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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Nov. 15, 2005
    Location
    NY
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    6,272

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamy View Post
    I'm not exactly built to borrow...( 6'2 150 lbs, freakish femur, LOL!)
    Ah oh I get that, another one here unable to borrow for the opposite reason 5'2" [in heels] and 110#... long from hip to knee which usually rules out borrowing kids saddles. *sigh*

    ETA great advice to just hack on the buckle- I wish I had slowed down and done more of that with my horse in the early years.
    I also agree with you on the hay/grain, more hay [not less] and less grain [not more]
    Any chance he has/had ulcers? My *next* horse will get fed a low nasc feed from day one, and I will not ever be afraid of alfalfa until I see what it does in that individual horse.
    Things I learned too late for my current horse.



  2. #22
    Join Date
    Jan. 12, 2009
    Posts
    288

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    Good Lord my T/O on quality pasture fat as hogs get 1/2 bale hay each as of September 1 w/ the grass lossing it quality.(35lb bales)
    Upping the grain is fine if spread out but hay needs to be upped as well. 2 flakes my guys would think thats starvation diet (of course depends on weight of flake)
    He looks fine by the way, I think Quest-Plus is an excellant idea since he was kept in a community herd before coming here. And the teeth obviously the gal who had Chimmy to trail ride for a year misrepresented his care to the Breeder/trainer.
    I am sure he is enjoying all og teh care and thoguth you are putting into him



  3. #23
    Join Date
    Jul. 30, 2005
    Location
    England
    Posts
    10,584

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    I'd be keeping hay in front of him 24/7, even if I had to pay extra for it. Agree with the lunging until he starts to build some topline. Is he on a ration balancer/vit/min suplement?
    Horse Show Names Free name website with over 6200 names. Want to add? PM me!



  4. #24
    Join Date
    May. 7, 2009
    Posts
    1,419

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    AMy agrees and will be doing something about the hay issue TODAY! she did not want anyone to think she was not on top of this but she is on her way to the dentist with 5 kids and away from her computer! She wanted to make sure you all knew she was on top of it LOL!!!
    Kim
    If you are lucky enough to ride, you are lucky enough.



  5. #25
    Join Date
    Feb. 5, 2008
    Location
    Upstate NY
    Posts
    2,052

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    I would use a gel pad if you can. More thick pads can sometimes create a problem, so I'd give one shaped saddle pad and then a gel pad a try. See what that looks like before you get on him.

    Definitly more hay too, I would give him as much as he can eat. If he were mine he would get free choice 24/7.

    For what it is worth, I am not a big fan of a lot of trotting and cantering on the lunge line. It's hard on them frankly and I personally would not do that much especially with the old bow. Though I would lunge him at the walk in side reins. That will help his shape with out the torque...Use a surcingle if you have one...

    He is very cute, I like him a lot! Let us know how you make out....



  6. #26
    Join Date
    Jul. 23, 2001
    Location
    Maryland
    Posts
    1,963

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    I have no experience with OTTBs, but my two cents:

    Get a good unaffiliated saddle fitter out to help you. This will not cost much and they should be able to figure out what brands might work for both of you, have demos/used saddles for you to try, and give you some padding tips to use in the meantime.

    Just go ahead and treat for ulcers. Ulcergard is expensive, but it put weight on my horse in two weeks that astonished me. And she didn't have what I would call very obvious ulcer symptoms. You can buy it online for $30 a tube. Give him one tube a day for 7-10 days and see if it's making a difference.

    I'm not a big fan of side reins and lunging. I think what you're doing sounds more correct -- walking and trotting, adding some circles and bending, up and down hills and over polls while he builds himself up . . .

    good luck!



  7. #27
    Join Date
    Dec. 8, 2007
    Posts
    419

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    I know. He was geting 6 flakes twice a day. until yesterday. Yesterday I noticed on the feed board that it said only 1 flake! I freaked!! I was unable to get in touch with BO, so plan on talking to her today. I will HAPPILY pay mroe for him to have more hay!!!
    Sorry, I jumped in the shower, I hope no one thinks I am not doing the right thing here.

    As for his teeth, they were really bad. VERY sharp! But are all better now!!
    Now off to the dentist with 5 kids... I think it was easier with the horse than it will be with the kids!

    Quote Originally Posted by unclewiggly View Post
    Good Lord my T/O on quality pasture fat as hogs get 1/2 bale hay each as of September 1 w/ the grass lossing it quality.(35lb bales)
    Upping the grain is fine if spread out but hay needs to be upped as well. 2 flakes my guys would think thats starvation diet (of course depends on weight of flake)
    He looks fine by the way, I think Quest-Plus is an excellant idea since he was kept in a community herd before coming here. And the teeth obviously the gal who had Chimmy to trail ride for a year misrepresented his care to the Breeder/trainer.
    I am sure he is enjoying all og teh care and thoguth you are putting into him



  8. #28
    Join Date
    Jul. 30, 2005
    Location
    England
    Posts
    10,584

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    Oh, heck, I wasn't bitching. Just offering my opinion I know it's not always easy to fit things in.
    Horse Show Names Free name website with over 6200 names. Want to add? PM me!



