[kcmel]

I want to remove all the microbials from my horse's diet, since I think he may be sensitive. I'm having a tough time finding a multivitamin that is both soy and microbial free. Does anyone have any suggestions? I was using Smartvite maintenance grass before, which I liked (his diet is mostly grass hay with some alfalfa/timothy cubes and a small amount of oats).

[Simkie]

I bet Uckele could whip something up for you...might be worth a call?

[sublimequine]

Um... you do realize the horse NEEDS microbes in its digestive system to function properly, correct?

[kcmel]

Well, of course I do, but he doesn't need any ADDED microbials.

[kcmel]

I bet Uckele could whip something up for you...might be worth a call?

Good idea. I checked their website and their basic multivitamins do have microbials, but I didn't think about a custom blend. I also emailed Smartpak to see if they had any suggestions, although I didn't really see anything on their comparison chart.

[sublimequine]

I've never heard of a horse being sensitive to any kind of probiotic, so excuse me if I'm highly skeptical.

[deltawave]

he doesn't need any ADDED microbials

Compared to what he ingests with his snoot down on the ground every day, a teaspoon or two of "microbials" is a drop in the proverbial bucket.

An allergy to bacteria--what is this theory based upon?

[Melyni]

Well, of course I do, but he doesn't need any ADDED microbials.

Horse feeds are far from sterile. Every bit of grass or hay has plenty of microbials on them.

But if you really don't want any microbials there are plenty on the market, in fact most companies don't put any in vit/min mixes.
or get one that has been pelleted, the pelletizing process cooks the mix so that no microbials survive.

PM me is you want a suggestion.

Yours
MW

[kcmel]

It's probably not the bacteria per se but some part of the large scale production thereof. I don't know; it's just a theory. When I had him on fasttrack when he was taken high doses of doxy for Lymes he had an immune response (a lymphangitis flareup). Then I had him on fasttrack again a couple of years later for runny poop and he developed hives. Took him off all supps and the hives got better. Started him back on his multivitamin and they came back. So that's the current theory we are operating under. It could be wrong but it makes sense to me!

[CoolMeadows]

Hey Melyni, are we talking about basic probiotics here or something different? Most of my barn's on Mega-Mag except Mr. Cool who gets Select II. They're both pelleted with added probiotics but if the pelleting process kills the good stuff, should I look for other sources?

Horse feeds are far from sterile. Every bit of grass or hay has plenty of microbials on them.

But if you really don't want any microbials there are plenty on the market, in fact most companies don't put any in vit/min mixes.
or get one that has been pelleted, the pelletizing process cooks the mix so that no microbials survive.

PM me is you want a suggestion.

Yours
MW

[MsSteno]

I want to remove all the microbials from my horse's diet, since I think he may be sensitive. I'm having a tough time finding a multivitamin that is both soy and microbial free. Does anyone have any suggestions? I was using Smartvite maintenance grass before, which I liked (his diet is mostly grass hay with some alfalfa/timothy cubes and a small amount of oats).

My mare is allergic to soy, oats, wheat and corn so I spent considerable time finding a good multi vit that didn't contain any of those. After lots of research I took 3 choices to my vet for his review and he liked the Pre-Ox best. She gets alfalfa/beet pulp/rice bran mix with her vitamins. She is doing much better and ulcers are at bay (from allergies).
Heres the website and best of luck..... http://www.horsetech.com/default.htm#top

[Melyni]

Hey Melyni, are we talking about basic probiotics here or something different? Most of my barn's on Mega-Mag except Mr. Cool who gets Select II. They're both pelleted with added probiotics but if the pelleting process kills the good stuff, should I look for other sources?

If it's pelleted none of the microbials are likely to have survived, you'll need another source. Yeast nitriles (prebiotics) such as Diamond V will survive pelleting.
So it depends on what they use.
MW

[Melyni]

It's probably not the bacteria per se but some part of the large scale production thereof. I don't know; it's just a theory. When I had him on fasttrack when he was taken high doses of doxy for Lymes he had an immune response (a lymphangitis flareup). Then I had him on fasttrack again a couple of years later for runny poop and he developed hives. Took him off all supps and the hives got better. Started him back on his multivitamin and they came back. So that's the current theory we are operating under. It could be wrong but it makes sense to me!

It might be the microbials or it might be something else. But obviously he is reacting to something. Allergies are usually to a protein, it might be a bacterial protein but then again it might be soy or alfalfa eg the base the they put the microbials (or the vit /min mix) into.

Take a look at the inactive ingredients as well, it there is something common to all the things he reacted to then it might be that.

Many many horse products are put into an alfalfa base to make them palatable to the horse.

MW

[TheOrangeOne]

you might try the optimum from www.theracelleq.com or platinum performance, www.platinumperformance.com I know optimum doesn't have added probios, and it's all food based if he is sensitive. Platinum is really good stuff, too.

[pintopiaffe]

PP definitely has added probiotics.

Can you get Blue Seal? Their Min-a-mix (not min-a-vite) doesn't have much in the way of filler. It is soy and alfalfa free. You have to be very specific if your feed store isn't really a 'farm' store, as they will try to sell you Min-a-vite.

INGREDIENTS
Monocalcium Phosphate, Calcium Carbonate,
Calcium Sulfate, Magnesium Oxide, Cane
Molasses, Potassium Chloride, Vegetable Oil,
Manganese Sulfate, Cobalt Carbonate,
Calcium Iodate, Zinc Sulfate, Ferrous Sulfate,
Copper Sulfate, Sodium Selenite, Vitamin A
Supplement, Vitamin D Supplement, Vitamin
E Supplement, Anise Oil.
GUARANTEED ANALYSIS
Calcium, Min. …………………… 18.0%
Calcium, Max. ..………………… 20.0%
Phosphorus, Min. ...................... 11.0%
Potassium, Min. …………….….. 1.0%
Magnesium, Min. ………..……… 3.8%
Copper, Min. ………………..…… 590 mg/lb (1300 ppm)
Selenium, Min. ........................... 14 mg/lb (30 ppm)
Zinc, Min. ………………………… 3180 mg/lb (7000 ppm)
Vitamin A, Min. ........................... 205,000 IU/lb

[deltawave]

How do you know the "vegetable oil" is not soybean oil? Do they guarantee these things or designate them "soy free"?

[TheOrangeOne]

How do you know the "vegetable oil" is not soybean oil? Do they guarantee these things or designate them "soy free"?

I thought it WAS soybean oil. Every time I look at the ingredients label on the crisco, that's what it says. Granted, I don't make donuts often, so it's been a while since I have closely examined crisco.

[Melyni]

How do you know the "vegetable oil" is not soybean oil? Do they guarantee these things or designate them "soy free"?

I don't think that the oil triggers the same sensitivity that the soy bean meal does. Of course it's always possible but it isn't usual.
LinPro is soy, and microbial free.
MW

[kcmel]

Thanks for all the suggestions. I will check them out. Yeah, I would rather avoid anything with "vegetable oil" just to be on the safe side. I don't think it has a good omega 6 to omega 3 ratio either (although its probably not in a significant amount to matter, really).

[deltawave]

Canola, flax and olive oil have lots of omega-3s. Not sure about this whole "ratio" business, personally, but that's another topic.