I was just using Icewater as an example , not that you should have used him.......I just picked a name.
Merry Christmas !
Merry Christmas !
How ironic (and hilarious) that you sought out advice from bayhawk, and then when he gives it to you, (as bluntly as he always does), you come up with some defensive rebuttal. Those are some interesting facts!
Merry Christmas indeed.
Please re-read my posts- I did not seek out Reece's advice regarding the QdR breeding but rather mentioned it because he brought QdR up-somewhat out of context, in fact. Reece and I have no quarrel with one another, now or at any other time. The subject of this thread is Diarado, a stallion that we have never used, do not intend to use in the near future as we have no mares that would suit him and one with regard to which we have noted what has been said.
This is the second time that, out of nowhere, you have targeted our posts as being boastful . We try to describe what we are doing and make constructive contributions when we can. We learn from our fellow COTHers in the main---all of them in fact when they are constuctive.
I fail to understand how our posts give such offense to you!
Perhaps the Chistmas spirit has reached you in California this morning and the elegance of Reece's expression in his most recent post is something that you can now share.
December 22, 2011
Could we please enjoy Christmas and/or get back to the subject of this thread which is the stallion Diarado and his get which will be seen at an event in Germany soon?
No dog in this fight since we don’t know any of you, except here on this board… but it seems you are exemplary successful breeders with a credible business model. I don’t really see how mentioning what you are doing is something you should have to apologize for. As for “hype" or boasting … pleeeeeze. You write about what you are doing, and it just so happens that what you are doing is exciting, informed, inspired and successful. That may come across as boasting to some who fall short of the mark, but so what? Are we only allowed to post about mediocrity?
If people want parity, and the right to post the same kinds of “hype” all they have to do is step up. It’s simply a matter of intense effort, a butt load of money and unfathomable hours of work and commitment.
As for Diarado and the video posted of the three young prospects… I thought they strongly resembled their sire. Diarado is an extra-ordinary stallion. I think the question for breeder is, “Is he the right stallion for your mare and your breeding goals.” For us, at this point we feel the answer is no, but I must admit we are curious to see what he is producing.
Personally, while I think Cartier has a nice sentiment here, I am with Zlotych. I think one should allow ones accomplishments to speak for themself, rather than writing lengthy, flowery, self-important and self-promotional posts at every possible opportunity. But obviously I am one of the few people not drinking the Kool Aid. SHF has some nice mares and has produced a few nice foals, but until some of those horses are having success in the ring, as Reece said, it is still just a foal.
In this example, I doubt Reece brought up QDR with SHF in mind. Not to speak for him, but I took it as a general example, not a shout out to the ever-important "custom foal contract with a European GP competitor". But all of a sudden the thread has nothing to do with the OP and everything to do with SHF's foal contract, and their all important due diligence etc etc. I imagine that if the client, GP competitor or local Joe, has the money in hand, they can breed the mare to whomever they want, and doubt they needed or asked for SHF's nod, and rightly so. Money talks and breeding is hard enough. A custom breeding would be just that, customized by the client, not the owner of the mare. Congrats on having a nice mare, many people do.
There are countless breeders on here with vast amounts more success and experience who allow their offspring to speak for themselves. I prefer that tactic, and find the excessive, shameless bragging to be most off-putting. All one has to do to find an example is read the thread about upcoming foals that was on here a while ago. Every breeder, large and small, famous and obscure, simply lists their choices, or gives a short blurb/description. Every breeder except SHF who goes on and on about the upcoming foals and how amazing they will surely be. Pretty please tone it down. It is almost nauseating at this point. And I am certain there will be feigned astonishment. Sigh. Why do I bother.
Apologies to the OP. I think Diarado is a lovely horse, but obviously may not produce that, necessarily. Will be interesting to continue to see what the future holds for his offspring.
And in general, you would be taken more seriously if you were a known entity. Nothing wrong with being anonymous, but you have to admit, it’s easy to throw rocks from the shadows.
For what it’s worth, most every post / thread on this forum is annoying to others at one point in time or another. (I could PM you my Top Ten List :cool:) If we all spent our time posting that we find so-and-so to be a pompous bag of gas, the forum would come crashing to a halt. You might consider taking a deep breath, and then letting this whole thing go for now. Go out and do something fun.
Btw, Al, I love the pseudonym, but you must know that evolution selects against altruism. :(
The top breeders in the world and most of the top breeders in the US (producing top competition horses) do not post on this forum.
