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  1. #1
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    Default <sigh> Why can't they be too dumb to use Craigslist

    [removed link]

    I have an 7 or 8 year old registered Appaloosa mare. I would like to breed her to a reasonably priced stallion,to see what type of babies she would produce. She is well bred,her sire has won 2 Bronze medallions,at the Appaloosa World show. I am looking for a AQHA or Appaloosa stallion. I am not willing to pay more than $300.00,as this is a maiden mare,and if she does not produce a quality foal,she will be sold.She is HYPP NH so I need to cross her on a stallion that either has no Impressive Bloodlines,or one that is HYPP NN. If your horse is not bred well,,do not respond to this ad.No Grade stock.

    :headdesk:
    Last edited by Moderator 1; Jan. 20, 2009 at 04:31 PM.



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug. 26, 1999
    Location
    Concord, California, USA
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    8,128

    Default

    Oh, I know. I was helping a friend horse search and turned up a nice looking pair of horses for sale in Nevada. Then I scrolled down... both were N/H. Forget that breeder/trainer and his/her horses.



  3. #3
    Join Date
    May. 6, 2007
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    Napanee ON
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    3,887



  4. #4
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    Dec. 12, 2007
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    Default

    We've removed the link to the Craigslist ad, as we'd rather the board not be used to directly foster a "pile on."

    Thanks,
    Mod 1



  5. #5
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    Default

    [SIZE=1]So I e-mailed her this: [SIZE=3]Read this and tell me whether you continue to think it would be responsible to breed an N/H positive horse[/SIZE][SIZE=3]. N/H carriers CAN BE SYMPTOMATIC. You have a 25% chance of producing an N/H foal by breeding to an N/N stallion. It's irresponsible breeding that keeps slaughter auctions in business. N/N tastes the same as N/H when eaten in Europe and Japan. I'm sure if you were to really look at your mare, her conformation and show record would not render her worthy of breeding. Do your mare, yourself and the horse population and adopt a horse. You can get a milk mare foal from Last Chance Corral for $250 (sometimes less) and you're saving a life, getting an N/N negative horse and they have wonderful breeds/colors. They even adopt characteristic appys. I'm waiting on the days that the registries toughen up and ban the registry of any N/H and H/H positive horses unless they're spayed or gelded. AQHA already banned the registration and showing H/H horses realizing the only way to eliminate a GENETIC DISEASE is to take away the reward for doing so. [/SIZE]

    http://www.bringinglighttohypp.org/VideoInformation.html
    http://www.bringinglighttohypp.org/HVideo.html
    [/SIZE]

    And her response: Her stallion was NH and was valued at $10,000.00 AFTER HYPP broke out.Impressive was the greatest AQHA stallion ever to live,and he was HH,,he had NO symptoms whatsoever.
    Dont you wonder what started all the research? We dont breed junk.She is 8,and has never had a symptom.Junk is what ends up in resucues
    Thansk anyway,I know you mean well,,but get your facts straight.Impressive just didnt creat the illness,,and they are many other MUCH worse that are trteated everyday,with diet.

    OMG!



  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jan. 12, 2007
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    4,227

    Default

    They show up on the Appy boards as well And sometimes they have stallions to stand It's just mind numbing sometimes!

    BTW I have an N/H horse and think he is the best thing on four hooves. I love Impressive bred horses and rarely own anything else.

    I also think the person should be introduced to a few of the better ApHC breeders to help her become educated about breeding period. Not just breeding her mare. In this economy anyone who breeds any horse should have their head examined for defects!

    If the OP will refer her to:

    http://www.appaloosa.com/

    They can educated her on the current HYPP rules and refer her to breeders who can help her make an educated opinion on her mare.

    Always better to offer solutions than to monkey pile!



  7. #7
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    Default Too harsh?

    My final word: Junk ends up in rescues? What planet are you on!? I had a 3 time WORLD CHAMPION appy stallion that ended up in the back of this barn in the middle of east podunk and he was confiscated by the SPCA. So, no, rescues aren't "junk dealers." November Rain, a horse ridden in the 1998 World Equestrian Games in Rome was just found rotting at a dealer's barn in PA, skinny and covered in rain rot. So, you're genetically defective Appy thing, surely isn't exempt from winding up in some hole somewhere. I feel really very sorry for your horses. Unfortunately, it's breeders like you who keep the rescues full and auction houses in business.

