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  1. #1
    Join Date
    May. 28, 2008
    Posts
    773

    Default Speak to me of Numero Uno! :D

    EDIT 12/8: With the passing of Rampal, I have decided to choose another stallion (limited supply makes me nervous). I am now wondering about Numero Uno - see post 22.

    Hey all! I have lurked a long time on this forum, but never really posted. I am thinking of breeding my mare this spring and I am wondering what you all would breed her to. She is a dynamite jumper and a very lovely little girl besides, but I am going into an intense 1.5 year program to get my BSN and will not be able to ride very much. I have always considered breeding her, so as far as timing goes, it seems pretty perfect to breed her this spring.

    The mare is reg. KWPN, 9 y.o., by Wolfgang out of a Concorde mare. She's only 15.2hh but both of her parents were 16.1. I've had her since she was 4 and she is really a great horse - I showed her in the AA hunters for a year or so but then switched to the AA jumpers. She's certainly capable of doing the Low AO jumpers, but a) I am a wuss and b) since starting college I have not been able to dedicate the time to riding that would allow me to make the push from the 3'6" to the 4'. Some weeks I can ride every day, some weeks I have 5 exams and am lucky if I see the outside of a textbook, you know how it goes.

    I came to this forum to get an opinion from the breeding gurus - what do you think of that cross? Is there another stallion you would choose for my mare? Who?? I would like to be able to register the foal KWPN, so that narrows the field a lot, but I would be okay with KWPN Reg. A. I would obviously like a good temperament that would be pretty suitable to an amateur. The only thing about my mare I would improve on, really, is a little less stubbornness (there are a couple things out there that once she makes up her mind about them, game over ), and a little more height (not crucial, I am a short person).

    Thanks for reading, here are some pictures of the mare if you're interested:

    http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pi...45&id=11324903 (best recent conformation shot I have, sorry)

    http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y14...nlake_8-08.jpg (forgive the watermark - I did actually purchase this picture, I just never scanned the unmarked version)

    http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y14...ties0707MS.jpg

    Her pedigree:
    http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/tsunami+m
    Last edited by 00Jumper; Dec. 8, 2009 at 12:09 PM.
    http://www.chronicleofmyhorse.com/profile/Ashley26

    "You keep one leg on one side, the other leg on the other side, and your mind in the middle." -- Henry Taylor, "Riding Lesson"



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Oct. 21, 2003
    Posts
    8,702

    Default

    Your mare is adorable and that stallion is lovely. I'm not one to give any advice at all beause I am in the same boat as you, all I will say is that the stallion owners are typically very nice and helpful. I notice he's at Iron Spring Farm, I bet they would be happy to spend some time talking to you and advising you on their stallions.

    Have fun, I am sure you will have a wonderful foal. Love your mare, I too have a tiny bay mare with a big personality.



  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr. 1, 2003
    Location
    SE Ky
    Posts
    4,401

    Default

    I also own a Wolfgang mare - but her damsire is Voltaire. Believe it or not she is a Third level (showing) PSG (schooling) mare.

    Regardless - a friend told me the Wolfgang Flemmingh crosses are a GREAT niche - Flemmingh is also jumper bred but throws fantastic movement with AA temperment and nice long legs to boot.

    It would have to be frozen but the Europeans like that niche quite a bit.

    Gotta love the Wolfgang neck and uphill movement! (My mare also likes to jump - but I don't ).

    Post pictures of the baby when it's born!
    Sandy in Fla.



  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec. 11, 2005
    Location
    Castle Rock, CO
    Posts
    2,829

    Default

    I ride a rampal son - he is one of the best jumpers I have ever ridden but he is quirky and hot.. he did come from a TB mare.. but Ramiro line horses can have some spice.

    What about Cavalier? http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/cavalier18

    Way underused IMO... and wonderful sire of jumpers with excellent temperments..



  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jul. 5, 2002
    Location
    Brookline, NH 03033
    Posts
    1,087

    Default

    Flemmingh frozen has run out and no more since he has passed. :-(

    Do you want to use fresh or frozen. For a first time breeding fresh is easier of course. I would suggest Navarone (Jus de Pomme x Armstrong). He is producing incredible jumpers and all around horses for anyone to ride. Impeccable characters that really want to work hard for you. Really is a strong trait in his foals. Very easy to break and train, and very well balanced. Navarone goes very well with the Wolfgang and Concorde lines. Plus there is a breeding special for him for bookings this month. $200 off.