I don't get it, I didn't even see bragging in Sakura Hill's post. Excitement, yes. However, I see a hell of a lot of bragging (most of it with nothing regarding competition results to back it up) on this forum from others.
As far as the original post, I liked the first and 3rd Diarado horses on the list.
We have quoted what we wrote regarding our custom foal option with Julia. I think that it speaks for itself as far as cicumspection is concerned. I might add that Julia's is not the only custom foal contract we have for 2013 and equal due diligence is always done when matching mare and sire in a way that will satisfy the client, the mare and us. We breed for the future, not the present and are always careful that anything that we produce will do honor to our breeding program. This is how we build our program and attract the kind of client we seek to serve.
Cartier, thank you for coming to our defense.Thanks to grayarabpony as well! It is appreciated. No, we do not know Zlotych or ALTruistic as it happens. They have written so little that until these attacks began, they have not been on our radar.
May I make this crystal clear- there is no fight between Reece and us. We frequently ask him for advice through more private channels and value that advice. There are others that we consult as well. Constructive input is essential throughout the breeding process! From our perspective,there ARE no dogs in this fight, simply two people who dislike our style in writing and, possibly, our breeding program. We have not critiqued Diarado.
Good grief, folks! I endorse Cartier's suggestion- go out and have some fun!
Whoa....just came back and found a train wreck again.
as Sakura said.....no problems here. I was just simply pointing out that all the hype surrounding this custom foal is just hot air in regards to the future. I hope it does , but chances are it won't turn out, as these breedings rarely do. You can look right now at the top ranked horses in the world and I can't see any that are from top of the sport mothers.
This is where I brought in my point about selecting the right stallion for the mare instead of the big name. Maybe the big name is the right selection ?
In all fairness to both sides , I can see where some of Michele's posts could be construed as boastful and bragging as some of the comments like "the ink drying on the contract" and such is a little dramatic in my opinion but as I stated above , you have every right just as other folks have every right not to like it.
Lets all breed good horses and carry on !
Perhaps the top of the sport mares are not always the mothers of the top of the sports horses (I suspect for more reasons that just ability to transmit as the top mares are frequently not used for breeding until aged), but when they are it can certainly created a dynasty--one of my old time favorites Retina.
Just looking at some of the Holsteiners at the top right now.......Casall , Corradina , Carlina , Carlo , Lambrasco , Cedric , Livello etc. Not from top performing mothers.
Same with sires......Carthago , Lord , Caretino , Capitol , Contender , Cassini , Corrado , Calido , Landgraf etc. Not from top performing mothers either.
Point is.......breeding and selection are far more productive.
I had a recent customer that only wanted a filly or mare from a performing mother. Very hard order to fill seeing as 80 % of the best producing mares have never seen the show ring. Nothing wrong with wanting something from a performing mother but you limit yourself this way with a very small window of opportunity. The best producing mares are overwhelmingly not performing mares.
I don't know many poor competitors turning into exceptional producing mares.
The beauty of breeding and selection is that there is no absolute answers.
Whoa! Baby Whoa! I think some people might need to have an extra glass of that special eggnog and chill out. Why do these threads have to end up being a cat, dog or whatever fight?
As for Diarado, I am not aware of any stallion that is right for every mare and every breeding program. If there is one out there please let me know. :) Diarado is a young breeding stallion and is not going to be on every breeders short list. He is however on mine. I like his 3 sons that will be presented and soon enough we will see what their fate will be. Diarado has had some huge shoes to fill ever since he was presented for his licensing. Tons of hype, sold for tons of money. I hope everyone had a Merry Christmas and will have a Happy New Year with lots of exciting new foals:):)
I've been fortunate to meet Diarado in the flesh and liked him very much indeed. He has tons of presence and very good conformation. He caught my eye even when I did not know who he was.
Added to that the people who look after him and who ride him all really like him. He's a nice horse in the stable and a nice horse to ride. He's got two very good paces, walk and canter and an OK pace which is trot. I liked his paces enough to consider using him as a dressage sire.
He is smaller, about 16:1. He is on the light side of middleweight. He has recently had an injury, I don't know what it was but he is sound again now.
He is a sire I'd seriously think about using because he is nicely put together and a nice person. He appears to pass both those things on so even if you don't get his incredible jump you should still get a lovely horse.
I also don't know any poor performing mares that turned into exceptional producers but I do know many mares in Holstein that had poor jumping scores who produce incredible jump in their offspring. You have to know your motherline.