PDA

View Full Version : Event Riders......Where is the credit????



3dayeventing
Aug. 9, 2006, 12:50 PM
At my daughters local "A" Hunter/Jumper barn they look down on me as an event rider. Almost like we are "lower class." I feel we deserve more credit in the equestrian world! After all we compete in three sports over a few days on one horse. What are your thoughts? Has anyone else gone through this?

InVA
Aug. 9, 2006, 12:55 PM
Chalk it up to the snootiness of equestrian sports. Not so much in eventing with the REAL eventers, though, thank goodness.

Frankly I'd like to see an A rated WHatever try to take my horse around a preliminary course...at preliminary speed, and not come back white as a ghost (if they come back at all) Wouldn't do that to my horse though!

just my opinion

Ja Da Dee
Aug. 9, 2006, 01:58 PM
I just quietly smile and nod while enjoying my $2500 horse when people walk around with their noses stuck up in the air.

Hilary
Aug. 9, 2006, 02:07 PM
I have a couple of friends from the "other" side, and have to say they are not all snooty, and while I can ride a preliminary XC course, I can't ride a 3' course like a hunter. It's actually kind of hard to get 8 perfect fences with perfect striding between each.

My friends who like hunters like the perfectionist aspects of it - "how perfect can I be this time". They don't like going fast. I would rather go fast, and perfectionism isn't my strong suit.

Lisa Cook
Aug. 9, 2006, 02:13 PM
Well, eventing dressage quality has historically lagged behind pure dressage standards. And the show jumping phase of eventing typically features courses that are less technical than the show jumping courses set at A shows. So it is understandable that some people who specialize in dressage or jumpers may think of eventers as "jack of all trades, master of none".

Of course WE know that coaxing a horse with xc on its mind through a dressage test is difficult. And show jumping a tired horse who has already done dressage and xc is not the same as show jumping at a jumper show. But those little important details probably escape a lot of non-eventers.

For what it is worth, I've ridden with a couple h/j trainers on my jumping, and I've never felt like I've been looked down upon because I event, and I've never been made to feel unwelcome in any way. The only time I can even think of an occasion where my eventing was even brought up is when I fell off at a hunter clinic. There was a moment of silence, and then the trainer announced: "She's OK! She's an eventer! They're tough!". :lol:

InVA
Aug. 9, 2006, 02:14 PM
I guess its each person's point of view. I have had sj and xc rounds that have been "perfect". I find it less interesting (in my point of view) to ask my self "how perfect will I be today" than it is to ask myself, " how many bruises will I have today?" My event horse can go like a hunter, too ...zzzzzzzzzz....

bornfreenowexpensive
Aug. 9, 2006, 02:21 PM
At my daughters local "A" Hunter/Jumper barn they look down on me as an event rider. Almost like we are "lower class." I feel we deserve more credit in the equestrian world! After all we compete in three sports over a few days on one horse. What are your thoughts? Has anyone else gone through this?

Those are not real horse people then....I worked with one of the best jumper trainers in the world and he didn't look down on event riders. He looked down on bad riders regardless of whether they were a jumper, hunter or eventer. One of the problems comes when riders, particularly young riders are not exposed to good horsepeople and not exposed to many different disciplines. Things can be learned from them all. At one time, many of the top Jumpers rode chase horses or evented and many eventers rode jumpers (many still do) etc.....those good horsepeople recognized the things they could learn from other disciplines and how to use those things to improve themselves and their horses in their chosen specialty. But riders who have only done or seen one type of riding can get snotty and closed minded....those are also often riders who do not grow as riders and trainers and do not become successful (at a high level) in their discipline.

RISHlover
Aug. 9, 2006, 02:22 PM
For the OP's snooty h/j riders - go find either Thrills and Spills 2 or I think there is a Mark Todd eventing video - with his infamous Burghley or Badminton one stirrup ride - IMO that is certainly one of the most fantastic feats of riding ever seen - that and Bruce Davidson at Rolex a few years back - sit those H/J'ers down to watch - if that doesn't garner some respect, nothing will. :yes: :yes:

lstevenson
Aug. 9, 2006, 02:24 PM
At my daughters local "A" Hunter/Jumper barn they look down on me as an event rider. Almost like we are "lower class." I feel we deserve more credit in the equestrian world! After all we compete in three sports over a few days on one horse. What are your thoughts? Has anyone else gone through this?


:lol: I would bet these are not jumper riders (who are usually very good horseman), but hunter riders that have this attitude. To me the a true test of a horseman is not how pretty they can look on a horse that goes perfectly, but to have them take a green horse out in an open field and train it.

