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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr. 23, 2008
    Posts
    192

    Smile Saddle Help PLEASE I AM DESPERATE

    Hello,

    I have a Hanoverian/TB that I need a dressage saddle for. The saddle company that I sent tracings to said that I need to GO CUSTOM because he has a decent (not huge/not small) wither and a wide back. Their Reasoning: Because of his back and shoulder he needs a wide, but because of his wither the wide tree will be to close to his wither. I dont want to believe this CUSTOM ONLY option because they may just be getting me to spend more money in these troubled times!

    Have any of you had horses like this (Decent Wither and Wide Back) that you have bought off-the-rack and have had no problems with, or some but modifications such as re-flocking corrected. What brands do you recommend also, and do you know of a saddle that accommodates the withered and wide backed horse? Let Me Know!



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jan. 12, 2008
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    986

    Default

    I have a TB that takes a med-wide to wide tree depending on the brand. She is a big-barreled girl, but she still has withers--she is a TB, after all! My dressage saddle is a Vega, and my jumping saddle is a Prestige.
    IMO a saddle company is going to do what they are supposed to do, and that is sell you one of their saddles. If they said you needed to go custom, obviously they don't have a saddle that fits your horses type. Perhaps you can try to find a saddlefitter unaffiliated with any brand (hard to find sometimes, but they are out there). That's what I ultimately ended up doing with my mare, and it made a world of difference to have professionally fitted saddles.



  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan. 4, 2000
    Posts
    24,408

    Default

    That's a very common type of back conformation and most tack shops have tons of used dressage saddles for sale. Make a wire form of your horse's back, measure it, take it with you to the tack shops. Pick out a couple saddles, take them home, try them out.



  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar. 4, 2004
    Location
    Oxford, PA
    Posts
    1,398

    Thumbs up Schleese Wave

    I too have a wide backed horse with a normal and not high wither. Wide trees accomodated her back, but sat downhill. A saddle that sat balanced front to back bridged. My mare has a slight dip in her back and her thoracic area (where her spine is attached to ribs and therefore more stable and can bear weight) is very short. After many saddles I ended up with a Schleese Wave. It is wide with wide panels and a wide gullet and the tree can be adjusted by a Schleese fitter so that the saddle is balanced and does not interfere with the shoulders. The tree points are swept away from the shoulder blades and the rear of the saddle has a gentle curve upwards so there is no pressure on the horse's lumbar area. As the horse changes, the saddle can be adjusted accordingly-no more growing out of saddles and buying new ones. I have had Roosli, Prestige (fishtailed), Ainsley, Custom Saddlery, Classic, Black Country, etc. and "wish I knew then what I know now". There are used Schleeses around on the internet as well as at Schleese. If you can't get a fitter in your area soon, you can get a "fit kit" from Schleese and send the saddle to them. They will fit it to your specs. I have a student that was measured at Dressage at Devon for a saddle. Schleese gave her the fit kit and she and I measured her horse following the instructions. The saddle arrived and fit like a glove. She is so happy with it that she is ordering another (saving her money). Yes, they are pricey, but IMHO worth the investment. The saddle can be adjusted infinitely and can be refit to another horse. Unfortunatly, even with saddle fitters working on my other saddles, they never fit my horse well.
    "You post all your drama on Facebook and get mad when people judge you? You're a special kind of stupid, aren't you?"



  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb. 15, 2007
    Location
    Midwest
    Posts
    706

    Default

    Hi there, welcome to the world of shopping for a wide, flat back with withers.

    My mare is a product of 2 Paint/Perch parents, and she's inherited that lovely Percheron neck and back. Her back is wide, flat and her barrel is quite round. However, she DOES have withers. They aren't exactly prominent, but they are definitely not mutton withers.

    I shopped and shopped...tried tons and tons of saddles. The good news is that with the higher end saddles, a saddle fitter can make adjustments in the flocking to better customize the fit to your horse.

    I was VERY lucky in finding a saddle that worked for my mare, off the rack. I ended up with a Courbette Charles de Kunffy Grand Prix that was basically brand new (had 5 rides in it) off of eBay for a fraction of the price. Because it was basically new, the flocking was able to adjust to her back over the next several months of riding in it.