  9. #29
    Join Date
    Sep. 8, 2007
    Posts
    2,899

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    My trainer introduced me to side reins with rubber surgical tubing built in. Schneider's has them, called Battaglia side reins. Amazing for my OTTB! It's great for them because they won't panic as there is so much give, but definitely still gets the point across. He was foaming and releasing his back in no time. And it immediately started to translate to his under saddle work. And they are fairly cheap, an added bonus!! As for the saddle, dare to try a Wintec? You can get the CAIR panels for shock absorption, purposely make it too wide, then throw a sheepskin half-pad underneath. Your horse will be in heaven and it won't break the bank. Then you can get another saddle when he's put on weight and muscle.



  10. #30
    Join Date
    Oct. 6, 2002
    Location
    Philadelphia PA
    Posts
    15,963

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    There's no way he's going to go well and comfortably in a saddle that pinches. I feel your pain, it's tough when they're filling out. It WOULD be a waste to go custom at this point-- he'll only change shape and you'll have to shell out more money.

    I would call a good, unaffiliated saddle fitter who can bring out a slew of lower end/inexpensive saddles (used older Collegiates, Crosbys, etc.) and buy one in the $700 and under range that might not be YOUR dream saddle, but that fits his back okay now. If you can get it a titch wide and use padding until he fills in more, all the better. Get him going in that and then 6 months+ down the line when he's filled out and fit-- then sell the "patch" saddle and buy something that fits him AND that you love. You can put away a little money each paycheck between now and then for it.

    There's just NO WAY you're going to get ANYWHERE on his back if it hurts to ride.

    I feel your pain. I have a 3 year old right now. I'm riding him in a saddle that's okay. I would LOVE to get one custom fitted for him that's perfect-- but that'd be a waste. He's growing and changing shape and I'd only have to turn around and get a new one in 6 months and another new one in a year. That's a waste. But that doesn't mean it's okay to use a saddle that pinches, there's a bid difference between "less-than-ideal-gotta'-shim-a-bit" and "saddle-that-hurts."

    In the meantime, I think some long lining and lunging is not a bad idea. I wouldn't crank him in TOO much with side reins until he's got a little more muscle and is fitter, but they're a good thing to add to the mix when the time is right.

    He is super cute.
    ~Veronica
    "The Son Dee Times" "Sustained" "Somerset" "Franklin Square"
    http://photobucket.com/albums/y192/vxf111/



  11. #31
    Join Date
    Oct. 6, 2004
    Location
    NASCAR HELL
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    1,751

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    Do forget to check teeth

    I am with the sidereins lunging people and supp with Vit E and Selenium if needed.
    The rider casts his heart over the fence,
    the horse jumps in pursuit of it.

    –Hans-Heinrich Isenbart



  12. #32
    Join Date
    Mar. 17, 2009
    Location
    New England
    Posts
    278

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    Just to prove that you can ask 30 horse people something and get 30 different answers, none of which are necessarily wrong... I'd do some good ole John Lyons giving exercises to get him to drop his head, you may only get a stride or two at the walk or trot right now - reward them heavily. Keep in mind, he's got no muscling in his neck for counter balance and judging by the ewe neck, was never taught to come down. It may just be that it's too uncomfortable to try to balance and move with his head down since his top line isn't developed. Could have nothing to do with the saddle, he just hollows out 'cuz race horses don't worry about being round, maybe just a habit. I would not crank him in on side reins - or any type of martingale for that matter - or do a ton of lunge work. With the old bow and his size, really hard on those joints and you can't jam a horse into frame, you must teach him and allow him the time it takes to gain the muscle to do it. Lot's of breaks and lots of walking, bareback is awesome too. He's really not that thin, he just needs to muscle up. You'll see that neck start to get cresty as he develops too. Very cute, good luck with him.
    Last edited by hossluva; Sep. 9, 2009 at 10:26 AM. Reason: typo
    If you destroy the land, you destroy the animals;
    if you destroy the animals, you destroy the people.



  13. #33
    Join Date
    Apr. 12, 2002
    Location
    Former Long Islander now in the middle of the Great Lakes
    Posts
    1,646

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    : Hay 24/7
    2: Older Crosby saddle with a spring tree for now, one with a plain flap and if it doesn't fit with NO pad, it's not gonna fit padded up or with special pads either. the less flocking the better. his shoulder is going to change too so he may be a medium now and might need a med wide or wide with in the next 6 months .
    3: Myler comfort snaffle ( curved bit ) although the french link should work but I have found many OTTB like the curved snaffle better.
    4: NO I would not recommend lunging yet or trying to get contact , or getting him to frame , I would want him to come down off the bit first, long low and slow .. once he can WTC on the buckle , then he's ready for more training . You are basically letting him down now , he is still trying to pick up the bit , that's his job.. your telling him he has no job yet he's just out for a Sunday stroll. and yes their are probably saddle issues affecting his flipping his head when you move out of the walk . unfortunately with all the specialized saddle being made now .. they forgot the horse it the equation .