A long time ago, I used to teach a top rated A show hunter rider (she wanted to learn some dressage) , and she admitted to me that she was afraid of going down hills. Walk was ok, trot downhill terrified her, and canter was out of the question. She also admitted that with her and everyone she knew, if a horse gave them trouble or was hard to train they would sell it to an eventer. :lol: That says something right there!

pinkngreen
Aug. 9, 2006, 02:26 PM
Beleive it or not we get more credit than we used to! I've had many hunters and dressage riders give me respect for being an eventer. Our sport is better understood by the other disciplines now than it was 10 to 15 yrs ago.

To be honest us eventers tend to look down on the other disciplines as well. We say hunter/jumpers are just too scared to event and dressage riders are scared to jump. Though I am in awe of a hunter rider that can jump around a 4ft course like it's a sunday stroll or a dressage rider that can make the hottest horse look relaxed and dreamy to ride. Though I personally respect a good rider from both of the other disciplines I am biased towards eventers. I still think eventers are the best. After all we are more well rounded right? If not we should be, it's not all about the cross-country. I like having to try to be the best at three types of riding. I feel like I could easily switch over to hunters or dressage and not have to do much catching up to fit in.

InVA
Aug. 9, 2006, 02:39 PM
[QUOTE=lstevenson]:lol:\. To me the a true test of a horseman is not how pretty they can look on a horse that goes perfectly, but to have them take a green horse out in an open field and train it.

RIGHT ON!

Speaking of going downhill. I wonder if, at Loudoun this fall, they'll have that downhill to a roundbale on the P and I xc course!? YIPES! ;-)

lstevenson
Aug. 9, 2006, 02:51 PM
[quote=lstevenson]:lol:\. To me the a true test of a horseman is not how pretty they can look on a horse that goes perfectly, but to have them take a green horse out in an open field and train it.

RIGHT ON!

Speaking of going downhill. I wonder if, at Loudoun this fall, they'll have that downhill to a roundbale on the P and I xc course!? YIPES! ;-)


Oh, yes that's usually always on the course. Don't worry! It's not as bad as it looks. It rides great! Because of the drop the horses usually do lower themselves and rub the roundbale. It makes it feel not very big at all. ;)

RISHlover
Aug. 9, 2006, 02:56 PM
Seemed to be years ago that horses not capable of doing hunters or jumpers then became eventers - I don't think this is true anymore at all. H/J have the potential of earning prize money at competitions, seldom to event riders have an opportunity to win prize money - which make the value of H/J greater.

Over the years I for one have become more interested in other disciplines and found it amazing how for instance if you watch Reining you can see the basics of dressage..

I will say the one thing eventers have over H/J is that trainers cannot school (i.e. ride) your horse or show your horse at the competition grounds, you or your trainer cannot say to the starter - Oh I have to wait for my trainer, nor does event management offer to hold up x-country and dressage because of "trainer conflict" at show jumping..

InVA
Aug. 9, 2006, 03:33 PM
[quote=InVA]


Oh, yes that's usually always on the course. Don't worry! It's not as bad as it looks. It rides great! Because of the drop the horses usually do lower themselves and rub the roundbale. It makes it feel not very big at all. ;)

I know! I jumped it once - the other time I ran P there they took it off the course. My horse came down the hill to it and started backing off as if to say, "er...mommy you don't really mean to be aiming at that roundbale do you?" and he pretty much landed at the bottom of the hill with me literally at the buckle! ha! it does jump well you just have to keep your eyes up! HA!

retreadeventer
Aug. 9, 2006, 04:02 PM
Do the following:
1. Find the issue of the Practical Horseman magazine where George Morris gushes all about how great event riders are. (I think it was May? - not sure).
2. Make a big copy - BIG copy - of the comments in the equitation clinic about how great eventers are, and get it poster size at your Walmart store copy machine.
3. Tape it up on the tack room door of the barn!
There! That ought to work!

NeverTime
Aug. 9, 2006, 04:18 PM
Do we really need another "us vs. them" thread?
How is the original post -- or many of these answers -- any different from the looking-down-their-noses that the H/J folks do? Every sport takes skills, and every sport requires actually *doing* it to really appreciate what skill is involved.

InVA
Aug. 9, 2006, 04:49 PM
NeverTime, If I didn't have first had experience with rude, stuck up hunter/jumper/whatever the heck they do riders I would agree with you. My horses live on a very large farm where there are race horses, some hunter riders, and a handful of event riders. We all rent out our respective barns. I also live on the property. the farm is in a small town. The hunter riders NEVER smile, wave, say hello, how are you or go to hell (I guess that part is big of them) . I was once snidely told, "yeah, we can tell you event." ( I guess because of my helmet.)
My horse was referred to as a common eventer and he's one of the nicest event horses in the area (if I do say so myself, I'm so stuck up eh?) ;-)
We all have bad days but their behavior is consistent and it includes the trainers and their clients. I have to laugh though when the clients ride up to the ring with the trainers in a golf cart and their grooms lead the horses on foot. And still they find nothing to smile about? HA! Now THAT'S horsemanship!

