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View Poll Results: Chestnut mare owners, do you try to avoid chestnut stallions?

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  • Yes

    21 28.77%
  • No

    52 71.23%
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  1. #1
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    Default Spinoff homozygous for black - Chestnut mare owners, do you try to avoid a chestnut?

    My best mare is a chestnut and I am always sad that many stallions I like for her are chestnut. And I LOVE bays.

    Do you, as a chestnut mare owner, try to avoid chestnut stallions in order to take a chance at another colour or do you just suck it up and breed to the better stallion regardless of colour?

    Luckily enough in my situation, there happens to be tons of equally gorgeous and talented stallions that come in all shades of bay so I can always breed to the "better stallion" with a slight chance of having something else then a chestnut...
    www.EquusMagnificus.ca
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  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by EquusMagnificus View Post
    Do you, as a chestnut mare owner, try to avoid chestnut stallions in order to take a chance at another colour or do you just suck it up and breed to the better stallion regardless of colour?
    I would hope that any reputable breeder would indeed breed to the better stallion regardless of color.


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  3. #3
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    Default

    I personally love a nice redhead.



  4. #4
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    Jul. 18, 2008
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    I too love a chestnut. My favorite colour actually. If I had to choose between 2 stallions both equally great, I would pick the chestnut



  5. #5
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    Nov. 30, 2000
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    I've never actually given color any thought when I plan breedings.


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  6. #6
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    Mar. 17, 2006
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    Over our many years of selling and slightly less of breeding, we've noticed that bay or black colts/geldings sell the best, by far. True or not, the "chestnut mare" label does influence buyers to some degree. I personally love a good mare, regardless of color.

    Of course, a good horse is a good horse. But, if you're breeding to sell, and you've sold a number a horses, you can't deny that color does play a factor. It's human nature - people pick their favorite color when buying a car, etc. To produce foals that sell is the goal, and to breed a sea of plain chestnuts is just not wise usually.

    We used to try to not have chestnut foals. Yep, we did. We had mostly plain bay fillies for several years, and almost all of our foals sold every year. But, last year our Donatelli filly arrived, plain chestnut, and blew the doors off that theory. She was spectacular in movement, looks and mind, and sold for the highest price of any foal we've had. Plain chestnut (but a liver-ish shade). Got very few inquiries on her I'm sure because of the plain chestnut mare thing, but the ones who came to see her were wowed. She is now currently standing top 5 in the country in the yearling HB and 2nd in her zone after only a couple shows (she's won every class), and her owner called today to tell me she was Best Young Horse again today at a rated show!

    So now we know that for sure, a good horse really is a good horse. Color may make a first impression but quality will make a lasting one.
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  7. #7
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    As someone who used to have a plain chestnut mare (albeit a stunning shade of dark liver), yes, I avoided breeding to chestnut stallions, absolutely. Not strictly because of colour, but because my mare had no white and was a "non-traditional" breed, and I knew that if she popped out a plain chestnut filly I'd be hard pressed to get it sold. Too many strikes against her.
    So I bred to two bays, the second one being sabino and homozygous.

    My second broodie is STILL chestnut, and while I would've loved to have found a bay or black mare, there was no way I was going to sacrifice my main criteria (conformation, temperament, movement) for colour. I scoured the net and searched through hundreds of ads for young Saddlebred mares, many of whom were flashy bays or blacks, but that didn't have the right conformation/movement. That said - the pressure is slightly off with this one because she has 4 white socks + star + snip, so I still may consider a nice chestnut stallion for her if I find one I really like.

    IF you are breeding a top, top mare (SPS, Elite, GP show record, etc etc..) to a top, top stallion, AND you get a phenomenal foal, who is outstanding in both movement and conformation and has that "wow" factor, then definitely, colour won't matter one iota, as the previous poster noted...

    BUT - let's be honest, most of us aren't breeding the absolute creme of the crop to the best in the world, and most foals DON'T turn out absolutely *perfect* and spectacular, so it's foolish for the rest of us to ignore market demands.. and right now the market (for the most part) demands bay or black or grey with lots of bling and "fancy/typey". About 5 years ago the market was hot hot for pintos - now, that's died down a bit. I predict the bling craze will die down at some point as well.
    But until then, to stack the odds in favor of breeding plain chestnut after plain chestnut is, well.... unwise.

    I still consider homozygous for black a *bonus*, though - and nothing more. The important stuff has to be there.
    Thing is though, there are enough high quality stallions out there that DO have all the goods - temperament, movement, conformation, bloodlines.. AND who are also homozygous or sabino.



  8. #8
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    May. 1, 2008
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    I'm personally getting tired of all of the black plain stallions out there now (creating plain black babies). I love any color with LOTS of bling! Warmblood breeders need a quality loud black sabiano (not pinto) ... but off the top of my head, I cannot think of one!?



  9. #9
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    LOL.. seriously?? You can't think of ANY?
    Gray Fox has TWO! Rewine and Aloha!!