    Oh, and I got the 36cm tree...fits great!

    Good luck!
    “Riding a horse is not a gentle hobby, to be picked up and laid down like a game of Solitaire. It is a grand passion.” ~Emerson



  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul. 19, 2001
    Posts
    8,542

    Default

    I posted a reply but don't know where it went.

    Anyway, contact a good used saddle place such as trumbull
    http://www.trumbullmtn.com/

    There are others such as bucks county, pelham, rick's heritage

    A good place will ask you to send a wither tracing / photos and will allow you at least a week to try the saddle. You could got that route before deciding if you need custom.

    I like dealing with these known companies better than with individuals because of risk factors involving fit , trials and returns.



  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun. 13, 2001
    Location
    usa
    Posts
    6,121

    Default

    Try an (old/cutback (at the withers) w/o kneeroles) passier, they seem to fit all horses more effectively (and they are so much cheaper).
    I.D.E.A. yoda



  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jul. 14, 2003
    Location
    MA
    Posts
    6,184

    Default

    You need a saddle with a wide tree with a deep gullet. They are out there. See if you can find a used Spirig. Spirigs usually have very deep gullets.

    If you can't find a Spirig, at least look for a a saddle with GUSSETTED panels. Panels with gussets have more room to reconfigure the flocking so that you can reflock them to be higher off the spine.
    "Against stupidity the gods themselves contend in vain" ~Friedrich Schiller



  9. #9
    Join Date
    Aug. 8, 2004
    Posts
    309

    Default

    My DWB has a broad broad back and a decent wither. No muttons, no shark fins. He fit a Black Country Eloquence X from Trumbull mtn. Was actually an EASY fitting, once I sent it to a place who knew what they are doing, and knows their products.



  10. #10
    Join Date
    Aug. 30, 2007
    Location
    Bradenton,FL
    Posts
    353

    Default Equestrian Imports

    Quote Originally Posted by 309016 View Post
    Hello,

    I have a Hanoverian/TB that I need a dressage saddle for. The saddle company that I sent tracings to said that I need to GO CUSTOM because he has a decent (not huge/not small) wither and a wide back. Their Reasoning: Because of his back and shoulder he needs a wide, but because of his wither the wide tree will be to close to his wither. I dont want to believe this CUSTOM ONLY option because they may just be getting me to spend more money in these troubled times!

    Have any of you had horses like this (Decent Wither and Wide Back) that you have bought off-the-rack and have had no problems with, or some but modifications such as re-flocking corrected. What brands do you recommend also, and do you know of a saddle that accommodates the withered and wide backed horse? Let Me Know!
    I don't know where you are, but Ann Forrest is by far one of the BEST saddle fitters in the world. She is in Sarasota FL, but she travels much, and she helps people nation and world wide. Her website is:

    www.equestrianimports.com

    She can send you her kit for a tracing, she will spend as much time as needed to help you. I have bought new and used saddles from her in the past, off the rack and she is a delight to work with everytime. She doesn't stop until you are satisfied. IMO, this is the type of person you need to work with.

    You may have to send a saddle back and forth a couple of times if you are not local, but totally worth it in the long run.

    She also travels so you may be able to hook up with her at a show or clinic.

    GOOD LUCK!!!
    Lori
    Fly Teddy Fly!
    Connemara's Rock!
    RIP Reilly Go Bragh



  11. #11
    laurence cohen Guest

    Default looknomore

    try calling paul at superior saddlery in california, one of the best saddlers in the country. also offers good advice.



  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jan. 3, 2006
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    781

    Default

    Passier GG - either new, or an older one that you can have the panels gussetted by a good saddler.

    Ours fit all our horses, which have a variety of shapes but which tend to being reasonanbly withered and with broad backs and wide-ish shoulders.



  13. #13
    Join Date
    Aug. 5, 2006
    Posts
    5,045

    Default

    What about the new Frank Baines Omni?