EventingJ
Aug. 9, 2006, 05:25 PM
Back in the dark ages - when black hunt coats were "in" in hunters, I worked for a trainer that always had a string of new ottbs every year. I would ride one or two and show them at his stupid h/j shows, and he allowed me to do jumpers and events with some of the not-so-hunter horses.

Those Hunter Princesses used to make fun of me, look down at me - mostly because I had no money :-p and I could ride their horses better then they could at half their age. I was told I had horrible equitation (yes, well when I was riding half broken horses I was being effective and not sitting pretty!) boy was it so much fun to kick their @sses in eq classes, esp because I was always riding green horses and theres were seasoned h/j horses.

When picking out a barn when I finally was able to afford my own horse I specifically picked out a small, laid back area with a nice indoor and a nice outdoor and lots of turnout. I love everyone at the barn, I'm pretty sure no one talks about me behind my back (honestly I couldn't care less), certainly no one says to my face how ugly i ride!

3dayeventing
Aug. 9, 2006, 06:17 PM
I have to admit we do get more credit now, however when I show up to my daughters barn they are only nice as they dont want to bite the hand that feeds them. My daughters father (ex-husband) is very much into the "look at me" scene!

When she rides with me she tacks her own horse etc. When she goes to my shows she helps groom, water etc. When she goes to H/J show's she just shows up dressed and ready to go, the grooms take care of everything. It's tough to teach kids balance these days.

I was watching one of her lessons the other day and I could'nt help but to over hear a few teens talking about how wealthly they were and how they lived in the top 1% of the highest income earners in the US.

I guess maybe things are different now days. Who knows. I will do my best to teach her good values and morals. ;)

3dayeventing
Aug. 9, 2006, 06:20 PM
InVA,

That is so funny:lol: I love it. I would love to watch them attempt to get my guy around any course! Like you said though, I wouldnt do that to my horse!:no: They are just showing their own personal insecuitys in my opinion! Who is really the one that is happy?:eek:

NeverTime, If I didn't have first had experience with rude, stuck up hunter/jumper/whatever the heck they do riders I would agree with you. My horses live on a very large farm where there are race horses, some hunter riders, and a handful of event riders. We all rent out our respective barns. I also live on the property. the farm is in a small town. The hunter riders NEVER smile, wave, say hello, how are you or go to hell (I guess that part is big of them) . I was once snidely told, "yeah, we can tell you event." ( I guess because of my helmet.)
My horse was referred to as a common eventer and he's one of the nicest event horses in the area (if I do say so myself, I'm so stuck up eh?) ;-)
We all have bad days but their behavior is consistent and it includes the trainers and their clients. I have to laugh though when the clients ride up to the ring with the trainers in a golf cart and their grooms lead the horses on foot. And still they find nothing to smile about? HA! Now THAT'S horsemanship!

monkeyeventer
Aug. 10, 2006, 12:27 AM
I have many of the same experiences with the hunter/jumper world (i know this is a steriotype). I also have plenty of friends that are h/j, and think that it takes guts! The next time someone puts you down for being a three day eventer, just look at them in the eye, and tell them, "What can i say, we are the rebels of the equestrian world"! As they say, 3 days, 3 ways!

bornfreenowexpensive
Aug. 10, 2006, 12:33 AM
I have to admit we do get more credit now, however when I show up to my daughters barn they are only nice as they dont want to bite the hand that feeds them. My daughters father (ex-husband) is very much into the "look at me" scene!

When she rides with me she tacks her own horse etc. When she goes to my shows she helps groom, water etc. When she goes to H/J show's she just shows up dressed and ready to go, the grooms take care of everything. It's tough to teach kids balance these days.

I was watching one of her lessons the other day and I could'nt help but to over hear a few teens talking about how wealthly they were and how they lived in the top 1% of the highest income earners in the US.

I guess maybe things are different now days. Who knows. I will do my best to teach her good values and morals. ;)

I suspect that those girls who are looking down on you are just run of the mill snobs (and spoiled) and it has NOTHING to do with them being h/j riders...they would be that way regardless of the horses. Sad.

RISHlover
Aug. 10, 2006, 12:58 AM
I suspect that those girls who are looking down on you are just run of the mill snobs (and spoiled) and it has NOTHING to do with them being h/j riders...they would be that way regardless of the horses. Sad.

you are so right...

magnolia73
Aug. 10, 2006, 10:02 AM
Pot, meet kettle.

If you want respect, you need to give it too. Comments like HJ would be scared to jump your horse around prelim or a HJ could not ride a green horse are just as wrong as eventers are yahoos. HJ has its own set of challenges, as does dressage. I think in terms of sheer guts, eventers come out on top. But hunters have consistensy, focus, accuracy and flow. Neither discipline is harder than the other. And you can buy wins in both arenas these days....

