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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Dec. 26, 2008
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    1,073

    Default Who get's prize money?

    I was speaking to a friend/BO today. She asked me an interesting question that I never considered. While I know how I would handle it I was wondering what the protocol was.

    She paid a trainer to take a horse to a show. Trainers daughter rode the horse in the classes. She paid the trainer her full trainers fees, paid a fee per class to have the daughter ride the horse in classes, and paid all expenses. Horse did very well and when it and the trainer came home she asked the BO if she wanted the horses ribbons. BO said no to let the daughter keep them.

    Well 4 months later she was on-line looking at show results and realized that some of the classes were money classes. Now all she received was the bill for the show (trainer paid on site)trainers fees and expenses and daughters rides and expenses. Her fault she really didn't pay attention to all the classes but rather the horse won it's divisions etc.

    Who should have received the prize money? ( I can guarantee that the daughter didn't get to keep it)

    If I had a client who was paying for training fees and ride fees on their horse I would give them the prize money and if they decided to give me something of it that would be nice if not oh well I have my other fees.



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jan. 29, 2007
    Location
    British Columbia, canada
    Posts
    124

    Default

    Did she get a copy of the bill as it came from the show? A lot of the shows here give prize money by just taking money off the show bill. Maybe that's what happened?



  3. #3
    Join Date
    Feb. 20, 2005
    Location
    New England
    Posts
    110

    Default

    Isn't prize money generally subtracted from the final show bill?



  4. #4
    Join Date
    May. 16, 2001
    Location
    Alaska. Not in an Igloo.
    Posts
    8,993

    Default

    My theory?

    She who pays for the horse show, gets the prize money.
    Seig Heil Polo Shirt!



  5. #5
    Join Date
    Sep. 6, 2003
    Location
    WA, Land of the damp Thongpend
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    2,451

    Default

    It is usually subtracted OR sent to the person whose SS number is on the entry as the prize money receiver a month or so later.



  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec. 26, 2008
    Posts
    1,073

    Default

    oh I am slow to day I didn't even think about the money being taken out of the show bill!!!

    I know they have had problems with this particular trainer charging them for ridiculous things so I think she assumed she kept it and I just went along!!!

    I can't believe this I am shaking my head in shame at my own forgetfulness!

    So just for future reference of a sum larger then show bill, it goes to the payer of the bills!? That's how I feel.

    Thanks for putting up with my silliness I am sick today and totally not thinking!



  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul. 6, 2005
    Posts
    1,140

    Default

    No - unless things have changed in the years since I showed in classes that paid money, the horse wins the money. Not the trainer or the rider. So the horse's owner gets the money.

    That's why there's no money in equitation classes that are limited to amateurs. The judging is on the rider, who can't win money.

    Money-won goes to the horse, meaning the horse's owner.

    But if it was subtracted from the show invoice - and if your friend actually got the original show invoice - she should see what happened to it in this case.



  8. #8
    Join Date
    Sep. 13, 2005
    Location
    Malibu, Ca/Ligonier, Pa.
    Posts
    424

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by KBEquine View Post


    Money-won goes to the horse, meaning the horse's owner.

    .
    Some of the shows we did (California) -- the money came about 30 days after the show
    was over -- by check to the owner of the horse who's SS number is on
    the entry form. Some of the regional Arabian shows give you the check attached
    to your champion ribbons - I wasn't aware that shows could or did deduct money
    from your final bill.


    I did notice that under owner information is says -- to advise if prize money is to be paid
    to a different payee and there is a place on your entry form for same ---
    so the trainer must have filled that portion out and had the money sent to him.



  9. #9
    Join Date
    Sep. 13, 2007
    Posts
    717

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by KBEquine View Post
    Money-won goes to the horse, meaning the horse's owner.
    Whenever I've leased horses, as in paid owner a large sum to use them for a certain amount of months, and am paying all of their bills both at home and for shows, I am getting that money, subtracted from MY bill.
    Although once I did ride a friends horse, I paid for its stalls/show fees, but did not pay her anything, so the prize $ (well as much as it can be from 5th place in the childrens hunter classic...) went to her, and that seems fair, since I was not 'leasing' him.



