I understand some traits are stronger in some lines than others and am interested to hear what traits people feel are very indicative in a certain letter line. For instance, I have heard the G Line is usually a bit stubborn and a bit heavier and the R Line is slow to mature, etc. I know that each horse in an indiviadual and many don't fit into these molds, but what are traits in particular lines that you find to be very prominent.
I apologize if this topic has been done...I can't find any info. on this.
Hmmm, I don't know if it counts as definite "Line" characteristics or traits but the website - http://horsemagazine.com/ has a section called Breeding Barn that does in depth 'discussions' about certain "Great" stallions and their progeny. Beyond that there are breeder interviews in the section of the "Breeding Barn".
If you are interested in Hanoverian Breeding there is a book called Die Grossen Hengste Hannoveraner by Werner Schockemohle (Paul's brother). It was a dinner time discussion from the time I was tiny until very recently...just too busy these days to sit down and chat about bloodlines most days. It is in German however...but copies appear from time to time on booklooker.de
In general, it is tough to be very specific about definite characteristics in a general population/bloodline...each horse is an individual and has the contribution of their dam that has to weigh in somewhere. Add in raising, training, injury, feeding and the list of 'what ifs' as to what characteristic came from where/whom grows well past who's who in the ancestor list. Some stallions are not very prepotent and allow the mare to shine through completely in the offspring...and that goes both ways with mares, too. I guess that's part of what makes breeding so much fun!
As a side note, we have had a lot of the old Hanoverian D line (Duellant in 3 generations or less) on the farm - these horses all lived well into their 20's and there are a few clear traits - they were tough to break (athletic, can really buck and/or rear as youngsters) but perform very well at a high level (PSG and higher), love to work each & every day, all have above average jumping talent (bold, careful, scopey) and are sound into their mid 20's. Conformationally speaking, the shoulder can be a bit upright (but has good length), front legs are correct, hooves are good shaped & strong, the backs are sometimes a touch on the long side but all have exceptionally strong loins, the hind leg has long gaskin, short cannon bones, hock can sometimes be on the straight side.
As far as broad generalizations - (and only referencing older Hanoverian lines here) My copy of Die Grossen Hengste is at the other house...I'll snag it tomorrow and see if I can add to this then.
A line = Absatz/Abglanz - refining, action trotter, added 'pretty' type, chestnut sabino
B line = Bolero/Black Sky xx - refining, brilliance, not an improver of jumping
D line = Duellant - dual talent, can have old fashioned heads, some wild chestnut sabinos (Donnerhall was an Oldenburg)
E line = Einglas/Athos - jumpers
F line = Ferdinand - jumpers, powerful hindquarters
G line = Goldfisch II - jumping talent
or Grande/Graf - refinement, brilliance
L line = Lugano/Der Lowe xx - sweet nature, dark color, good jumping talent
M line = Marcio xx - heat, refined FEI dressage maker
S line = Senator/Semper Idem - jumping talent, refiner
W line = Woermann/Wohler - dressage, can be heavier in type, typically chestnut
Florestan, Cor de la Bryere Sandro Hit, Hohenstein, Caprimond, Belissimo, Donnerhall, Rubinstein, et al...these are newer additions since AI & frozen semen breeding became the norm. One of the difficulties in narrowing down characteristics is that the breeding districts are no longer separate - you can be in Hanover and breed to Oldenburg stallions and vice versa. The information is available but you will have to seek it out and always remember that each stallion has a mareline behind him.
In the end, you have to judge the individual in front of you - either as a rider or future breeding specimen.
Thank you Tasker for that information. I find it all so intriguing. I understand that the mare has very much influence so the broad generilizations are fine with me. If you do find more to add, I am very delighted to hear it. You post was very educational.
Large eye, the 1970 & 80's version of a 'pretty' head - not Arabian influenced but not coarse. Clear, well defined throatlatch, normal length neck - useful length, not too long, not too short. Shoulder can be a bit on the straight side with good length but still maintains good use of the forearm & freedom of the elbow. Back/loin - correct length & strong. Tail can be high set. Stifle can sometimes be straight. Hock can also be straight. Use of the hind limb is often personified by 'the Weltmeyer' trot - clear engagement, bring the hoof cleanly under the body with great power & thrust.
Absatz was an 'Action Trotter' at Celle and refining stallion for the heavy, old style Hanoverian mares.
Dual talent for producing grand prix show jumpers & dressage horses.
We still have Absatz descendants here on the farm as Abundance (Absatz/Dominus/Goldfisch II) stood here in the late 70's. They like to work, have a high sense of self and fairness and are very talented. We've tended to aim the ones with jumping talent into that arena and the dressage talents into their speciality. With producing dual talent offspring, Abundance produced exceptional hunters (Ruxton, Rushton, etc) and event horses (Always A Lady, Aachen, etc). There have been quite a few that made good driving horses also.
I've been very lucky in that I grew up riding Absatz grandchildren and quite a few Duellant/Radetzky grands as well...if you have an specific questions, I'd be happy to answer them privately as this post toes the advertising line. Like the bit I wrote earlier about the D line - the A's have been horses that like to work, hardy, hard working beasties that want a job. They have opinions about their universe but are sensible, smart and talented. We kept 5 Abundance offspring for our program. 4 were successful FEI horses, 1 was an exceptional jumper in the Am/Owners for my dad. 3 stallions and 2 mares.
Absatz Grand children - Again & Again, Able and Ready, Aurora, Able Spirit and great grand son Avebury WF.
Last edited by Tasker; Nov. 13, 2009 at 04:05 PM.
Thank you Tasker for all your help. You sure do know your stuff. Anyone else care to chime in as well? Hoping to keep this thread alive as I am very interested in what people have to say on the subject.