  10. #10
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    I've found that people don't look at liver chestnut and red chestnut the same way. So I try for mares and stallions that are sooty if possible when breeding chestnut to chestnut. Though I like chestnut mares. If they trust you and want to work for you (big if's BTW) then they will give you 110% when you're in the ring and need the last wind or make a small distance error. Gotta love an honest horse. At least you always know where you stand
    Of all the things I've lost, I miss my mind the most...now where did I put those marbles...
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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by ASBJumper View Post
    LOL.. seriously?? You can't think of ANY?
    Gray Fox has TWO! Rewine and Aloha!!
    Holy cow! Of course! My brain is on Dressage horses though.. and nope.. can't think of any.


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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mythology View Post
    I've found that people don't look at liver chestnut and red chestnut the same way. So I try for mares and stallions that are sooty if possible when breeding chestnut to chestnut. Though I like chestnut mares. If they trust you and want to work for you (big if's BTW) then they will give you 110% when you're in the ring and need the last wind or make a small distance error. Gotta love an honest horse. At least you always know where you stand
    Unfortunately you can't breed for liver chestnut any more than you can purposely breed for a blood bay over a black bay. You get whatever shade you get. Liver chestnuts can produce red chestnuts, there's no more likelihood of them producing another liver than any other chestnut (someone please correct me if I'm wrong - but I asked about this very thing way back in '04!).

    And FWIW, i have found that the chestnut mare stereotype is ridiculous. Both my chestnut mares are incredibly sweet and gentle and would do anything I ask. The first one was an alpha, the new one is more submissive. Neither one of them is any different when in season, and have no 'tude whatsoever.

    My BAY mare, on the other hand.... man.. she's a sassy one. But she comes from the Uniform line, so.. there ya go.



  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by ASBJumper View Post
    Liver chestnuts can produce red chestnuts, there's no more likelihood of them producing another liver than any other chestnut (someone please correct me if I'm wrong - but I asked about this very thing way back in '04!).
    Ive personally found liver x liver breedings produce more livers. Though it is in no way guaranteed.
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  14. #14
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    Hmm.. in that case, I may need to revisit Briar 899, then... *drool*..



  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by hessy35 View Post
    I'm personally getting tired of all of the black plain stallions out there now (creating plain black babies). I love any color with LOTS of bling! Warmblood breeders need a quality loud black sabiano (not pinto) ... but off the top of my head, I cannot think of one!?
    Sabino IS pinto I think maybe you meant Paint? There really is a big difference, with Paint being a breed of QH/TB/Paint breeding. Pinto refers to patterns. High white and a big face blaze is pinto

    Quote Originally Posted by hessy35 View Post
    Holy cow! Of course! My brain is on Dressage horses though.. and nope.. can't think of any.
    http://www.exclusiveequines.com.au/dressa_j.htm shows quite a few black stallions with at least some minimal white. The problem is that the black base tends to suppress the expression of white, so having a more blingy black horse is not as common, as you're seeing, as a blingy chestnut. De Niro is pretty good in terms of how much chrome he has for being black.


    Quote Originally Posted by Mythology View Post
    I've found that people don't look at liver chestnut and red chestnut the same way.
    Glad you said that so I don't have to IME, liver gets lumped in the "dark" category. I really would prefer not to have a normal chestnut; I MUCH prefer the black-based colors, even if it's a buckskin (so possibly not even all that dark). But I would jump all over a liver chestnut just like I'd jump all over a black or bay.

    So I try for mares and stallions that are sooty if possible when breeding chestnut to chestnut.
    But sooty and liver are different, as a plain ol' chestnut can also be sooty. Sooty works on most colors.

    Quote Originally Posted by RiddleMeThis View Post
    Ive personally found liver x liver breedings produce more livers. Though it is in no way guaranteed.
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  16. #16
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    Love my Red Head! hoping for another next year, which is why I bred to a Red Stallion.
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  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by JB View Post
    Sabino IS pinto I think maybe you meant Paint? There really is a big difference, with Paint being a breed of QH/TB/Paint breeding. Pinto refers to patterns. High white and a big face blaze is pinto
    Hmmm. Well what do ya know. I owned a pinto. I don't think I've ever been told sabino = pinto. Learn something new every day!



  18. #18
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    Give me a redhead ANY day. I don't care about color, it's the last thing on my list, but I won't breed to a pinto (meaning tobiano/tovero, sabino is fine) just because it's not something *I* want. I was thrilled to get a deep, dark, chestnut sabino filly this year from 2 bays (Mom is plain bay too). She's shedding the same dark red color too.
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  19. #19
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    My favorite color is bay. My stallion is chestnut and ALL my mares (2 I bought, 4 I bred) are gray or ... chestnut.

    Yeah, color is low on my list of problems (although my chosen breeding group is gray-heavy, so if all else were equal, *not* breeding gray to gray is nice. But I've done it.)
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  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by JB View Post
    But sooty and liver are different, as a plain ol' chestnut can also be sooty. Sooty works on most colors.

    You are right sooty and shade are different, however I've found most livers combine sooty with the dark shade and those end up looking the darkest. I should have specified Shade as well- OOPS! Sorry

    And I have found Liver x Liver gives a much higher precentage of Liver babies as well...

    I have (and had) a lot of redheads, some are so NOT the sterotype, but most (75% approx) are, I've noticed in my own experience. But I like them, I'm not dissing any of them
    Of all the things I've lost, I miss my mind the most...now where did I put those marbles...
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