    For frozen I would suggest Corland. Super characters and fantastic jumpers. Many go to Grand Prix but good for anyone.

    Another nice one that puts on really nice characters is Tenerife. They are such nice horses to work with. I have had several and they are super amateur horses and of course lots of talent for the jumps.

    Kathy
    Majestic Gaits-Dutch Warmbloods,#1 USEF Dressage Sporthorse Breeder. #1 KWPN-NA Jumpers.Standing Navarone,Schroeder,Dante MG.VDL Frozen. Approval KWPN Han OLD RPSI BWP Canadian SWANA sBs SF Holst



  6. #6
    Join Date
    Mar. 26, 2008
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    1,098

    Default

    I have a Calvados mare out of a Wolfgang mare that I purchased from Team Nijhof as a 3 year old. Interesting is that I bred her to Concorde before importing her from Holland (on the advice of Jeanette from Team Nijhof). My Concorde/Calvados/Wolgang filly is very nice.

    You might try and see if Team Nijhof (www.team-nijhof.nl) has any frozen still left from Calvados. The cross with your mare would be very nice. He is approved with KWPN.

    This is my Calvados/Wolfgang/Ulft mare freejumping the other day. My girls were playing around with her and video taped her. The standard height is 5 feet. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=puH24S2K5wI Obviously, she is my 22 year old's next jumper.
    Richard, Approved Black KWPN Stallion
    Website
    and Facebook page
    Oh Kaptain Underpants SFS, Approved BRp pony stallion
    Website and Facebook page



  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun. 9, 2003
    Location
    Alabama
    Posts
    5,572

    Default

    I'm sure Iron Spring can give good advice. The only Rampal I knew was quirky to dangerous, although very talented and huge. I've had some other feedback from folks who had Rampals with the same comments. Bred to the right mare, I'm sure he is wonderful.
    PennyG



  8. #8
    Join Date
    May. 28, 2008
    Posts
    773

    Default

    Thanks to those of you who have replied already. Some of the comments about Rampal worry me - my mare is not hot by any stretch of any definition (most days you'll find me dragging her in from the field to ride; once in the barn, she promptly falls asleep. Then we meander out to the arena, etc. ) and a little more blood would certainly not be something I'm totally uninterested in, but it's the 'quirky' that gets me. She is not bad, but she is very quirky sometimes. Perhaps Rampal is not a good cross in that case? I had heard that about Ramiro lines, but I hadn't ever really seen it in the Rampal babies I've known (though I've certainly seen it in other Ramiros!).

    So perhaps I should open the field a little more - if YOU had my mare, who the heck would you breed her to?! I would prefer fresh but all I can seem to find is frozen - is there even any KWPN stallion that could ship to DE fresh?
    http://www.chronicleofmyhorse.com/profile/Ashley26

    "You keep one leg on one side, the other leg on the other side, and your mind in the middle." -- Henry Taylor, "Riding Lesson"



  9. #9
    Join Date
    Nov. 24, 2007
    Location
    London and Le Mans
    Posts
    392

    Default

    Speak to Judy Yancey about Kannan, he fits the bill for everything you're asking. There's video of him at www.frenchstallions.org

    He's a lovely guy, I ride him a couple of times a week in the woods and his kids tend to be super nice temperaments and great for amateurs to pros.



  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jun. 9, 2003
    Location
    Alabama
    Posts
    5,572

    Default

    Kathy at Majestic Gaits is probably as knowledgable as anyone in the US about the Dutch horses. Her stallion, Navarone would probably work well for you and she might have other suggestions as well. Good luck!
    PennyG



  11. #11
    Join Date
    Feb. 22, 2000
    Location
    passepartout
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    10,413

    Default

    Olivier.

    Olivier is KWPN, 17hh, does GP dressage and has a terrific jump (see the video). He was trained by a YR (who posts here) and his offspring have very ammy-friendly temperaments -- a number of them have been trained/started by ammies and teens.



