to overeating because for some people it creates ravenous hunger. if you've never been hypoglycemic you woldn't understand how sick it can make you feel and food is the fast cure- but you have to be very careful about what kind of food, or you just get into a cycle of up and down with your blood sugar.


    The Dr. Bernstein book and several other naturopathic books as well as something called "The Paleo Diet" have been very helpful. Lean Protein and leafy green veggies are the mainstay of what I eat. Any sort of grain product and most fruits are just too much like jet fuel for this old clunker, and will burn out my motor.
    "The Threat of Internet Ignorance: ... we are witnessing the rise of an age of equestrian disinformation, one where a trusting public can graze on nonsense packaged to look like fact."-LRG-AF



  2. #22
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    I have hypoglycemia, too. I manage it through diet. BUT, as I encounter this again and again and again... the everyday American diet is replete with sugars. Jammed with sugar. Acknowledge that fact, and you're on your way to eating better.

    Get with a good nutritionist. Don't go the diet and glycemic index on your own. There is more than one index in use!!! You need to learn how to read food labels, the sugar, carb, protein numbers. You have to eat fresh foods, READ labels, and avoid with great determination and will power any packaged foods (spaghetti sauces, even canned veggies!) that contain any sugars. Evaporated cane juice, juice concentrate -- these are ALL sugars and are all trouble, and IMO this is how people who 'couldn't believe' they could end up Type 2, end up type 2. Oh, and juices and alcohol! A big sugar source.

    Low carb/glycemic, good proteins, good fats, hydration with water, and supplements: It's a tough diet to follow, but one that everyone in the country should be following, as that is how we as humans have been designed to eat.

    I always have a source of protein with me. Always. Cheese, soy chips, some nuts. They are there should I need an emergency pickmeup.

    CapOnLap: Is it untreated reactive hypoglycemia that leads to diabetes, or just if you have RH, watch your diet, you're still skunked?



  3. #23
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    Cyberbay- I am not an endocrinologist, AND PLEASE DON'T TAKE THIS AS SPECIFIC MEDICAL ADVICE:TALK A LOT WITH YOUR OWN DOCTOR AND DIETICIAN IF YOU HAVE SPECIFIC QUESTIONS. if you want to read the research you can defend whatever position you want, but this is my interpretation:

    reactive hypoglycemia, for some people, is a genetically determined reaction to fast carb sources. As you say, our modern diet is packed with fast carbs and so people with the predisposition will suffer RH ( as I did as a child and young person). However all this up/down/massive release of insulin all day long leads to overeating which leads to overweight and insulin resistance, also part of the same genetic predisposition. And eventually the pancreatic insulin response and the cell's response to the insulin, wears both of them out, so that's what becomes, first pre-daibetes or insulins resistance or metabolic syndrome, and eventually one form of type 2 diabetes.

    I don't think there is ANY research out there that tells us with the familial predisposition, that if we watch our diet carefully from the beginning, we won't get the diabetes, but I am betting on it. I am hoping we're not simply doomed by our genes despite what good things we do for ourselves.

    The large amounts of carbs that are included in the modern diet were not present in as great a quantity when humans evolved. An ancient "Paleo" diet, was very low on carbs- there simply wasn't that much wild grain about and it took a long time to gather and to prepare as wild grains are mostly bran and need to be boiled or pounded to be digestible. Cavemen probably ate a fair amount of animal flesh, leafy greens, some roots, some nuts and berries and few dairy products, if any (fresh-not cultured- dairy products are often high in carbs too!)The ability to mount a good insulin response is probably an advantage for evolutionary survival, as it makes us able to eat those fast carbs and cope without getting sick. So as we became farmers and were able to produce large amounts of grain products- that store well out of the growing season- those who could eat the grains survived better. At least long enough to reproduce. Since ancient humans only lived about 35 years, the gene survived, but its later consequences in older age are what we are seeing now.

    Our modern diet sux rox. Most of the advice I see given to diabetics to cope with the modern diet also sux- recommendations for all those artifical sweeteners, using hypoglycemic drugs, and increasing amounts of insulin so that they can continue to consume fast carbs, especially treats and alcohol- I don't think it does any one any favours. I have substantially altered my diet as a result of my reading. I eat a lot of salads, a lot of cooked greens, a few pulses such as peas and beans , a fair bit of lean animal protein like meat and eggs and some cultured dairy products like cheeses. I might have one piece of bread or similar carb a day, and even though I love rice, I confine it to once a week or so, rarely eat potatoes or pasta and deserts are usually fresh fruit or dark cocolate when I ahve them. I minimize my alcohol intake. I am certainly not perfect, but rarely get RH anymore. My diet is also fairly low calorie, so I take several supplements to ensure I am getting enough vitamins and minerals.

