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  1. #41
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    Dec. 13, 2005
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    Strasburg, PA "Just west of Paradise"
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    Default

    If you don't like what she wrote, no one is forcing you to read it.
    The board has an ignore feature as well and it goes both ways.

    If this isn't a save the horses from slaughter thread what is it?

    There are thousands of horses for sale. Not every horse is going to get bought and some will end up going to slaughter.

    This thread is a sale thread in my opinion. Others on here are not allowed to advertise to sell horses. The only difference is was the tacking on the phrase, the horses may go to slaughter and the list of "brokered" horses is on a rescue's site. The rescue makes it perfectly clear they are not in possession of the horses and they are not theirs.

    Why should these horses be singled out any more then the other thousands of horses up for sale?

    You may not like what I have to say, but it is a fact, that someone is trying to play on the emotions of some, to buy these specific horses.



  2. #42
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    Dec. 4, 2002
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    Dungeon of the Ivory Tower
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    Default

    It's not that they are being singled out. COTHers are an incredibly wonderful and generous group, and many do what they can to save. If you'll scan the threads, you will see that this is just one of many such threads.

    If you choose not to help, or can't, that is fine, and absolutely your choice. AC4H is still 501(c)3, and this type of thread is no different from CANTER threads (or similar) alerting us to track closings. BUt there are many of us who want to know, and want to help. Most of us cannot take a horse in. Many of us, with this economy, can't afford to donate. But some of us can, and if enough can do just a little (my dribble theory) it can add up to a whole lot.

    True, we cannot save them all, But for the ones we can, that makes all the difference. These horses are at risk of certain death - and a not very humane death.

    I hope that this thread has come to the attention of someone who may be able to offer a home to even one of those at-risk horses. And I will never ever fault anyone for trying to do so.
    www.specialhorses.org
    a 501(c)3 organization helping 501(c)3 equine rescues




  3. #43
    Join Date
    Dec. 27, 2006
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    2,058

    Default

    Bluey, you are my hero.



  4. #44
    Join Date
    Nov. 14, 2002
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    Sorta near the Devon Horse Show grounds...
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    Default

    Outside of the cloistered walls of COTH, newspapers across the country are running front page articles discussing the fact that economic conditions have put horses in private homes at risk. People simply cannot afford to keep them, with costs skyrocketing, and incomes faltering. The number of horses here on the giveaway board give some strong indication of just how challenging these times are.

    This is something that has been near and dear to the heart of so many here on COTH- and now, the world at large is being made aware of it. To say that somehow anything here concerning the welfare, at any level, of a horse, should be limited, or censored, is a patently absurd. The fact that a Broker is trying to make a living on a horse who has lost one of these homes isn't the fault of the Broker- but it sure as hell isn't the fault of the horse, and it makes them no less at risk for sliding down the scale into truly desperate straights. Does a horse need to be starving in a field, or standing in a feedlot to be at risk? If you believe that, your rose colored glasses are working, just fine.

    This may not be your welfare concern- you may be worried about riding in the cold weather, or keeping shoes on in the mud, or waterproofing your blankets, or some other concern- but it IS a welfare concern, and as such, I hope that we never turn a blind eye to these issues on COTH.
    When someone shows you who they are, BELIEVE them- Maya Angelou
    www.americansaddlebredsporthorse.net
    http://www.asbsporthorse.blogspot.com/



  5. #45
    Join Date
    Apr. 14, 2006
    Location
    The Low Country
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    847

    Default

    So, wait, the pro-slaughter people don't care if horses go to slaughter (and think this is a preferable option for any horse) and OBJECT when people try to PREVENT horses from going to slaughter and label anyone who dares to contribute to such an effort an "animal rights activist?"

    Really?

    I choose to contribute to some rescue efforts. I, personally, do not support AC4H, but I would not condemn or belittle anyone who chooses to help keep these horses from going to slaughter.

    I realize that we cannot save them all. I also realize that some slaughter experiences for horses are worse than others, but if I can spare one horse that fate then why wouldn't I? And how does it affect the pro-slaughter trolls' world if someone tries?

