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  1. #1
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    Default How much is "make an offer"?

    Found a horse to look at. It is a 3 yr old, unstarted gelding. Good upbringing, handled often, raised in a good home. Good solid build, about 15hh, good feet and 8" cannon bones. Bloodlines from racing bred horses.

    I am planning to go see it next week and asked how much ( i thought it was a free to a good home situation). She wouldn't tell me a $ amount, just said no reasonable offer would be refused. Owner wants the horse to go to a good home with someone that can take him to the top. Capable of 100's oneday with training and conditioning. 1/2 siblings are successful endurance horses.

    What DOES a reasonable offer sound like? I don't want to offend, but I want a good deal too.

    Do I take the trailer with me? The drive is about 2 hrs.



  2. #2
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    Default Hay

    Geeze that is loaded and I wouldn't worry about offending if these folks are strangers. If you like the horse, offer what you see fit even if it's free. When they hedge, turn your body as to leave without saying anything...You'll be able to judge the sale at how desperate they sound...

    Also, using silence puts people off. After they've hedged and you turn back to them, wait for them to respond. People are uncomfortable with silence and will say something usually in your favor.

    I have a lot of sales experience and you can run the show with body language even if you're the buyer.

    I don't have any experience purchasing horses. I owned horses all my life but only one wasn't a freebie so I'm not so sure about a PPE or whatever. I just know sales and am offering that advice. I'll be curious to hear what others have to say...
    Sorry! But that barn smell is my aromatherapy!
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  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by IrishKharma View Post
    Found a horse to look at. It is a 3 yr old, unstarted gelding. Good upbringing, handled often, raised in a good home. Good solid build, about 15hh, good feet and 8" cannon bones. Bloodlines from racing bred horses.

    I am planning to go see it next week and asked how much ( i thought it was a free to a good home situation). She wouldn't tell me a $ amount, just said no reasonable offer would be refused. Owner wants the horse to go to a good home with someone that can take him to the top. Capable of 100's oneday with training and conditioning. 1/2 siblings are successful endurance horses.

    What DOES a reasonable offer sound like? I don't want to offend, but I want a good deal too.

    Do I take the trailer with me? The drive is about 2 hrs.
    I'm a horse breeder, seller AND buyer, and I would not make the drive over there without getting more specific info from the seller.

    When I drove to Belesamo Arabians, we had most of the pricing worked out before I even got there -- what she would take for certain horses, how much I was going to put down, how much I was going to pay each month, etc., even though I hadn't decided exactly on which horses I was going to buy.

    Once I got there, we did alittle more back & forthing -- so I ended up buying 3 horses (I was only going to get 2), she dropped the prices abit more and I agreed to extend my payments afew more months. We all went away happy.

    So this is what *I* would do:

    Tell the seller exactly that (in a nice way)...something like, "Blaze sounds like the kind of horse I'd be interested in, but I am on a tight budget and I don't want to come all that way if he's going to be priced out of my range. If we can agree on a price range, I will bring my trailer with the intent to take him, but I have to know we are 'on the same page' in terms of $$. I will give him a good home, etc. (we assume you WILL), but I can't afford to pay more than $______. Would you accept that for him if I like him?"

    Then name your price. Personally, I would start low...because you can always go up. Say, $500-1000. If the seller demurs and says something like ,"well, I was hoping to get alittle more for him," then YOU say, "Ok, well, what were you thinking of?"

    And that's how it goes....it's called negotiation. <g>

    If the seller says, "Oh, I would NEVER take less than $2000 for him!" Then you have a starting point. Of course, you can come back and say..."Well, that was really more than I had planned on spending...I could probably come up with alittle extra -- would you take $1500 for him?"

    'Haggling for horses' is a fine art, and it doesn't seem alot of people in this culture are very good at it, but I've found that ALL horse related stuff is open to discussion...so give it a try.



  4. #4
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    Default Hay

    Just a note to add to the above poster. I personally would ask what range specifically the seller was looking to sell the horse. If you say your budget was $1000 and these folks were thinking of only $500. They then could quite possibly negotiate you up to $1200 on a horse they were only hoping to get $500 for...

    You can also say "[Buyer], I can not hitch my trailer up without knowing a ball park..." I personally wouldn't tell the range you're looking to spend...
    Sorry! But that barn smell is my aromatherapy!
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  5. #5
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    Default Hay

    Another note, you could say "Blaze looks like the type of horse I'd be looking for but I'm on a tight budget..." then leave this big space of silence for them to fill in.