    It is very difficult to keep to the guidelines, not to mention expensive and time consuming, as one has to avoid any sort of pre-packaged or processed foods which are all high in sugars and sweeteners and carb thickening agents.
    "The Threat of Internet Ignorance: ... we are witnessing the rise of an age of equestrian disinformation, one where a trusting public can graze on nonsense packaged to look like fact."-LRG-AF



  4. #24
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    OP - I hope I've not hijacked your thread. Please consider working with a nutritionist. You stand a good chance of reversing your condition through diet. Also, if there is heart disease in the family, there is sugar disease, IMO.

    ConLap -- no, you're not violating your Hypocratic oath!! KNow all about the paleo concept of diet.

    I've been working with a nutritionist since the onset of (obvious) symptoms. She is very good and has been able to tell me which sorts of foods are good, which are not so good: for example: red skin potatoes, yams, sweet potatoes = good; white potatoes = not good, that sort of thing. Dark leafy greens! She also pointed out that I have a wheat sensitivity. An itchy ear is a chronic sign of a food allergy, too, which flares up whenever I have a cookie too many. I do eat beans quite a bit. My carbs are mostly vegs and fruit now, with some going off the rez when I just want 'something else to eat.' I will eat sweets; I don't do juices or alcohol.

    Doctors to this day would not be able to tell me I have RH. The nutrionist told me by reading my blood work. Anyhow, with moderate carbs and protein 5x/day, I am basically fine. I only get woo-woo if I haven't eaten in a timely way. Protein is ALWAYS IN THE HOUSE (and car). What do you mean by your symptoms coming up? And I envy your fasting blood sugar.

    The American diet is a complete danger to human health!! This type 2 issue is b/c they're making us focus on fat (our health guidelines, I swear, is nothing more than just one lobbyist group outgunning another lobbyist group), when the real problem in health is SUGAR.



  5. #25

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    Here is the ADA food advisor interactive app I was talking about.

    http://www.diabetes.org/food-and-fit...-food-advisor/

    I've found it be a useful patient teaching tool to enable new onset diabetics to find out where their favorite meals fall in the scheme of things and learn how to adapt it to fit.

    There are usually plenty of free seminars at most hospitals. Try and attend one. Ask as many questions as you can think of.

    My own diet is a modified controlled carb diet. Emphasis on the quality proteins and avoid the 3 white powders, Flour, Sugar and Cocaine (ok kidding on the cocaine.)

    TTP



  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by cyberbay View Post
    OP - I hope I've not hijacked your thread. Please consider working with a nutritionist. You stand a good chance of reversing your condition through diet. Also, if there is heart disease in the family, there is sugar disease, IMO.
    No, no not at all. This has actually been some fascinating reading. I already make a point of not eating sugar if I can help it, plus lots of leafy green veggies, nuts and cheese etc as snacks as many have posted, and dont drink much alcohol (maybe a drink or two a couple of times a week).
    Keep it comin' this has been some great information from everyone.


    Let's see what y'all think about this:
    The dr gave me a glucose monitor thing and i check my blood 2x a day, some days more.
    My fasting blood in the morning is always over 200, one day as high as 267, and my blood 2 hrs after dinner is usually around 140.
    One day around 4 pm all of sudden I got weak and nauseous and could barely stand, so I took my reading real quick before i made a sandwich just to see what it was and it was in the mid 70's. And i had eaten a healthy breakfast and lunch that day.


    **eta: rechecked the meter and realized i posted the wrong results.
    the 140 and up is the am reading and the 267 is the pm. It hasn't been lower than 140 in the am at all
    Last edited by Jaegermonster; Dec. 29, 2009 at 10:32 PM. Reason: posted blood results backwards
    "Perhaps the final test of anybody's love of dogs is their willingness to permit them to make a camping ground of the bed" -Henry T. Merwin



  7. #27
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    I can only speak from the Type I perspective, but I've been around the block and back with that, having been diabetic 37 years now.
    Typically 70's is considered in the range of normal blood sugars, but one can get the same low sugar sensations from rapidly falling blood sugars.
    Had you been more active than usual the day you got weak and nauseaous??



  8. #28
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    No, I'm usually pretty active anyway, I just had been working around the farm that day. As others mentioned, throughout my life sometimes I would get weak and shaky if I didn't eat regularly, so I would make sure to eat several small meals and have healthy snacks.