    I dearly hope that COTH decides to open a well regulated Horse Welfare board. So many of the horses who go to slaughter and suffer abuse and neglect are the "refuse" of the industries supported and encouraged by this very board. However, if they do, I would hope that some people would have the decency (fat chance, I know) to leave people to their good fight to make a difference in the lives of a few horses.
    When life gives you lemons. . .say &%^# you lemons! And throw those lemons back in life's face so that it will be afraid of you and won't try that crap again!



  6. #46
    Join Date
    Feb. 13, 2005
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    Columbus, OH
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bluey View Post
    Very nice that some feel like aquiring their next horse thru a "rescue" effort, but in reality, we are just playing musical chairs with horses when buying one talked about in the rescue threads here, when maybe we would have been better buying a more appropiate horse locally.
    Bluey, you're my COTH person of the day for saying this.
    ________________________
    Resident COTH saddle nerd. (CYA: Not a pro, just a long-time enthusiast!)
    http://twitter.com/jenlmichaels



  7. #47
    Join Date
    Jan. 4, 2007
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    TX
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    Quote Originally Posted by LessonLearned View Post
    So, wait, the pro-slaughter people don't care if horses go to slaughter (and think this is a preferable option for any horse) and OBJECT when people try to PREVENT horses from going to slaughter and label anyone who dares to contribute to such an effort an "animal rights activist?"

    Really?

    I choose to contribute to some rescue efforts. I, personally, do not support AC4H, but I would not condemn or belittle anyone who chooses to help keep these horses from going to slaughter.

    I realize that we cannot save them all. I also realize that some slaughter experiences for horses are worse than others, but if I can spare one horse that fate then why wouldn't I? And how does it affect the pro-slaughter trolls' world if someone tries?

    I dearly hope that COTH decides to open a well regulated Horse Welfare board. So many of the horses who go to slaughter and suffer abuse and neglect are the "refuse" of the industries supported and encouraged by this very board. However, if they do, I would hope that some people would have the decency (fat chance, I know) to leave people to their good fight to make a difference in the lives of a few horses.
    I think that some miss the forest for looking at each individual tree.
    There is much more than meets the eye in these discussions.
    These are very serious concerns, way past slaughter, that in reality is just one more way to dispose of some unwanted horses.

    Other than the one horse that may be helped, of giving any one horse another chance at being of use, the real issues here are about what we want our use of horses to be and who is to decide.

    We have gone from "saving the horses from slaughter" to "saving the horses from racing", to "save the horses" from eventing, rodeo, whatever you want to name, to what else will the next target be?

    Try looking at that big picture and why some may object to the subtle and not so subtle propaganda behind many so called "rescues".



  8. #48
    Join Date
    Nov. 14, 2002
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    Sorta near the Devon Horse Show grounds...
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    4,155

    Default

    I think that it is very easy to extrapolate out to the ends of something, and smell PETA behind each and every effort to help a horse.

    Even in the era of Monica Lewinsky, sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.

    Look at each horse, on a case by case basis. If the horse is in an "at risk" situation, as you define it yourself, or as it is defined generally, you can step up and help.

    If not, you can sit back, and say that you are not going to enable any of those dogooders who might be members of those factions on the fringe- my God, they could be part of the conspiracy to take away our rights to....whatever. In the mean time, horse like those originally brought to our attention by this thread are STILL on the bubble.

    Why people feel the need to stop others from trying to help where they can is beyond me. It seems that they feel possessed of some great wisdom that escapes those who are out there pulling horses out of at risk situations, or that, because they are not actually doing this themselves, they are somehow in need of stopping others.

    All I give a damn about, in all of this is the horses. Do no let anyone make you lose sight of them- ever.
    When someone shows you who they are, BELIEVE them- Maya Angelou
    www.americansaddlebredsporthorse.net
    http://www.asbsporthorse.blogspot.com/



  9. #49
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    Apr. 23, 2004
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    Los Angeles
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    989

    Default

    Nice post Bluey and very true.



  10. #50
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    Jan. 4, 2007
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    TX
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    Quote Originally Posted by ASB Stars View Post
    I think that it is very easy to extrapolate out to the ends of something, and smell PETA behind each and every effort to help a horse.

    Even in the era of Monica Lewinsky, sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.

    Look at each horse, on a case by case basis. If the horse is in an "at risk" situation, as you define it yourself, or as it is defined generally, you can step up and help.