  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb. 3, 2000
    Location
    Nokesville, VA
    Posts
    35,326

    Default

    By convention, the prize money goes to the owner (or lessor).

    But most entry blanks nowadays have a place to fill in (WITH SS#) who gets the prize money.

    Did you sign the entry blank?
    Janet

    chief feeder and mucker for Music, Spy, Belle and Tiara. Someone else is now feeding and mucking for Chief and Brain (both foxhunting now).



  11. #11

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by KBEquine View Post
    That's why there's no money in equitation classes that are limited to amateurs. The judging is on the rider, who can't win money.
    I don't think it's true that ammys can't win money. That would mean an ammy owner couldn't show their own horse in say, the Regulars. And I know darn well there are ammys in the sidesaddle division, which does often have prize money.
    http://www.tbhsa.com/index.html

    Originally Posted by JSwan
    I love feral children. They taste like chicken.



  12. #12
    Join Date
    Dec. 28, 2008
    Posts
    69

    Default

    The prize money goes to the owner.
    Ammys can win money, there are classes in the A/A and A/O that offer prize money.



  13. #13
    Join Date
    Sep. 6, 2003
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    WA, Land of the damp Thongpend
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    Default

    Those are for classes judged on the horse, not the rider, you can not win money in an equitation class as an amateur and remain an amateur.

    That is what KBEquine stated.



  14. #14
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    Feb. 3, 2000
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    Nokesville, VA
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    Default

    In a non equitation class, it is the HORSE that wins the money. That money (going to the owner or lessor) doesn't violate amateur status.

    But if the owner and the rider are different, and the rider is an amateur, the money can't go to the amateur (non-owner) rider. That would be construed as paying the rider.

    In equitation classes, if money were awarded, it would go to the rider (since it is the rider being judged) and would violate amateur status.
    Janet

    chief feeder and mucker for Music, Spy, Belle and Tiara. Someone else is now feeding and mucking for Chief and Brain (both foxhunting now).



  15. #15
    Join Date
    Feb. 3, 2000
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    Nokesville, VA
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Extreme Chaos View Post
    The prize money goes to the owner.
    Ammys can win money, there are classes in the A/A and A/O that offer prize money.
    Amateurs can win the money in their role as OWNER.
    In an A/A class, if the rider is not the owner, the rider can't take the prize money without violating amateur status.

    But the owner can take the money.
    Janet

    chief feeder and mucker for Music, Spy, Belle and Tiara. Someone else is now feeding and mucking for Chief and Brain (both foxhunting now).



  16. #16
    Join Date
    Sep. 13, 2007
    Posts
    717

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Janet View Post
    Amateurs can win the money in their role as OWNER.
    In an A/A class, if the rider is not the owner, the rider can't take the prize money without violating amateur status.

    But the owner can take the money.
    Even if it doesn't exceed the show bill?



  17. #17
    Join Date
    Jun. 29, 2004
    Posts
    10,741

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MyGiantPony View Post
    I don't think it's true that ammys can't win money. That would mean an ammy owner couldn't show their own horse in say, the Regulars. And I know darn well there are ammys in the sidesaddle division, which does often have prize money.
    But in those divisions its the horse being judged and thatt is actually winning the money, unlike an equitation class where its the rider being judged.



  18. #18
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    Feb. 3, 2000
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    Nokesville, VA
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by heartinrye View Post
    Even if it doesn't exceed the show bill?
    That would be a good question to ask the USEF.

    If the rider (not the owner) paid the entry fees, etc., you could MAYBE say that the OWNER receives the prize money, and then "reimburses show expenses" for the RIDER, as permitted under GR1306.2.c.
    Janet

    chief feeder and mucker for Music, Spy, Belle and Tiara. Someone else is now feeding and mucking for Chief and Brain (both foxhunting now).



  19. #19

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BAC View Post
    But in those divisions its the horse being judged and thatt is actually winning the money, unlike an equitation class where its the rider being judged.
    Oh, sure....but I wonder...what about prizes that exceed the gift allowance. Like the Medal kids winning a Pessoa saddle...can the adult medal riders win things like that? I haven't done eq since I was a kid, so I don't have a clue...
    http://www.tbhsa.com/index.html

    Originally Posted by JSwan
    I love feral children. They taste like chicken.



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