    I just checked it again 2 hours after dinner and it was 285. I had turkey, a small amount of walnut and apple dressing (no sugar in it all) a couple spoonfuls of cranberry sauce (homemade). granted it was a little more that what i usually eat for dinner, but my blood results have really been all over the place.
    "Perhaps the final test of anybody's love of dogs is their willingness to permit them to make a camping ground of the bed" -Henry T. Merwin



  9. #29
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    I am also a Type I diabetic, and as such, have been insulin dependent since I was 5 years old. Clearly, it wasn't a terrible adjustment for me, as I was so young.

    The FIRST THING any new diabetic needs to do, type I or type II, is GO TO AN ENDOCRINOLOGIST. It is absolutely critical that you see a doctor that works with diabetics all day, every day. GPs typically have very little knowledge of diabetic-related issues- my pediatrician waited two weeks to send me to the hospital before I got my type I diagnosis. At 5 years old, I'd lost 17 lbs in 12 days. No one thought it necessary to check my blood sugar.

    That being said, times have changed A LOT since then. There is so much new technology on the market that makes being any kind of diabetic easier. If your blood sugar levels are running 500+ on any kind of regular basis, make no qualms about it: you are putting your body at serious, serious risk for severe, permanent complications. Kidney problems, liver problems, thyroid problems, circulatory problems, vision problems... the list goes on. One way you can get an idea of your average sugar levels is getting a hba1c test which measures your average glucose levels over the course of the last 90 days or so. "Good", by my endocrinologist's standard (at Johns Hopkins, so a great hospital), is below 7 for an average adult.

    I don't mean to scare you into anything. Well-managed diabetes can mean absolutely no adverse effects ever occur over a lifetime. First thing any new diabetic should do is make an appointment with an endocrinologist, who can set you up with a great nutritionist where you can make sure that your diet is a good one for a diabetic. You might eat very healthily, but your choices in foods might be less than perfect for a diabetic.

    To the poster that said they "strongly disagree" with carrying a high-carb snack- why??? High carb snacks (granola bars, etc.) are GREAT for sudden drops in blood glucose levels, particularly if one is out doing something relatively active/secluded. The OP mentioned she is an avid foxhunter. Finding herself several hours into a ride with a low blood sugar and nothing to eat that provides long-lasting elevation of said glucose level could be incredibly dangerous. What do you suggest a diabetic do to correct a severe low blood sugar? Short acting sugars will often only mask the problem until more complex sugars can be absorbed by the body...
    Here today, gone tomorrow...



  10. #30
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    The apple and walnut dressing, what was in it? Did you make it, or was it purchased? How was the turkey prepared? Also, cranberry sauce is basically straight sugar.

    The reactive hypoglycemia thing is what I was talking about too. It did cause me to get shakey, and I ate like all the time. I craved sugary food like a drug addict.

    For me, once I got things under control, I could add back in the occasional treat. Of course I was hypoglycemic, not diabetic. The brain injury seems to have straightened everything out though.



  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaegermonster View Post
    I recently found out that I may have Type 2 diabetes. It was quite a shock, as it doesn't run in my family, I am not overweight, maintain a good diet (lots of veggies, fruit, fish etc).
    Are there any special considerations as far as riding, being outside etc? I ride quite a lot, whip in at two hunts, do tons of farm chores. But I really know nothing about this,never having been around it.
    I plan to call my regular dr tomorrow for a follow up appt to verify this and get more info, but just wanted to pick everyone's brains here.
    Thanks!
    Depending on the severity, you may need no meds at all....watching your sugar and starch intake may be enough if it is not too bad. Always start there first.
    If you are diabetic injuries do take longer to heal.
    The first thing related circulation problems will affect are your feet: wear soft socks, good fitting shoes with support and don't pinch. Keep warm in cold weather.
    If you do have to cheat on the diet (eat sugars and starches) then do it AFTER putting some protein in your system first. Don't let the starch and sugar be the first thing to hit bottom in the old gas tank............



  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by cyberbay View Post
    An itchy ear is a chronic sign of a food allergy, too, which flares up whenever I have a cookie too many.
    No kidding about the itchy ear? Hmmmm...
    ~ Horse Box Lovers Clique ~



  13. #33
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    I have hypoglycemia. It can turn to diabetes. I have to avoid anything that triggers the pancreas. I have to eat high protien and no sugars. Nothing that will turn to sugar quickly. Complex carb are acceptable but read every label and see what you are putting in your body. Avoid corn. Corn syrup corn starch.
    Take beef jerky with you as a snack It breaks down slowly and wil not hit you with a sugar high.
    I have been told by Dr.s there is no such thing as Hypoglycemia. Just at a candy bar and your bloodsugar will rise. Yes it will and the pancreas will go nuts. It OD's the body with excess insulin. and then I am falling asleep on my feet.
    So I eat like a diabetic to keep the pancreas asleep. Don't eat candy or any high sugar foods. that includes fruit. I was told by a dietician to eat a vegetarian, high carb, low protien diet. I looked at it and told her she was nuts to think I was going to follow that. I am an O + blood type. Oh well she graduated from Berkley Ca. I can forgive her.
    Listen to your Dr. and do research on your own. Change your diet to a diabetic diet.
    I really wish you the best in getting control of it.
    Regards, sadlmakr



