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  1. #1
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    Default Breeders' Cup Expansion on Agenda

    The Breeders' Cup folks are talking about adding, among others races, a turf sprint for next year at Santa Anita. Also, a stayers race on the artificial dirt has been mentioned.

    What else should they consider?
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  2. #2
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    On a related note the The American Graded Stakes Committee is not upgrading the three new $1M BC races added and run this year on the day prior to the big day to being graded at all - let alone Grade 1 like the rest of the BC races.

    It seems rather odd although the circumstances seem blurred. I know (the BC) requested Grade 1 status back in 2006 for the 2007 races but pulled it back although its unclear if they did the same again for the 2008 race too:

    DRF 11-28-07

    According to the committee’s secretary, Andrew Schweigardt, the committee did not consider assigning Grade 1 status to the three new $1 million races that Breeders’ Cup ran this year at Monmouth Park. Breeders’ Cup officials had initially asked the committee to consider grades for the races but rescinded the request. The committee typically will not assign grades to any race that has not been run for three consecutive years.

    Officials for Breeders’ Cup could not be reached late on Thursday.
    As to the expansion - like it or not - I suspect the BC will add some racing in Asia into the schedule in the new few years. There is too much money and fan enthusiasm to ignore by making this just a US/Canada and trickle of Euros event.



  3. #3
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    I think they should definitely expand their card to add a few more races that appeal to the international crowd-- staying races, more grass races, etc. But we better somehow make it darn lucrative for the foreigners to ship in for those races, because there's no way in heck we could fill them with G1 caliber horses on our own.

    But otherwise, I personally feel we pretty much have the bases covered. In my opinion, a Breeder's Cup Champion horse should be able to adapt to one of the challenges placed in front of it. Not have a challenge specifically written for it. Too many more races and I feel like any Tom, Dick, or Harry could have a Breeder's Cup "champion" if they can pick the right race and pony up the money. I kind feel like it would devalue it's meaning a little if we add much more, you know?
    Don't fall for a girl who fell for a horse just to be number two in her world... ~EFO



  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Texarkana View Post
    Not have a challenge specifically written for it. Too many more races and I feel like any Tom, Dick, or Harry could have a Breeder's Cup "champion" if they can pick the right race and pony up the money.
    You mean you are against a $1M Breeders' Cup 5-furlong race written just for maidens 3yrs and older who were sold at Keeneland or Fasig-Tipton for at least $3 million? How unkind are you?

    The Green Monkey will be devistated to hear that!

    Agreed that the BC is close to having pretty much has everything covered. We have to be careful not to want the BC to become like the Calder Extreme day with bits of unique racing. Nor should they steal the thunder from the Claiming Championships. However it would be neat to have a successful and hard working runner like Golden Hare enjoy some of that glory that comes from winning on a stage like Breeders' Cup day.



  5. #5
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    What, no Grey Goose Breeders' Cup Gray Pride? Or how about a Wrong Way race...surely this would attract the foreigners. Expansion can go too far.

    I thought a stakes race had to be held for at least two consecutive years before it could be eligible to be graded (hence why the MassCap lost its graded stakes status)? 'Not sure where I heard that or if it's even right.

    Re: Golden Hare, that's why I like the Claiming Crown. Though the stage is smaller and the purses a mere fraction of the Breeders' Cup, at least it's a chance at a little bit of glory and recognition for hard knock iron horses.



  6. #6
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    What about the Dudley Do Right Cup for Canadian-breds? We could even make the jockeys ride backwards.
    "Gallop as if you were to die tomorrow, jump as if you were to live forever."



  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barnfairy View Post
    I thought a stakes race had to be held for at least two consecutive years before it could be eligible to be graded (hence why the MassCap lost its graded stakes status)? 'Not sure where I heard that or if it's even right.
    The DRF article indicated had to be held three-years, however the Breeders' Cup was granted special rights in the early 1980's for the first BC in '84 to be Grade 1 from the first running.

    What is nice about the Claiming Crown is the very strong committment by the Ellis Park owners to this bit of glory to "the little" and indeed the hard knockers of this sport.

    I'd hate to see the BC organizers skim off the cream of that claiming crown in some future addedl BC race.



  8. #8
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    A neat little resource (in pdf): BloodHorse all US graded stakes for 2008 (in pdf file)

    It includes the disatance for each race too

    I don't see the Mass Cap (as expected) having been restored to a graded level yet.



  9. #9
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    Howzabout chariot races?
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    Starts with an 'S,' ends with a 'T.' You figure it out.

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  10. #10
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    Oh chariot races! With hot men in small toga things! I think an egg on the spoon race or dollar bill race would be quite fun.
    "To my Gub... Godspeed my friend, till we meet again." 1996-2007.
    Runway (Sasha) 2009 Zweibrucker filly by Redwine.

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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by gubbyz View Post
    I think an egg on the spoon race or dollar bill race would be quite fun.
    Would that be a graded or ungraded race?



  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by olympicdreams04 View Post
    What about the Dudley Do Right Cup for Canadian-breds? We could even make the jockeys ride backwards.
    In all seriousness, I think a race for foreign-breds could be a good idea. It might encourage some more "imports" to enter, and maybe it would be a way to reduce some of the nomination complications posed to the non-USA bred horses. It would also give some justification to the "World" Championships title.

    The big questions would be what type of race would be most likely to fill with top notch horses. Dirt or grass? Sprint? Classic distance? Something longer? I would think a longer race on the grass would be most successful, but who knows...