    If not, you can sit back, and say that you are not going to enable any of those dogooders who might be members of those factions on the fringe- my God, they could be part of the conspiracy to take away our rights to....whatever. In the mean time, horse like those originally brought to our attention by this thread are STILL on the bubble.

    Why people feel the need to stop others from trying to help where they can is beyond me. It seems that they feel possessed of some great wisdom that escapes those who are out there pulling horses out of at risk situations, or that, because they are not actually doing this themselves, they are somehow in need of stopping others.

    All I give a damn about, in all of this is the horses. Do no let anyone make you lose sight of them- ever.
    Are you not maybe assuming a little too much there?
    Why would you think that people that may want to point out some truths are not also, have been always, helping horses in need?



  11. #51
    Join Date
    May. 9, 2008
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    2,887

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluey View Post

    I am afraid that the day is coming where we will see people "rescuing" horses from stables, because keeping a horse in a stall will be deemed abusive, or horses turned loose at shows, because they are being abused when asked to jump, etc.
    That day is already here and it is the prime reason why I adopted my critters from Sunkissed clear across the East coast rather than in my own backyard.

    I love and support rescues...it is all we adopt here for many, many reasons. But at times I really get tired of the "send me your money, I just "rescued" another $800 dollar horse from the auction. There were three other buyers there...including a woman who really wanted a life long companion horse...GOSH! I couldn't let that happen! So I out bid her! Now we REALLY need more donations and she will be listed at $3,000 after she completes $1,000 worth of training."

    Not saying that is the case here...no way...but I am very, very tired of the way "bad" rescues make it hard for the "good" rescues. And I have had my fill just today...sorry, needed to vent a little

    I hope these horses have happy endings
    I Loff My Quarter Horse & I love Fenway Bartholomule cliques

    Just somebody with a positive outlook on life...go ahead...hate me for that.



  12. #52
    Join Date
    May. 11, 2007
    Posts
    470

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bluey;3748123Very nice that some feel like aquiring their next horse thru a "rescue" effort, but in reality, [B
    we are just playing musical chairs with horses[/B] when buying one talked about in the rescue threads here, when maybe we would have been better buying a more appropiate horse locally.
    You can say that about anyone purchasing a horse. How about the people adopting CANTER horses? Surely one can find local TBs or other horses locally. I don't remember seeing any comments from you or anyone else crabbing about people adopting them from across the nation. Who are you or anyone to say a person would be better off buying a local horse as opposed to going through a rescue 1/2 across the country.

    Weren't you on a previous thread willing to "rescue" a horse in CO? Surely you could find more than enough horses locally. Why is it OK for you and not anyone else?



  13. #53
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    Nov. 14, 2002
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    Sorta near the Devon Horse Show grounds...
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    Please.

    I am speaking about this group of horses, specifically.

    Whatever is being done- by you or anyone else- for others certainly deserves a thread of its own to celebrate those efforts. If you prefer to keep those efforts to yourself, that is sure OK, too.

    Perhaps I missed what you were doing for these horses, other than questioning the rationale?
    When someone shows you who they are, BELIEVE them- Maya Angelou
    www.americansaddlebredsporthorse.net
    http://www.asbsporthorse.blogspot.com/



  14. #54
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    Jan. 4, 2007
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    TX
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sail Away View Post
    You can say that about anyone purchasing a horse. How about the people adopting CANTER horses? Surely one can find local TBs or other horses locally. I don't remember seeing any comments from you or anyone else crabbing about people adopting them from across the nation. Who are you or anyone to say a person would be better off buying a local horse as opposed to going through a rescue 1/2 across the country.

    Weren't you on a previous thread willing to "rescue" a horse in CO? Surely you could find more than enough horses locally. Why is it OK for you and not anyone else?
    Many see what I see but choose not to comment most of the time.
    I would not have posted here at all, until the personal attacks started by some, that had their say without restrain for too long.

    As for the one horse I was interested in, not that far away, I was asked not to comment on it, so I won't, to protect the guilty.