    I'm telling you silence can close a deal. You can go to some of the big sales seminars and conference in this country and there are classes on "Closing the deal with silence!" - honestly! Good luck!
    Sorry! But that barn smell is my aromatherapy!
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  6. #6
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    Jul. 13, 2006
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    Default

    This happened to me a few weeks ago. I went to try a few horses that were bred and raised by the same couple. The wife didn't set a price - merely said that if something clicks with me, we will work it out. Went out a second time for a second ride on the horse that I clicked with, and the husband than says to me that he doesn't care if the horse sells or not - he will just fence in more pasture. Bottom line, he didn't want to sell, but the wife did. If I would have pushed for a price or at least a range, the husband would have been involved in the discussion and I wouldn't have wasted my time. Twice I made the 3 hour round trip drive.

    At least get a price range before you go.
    Member of My Balance is Poo Poo Clique



  7. #7
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    In today's market a horse like the OP described would be $500-$700. That is most reasonable. It might offend the sellers, but if so it's because they invited offense.

    A listing like the seller is making suggests that they are either clueless or in denial about today's equine market.

    Personally, I'd pass them by and find folks more in touch with reality.

    G.



  8. #8
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    Default

    I no longer let sellers push me into the "make an offer". I would only make an offer based on THEIR price. Like someone said, you could offer more than what they were thinking of asking.

    Untrained horses are a dime a dozen, many buyers are aware of the costs of training and budget that into their horse price.



  9. #9
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    I wouldn't waste my time...and it would be a time-waster.

    They know what they'd like to get (usually inflated).
    They might know what they'd take (but not always)

    I suggest getting a number before wasting yoru time...their horse is only worth what someone is willing to pay, no more.

    Don't bring your trailer, it puts added pressure to fill it for the trip home.



  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guilherme View Post
    In today's market a horse like the OP described would be $500-$700. That is most reasonable. It might offend the sellers, but if so it's because they invited offense.

    A listing like the seller is making suggests that they are either clueless or in denial about today's equine market.

    Personally, I'd pass them by and find folks more in touch with reality.

    G.
    Wow -- find me all the well-bred (successful racing lines), well-handled, well-taken care of 3 year old PB Arab mares, 15hh or better (chestnut or bay, please) with good feet & good bone that you can get for $500-700. Please PM me with contact info. I'd be VERY interested.



  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyzteke View Post
    Wow -- find me all the well-bred (successful racing lines), well-handled, well-taken care of 3 year old PB Arab mares, 15hh or better (chestnut or bay, please) with good feet & good bone that you can get for $500-700. Please PM me with contact info. I'd be VERY interested.
    Start by perusing the giveaway section of this site.

    Or, better still, you could give us your analysis of market value.

    G.



  12. #12
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    Default

    According to the range in response, the "value" of the said horse could be $500- ????

    It is a gelding if that makes any difference. In my opinion, I would value a mare higher since you could breed it (pending it was of breedable stock) if there was an injury to prevent riding capabilities.

    Why do people do this!!! They obviously have a $ amount in their mind...



  13. #13
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    Default

    don't play the game. Just tell 'em you need a figure to work with, period. Not driving 2 hrs one way to find out reasonable is 7500. When your budget is 3500.



  14. #14
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    Default

    I would discuss price range beforehand too.

    Where I live, there are TONS of really cheap, nice looking young unstarted Arabs. I have noticed though that some of the breeders do want to charge what to me is a lot of money (say $3k-8K) because of the bloodlines, performance records of the family, and the "quality" of their horses. I'm cheap, and I wouldnt pay that much when in my opinion, you can get really nice ones for a song. My 2 Arabs were free as a weanling and $800 as a 3 year old. A few of my friends also bought NICE young Arabs from a fairly well known breeder from a dispersal sale for a few hundred each.

    BTW, I know someone with a Belesemo horse. I dont know how much he paid for it, but man, it is gorgeous!



  15. #15
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    Default

    Price is my first question, no need to look at a horse priced higher than I am willing to spend.

    "No reasonable offer" and "to a good home" = meat price for me.
    No hour of life is wasted that is spent in the saddle. ~Winston Churchill



  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guilherme View Post
    Start by perusing the giveaway section of this site.

    Or, better still, you could give us your analysis of market value.

    G.
    Well, like anything in the world (houses & horses included), a thing is worth only what someone is willing to pay for it. And everyone assigns value differently.

    To me, mares ARE worth more, because you can breed them -- but also I prefer to ride mares. But in the endurance world, fillies/mares are NOT as desirable, because more people prefer geldings.

    I sell my Arab/Teke foals (all buckskin or palomino) for $2500-4000. Most are sold as weanlings/yearlings. But I find there is actually a stronger market for them then there is for many PB Arabs. Go figure. Still, they sell, so that proves there is a place for them in "the market."