InVA
Aug. 10, 2006, 11:42 AM
HA! You gotta laugh! my friend Cinnabar (on this forum) was visiting with her horse for the MD horse trials and we hacked past a h/j/? girl in the ring... we both practically yelled. "hello! good morning!" really loud and with big smiles on our faces! Had we not done that the girl wouldn't have acknowledged us riding by... who are these kids parents? THey have NO manners! Sadly, its the adults too!

I agree with whoever said " PHHFFFFTTT!!!!" That's what I say!

Lisa Cook
Aug. 10, 2006, 11:57 AM
HA! You gotta laugh! my friend Cinnabar (on this forum) was visiting with her horse for the MD horse trials and we hacked past a h/j/? girl in the ring... we both practically yelled. "hello! good morning!" really loud and with big smiles on our faces! Had we not done that the girl wouldn't have acknowledged us riding by... who are these kids parents? THey have NO manners! Sadly, its the adults too!

Hey, that might be a little harsh. When I ride, I can be concentrating so much on what I'm doing, I'd never notice anyone going by the ring, even it was my best friend.

At the barn where I board, cars park up against the ring. It is not unusual for me to get done with what I'm working on, look up at the parked cars, and realize with surprise that a whole bunch of boarders have arrived while I was riding right in front on them. Hopefully they can recognize that I was deep in concentration and not being a total snob who was raised by neanderthals.

InVA
Aug. 10, 2006, 12:04 PM
When I ride, I can be concentrating so much on what I'm doing, I'd never notice anyone going by the ring, even it was my best friend.

.

Point taken. but in my cases they weren't riding...they're either hacking by or just walking in the ring on a loose rein waiting for the golf cart/trainer to arrive. They'll look AWAY rather than engage you and say hello. it's hilarious.

NeverTime
Aug. 10, 2006, 12:25 PM
HA! You gotta laugh! my friend Cinnabar (on this forum) was visiting with her horse for the MD horse trials and we hacked past a h/j/? girl in the ring... we both practically yelled. "hello! good morning!" really loud and with big smiles on our faces! Had we not done that the girl wouldn't have acknowledged us riding by... who are these kids parents? THey have NO manners! Sadly, its the adults too!

I agree with whoever said " PHHFFFFTTT!!!!" That's what I say!

Sadly, I can think of PLENTY of event riders -- some of whom were competing at the MD horse trials, undoubtedly -- who would do the same thing. Being friendly and personable are not prerequisites to choosing eventing as your discipline. Being a snob is not a prerequisite to showing H/J. Venture over to their BB and you'll find the same kind of inspiring stories of working one's way up in the sport that you find here.

And comments about how H/J riders can't groom, can't ride, can't appreciate how wonderful you are because YOU'VE chosen the higher ground of eventing... that's just silly. Sure, there might be people like that (in ANY discipline), but there also are plenty of H/J riders out there who are FAR better technicians over fences than the average event rider and who most of us could stand to learn a lot from. We've got to split our time three ways, between dressage, jumping and conditioning; they can spend a lot more time developing an eye and an understanding of how to get a horse to a fence perfectly -- skills my horse really wishes I had! By assuming they don't know what they're doing because they ride H/J, well who's being the snob in that case?!?

You know what they say about assumptions -- they make an a$$ out of U and other event riders!

InVA
Aug. 10, 2006, 12:39 PM
I never said they couldn't groom. PHHFFT!

Perfect Pony
Aug. 10, 2006, 12:40 PM
I'm sorry but "they couldn't get on my horse and jump him around" is NOT a good reasoning for your cause, quite the opposite. I am proud of my riding and my horse when ANYONE could get on him and ride him around a course...

People around here (in NorCal) tend to look down on event riders because so many of them are so bad and have absolutely NO BUSINESS out jumping around training or prelim most of the time. I typically watch novice-prelim with a knot in the throat.

Is it any wonder Judi and Rainier (straight from H/J land) go out and kick major butt?

I respect a good event rider as much as anyone, but going to events around here are downright scarey.

I don't mean to be mean about it, but there needs to be a little dose of reality. Why eventers have the need to always "move up and up and up" is beyond me. I know of many horses who couldn't go around BN nicely or with any rhythm out being forced around training.

Classic Melody
Aug. 10, 2006, 01:14 PM
And comments about how H/J riders can't groom, can't ride, can't appreciate how wonderful you are because YOU'VE chosen the higher ground of eventing... that's just silly. Sure, there might be people like that (in ANY discipline), but there also are plenty of H/J riders out there who are FAR better technicians over fences than the average event rider and who most of us could stand to learn a lot from. We've got to split our time three ways, between dressage, jumping and conditioning; they can spend a lot more time developing an eye and an understanding of how to get a horse to a fence perfectly -- skills my horse really wishes I had! By assuming they don't know what they're doing because they ride H/J, well who's being the snob in that case?!?