  14. #14
    Join Date
    Feb. 28, 2004
    Location
    Marshall, VA
    Posts
    1,159

    Default

    The Passiers panels won't be big enough. Advanced Saddle Fit's Detente line has two trees for horses like yours, with big, gorgeous panels that are felt-lined to help keep their shape. The Isis (http://www.consensus-shopping.com/ad...ente-isis.html) or the Cleo, if you're a petite person. My normal-wither-but-ridiculous-wide-under-the-stirrup-bars Westfalen mare goes brilliantly in the Albion SL Ultima, too.

    If you give us a location, someone out there might be able to recommend a saddle fitter in your area; you need someone qualified who doesn't just sell a specific brand of saddle to help you out.



  15. #15
    Join Date
    Aug. 12, 2005
    Location
    Spotsylvania, VA
    Posts
    173

    Default I second recommendation to contact Ann Forrest

    Ann knows her saddles and will work with you to find the saddle that fits both you and your horse. I have a 16.1H Appaloosa who has a broad wide back with withers (lots of TB in her pedigree!). She is very comfortable in an Albion Platinum - shoulders swing freely, willing to work over her back. The saddle also has a narrow twist which suits me. KarenRO



  16. #16
    Join Date
    Dec. 13, 1999
    Location
    Greensboro, NC
    Posts
    35,698

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by 309016 View Post
    Hello,

    I have a Hanoverian/TB that I need a dressage saddle for. The saddle company that I sent tracings to said that I need to GO CUSTOM because he has a decent (not huge/not small) wither and a wide back. Their Reasoning: Because of his back and shoulder he needs a wide, but because of his wither the wide tree will be to close to his wither. I dont want to believe this CUSTOM ONLY option because they may just be getting me to spend more money in these troubled times!
    Either he really doesn't know what he's talking about, or none of their saddles are appropriate for your horse so he's trying to get extra $$ by pushing custom.

    Check out www.balanceinternational.com - you won't regret it.

    Just how "wide" is his definition of wide? Did he give you a cm number? My WB gelding has "decent" (ie normal) withers and fits very nicely into a 36cm Prestige.
    ______________________________
    The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances. - ET



  17. #17
    Join Date
    Oct. 2, 2007
    Location
    Beyond the pale.
    Posts
    2,957

    Default

    I can bet who the saddle comany is that told you that you must go CUSTOM, because the same company insisted I do that. Close to $5K and a year later, their saddle still did not fit and they couldn't make it fit either. Happily I was able to sell the saddle to one of their other groupies with only about $1K loss. I ended up buying a series of old Keiffer Weins ( all have adjustable trees and cutback heads), which fit him "off the rack", and once he was finished growing up, I have been happy with a borrowed Passier Grand Gilbert and now a used Windsor Elite, also both off the rack ( although the Elite was adjusted a tich wider to fit his back and I've had the gussets restuffed to fit his back properly.)
    "The Threat of Internet Ignorance: ... we are witnessing the rise of an age of equestrian disinformation, one where a trusting public can graze on nonsense packaged to look like fact."-LRG-AF



  18. #18
    Join Date
    Feb. 23, 2005
    Location
    Spotsylvania, VA
    Posts
    12,996

    Default

    County saddles can be fitted to many horses
    I wasn't always a Smurf
    Penmerryl's Sophie RIDSH
    "I ain't as good as I once was but I'm as good once as I ever was"
    The ignore list is my friend. It takes 2 to argue.



  19. #19
    Join Date
    Oct. 15, 2002
    Location
    Saskatoon, SK, Canada
    Posts
    2,516

    Default

    Bates innova or isabell is worth a look.

    Albion may be able to go 'off the shelf' but a custom tree (on the platinum model) is only another $100 pounds ($200 ish dollars) it has longer tree points so flaring the ends can be good for this style of horse. . .
    Qualified Saddle Fitter with the S.M.S.
    www.ravenwoodaussies.com



  20. #20
    Join Date
    Mar. 15, 2007
    Location
    (throw dart at map) NC!
    Posts
    4,693

    Default

    I'm riding a Rubenstein/Inschallah daughter who has a very broad back and a bit of a sharkfin-like wither. She originally had a custom Hulsebos. Currently, she goes fine in a Bates Isabell with a narrow plate (fits OK but not Fabulous) and moreso in a $800 saddle we can't figure out who made that was purchased off of eBay. I jump her in a Wintec jump saddle with a gel pad. She seems fine in it.



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