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  1. #21
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    Default Curious??

    Can I ask why you would prefer Creme over Perlino?? I'm curious...
    Riding the winds of change

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  2. #22
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    Jan. 14, 2003
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    Probably due to the fact if you know you have a cremello, then you have a guarantee that when that cremello is bred to a chestnut you will always get a palomino foal. With perlino you would get either buckskin or palomino. Some people prefer palomino over buckskin (I do).
    Chris
    Ladybug Hill--Hunters and Ponies
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  3. #23
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    Dec. 4, 2007
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    Picturesque Hillsboro Virginia
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ladybug Hill View Post
    Probably due to the fact if you know you have a cremello, then you have a guarantee that when that cremello is bred to a chestnut you will always get a palomino foal. With perlino you would get either buckskin or palomino. Some people prefer palomino over buckskin (I do).
    Sorry just saw this...been busy catching up on yard work and house work after 2 new foals a day apart. Rhyadawn exactly what ladybughill said and if you have a cremello bred to a homoz bay you can guarantee a buckskin everytime too.
    Zillionair Cremello JC Thoroughbred & Pure White Gold All White Palomino Dual Thoroughbred & APHA
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  4. #24
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    Dec. 12, 2002
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    Default

    My guess is cremello but a perlino would be neat too. I have had both and one can not really tell until the DNA results are sent back.

    I have a question...Being a breeder myself, I would personally never breed a mare back to her sire or sires full brother. It just does not sit right with me. I know I have my opinions and others are entitled to their own so; What made you want to do that to create this foal? I would like to hear why you chose to breed this mare back to the same sire line and I sincerely hope it was for more than just the colour. The dam to this foal is Ebony Gold Orchid whose sire is Billionair? and the sire to this double dilute colt is Zillionair (full brother to Billionair)? So in an essence you bred the mare back to her sire.
    There is the argument of line breeding/in breeding that has been debated on here when a breeder crosses back say a 3rd and 4th generation. But to breed a mare back to her sire/uncle? Would love to hear others opinions...
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  5. #25
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    Jun. 15, 2008
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Faiths CremelloWB View Post

    I have a question...Being a breeder myself, I would personally never breed a mare back to her sire or sires full brother. It just does not sit right with me. I know I have my opinions and others are entitled to their own so; What made you want to do that to create this foal? I would like to hear why you chose to breed this mare back to the same sire line and I sincerely hope it was for more than just the colour. The dam to this foal is Ebony Gold Orchid whose sire is Billionair? and the sire to this double dilute colt is Zillionair (full brother to Billionair)? So in an essence you bred the mare back to her sire.

    There is the argument of line breeding/in breeding that has been debated on here when a breeder crosses back say a 3rd and 4th generation. But to breed a mare back to her sire/uncle? Would love to hear others opinions...

    Agreed. I would not consider this line breeding at all but rather inbreeding. I would also like to know the reasons for breeding this mare to what basically amounts to her uncle. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but it's just not right. I do hope that this colt will be gelded & not allowed to reproduce.



  6. #26
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    Feb. 10, 2006
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    Middle of Nowhere, take a right, FL
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    Default

    There's nothing wrong with inbreeding but you'd want to cross this foal out to another line.

    Someone said if it works it is linebreeding, if it doesn't it's inbreeding!

    Inbreeding concentrates genes, good or bad. It is another tool to use. You just don't want to KEEP on inbreeding, you have to know when to outcross too.
    Every mighty oak was once a nut that stood its ground.

    Proud Closet Canterer! Member Riders with Fibromyalgia clique.



  7. #27
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    Dec. 4, 2007
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    Picturesque Hillsboro Virginia
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    FaithcremelloWB/April I believe everyone can see right through this post for what it's hidden agenda is, being you also breed colored TBs.