Thank you. I couldn't have said it better myself. I came from hunterland, and I can't even tell you how many times event riders have asked me, Why do hunters do this, why do they do that, they are so ineffective, someone just hands them the reins and they go, etc - it is VERY annoying and mostly untrue stereotypes. (Most event riders have been very nice to me. But there is an element of, yes, I think jealousy, in some event riders of hunters. I don't know why.)

You know what I finally started saying to eventers who would quiz me about the stupid things hunters do? "In all my years of riding hunters, I never once heard anyone mention eventing." It's true, and that really shut them up. I don't get why some eventers are so obsessed with hunters. It's not a two-way street.

I'm glad I switched to eventing - I can't afford a fancy hunter and eventing is more fun and a new challenge, anyway - but every day I'm thankful for my hunter and eq background. It has not hurt me in any way, but enhanced my riding as I try a new discipline.

Oh, and I learned at the Phillip Dutton clinic a few weeks back that Phillip trains with George Morris in Florida several times a year. Who says we can't get along?

flash1
Aug. 10, 2006, 01:46 PM
That used to happen in our old barn....eventing was looked upon as "cruel" to the horse...hunter paces " just a way to get your horse lame"...and god knows what they would think if they knew we were foxhunting now as well....oh and not to mention my horses live out 24/7 only coming in to eat grain....( used to get 1 hour turnout max.) oh well.

short strided
Aug. 10, 2006, 02:06 PM
"To be honest us eventers tend to look down on the other disciplines as well. "

As a hunter rider, that is the exact experience I had with an eventer I met recently.:(

We were in a crowd of non-horsey people attempting to explains our respective disciplines. Her explanation was as follows:

"We do dressage, cross country and stadium. It is a sport where you see what your horse can actually do as opposed to winning a ribbon because you have the most expensive horse or the judge likes your pants."

I just smiled at her and turned around.

However, that was just one person. I would never assume that ALL eventers were so rude.;)

Rye
Aug. 10, 2006, 02:29 PM
Seriously. Besides...Who cares? Sometimes I think personal insecurities are the real drivers in these types of statements. Be happy with who you are, the horse you have and everyone else can go rot if they don't like it.

Every few months there are statements like this on the event board and then similar statements on the hunter board or dressage board.
1. Hunter riders will whine about nobody appreaciated how hard it really is to put in a beautiful, smooth round. It is hard.
2. Dressage riders whine that nobody understands how hard their tests are to ride properly.
3. Event riders whine that what they do is hard. It is.

I ride hunter and jumpers and we have eventers come to our rated shows to do the jumpers and they do just fine. Nobody looks down on them. If you come prepared with a nicely turned out horse, appropriate attired and ready to show, great then let's all enjoy a fun day.

I think the only time someone gets a "questioning glance" is when they clearly are not ready to show and the horse is out of control and the rider is seriously underprepared. That happens in every discipline.

magnolia73
Aug. 10, 2006, 03:05 PM
We do dressage, cross country and stadium. It is a sport where you see what your horse can actually do as opposed to winning a ribbon because you have the most expensive horse or the judge likes your pants."

That's western pleasure..... just kidding. The pants myth is from hunter riders with sour grapes, and the expensive horse...well.... if it is also the nicest, you will win....of course, same with eventers.

InVA
Aug. 10, 2006, 03:09 PM
That's western pleasure..... just kidding. The pants myth is from hunter riders with sour grapes, and the expensive horse...well.... if it is also the nicest, you will win....of course, same with eventers.

I thought it was in vaulting that your pants made you win?

that's the thing...in eventing all the expensive tack, britches, tall custom boots in the world won't help you out on XC. and an interesting thread might be very expensive experienced event horses who were purchased by/ for people who couldn't ride them...

Anyplace Farm
Aug. 10, 2006, 03:24 PM
Someone over on the snooty Hunter/Jumper forum gave us all a heads up on this thread so I had to check it out.

You know what is funny? Never, in six years posting on this board, have I ever seen one poster over on the H/J forum start a thread dissing Eventer people.

In 35 years of riding hunters, jumpers and doing the eqs, never have I heard one person in those arenas diss eventer people. In fact, it's been quite the contrary, like, "I don't see how they jump that stuff -- I'd be scared out of my mind." Or, "I can barely handle one show day, how do they do it for 3?"

Hmmmmmm......

Rye
Aug. 10, 2006, 03:25 PM
"that's the thing...in eventing all the expensive tack, britches, tall custom boots in the world won't help you out on XC."

Newsflash....that stuff won't help you win a jumper class or a hunter class either. We routinely have to remind the neophytes in the HJ world of this shocking fact as well.