    The rest of the these suggestions are awesome. I'm all for G1 $1 million egg-on-spoon.
    Don't fall for a girl who fell for a horse just to be number two in her world... ~EFO



  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Texarkana View Post
    In all seriousness, I think a race for foreign-breds could be a good idea. It might encourage some more "imports" to enter, and maybe it would be a way to reduce some of the nomination complications posed to the non-USA bred horses. It would also give some justification to the "World" Championships title.

    The big questions would be what type of race would be most likely to fill with top notch horses. Dirt or grass? Sprint? Classic distance? Something longer? I would think a longer race on the grass would be most successful, but who knows...
    I don't think restricted races, other than 2yo and F/M races, should be a part of the BC.
    One thing that is a detterent to real foreign participation, outside of Euro horses, is the prohibitive supplimental fee for non nominated horses. Not so much a problem for European horses as most are nominated through the reciprocal agreement with the EBF, but it scares off many AUS/NZ, Jap, HK and S American horses. Maybe having a certain number of invitaional spots set aside, or letting the winners of certain foreign races get a spot.
    Arguably the best Turf horses in the world at the moment are in the far east.... Admire Moon, Pop Rock, Viva Pataca, Vengance of Rain, Delta Blues.

    Still think the 7 furlong Turf courses, 2 tight turns and a short stretch, don't help either. Looking at the images on the Googe Maps thread gives a good illustration of rare that is outside of the US.



  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Texarkana View Post
    In all seriousness, I think a race for foreign-breds could be a good idea. It might encourage some more "imports" to enter, and maybe it would be a way to reduce some of the nomination complications posed to the non-USA bred horses. It would also give some justification to the "World" Championships title.

    The big questions would be what type of race would be most likely to fill with top notch horses. Dirt or grass? Sprint? Classic distance? Something longer? I would think a longer race on the grass would be most successful, but who knows...
    It seems to me that a long turf race would be most appropriate, but as we can see so clearly in the Google map thread, I think it would be difficult to adequately accommodate this on a continual basis in the US.

    At the risk of sounding like an isolationist, sometimes I think it would just make more sense to drop the whole "world championships" claim -- who are we kidding here? Wasn't the Breeders' Cup founded along the lines of encouraging (American) horses to keep running beyond the Triple Crown races and other early classics? (We all see how well that's working! )

    Quote Originally Posted by Texarkana View Post
    The rest of the these suggestions are awesome. I'm all for G1 $1 million egg-on-spoon.
    Shouldn't the egg & spoon be a GAA?
    Last edited by Barnfairy; Dec. 3, 2007 at 12:38 PM.



  15. #15
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    It's official!

    Three Races Added to Breeders' Cup for '08
    NTRA.com
    12/10/07

    The new Breeders’ Cup World Championships races, which will be run on Breeders’ Cup Friday, are:


    $1 million Breeders’ Cup Turf Sprint; 3-year-olds and up; 6 ½ furlongs (turf)

    $1 million Breeders’ Cup Juvenile Fillies Turf; 2-year-old fillies; 1 mile (turf)

    $500,000 Breeders’ Cup Dirt Marathon; 3-year-olds and up; 1 ½ miles
    Sadly, it looks like they didn't consider the GAA $1 million Egg-On-Spoon sponsored by the USDA. Their loss...
    Don't fall for a girl who fell for a horse just to be number two in her world... ~EFO



  16. #16
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    $500,000 Breeders’ Cup Dirt Marathon; 3-year-olds and up; 1 ½ miles
    I can only imagine the great iron horse Exterminator looking down from above with hearty laugh at the almost offensive use of the word marathon - come on!

    Can't they at least try for 1 7/8 if not 2 miles? IMHO 1 1/2 miles is what the BCC should be at as the Jockey Club Cup once was.



  17. #17
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    Oh, I agree, it's pretty silly when the "marathon" is only 2 furlongs longer than the classic. Just proving how narrow our view of racing has become...

    Even funnier, there's a bigger purse for 2 year old fillies on the grass. I'm sorry, but that division is just over the top for me. You can't convince me there's enough 2 y/o turf-running females competitive at a G1 level to justify that race. If you have a filly that's really that good, she can run with the boys. But that's just my opinion.

    And I will never understand our infatuation with sprinting on the grass...
    Don't fall for a girl who fell for a horse just to be number two in her world... ~EFO



  18. #18
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    1½m doesn't seem like much of a marathon really, but I suppose they'll have no one show up if they make it a real distance race. Thing is it may end being a 1 5/8m race by default, as most tracks outside of Belmont would have difficulty carding a 1½m race due to configuration.
    I say go to a 1¾m and run it out of the 6f chute, just about any track can card that distance.



  19. #19
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    With the 2008 Breeders' Cup being held at Santa Anita (2009 is still an unknown; I suspect Arlington Park will try for it) they can easily accomodate the longer distance (1 1/2 mi) and one can assume their synthetic track will perform just fine. With some good weather the BC officials might just have one banner wagering and attendance numbers for next year's event.



  20. #20
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    I think a lot will be said about the use of the word "marathon" in the next year. We all seem to be of the same opinion here. But how many opportinities are there out there for horses to race at this distance? And could this possibly have a negative effect on the Classic like the new mile could? I suppose the $1 million and $5 million might prevent that.

    I saw the turf dash here in PA on their big day and I will admit, it was pretty exciting to watch. Not saying I am for it, but it was fun.



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