    Before I hit send - too harsh?



  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jan. 2, 2006
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    Dallas, NC
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    Default

    NO! Send it! Please or I will.....if I knew where to send it. : )
    I want a signature but I have nothing original to say except: "STHU and RIDE!!!

    Wonderful COTHER's I've met: belleellis, stefffic, snkstacres and janedoe726.



  9. #9
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    Default

    Already sent...

    Because I have absolutely no guilt, does that mean I'm a horrible person?



  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan. 12, 2007
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    Default

    Hmmm....Sorry snowflake I always wonder who it serves when someone gets on a soap box.

    Clearly this person knows a little about her horse and it's breeding. She may not be in touch with the reality of the current horse market. Rather than educating her, she has now been berated. Berated people become stubborn and entrenched and are then no longer teachable.

    Where I in no way share your views on HYPP, I do take a dim view on breeding because of price alone and not focusing the the end result.

    When we stood stallions to unproven mares owned by dim witted owners we required them to show us their long range goals with the planned foal. In our breeding shed the owner had to show us they were worthy of handling a foal by our herd sire. If not they had to go else where. We were not trying to make them feel inferior, but rather we wanted to educate them about the realities of long term breeding ramifications. A poorly bred horse or wrongly bred horse produces only a poorly performing horse. Coupled with a clueless owner it produces fodder for the processing plants, not the rescues.

    No doubt this berated woman has dug in her heels and will breed her mare to what end I am not sure. However I seriously doubt your intervention had little effect except to piss her off. Was that your intention?



  11. #11
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    May. 4, 2006
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    Default

    Why not tell her the truth Woodland? Nice reasoned discussions have little bearing on the already made up mind which clearly she has as she has thought through so well why she would like "to see what her Appy will produce". Sounds like the "we just have to let the kids see the miracle of birth" reason for breeding. I am reminded of the parable of the cave by Plato; the people were chained to the wall and could see only the shadows of those on the outside cast on the wall in front of them. They could only judge what the real world was like by those shadows. When they were turned around and could look at the light, at first they were blinded. One only hopes that her eyes can adjust to the light.....
    "I have brought on the hatred of Wall Street and I relish it".
    Franklin Delano Roosevelt



  12. #12
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    Jul. 27, 2007
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    Default

    Since AQHA banned H/H, I'm told that breedings to HYPP positive horses (even the N/H) are way down. Has ApHA done the same?



  13. #13
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    Jan. 12, 2007
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Calamber View Post
    Why not tell her the truth Woodland? Nice reasoned discussions have little bearing on the already made up mind which clearly she has as she has thought through so well why she would like "to see what her Appy will produce".

    I am EXPOUNDING the TRUTH!

    She doesn't even know what she is trying to accomplish. Leading her in the right direction rather than bashing her head in with a hammer may have more long term effect. I mean the hammer might stop her now, but it will also piss her off enough to do it out of spite.

    Think about all the things you are interested in but know little about. Could you also walk the wrong path because you did not know a better way?

    As far as HYPP is concerned she needs to discuss it directly with her breed association. Personally I have absolutely no problem breeding a quality N/H horse to an N/N horse because genetically they are unlikely to have an N/H offspring. And certainly will not have an H/H offspring. And please spare me the amateur geneticist lectures - alone on this thread the only HYPP references are the ones that are contrary to the correct - although they contain a modicum of truth. I no longer breed horses but I can see the value in a good mare. As I said anyone breeding any horse in 2009 ought to be committed for idiocy.

    But truth is education not bashing - right?

    As far as what the APHA is doing with HYPP I haven't a clue I not a fan of the paint horse. The ApHC has banned H/H from breeding but like AQHA not the N/H horses. However there are other very stringent rules that must be followed to breed ApHC. Because they are a breed that prefers colored offspring to the tune of setting what can be bred to what - not the bizarre mutation and muddled lines that are the AQHA APHA, they have different standards.

    ApHC struggles daily with it's identity. Is it just a color breed, or is it a breed that is not defined just by color? No one knows, and leadership is in all different directions on that issue. Breeding issues are destroying the ApHC. That is why it is imperative that a potential breeder be highly educated, not just on HYPP but on every aspect or the offspring may not have papers when it arrives. It's a mess I'd rather stay out of. I have always seen the ApHC as a horse of color that was never ever defined by it's color alone, but by it's unique abilities.