    But to answer you question..I am very pleased with Ebony Gold Orchid and with Zillionair and what he has produced so far with many different mares. Some of your best horse/dogs/cats ect come out of breedings like this. Just look at some of the crabbat(spelling?) breeding in the arab world...and their pedigree is much more inbred and they have produced some very nice horses this way. This colt is one of the best colts I've produced and I can see that in him already!!! So I am thrilled to death with this cross and I would say the mare and the stallion have out produced themselves with this wonderful colt that is not only very correct, but very sweet and out going!!! Plus he won't have a club foot to pass onto his offspring. Thanks for asking!!!

    I have a question for you though...why do you have so many horses in your breeding program that have known club feet in their line? And I know your answer will be..."oh mine don't have club feet!" Well this is why surgery is done prior to 4 months of age so you won't know they have club feet..but when you breed them you are bound to see it come out, but again I doubt you would admit tha on a public bb. I for this reason stick to the bloodlines I have and don't cross over to the Glitter Please line at all and never will in my program. A strong foot is very important to me and I would not be able to do surgery an not disclose it to potiential clients, so I just don't even go there.

    April Best of luck with your breeding program!!!

    mare shopper welcome to the BB!!!
    Zillionair Cremello JC Thoroughbred & Pure White Gold All White Palomino Dual Thoroughbred & APHA
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  8. #28
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    Dec. 4, 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by summerhorse View Post
    There's nothing wrong with inbreeding but you'd want to cross this foal out to another line.

    Someone said if it works it is linebreeding, if it doesn't it's inbreeding!

    Inbreeding concentrates genes, good or bad. It is another tool to use. You just don't want to KEEP on inbreeding, you have to know when to outcross too.
    Summerhorse you are correct!!! I will breed him to TB mares not related to him in the future if I still have him!!!
    Zillionair Cremello JC Thoroughbred & Pure White Gold All White Palomino Dual Thoroughbred & APHA
    http://www.norsire.com
    Live Streaming Foaling Cam
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  9. #29
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    Jun. 27, 2003
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    6,030

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    Quote Originally Posted by Blonde Filly View Post
    FaithcremelloWB/April I believe everyone can see right through this post for what it's hidden agenda is, being you also breed colored TBs.

    But to answer you question..I am very pleased with Ebony Gold Orchid and with Zillionair and what he has produced so far with many different mares. Some of your best horse/dogs/cats ect come out of breedings like this. Just look at some of the crabbat(spelling?) breeding in the arab world...and their pedigree is much more inbred and they have produced some very nice horses this way. This colt is one of the best colts I've produced and I can see that in him already!!! So I am thrilled to death with this cross and I would say the mare and the stallion have out produced themselves with this wonderful colt that is not only very correct, but very sweet and out going!!! Plus he won't have a club foot to pass onto his offspring. Thanks for asking!!!

    I have a question for you though...why do you have so many horses in your breeding program that have known club feet in their line? And I know your answer will be..."oh mine don't have club feet!" Well this is why surgery is done prior to 4 months of age so you won't know they have club feet..but when you breed them you are bound to see it come out, but again I doubt you would admit tha on a public bb. I for this reason stick to the bloodlines I have and don't cross over to the Glitter Please line at all and never will in my program. A strong foot is very important to me and I would not be able to do surgery an not disclose it to potiential clients, so I just don't even go there.

    April Best of luck with your breeding program!!!

    mare shopper welcome to the BB!!!
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  10. #30
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    Default

    I was just posting the same thing, but deleted it.
    =*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*
    ~Jilltx~



  11. #31
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    Australia
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    Default

    However..Well done. This is one of the longest DD threads , before the lines were drawn in the sand!



  12. #32
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    Oct. 6, 2002
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    Philadelphia PA
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    Default

    Can we just agree that everyone is the best-est and most cool and has the first the best the only the supreme the magical -- and keep the fighting behind the scenes? I love reading about equine genetics but can't stand the non-stop-bitchfest that seems to accompany any discussion of colored thoroughbreds. Honestly! Is the snarking good for anyone's business?!
    ~Veronica
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  13. #33
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    Dec. 12, 2002
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    Default

    oh norsire. What can I say. I simply do not agree with crossing a uncle/sire back on it's own daughter. That is my opinion and I am entitled to it. It has nothing to do with me breeding coloured TB's or not. I am all for competition in the breeding business as I think it only raises the standards to which we all aspire; to have more breeders breeding Hanoverian, dutch, Swedish, thoroughbreds for sport etc... In the Arabs they may breed sire back to daughter and also in dogs... but who does it in the Thoroughbred world or even WB's? Anyone? If they did I would have to think that the sire/uncle had been competing at the top of his sport. I was hoping you would give some reasons why you chose to do it rather than get nasty and tell us they do it in Arabs and dogs.