    Oh -- and I didn't see any horses that fit my needs in the giveaway section....



  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by IrishKharma View Post
    A
    It is a gelding if that makes any difference. In my opinion, I would value a mare higher since you could breed it (pending it was of breedable stock) if there was an injury to prevent riding capabilities.

    Why do people do this!!! They obviously have a $ amount in their mind...
    Once again, according to breeder friends of mine who are far more experienced in all aspects of endurance than I, geldings have a higher market value than mares (see my other post). Take that for what it's worth.

    As for why people do this? Well, just like one of the other posters mentioned, the sellers are using silence and hoping YOU will chime in with an offer. If the horse was originally offered as a giveaway, then I would assume the price is not high....but this person is waiting for YOU to speak first in hopes that you will offer more than she was hoping to get.

    Either that or she's simply waiting for "the highest bidder."

    Again, I would sort out this price range thing before you ever went, but DO take your trailer. And bring cash. Both of these things show the seller you are serious and not just tire kicking. You may not be comfortable doing the negotiation thing....alot of people aren't.

    So just cut to the chase with the seller and say (in a nice way), "Look, Blaze really sound like a horse I'd like, but I need to get a good idea of what you want for him before I haul all the way over there. Right now, what is the least you will take for him?"

    See if that works. But DEFINITELY get the ball rolling on the price discussion or I agree -- you are wasting your time.



  18. #18
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    I'm in the minority in that 2 hours drive is nothin'. Go see the horse, if you like it, make an offer you can live with. Too bad, so sad if you offend. Last November, I went to see a horse 2 hours away on bloodlines alone. They started out asking $8K for her (I didn't know what they were asking for her when I went out, they had just said make an offer)- I paid $200 (no I didn't leave off a zero). They really did want a good home for her. So now I have a gorgeous, amazingly bred Morgan mare in my barn, but had I been worried about making my offer I wouldn't.
    “While the rest of the species is descended from apes, redheads are descended from cats.” Mark Twain



  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyzteke View Post
    Wow -- find me all the well-bred (successful racing lines), well-handled, well-taken care of 3 year old PB Arab mares, 15hh or better (chestnut or bay, please) with good feet & good bone that you can get for $500-700. Please PM me with contact info. I'd be VERY interested.
    Not a bad point! Perhaps the op just needs to search the Internet and see what is available for how much, to get a feel for a good price. I don't know Arab bloodlines but here is a start:

    http://www.arabianhorses.org/marketp...sults_pas2.asp

    That is a pretty long list of PB Arabs all for under $1000.

    Holly cow look how many FB Arabs under $1000 (463) Wow! I though QHs were bad now

    http://www.arabianhorses.org/marketp...esults_pas.asp
    Last edited by MSP; Mar. 17, 2009 at 06:29 PM. Reason: added link
    No hour of life is wasted that is spent in the saddle. ~Winston Churchill



  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by MSP View Post
    Not a bad point! Perhaps the op just needs to search the Internet and see what is available for how much, to get a feel for a good price. I don't know Arab bloodlines but here is a start:

    http://www.arabianhorses.org/marketp...sults_pas2.asp

    That is a pretty long list of PB Arabs all for under $1000.

    Holly cow look how many FB Arabs under $1000 (463) Wow! I though QHs were bad now

    http://www.arabianhorses.org/marketp...esults_pas.asp
    Actually, this WAS a good idea. I went to the site and did a search 1st for Chestnut Mares, age 3-5, priced under $1000. There were 2. One was sold. Both were halter lines (NOT what I'm looking for).
    Then did the same search for the same color but upped the age to 6-10. Again, 2 available, but one was for lease. Again, halter bred.

    Then turned to bays -- did the same thing.

    Under age 3-5 there were 2. Both halter lines. Did the search for age 6-10 -- and a whopping FIVE came up...one was sold. THere were actually 2 I'd snap up in a heartbeat, even though both were only 14.2-14.3hh, and one of those was actually racebred....but she was in the opposite end of the country from me.

    So if you start to weed through those 463 horses, you will find alot of crap. Just like in QHs. Yes, you CAN find deals (and believe me, I am ALWAYS looking for them), but for the most part quality holds a better price than "fashion." But trust me, it's hard to find good Arabs (meaning bred for performance, well taken care of, solid of body, bone, feet & mind, good-sized (over 14.3hh) for cheap.

    As to the OP, if this horse is as represented, to me anything under $1000 is a pretty good deal. Obviously, the less you pay, the better! So again...START LOW. You can ALWAYS go up. And I've never met anyone so "offended" that they refused to sell you the horse if you raised your price!

    Good luck. And if you do end up going, please take pics. I'd love to see what you get.



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