  12. #12
    Join Date
    Oct. 29, 1999
    Posts
    14,409



  13. #13
    Join Date
    Mar. 27, 2006
    Location
    Bethel PA
    Posts
    752

    Default

    you haven't said what needs improving on your mare, which is critical to know in attempting to select a stallion. often the height of small mares is one of the hardest things to counter even with the biggest stallions. while there are exceptions, when you get a stubborn small gene in there it can take generations of breeding to large stallions before you're back at the size you want.

    she is smaller than the standard 16.2h which many breeders aim for, and certainly many smaller horses are at a disadvantage getting down the lines in the hunter ring without looking like they're stretching hard.

    she is attractive and looks attentive to her work and also athletic.

    if i were looking to make a slightly bigger offspring to do 4' jumpers but also 3'6 hunters i would be considering the stallion cunningham carefully.



  14. #14
    Join Date
    Aug. 18, 2008
    Posts
    314

    Default

    I've known two Rampal mare, although quite athletic they were very unrideable.



  15. #15
    Join Date
    Feb. 7, 2002
    Location
    UNITED STATES
    Posts
    2,869

    Default

    I like Navarone too... never met him in person, but seems to have a lovely mind.
    *Better to have loved than to have never loved at all.*
    ALWAYS Blessings NEVER losses.



  16. #16
    Join Date
    Apr. 28, 2009
    Posts
    357

    Default

    I started a Rampal over fences. I wouldn't say he is all that hot but I would say I think he would be better suited to do dressage. He jumps okay and has his knees up but he throws his lower leg out in front of him over fences. I don't know how he'd make out as a jumper but as a hunter, its not appealing. He does have the most comfortable canter I think I've ever sat. I would also consider Consul. I know several Consul's and they are fun, quiet, talented over fences for sure, and move well too. Only drawback to them is I'd say that he will tend to give the foal a sizeable head. If your mare has a smallish head, I think it's be fine. Good luck!



  17. #17
    Join Date
    Apr. 30, 2009
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    3,344

    Default

    Judgement. That would be really cool.



  18. #18
    Join Date
    Sep. 28, 2008
    Location
    Chester County, PA
    Posts
    529

    Default

    I have a 2 yr old Rampal gelding out of a Thb who is not hot. the dam is very quiet and not hot and is 15.2. My guy will be about 16.1 - 2. Free jumping he is quite good with his knees and back. Nothing quirky about my guy at all and is a real pocket pet.
    *Every horse is a self-portrait of the rider....Autograph your work with excellence.*
    Supporting Nokotas www.nokotahorse.org
    Lipizzan's rock! http://rigitta.blogspot.com/



  19. #19
    Join Date
    Oct. 17, 2007
    Location
    Vancouver, British Columbia
    Posts
    506

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FMulder View Post
    Speak to Judy Yancey about Kannan, he fits the bill for everything you're asking. There's video of him at www.frenchstallions.org

    He's a lovely guy, I ride him a couple of times a week in the woods and his kids tend to be super nice temperaments and great for amateurs to pros.
    I'm going to second you take a look at Kannan. He's a tall rangey stallion that is cited as specifically suited for smaller or medium mares that lack size, scope and power. His offspring express so much scope, just take a look at the recent posting about the P.S.I. auction, and now look at the Kannan offspring: http://www.psi-auktion.de/en/psi-auc...g-horses-2009/



  20. #20
    Join Date
    May. 28, 2008
    Posts
    773

    Default

    Thanks again guys for replying. I spoke with Meghan at ISF and while she favored Judgement I am hesitant on the closeness of the cross, as am I with Kannan. In light of Rampal's recent passing, I am reconsidering my choice. I have a maiden mare, and he's a limited supply of frozen semen now and, well . . . I don't like those odds. So the stallion hunt beings anew.

    As far as what I am looking to improve on my mare, I would like a little more height (not huge - 16.2 horses are plenty big for me!), a better topline (she has a little bit of a roach back but nothing absolutely terrible - I didn't really ever even notice it much until the KWPN mentioned the slight roach at her inspection), better hocks and a little more forward. She has plenty of jump and scope, but I suppose those things wouldn't go amiss in a stallion . I'd like to use fresh semen if possible (the mare is in DE) and, again, a KWPN stallion would be preferable, but I would be willing to go with a stallion that would get me a Reg. A-eligible baby.

    I have gotten some great suggestions on this thread, and have started seriously considering two of them, but keep 'em coming! The more the merrier, imho.
    http://www.chronicleofmyhorse.com/profile/Ashley26

    "You keep one leg on one side, the other leg on the other side, and your mind in the middle." -- Henry Taylor, "Riding Lesson"



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