  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hampton Bay View Post
    The apple and walnut dressing, what was in it? Did you make it, or was it purchased? How was the turkey prepared? Also, cranberry sauce is basically straight sugar.
    I made the dressing. I made it from homemade croutons made from homemade bread, with chopped up red delicious apples, walnuts, and a little bit of chicken bouillion, and a chopped up onion, and then you let it simmer all day.

    the turkey was just roasted in the oven, no stuffing or glaze or anything, and I made the cranberry sauce myself with Splenda (my mil is diabetic but she is obese, but we already make a lot of concessions for her diet wise). It's a little trickier to make it with splenda but we finally figured it out, less water and more splenda than it calls for so it will gel.
    "Perhaps the final test of anybody's love of dogs is their willingness to permit them to make a camping ground of the bed" -Henry T. Merwin



  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by FrenchFrytheEqHorse View Post
    To the poster that said they "strongly disagree" with carrying a high-carb snack- why??? High carb snacks (granola bars, etc.) are GREAT for sudden drops in blood glucose levels, particularly if one is out doing something relatively active/secluded. The OP mentioned she is an avid foxhunter. Finding herself several hours into a ride with a low blood sugar and nothing to eat that provides long-lasting elevation of said glucose level could be incredibly dangerous. What do you suggest a diabetic do to correct a severe low blood sugar? Short acting sugars will often only mask the problem until more complex sugars can be absorbed by the body...
    I wondered about that as well, not only do I hunt, I am a whip at two hunts. So I am REALLY out there by myself. And that was a concern of mine, even though I do already carry a granola bar or trail mix ( not the sugary kind with m n m's in it though) in my sandwich case in case I get stuck out looking for a hound or something.
    Have a follow up appt in about 10 days with my Gp to follow up on what the meter says and go from there. We already talked about the endocrinologist.
    My blood the afternoon I saw her was normal, but it was before dinner and a few hours after lunch. The fasting urinalysis at the wellness thing was 500 though, which was kind of scary.

    It's been consistently over 150 in the mornings, and above 200 in the evenings after dinner.

    ****ok i found it. The day I got so shaky and weak it was 167 at 938 am, I got shaky around 5 pm, and it scared me since I'm here alone so I headed in to the house and decided it might be good to see what the reading was.
    At 5:27 pm it was 91 and I ate a turkey on whole wheat bread sandwich and had a glass of milk, then at 7:34 pm it was 232.

    I haven't gotten shaky like that again so haven't been taking a third reading but almost all of my readings am and pm have been pretty consistent with the above and usually a little higher.
    "Perhaps the final test of anybody's love of dogs is their willingness to permit them to make a camping ground of the bed" -Henry T. Merwin



  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaegermonster View Post
    I recently found out that I may have Type 2 diabetes. It was quite a shock, as it doesn't run in my family, I am not overweight, maintain a good diet (lots of veggies, fruit, fish etc).
    Are there any special considerations as far as riding, being outside etc? I ride quite a lot, whip in at two hunts, do tons of farm chores. But I really know nothing about this,never having been around it.
    I plan to call my regular dr tomorrow for a follow up appt to verify this and get more info, but just wanted to pick everyone's brains here.
    Thanks!

    Hey My sister has had type 1 diabetes for 3 years now, and although we had to take off riding for her for about 4 months, just so she could get the hang of using insulin and dealing with highs and lows, after that break, we got straight back to riding and work 3-5 days a week. Riding is very good exercise for your sugars, and helps keep sugars low, however we have found a few things that help.
    1. She ALWAYSSS has juice boxes, mini icings, the emergency syringe of I forget what granola bars beef jerky, and a meter at the barn, somewhere near the arena, so that if she goes low, she has the supplies to get her sugars back up quickly.
    2. If you are going to go on a trailride, or anywhere that you wont be able to have food on the ground near you, what my sister likes to do is bring a sort of fanny pack that contains all of her supplies.
    3. Let people at the barn know that you have diabetes, and what the symptoms of a high and low sugar are, and it might even be a good idea to teach someone you ride with how to treat a low. What my sister did was get one of the dover personalized bracelets, and it says Diabetic, that way ppl automaticallly know incase she has not told them.
    4. Check your sugar before and after you ride.
    5. NEVER give insulin and ride before eating your food, my sister pulled this at a horseshow, because otherwise she was going to miss her division, needless to say, bad idea.
    6. If you are feeling poorly, or can feel your riding just going downhill, dont hesitate to stop and check the sugar
    those are just a few of the things my sister does, pm if anything else comes to mind!!Best of luck to you



