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  1. #1
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    Question spinoff - 2 fall rule?

    Thread on the eventing forum brought up a couple of BNTs with a '2 fall' rule -- I come off twice, the horse is out of my barn.
    I'm curious about what kind of rules people have for themselves? Does the horse had to be actively trying to lose the rider for the two falls to count? And do ammies and pros draw the line in different places?
    "I never panic when I get lost. I just change where I want to go."
    -Rita Rudner



  2. #2
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    When I first started riding, if I had a 2 fall rule, I would not have stuck with hores for long. The fall rule in eventing has to do with continuing on at a HT; there are reasons for that rule. I would not apply it to every day life with horses. It's very situational and individual. There are horses that I will not ride again and I didn't fall off.



  3. #3
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    No, eventing changed that rule--if you fall off in competition, you're out, full stop.

    The "two-fall" rule quoted is from a BNT--I think Philip Dutton. Someone who can ride damn near anything, stick no matter what. If the horse throws him twice, or falls with him twice, it's gone. I think mostly because he's got enough horses not to risk his livelihood dealing with whackadoos.



  4. #4
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    That makes perfect sense. Too many good ones out there, especially for someone like him.



  5. #5
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    Oh OK, that I can understand. It is going to take ALOT for a horse to throw Dutton and he wants horses that can compete at the higher levels so yeah, if HE falls off the same horse twice or a horse falls twice, I can see that. Now a novice rider, not so much.



  6. #6
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    I would think it would have to depend on the circumstances of the falls. Was the horse actively trying to throw you? Or did you screw up?
    -Debbie / NH

    My Blog: http://deborahsulli.blogspot.com/



  7. #7
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    Well, I'm sure there are always exceptions. I witnessed Phillip's fall from Connaught several years back at Rolex. Phillip said it was his fault, the horse wasn't quite ready for the level--clearly stuck with him, since they made the team this year.



  8. #8
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    Haha, I read it wrong. I thought you meant if a student fell off twice, the trainer would chuck them out of the program. Which surprised me bc all the BNTs I know require the faller buy a case of beer for the barn. I couldn't image most BNTs giving up that goldmine!
    If I tossed every horse who dumped me more than twice, I'd be on foot....



  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by RiverBendPol View Post
    Haha, I read it wrong. I thought you meant if a student fell off twice, the trainer would chuck them out of the program. Which surprised me bc all the BNTs I know require the faller buy a case of beer for the barn. I couldn't image most BNTs giving up that goldmine!
    If I tossed every horse who dumped me more than twice, I'd be on foot....
    That was kind of my feeling; most of us who've had the same horse for any significant amount of time have fallen off multiple times.

    But I was just curious about what has to happen for different people to throw in the towel on a horse. Do amateurs have a higher tolerance because they're (theoretically) not as strong in the saddle, or a lower tolerance because they're in it for pleasure?

    I've had a good friend get seriously hurt on a horse because she ignored the first two or three falls -- no one's fault, just a bad match. I've had a friend sell a horse in a week because she had one not-great but not bad division on it -- while someone else had a good division on her horse at the same show. And I've got a friend now who has "drawn the line" at least twice with a horse that's had a complete mental breakdown on her, only to change her mind and start over.

    So I wasn't referring to anything or anyone in particular. It was just the Phillip Dutton quote that made me curious about other people's opinions.
    "I never panic when I get lost. I just change where I want to go."
    -Rita Rudner



  10. #10
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    I think it would depend on the situation! If i were a professional rider with a bajillion horses to ride all the time, it might be a practical rule -- if i break a few bones or something, it could be a major halt to the everyday life style of a professional rider. They have clients horses to ride, and if they have to get someone else, it can be a real pain, i bet. but, as for me, I am a junior and I will only on rare occasion 'refuse' to ride a horse. It's happened before, but only with very specific and good reasons. There's just some horses that I can not safely ride. I will flat out refuse to ride a massive, strong, and very hot warmblood. Why? I'm 5' tall and 100 lbs. I can handle the craziest of ponies, but I won't stand a chance on an angry dinosaur of a horse. It's unpractical and a waste of time/money and an unnecessary risk, because I'm fairly sure something bad would happen.
    (|--Sarah--|)

    Blitz <3 & Leap of Faith <3



  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by RiverBendPol View Post
    Haha, I read it wrong. I thought you meant if a student fell off twice, the trainer would chuck them out of the program. Which surprised me bc all the BNTs I know require the faller buy a case of beer for the barn. I couldn't image most BNTs giving up that goldmine!
    If I tossed every horse who dumped me more than twice, I'd be on foot....
    I'm glad my old trainer wasn't aware of that rule. I fell off while training with her more times than I can count. The majority of the time it was my horse running out on a jump or doing a 180 spin when spooking. I ate dirt quite a bit on that horse.

    The assistant to my new trainer has been bucked off probably four times in the past month by this one greenie. It's amazing how she just jumps right up and pops back on. Maybe it's due to the footing which is boingey and soft.

    If a horse actively tried to get me off by bucking more than twice, I'd send it to a professional. That's a dangerous horse.



  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by RiverBendPol View Post
    Haha, I read it wrong. I thought you meant if a student fell off twice, the trainer would chuck them out of the program. Which surprised me bc all the BNTs I know require the faller buy a case of beer for the barn. I couldn't image most BNTs giving up that goldmine!
    If I tossed every horse who dumped me more than twice, I'd be on foot....
    If this was true, there would be no trainer left for me to ride with.
    I fell off 3x in one lesson, talk about embarrassing!!!



  13. #13
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    I've been hurt badly coming off the same large pony twice...

    First time was our 4th or 5th ride. We were trying to 'go solo' without our steady companion horse/rider right beside us. They were on the other side of the ring.
    We were standing perfectly still on a fairly long rein and I asked for 'walk-on' with my voice and leg. No response. I applied my leg again, and again and AGAIN.
    Pony took exception and launched into a HUGE buck, which I was not expecting.
    Six broken ribs, punctured lung, an ambulance ride and a 3-day stay in hospital with a chest tube.
    Quite a few people told me to get rid of him.
    I did send him to the trainer for 5 weeks while I recovered. He did not put a foot wrong.

    Two years later same pony took a very nasty tumble in the wet slippery pasture.
    I gave him a couple of days off, poked and prodded his back, tacked him up and longed him and he seemed fine. Got on and did some stretchy walk and trot. Seemed fine. Moved on to working trot. Perfectly happy. Decided to try a bit of canter and he exploded like bronc.
    Hairline fracture of the pelvis for me. Six weeks of no riding.
    Plus weeks of chiro and massage for the pony, who had a nasty misalignment in his pelvis, withers and neck.

    I had many more people tell me to get rid of him.

    He is now 8, and I still have him. Love him!
    Schooling First Level and are competitive against the big fancy WB's.
    He still has a bit of that cheeky, 'make-me-do-it' attitude, but he has never bronco bucked again.

    But I'm sure there are still people who think I was crazy to keep him.



  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by actcasual View Post
    I've had a good friend get seriously hurt on a horse because she ignored the first two or three falls...
    Been there. This time last year, I was riding a feisty newer horse who was a potential lease. He was a little sour and started getting dirty within a week. The first three falls (in a week!) I rolled with, but I was too stubborn. The fourth one, we were cantering when he planted his front feet and bucked. I came off over his head and jammed my spine hard when I landed flat on my rear.

    Not a permanent injury, nothing broken, but was by far the most painful injury I've ever had. Took months to fully recover.

    I've since realized that I need to be a little more realistic. I knew the horse was being rotten, and I shouldn't have played the hero.

    Such is life.



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