Again, I think personal insecurities are the real drivers in these types of "poor me" statements about your chosen riding discipline. Be happy with who you are, the horse you have and everyone else can go rot if they don't like it.

Anyplace Farm
Aug. 10, 2006, 03:38 PM
"that's the thing...in eventing all the expensive tack, britches, tall custom boots in the world won't help you out on XC."

that stuff won't help you win a jumper class or a hunter class either. We routinely have to remind the neophytes in the HJ world of this shocking fact as well.
Well I tell you what -- I gots da custom Vogels, the Grand Prix jackets, the Essex shirts, the Ariat Pro Circuits, my little GPA knock off and trust me, I know for a fact that ain't gonna win me no ribbons, honey.

Even the purty, expensive horse won't do it for you. When its all said and done, we all, regardless of discipline, still have to sit up there and ride the things.

Hate to say it but you guys sound like you have inferiority complexes over here. Why beat on the H/J people? Like I said, I haven't heard conversation #1 of you guys.

My personal regard for eventing is very high. I cannot imagine having to buy all the equipment. I cannot imagine galloping down to a big jump with a freaking ditch on either side of it without watching my life pass before my eyes. I cannot imagine having to train for three different events. I cannot imagine having to condition for that so that your horse is sound enough to move on to the next phase. My list goes on.

I don't know any H/J people who belittle what you do. I know I would never do it because I'd be scared sh*tless and certainly don't have the stamina for that kind of competition. Give me my three little 2 minute classes and a comfy bed that night and I'm happy.

I don't think you can find a majority in the H/J world that look down on you. Definitely not fair to make blanket statements. We're all horse people -- I think for the most part, we have a strong respect for what it takes to win ANYTHING.

NRC260
Aug. 10, 2006, 03:40 PM
I am sorry that you think that everyone who rides H/J is snooty and looks down on eventers but you are sadly mistaken. I ride H/J and have a good friend who is an eventer and I think she is an amazing rider. Yes, I have evented before and yes it scares the sh*t out of me! The stuff you all jump wouldn't want to jump but I don't think that makes me less of a rider than an eventer.

Apparently from the looks of the posts most people here seem to think it does. Looks to me like you all are the ones who are looking down on the H/J world I'm afraid.

Grow Up.

NeverTime
Aug. 10, 2006, 03:46 PM
I thought it was in vaulting that your pants made you win?

that's the thing...in eventing all the expensive tack, britches, tall custom boots in the world won't help you out on XC. and an interesting thread might be very expensive experienced event horses who were purchased by/ for people who couldn't ride them...


.... how right you are! However, I *think* I see this more with aspiring upper-level riders who buy more horsepower than they can handle than with ammies out to enjoy a Cadillac ride at the lower levels. I think the prelim/int/advanced riders who go the route of too much gigantic ISH to control may do so at the advice of a BNT who sees them as a walking checkbook and, perhaps, an avenue to another nice ride for him/herself once the owner gives up.

InVA
Aug. 10, 2006, 03:50 PM
NO kidding, NeverTime! Often people with big checkbooks buy horses that have been around the big tracks (rolex. etc. ) and then find that they CAN'T make mistakes on them, the horses aren't used to it!

AND what about the horse that is stopping all over the place at prelim but who is still sold on for a buttload of money to an amateur that only wants to go novice because their BNT said this is the horse you have to have (I'm quoting a friend on this one!)

Irish2theKore
Aug. 10, 2006, 03:52 PM
I am a hunter and an eq rider and I find (most) of this thread disgusting and disrespectful! I used to event and there were stuck up and snotty event people just like there are snotty hunters. Hunters does take a lot of skill, you try getting your horse to keep an even pace, get all the strides, take off at a perfect distance, and have him look good over it. Or how about equitation... which is a jumper type course except you have to look good over it. You can't just fly over things. I'm not saying eventing doesn't take work because it does. I’m just saying not to judge us by a few people you’ve seen. Also Anyplace Farm is right, we don’t have topics in the hunter BB dissing eventers. So why are you dissing us? I got out of eventing because the cross country fences scared the crap out of me after they got above 3’. However, hunters is dangerous too. A few years ago a girl who lived very close to me died at a big hunter show down in Kentucky so don't tell me that it's easy.

For 3dayeventing: I take care of my horse at all shows from our local schooling shows to our A shows. Our trainer wouldn’t have it any other way. And I know other hunter people also take care of their own horse.

For InVA: I’m sorry you have not had good experience with your hunter/jumper people. I board at a barn where the owner’s daughter events and she and I are extremely close and she RESPECTS hunters and eq just like I RESPECT eventing. I would like to see you take one of our babies around a hunter course. If you can do that as well as we can then we’ll try riding your horse. Until then please do not judge us because there are some riders who, with a little work, could succeed in ANY discipline they put their mind to!

for the nice people who have replied thank you so much! I'm glad to see that it's not most eventers who feel this way because I've always respected you guys!