    As for the club foot issue you raise... that has nothing to do with this topic or line/in breeding. It is throwing something else into the mix to try and steer away from the topic at hand. But since you brought it up... For the record none of my horses have club feet. We just had an open house last week and the public/other breeders came and saw all our foals, mares and stallions. I have one Glitter Please daughter and two Glitter Please grand-daughters who all passed the German Oldenburg mare inspection and were entered into main mare book. We welcome visitors anytime. Nothing more to say about that as it has been brought up and discussed at length already with the Glitter Please line.

    vxf111;snarkiness is not good for anyones business. I was sincerely wondering why Norsire chose to do this cross as I just do not get it and don't agree with it. I do like some of her horses. This is not a plot against her or her breeding... Simply this cross had be baffled.
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  14. #34
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    Aug. 2, 2005
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    Quote Originally Posted by Faiths CremelloWB View Post
    As for the club foot issue you raise... that has nothing to do with this topic or line/in breeding.
    Neither does your post. This thread was a simple Cremello or Perlino thread. And that was all until you decided to bring up other topics. If you are allowed to steer a thread off topic why cant norsire?

    Whether I agree with you or if I dont, please stop calling the kettle black.
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  15. #35
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    Default

    I answered the original question. I also had another question about the very horse this topic is about. That is quite relevant. If someone can say how cute it is can I not ask why she chose to do this cross?
    http://www.blazingcoloursfarm.com

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  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Faiths CremelloWB View Post
    My guess is cremello but a perlino would be neat too. I have had both and one can not really tell until the DNA results are sent back.

    I have a question...Being a breeder myself, I would personally never breed a mare back to her sire or sires full brother. It just does not sit right with me. I know I have my opinions and others are entitled to their own so; What made you want to do that to create this foal? I would like to hear why you chose to breed this mare back to the same sire line and I sincerely hope it was for more than just the colour. The dam to this foal is Ebony Gold Orchid whose sire is Billionair? and the sire to this double dilute colt is Zillionair (full brother to Billionair)? So in an essence you bred the mare back to her sire.
    There is the argument of line breeding/in breeding that has been debated on here when a breeder crosses back say a 3rd and 4th generation. But to breed a mare back to her sire/uncle? Would love to hear others opinions...

    I had this question too actually, just didn't have the "stuff" to ask it. (The line-breeding issue is one that I am researching and still sit on the fence about it) I'm glad it was answered in as much as it was
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  17. #37
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    Feb. 23, 1999
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    Just for the record, I live very near to where Glitter Please stood at stud in Texas. Saw him several times and have seen MANY MANY MANY of his offspring. As babies. Long before there could have been any corrective surgery done. Never saw a club foot on ANY of them. Seen many of them as adults. No club feet.
    Visit Sonesta Farms website at www.sonestafarms.com or our FaceBook page at www.facebook.com/sonestafarms. Also showing & breeding Cavalier King Charles Spaniels.



  18. #38
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    Sep. 29, 2006
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    Default

    Yes but with the Perlino if he is homozugous agouti and homozygous black then you could have a very special double dilute. Anyone know of any DD with this status?



  19. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by L&L View Post
    Yes but with the Perlino if he is homozugous agouti and homozygous black then you could have a very special double dilute. Anyone know of any DD with this status?
    I know of one or two, but none for the SH market.
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  20. #40
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    Jul. 29, 2005
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    I think one of the Red Fox farms tb sires is.. but I cant find it on their website.



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