  14. #34
    Join Date
    May. 14, 2008
    Posts
    686

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    Hi Mamy! I have the EXACT same horse! Well, I had the exact same horse. My beast was high headed, thin and running around like he had no clue what the bit meant. I had people smack a degouge on him to try to FORCE him to round over his back but it didn't work too well. He did was he was TOLD but he didn't know WHY.

    I changed saddles to a wintec until I could buy a Bates and he was much happier. Then I started to work just long and low. Just like suggested. On the buckle, move off my leg. His head came down once he started working from behind. He also gets lunged in side reins just to sort of warm him up for what's to come.

    I also treated for ulcers at one point and he finally calmed down and gained weight. I feed him Cadence by Buckeye and it made a huge difference!!!

    Honestly, if you cure the saddle issue, you'll probably cure several other issues. You are doing all the right things, the hill work will teach him where his hocks are, long and low will teach him to move off your leg and side reins will teach him framing that he figures out on his own instead of you making him.

    I think you're being a very responsible and wonderful mommy!



  15. #35
    Join Date
    Jun. 9, 2003
    Location
    Alabama
    Posts
    5,479

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    Check for ulcers
    Try Ultium and alot more hay
    I've had good luck using a KK snaffle (similar to French link but the aurigan or German silver seems to be more "tasty" and gets them to chew and relax --) Many OTTB's I've had have trust issues with their mouth -- rough hands on the track so it just takes time and soft hands, too.
    Saddle fit is extremely important (as you already know) -- good luck with that
    Horse masseuse and chiro are good ideas also to cover all the bases, I've had great luck using both
    You'll get more relaxation trail riding and hacking than ring work or even lunging, after you are sure he's comfortable, especially with the walk IMO
    Is he getting adequate turnout?
    Good luck!
    PennyG



  16. #36
    Join Date
    Jun. 17, 2001
    Location
    down the road from bar.ka
    Posts
    31,570

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamy View Post
    Yep,
    I did talk to a vet about everything. He wanted to give him some more time....
    Ummm...what tests did the vet do? Did s/he pull blood? Scope for ulcers? Check the teeth (and not just by pulling the upper lip back to see if there are any in there)? Did the vet take a fecal sample to see what type internal parasites the horse is providing support for?

    Or did s/he just look at him and say "yeah, he's skinny"?
    When opportunity knocks it's wearing overalls and looks like work.

    The horse world. Two people. Three opinions.



  17. #37
    Join Date
    Jul. 24, 2004
    Posts
    2,670

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    FWIW - My OTTB mare would NOT put her head down either... she was fine for the first few years I had her but then became increasing inverted... took her to a vet clinic and had full films done (along w/ other stuff) - turned out she has Kissing Spines. Her back muscles were extremely inflamed and she was miserable. No way we could have seen what was going on w/ a farm call vet... my suggestion is to find a vet who has the tools to make a diagnosis and go from there - you need to find the route of the problem .
    "When a horse greets you with a nicker & regards you with a large & liquid eye, the question of where you want to be & what you want to do has been answered." CANTER New England



  18. #38
    Join Date
    Jul. 24, 2004
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    2,670

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    Quote Originally Posted by findeight View Post
    Ummm...what tests did the vet do? Did s/he pull blood? Scope for ulcers? Check the teeth (and not just by pulling the upper lip back to see if there are any in there)? Did the vet take a fecal sample to see what type internal parasites the horse is providing support for?

    Or did s/he just look at him and say "yeah, he's skinny"?
    My thoughts exactly...

    Unless tests are done, you aren't going to truly know what is going on.
    "When a horse greets you with a nicker & regards you with a large & liquid eye, the question of where you want to be & what you want to do has been answered." CANTER New England



  19. #39
    Join Date
    Aug. 18, 2009
    Location
    Unionville, Virginia
    Posts
    107

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    I had the same problem with my OTTB. He would walk long and low but as soon as I asked him to trot he stuck his head straight up in the air. Everyone has given good advise. I found that working with ground poles helped ENORMOUSLY!! It brought his attention down and he had to lower his head and raise his back to get over them. I would recommend trot poles, and walking hills for a month or two to strengthen his back and hind end. Lunging in side reins should help but pole work worked much better for my guy. Maybe if you lunged over a pole a couple times a week.
    "But if you buy them as ponies aren't they cheaper?"



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