NMK
Aug. 10, 2006, 04:02 PM
Go play in their sandbox sometime...I did an A rated jumper show last weekend. It was a blast! We even won one class, and my horse is a CANTER rescue. Guess the hunter folks I know are different. They are fun and hepful like the event folks I know.

Nancy

onthebit
Aug. 10, 2006, 04:27 PM
As a lifelong h/j rider who started doing some eventing this year I find this thread very disappointing. I can assure you that at any of the big h/j barns or A shows I have shown at throughout my lifetime I never once participated in, or overhead a conversation dissing eventers. It really does sound like some people on this thread have an inferiority complex.

Putting in a good hunter ride with eight perfect, flowing fences is hard. Putting in a good, clean ride in some of the bigger A shows in the jumpers is hard. At the events I have been at this year I have seen very little riding that would indicate many of those participating would have a shot at doing it either. But was I sitting there putting them down? Of course not! I know that they are trying to train for three different phases, and I appreciate how hard it is. They aren't focusing just on the hunter ride, or just on the stadium phase.

And don't tell me h/j people cannot ride outside a ring, or can only ride on a level surface in perfect footing. My horse and I both did our first x-c jumps for either of us in a schooling competition, and negotiated jumps on up/down approaches, a bank and a ditch for the first time ever for both of us and not only did we get around, we had a clean go. I think good basics translate well to the lower levels in any discipline. Good basics are just good basics.

Good grief, and eventers see themselves as the friendly and welcoming crowd?? :confused: Thankfully all the eventers I have met in person do not seem to subscribe to the theories being tossed around in this thread. I wouldn't have been able to get back to h/j land fast enough.

breakthru
Aug. 10, 2006, 04:28 PM
That's what we're supposed to do, right?

Stereotypes are stereotypes and they exist everywhere, and I'm sure we could all post something that "proves" that either h/j people or eventers are "better" riders. I sure have my own personal experiences and opinions about this that I'm tempted to post, but I'm not going to. why?

Because to whine about how eventers get no respect goes against the spirit of eventing, in my opinion. It does no good to prove how tough you are by whining about how everyone looks down on you. If you want to be different, than be different! Don't gossip!

Buck up, pick yourself up, shake yourself off, and go ride some XC! To hell with anyone that thinks you can't ride! (unless you can't, of course, in which case, listen to your instructor :) )

InVA
Aug. 10, 2006, 04:38 PM
For InVA: I’m sorry you have not had good experience with your hunter/jumper people.

apology accepted...

AC & Ty
Aug. 10, 2006, 04:42 PM
Like the other H/J ladies who have invaded this thread, I must say that I can't believe how blatant you are about it!!! I mean, if we jab at something it's usually only tongue in cheek...not open season! But I digress...

I ride in the hunters. My horse also foxhunts. I am showing at a jumper show (cause methinks he would rather be a jumper) next week. I have shown jumpers in the past. I jump him over the XC jumps at my barn all the time, he is very brave. I have ridden 3 dressage tests in my entire life, and had 2 dressage lessons. I have never been so exhausted in my entire life. I also have done a couple of Combined Tests. I am contemplating NOW, doing some BN or maybe N events with my beast, since I like to do many different things with him so he doesn't get ring sour. I think it would great for his confidence and conditioning. BUT....I am mainly a hunter rider.

As far as eventing goes, I love it, I love to watch it, and I seriously believe that anyone riding above Training level has a death wish, but that's just me...I would NEVER have the nuts to do it...no matter if I could ride grand prix level jumper courses! Do I agree with everything? NO, but then I don't ALWAYS agree with the judges in hunterland, either.

My satisfaction comes from knowing that my horse was better (in some way) than he was the time before. If we fixed one thing, it's a success. And I am sure ALL riders feel like that, NO MATTER WHAT THE DISCIPLINE IS. We are ALL here to better ourselves and the horses...so SHAME ON YOU GUYS....what gives you the RIGHT to look down on ANYONE?

BigRedHorse
Aug. 10, 2006, 05:01 PM
I have met just as many snooty hunter riders as I have eventers and dressage riders and western pleasure riders and jumpers. I don't think it has much to do with what discipline you ride and everything to do with people's lack of respect for all other people, not just the ones that use their horses for a different purpose.

Doodle
Aug. 10, 2006, 05:03 PM
Geez, You all are so defensive! Can't you tell they're just joking about it - stop taking is so seriously! :lol:

hb
Aug. 10, 2006, 05:06 PM
I took a break from the forums for a few days because of the negativity. Didn't even lurk.