  17. #37
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    If it goes low: carry the little glucose tabs. Juices still do not absorb nearly as quickly as the glucose tabs though OJ will do in a pinch. That is a quick fix to be followed up by more "solid" food.



  18. #38
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    OP, it could be that your body is adjusting to the 'new' way of eating. I went through a couple of 'Uh, oh's myself in the first few weeks. it's a very, very uncomfortable feeling. Then, I figured out that I should have some sort of protein with me always.

    I carry protein (cheese, soy chips, turkey hot dogs (already cooked), chick peas -- they're great-get them in the pull-top cans) whenever I go to the barn or am going to be away from the house for more than 2 hours; and since I drive a lot, I always 'plan' to be stuck in traffic and always have food, too, for those situations.


    Sdlrmakr - Being h'glycemic, am kind of bumming out about the 'no sweets ever' and the 'don't trigger the pancreas' rules you go by. I struggle with my sweet tooth and know for sure that there are some foods (can't always figure out which ones, 'tho) that make my stomach growl (told that the growling is the pancreas doing its thing).

    Were you told to eat this way? My nutritionist has never phrased it that way, and hasn't limited any carbs, except the high-glycemic types and to not have more than 2 pieces a day. Whole carbs only, protien at every meal, and have 5 meals a day.



  19. #39
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    That's the thing, I haven't made any dietary adjustments yet. 1) the dr didn't see a problem with my diet when she reviewed my food diary that I had been keeping prior to this for other reasons, and 2) she wanted me to just keep doing what i've been doing while doing this short "trial" testing period so she could get a more accurate picture of what's going on.
    So the readings on the meter are very interesting to me and not what I expected at all.
    My husband just got home, he weighs about 280, drove down from Va today (10 hours) eating junk food and drinking regular Coke the whole way. We tested his blood after mine just for kicks and his was 105. Grrrrrrrr.

    Mine after eating a romaine salad with no dressing and a turkey sandwich on whole grain bread (no cheese) with a glass of fat free milk for dinner was 152. This am the fasting one was 232, last night after dinner was 216
    "Perhaps the final test of anybody's love of dogs is their willingness to permit them to make a camping ground of the bed" -Henry T. Merwin



  20. #40
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    Just reading your last post only--I wonder if you're going too low and rebounding.

    I'd ask about that. Your AM fasting and the fact that you were that high post prandial after that kind of meal screams it to me.

    What happens is you DO have insulin--basically *too much*, or I think more scientifically accurate, not the right control over how the pancreas dumps it. Your body sends it out, you go waaaaaay low, say 30-50, and then you rebound back up.

    This was happening to me at night. I'd eat 'supper' at work around 2000 and go to bed at 0300. Wake up at 08 and my fasting would be 130 and RISING. And the longer I went without eating, the more it went up. Then sometimes when I'd eat a really good, NO carb, or 'virtually' no carb meal like a couple oz of broiled chook on lettuce... or such... I'd go UP. Same thing was happening sort of--my body was sending out TOO MUCH insulin for the meal I'd eaten, and so I'd go loooooow, and then liver say "holy cow we're having a hypoglycemic episode' and kick out glucagon... but would never switch off. So you get stuck in this cycle of way-low-way-high-way-low etc .

    The irony in my case is my A1c was always decent. Because it's an 'average', the lows were SO low and so common, that the PPs of 250+ were averaged right out.

    I was diagnosed based on PP #s, and it took some time to get things under control. I had to *add* some good fat (which helps absorption of carbs, believe it or not!) and actually add some calories. I still stay pretty low on teh carbs, but will admit to some pecan pie for brekkie t'other day, and wasn't worse off post prandial. I think once you have control on a regular basis, the occasional treat doesn't send you quite so far into the abyss.

    Keep asking questions. Keep your chin up. It's really Big at first. A few years later, it's just a habit. I *do* think it takes a lot of focus the first while, learning all the Stuff There Is To Learn about Diabetes... But when you find out what works for you and your body, it becomes habit and not such hard work
    InnisFailte Pinto Sporthorses & Coloured Cobs
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    Bits are like cats, what's one more? (Petstorejunkie)



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