    We show ApHC circuit. The club has been in turmoil for decades over breeding issues. It disgusts me. Hard headed people will be the club's demise. So I will not monkey pile on this person's unfortunate ideas. Rather I would like to point her in the direction of her association for guidance on breeding. Doing anything else will only cause a mistake in the form of a foal.



  14. #14
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    Default

    Sorry, I meant ApHC.

    I don't call a 25% chance of an N/H horse "unlikely," but unfortunately the chances are actually 50%.



  15. #15
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    Aug. 25, 1999
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    Holland Township, NJ
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Snowflake View Post
    I am not willing to pay more than $300.00,as this is a maiden mare,and if she does not produce a quality foal,she will be sold.
    'Cos, breeding a maiden to some piece of crap $300 stallion is a FINE way to see what she can produce.

    Wow.

    People scare me. I know a guy that has race horses, including a small, mostly mediocre broodmare band. He has been told more than once that if he reduced his mares from 8 to 5, keeping the best of the lot, and using the same stud fee budget on 5 mares instead of 8, he will have better results. And he just doesn't get it. He just keeps stretching the budget to cover 8 mares and gets crap. And pats himself on the back for it. The five he should keep would make him some nice babies if he spent a little more on nicer studs. One DID make nice babies; for her previous owner!



  16. #16
    Join Date
    Nov. 5, 2008
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    North Georgia
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    Default

    There was an ad on Atlanta's Craigslist last week:

    1 male horse
    1 female horse
    male is fixed

    ---------------------------------------
    Here are some more (funny thing is...the first one... this person had this horse listed as a gelding on another classifieds site. Both this horse and another are quite underweight, and we had offered them $300 for both of them - they refused):

    1. For sale I have a grade stud. He has one of the best tempers I have ever seen on a stud. I have ridden him but not much, and does fine under a saddle. He loads and unloads off a trailer very well.He also loves attention. Would make a good trail horse if gelded or a good stud for breeding. Was asking 250, but I dont have the room for him so I am asking $150.

    // Because we need more grade studs with good "tempers."

    2. I have a 4 yo. App Mare that I want to sell for 450-500 or possibly lower or trade her for another horse or something else. If you have a good home and can prove it I will possibly give her to you for free, tho I would like to be allowed to come see her a couple of times to make sure she is doing fine. She is not trained to ride and has had nothing done with her. I got a mare and didn't listen to anyone and I would like to get a gelding but I need to get rid of her first. Just dont have to do anything other than ride. Email me for pictures, thanks!

    // 4 y/o nothing done with her...$450-$500 or free.
    If wishes were horses then beggars would ride...
    DLA: Draft Lovers Anonymous
    Quote Originally Posted by talkofthetown View Post
    As in, the majikal butterfly-fahting gypsy vanners.



  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by HydroPHILE View Post
    There was an ad on Atlanta's Craigslist last week:

    1 male horse
    1 female horse
    male is fixed
    At least they had the sense to fix the male. No such luck with the above craigslister.

    What keeps sticking with me is where she says "Do you wonder what started all the research?" No, I don't need to ponder that. Horses starting dying a horrible death. That's what brought on the research. The thing about this disease is that the horses are concious and aware of what's happening to them. It's not like a seizure disorder where the neurologic system "blanks out" and most victims aren't aware of what's happening with their body. These horses can suffocate during an attack and they're fully aware that they are unable to breathe. How simply horrifying. And how easily preventable.



  18. #18
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Snowflake View Post
    At least they had the sense to fix the male. No such luck with the above craigslister.
    Doesn't mean they "fixed" the "male"
    If wishes were horses then beggars would ride...
    DLA: Draft Lovers Anonymous
    Quote Originally Posted by talkofthetown View Post
    As in, the majikal butterfly-fahting gypsy vanners.



  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by HydroPHILE View Post
    Doesn't mean they "fixed" the "male"
    HydroPHILE, it's too early for puns. You lost me.



  20. #20
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    Default

    It wasn't a pun.

    I was merely saying...it doesn't mean they gelded the stallion. They probably bought him that way. Chances are, they probably bought a mare and a gelding from someone that told them, 'and you can breed them and have babies!' not telling them that the "stallion" is missing a piece of hardware.
    If wishes were horses then beggars would ride...
    DLA: Draft Lovers Anonymous
    Quote Originally Posted by talkofthetown View Post
    As in, the majikal butterfly-fahting gypsy vanners.



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