  15. #55
    Join Date
    May. 26, 2005
    Location
    Central Maine
    Posts
    411

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by LessonLearned View Post
    So, wait, the pro-slaughter people don't care if horses go to slaughter (and think this is a preferable option for any horse) and OBJECT when people try to PREVENT horses from going to slaughter and label anyone who dares to contribute to such an effort an "animal rights activist?"
    One can't help but notice the irony.
    Proud Anti-Slaughter Handwringer http://www.tbfriends.com/



  16. #56
    Join Date
    Nov. 15, 2005
    Location
    NY
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    6,772

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by DressageGeek "Ribbon Ho" View Post
    IAC4H is still 501(c)3, and this type of thread is no different from CANTER threads (or similar) alerting us to track closings.
    So do the broker horses 'bailed' by AC4H go out with a rescue contract protecting them?
    Are there reference checks, site checks afterwards, etc?
    Is any portion of the 'bail' for a broker horse deductible?
    If not, how is their charitable status applicable?



  17. #57
    Join Date
    Sep. 16, 2003
    Posts
    921

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    COTH, like any other forum, reflects the times we live in currently. As a horse board, it reflects what is happening in the horse community at large. When the Olympics were happening, there were multiple threads regarding the Olympics. When the FEI games come to Kentucky in 2010, the pages will be filled with topics on that.

    Right now, we are in economic times that suck for many, including horse owners. Hence, more rescue threads. On trot.org, we do have a rescue forum specifically, and have had one for a few years, however, the number of threads that have started and the amount of traffic on those threads has increased over the last three months dramatically. So, I wouldn't say that COTH is becoming rescue central, it is just doing it's job as it always does, which is to reflect the current state of the horse industry. And, right now, like it or not, there are more horses at risk of not having homes.



  18. #58
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    Nov. 14, 2002
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    Sorta near the Devon Horse Show grounds...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Angela Freda View Post
    So do the broker horses 'bailed' by AC4H go out with a rescue contract protecting them?
    Are there reference checks, site checks afterwards, etc?
    Is any portion of the 'bail' for a broker horse deductible?
    If not, how is their charitable status applicable?
    If the funds to "bail out" these horses were donated directly to AC4H, then yes, the horses must have adoption contracts on each of them, because, in reality, they are the property of the rescue. Appropriate reference checks and such are done by AC4H. I am an approved foster/adopter for them and they did these checks on me.

    If a horse is purchased by an individual directly from a Broker, no such contract exists.
    When someone shows you who they are, BELIEVE them- Maya Angelou
    www.americansaddlebredsporthorse.net
    http://www.asbsporthorse.blogspot.com/



  19. #59
    Join Date
    Aug. 11, 2007
    Location
    California
    Posts
    115

    Default I don't get it.

    Dear pro-slaughter folks,

    Isn't it bad manners to divert a thread for your own purposes? This was a thread to spread awareness about a specific group of horses that were likely destined for slaughter. Getting the news out meant that people could get involved in helping them if they felt so inclined. This wasn't a discussion thread. I understand that the beauty of COTH is that everyone has different opinions but it seems that alot of threads have gone way off track - so much so that it is difficult to follow the original thread. Start your own thread if you want to go off-subject.

    No offense meant for anyone who jumped in to defend the original thread.....



  20. #60
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    Oct. 31, 2004
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    4,768

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    If you really believe this then you should report it to the moderator. I don't happen to agree and you surely have the right to your opinion. However this is what the mods do, they decide if something is inappropriate.

    I do use my ignore option when I get tired of reading the same old tired things from the same people. Obviously you are not on my ignore list. I've been on this forum for a few years and have learned my way around, made plenty of mistakes and learned to tone down a bit. But going after someone does bring out the underdog defense mode in me.

    IMHO, you should allow the mods to do their job and if they agree with you they will address it to the op. If you believe this to be a real case of selling horses then the right thing to do is to make a formal complaint to the mods and let them decide.




    Quote Originally Posted by 7HL View Post
    The board has an ignore feature as well and it goes both ways.

    If this isn't a save the horses from slaughter thread what is it?

    There are thousands of horses for sale. Not every horse is going to get bought and some will end up going to slaughter.

    This thread is a sale thread in my opinion. Others on here are not allowed to advertise to sell horses. The only difference is was the tacking on the phrase, the horses may go to slaughter and the list of "brokered" horses is on a rescue's site. The rescue makes it perfectly clear they are not in possession of the horses and they are not theirs.

    Why should these horses be singled out any more then the other thousands of horses up for sale?

    You may not like what I have to say, but it is a fact, that someone is trying to play on the emotions of some, to buy these specific horses.



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