I was bored at lunch today, not enough time to get out of the office, so I decided to take a look at the forums again. This thread was at the top of the event forum when I came back today.

Oh, well.

Trixie
Aug. 10, 2006, 05:42 PM
I would bet these are not jumper riders (who are usually very good horseman), but hunter riders that have this attitude. To me the a true test of a horseman is not how pretty they can look on a horse that goes perfectly, but to have them take a green horse out in an open field and train it.

How eye-opening to know that obviously, because I ride hunters, my horses were born TRAINED.

While I agree that it's a test of horsemanship to take a horse into an open field and train it, why do you think our horses go around and make it look easy? Because we've trained them. I appreciate the generalizations, though.


For the record, I think this thread is snarky and rude and just smacks of sour grapes and poor stereotypes. I ride hunters, I showed eq for quite some time, but I'm in the process of taking my horses to foxhunt camp, we go XC and trail ride constantly, and we plan on entering some lower level events. But you'd never know that upon seeing me in the hunter arena, or around an eq course.


Those Hunter Princesses used to make fun of me, look down at me - mostly because I had no money :-p and I could ride their horses better then they could at half their age. I was told I had horrible equitation (yes, well when I was riding half broken horses I was being effective and not sitting pretty!) boy was it so much fun to kick their @sses in eq classes, esp because I was always riding green horses and theres were seasoned h/j horses.

The only reason I would ever look down on someone at a horse show is not for their lack of money, but for their lack of class. That is exactly what this thread is showing me - a tremendous lack of class.

Queen Latisha
Aug. 10, 2006, 06:27 PM
This is just nonsense, you have snooty people in every sport. I'm a hunter rider and never look down on anyone. Maybe it's just the type of people you come in contact with.:eek:

bambam
Aug. 10, 2006, 06:53 PM
Okay- I tried to stay out of this but just cannot keep my mouth shut (general problem I have anyway;) ).
Before the h/j riders continue saying how horrible we eventers are for dissing h/j riders, why don't you take a look at how small the number of posters is who actually did so here (as opposed the number of posts) and how many disagreed.
Lets all take a deep breath and acknowledge that there are h/j riders who merely perch on their pricey made packers, there are eventers who cannot rider their way out of paper bag, completely miss the horsemanship and riding skill part of riding and make you cringe when you see them go, there are h/j riders who look down at eventers and there are eventers that look down on h/j riders. And I have seen threads knocking both on this BB.
Done correctly both disciplines are extremely hard.
Lets not get our knickers in a twist and move on . . . please

Gnep
Aug. 10, 2006, 06:58 PM
3 day,

they are right, all english riders are candy a.., snifflers, wuzzies, that need to be looked down on.

Jaideux
Aug. 10, 2006, 07:15 PM
Hi, there.

Hunter rider here, who's dabbled in cross country schooling and some very basic dressage at very very low levels, and I would just like to say a few things:

I choose to do Hunters because it's the most popular discipline in my area. I started at a barn, made friends, moved around with them, and kept getting more and more embedding in the Hunter scene, and I just don't feel the need to move. It's not because I'm afraid of eventing, but I've invested so much into being a Hunter that I can't justify the costs and risks of changing disciplines at this point. And I'm okay with that. Also, given my natural limitations as a human, mentally, physically, financially, emotionally, geographically, etc, I'm aware that the degree of sucess I would have eventing would not be satisfying to me- it would likely be at the level of the people that I discuss below- the unsafe. Not that I would be one, but who wants to be surrounded by that? And it's not because I'm "not good enough", but because I'm "differently abled" than what is the ideal eventer.

Also, the only time I have ever heard anythind disparaging about Eventers is when they are teenagers (heck, even grown adults!) racing dangerously around the XC/stadium, clearly showing no skill beyond the ablity to perch on a nearly out of control horse- not showing the rhythm, balance, and collection you can clearly see at the upper levels. For some reason they think that just because they can do that, they are a better rider than anyone else "because they event". And you'll hear those same remarks when jumpers are going around fast and dangerous, not big-strided and balance to turn efficiently and jump high.

I like perfection. I like being "prettyful" when I go in the ring. Doesn't mean I can't respect you guys for doing what you do, and it also doesn't mean that I can't see the faults in my own discipline. Of course we have people taking the easy route and perching on their imported warmbloods who can clock around a 4' hunter course, then handing it off to their groom, but we have a lot, too, who do their own work from the ground up. But I know for a fact that eventers can be guilty of the same thing. All horse people CAN be guilty of that.

I just think about it like this: would a ballet dancer (equitation) be justified in looking down on a tap-dancer (eventing) or a jazz dancer (hunters)? No. It's dancing, sure, but after that, it's largely apples and oranges.

Interesting discussion, though.

TheOrangeOne
Aug. 10, 2006, 07:47 PM
Grace finds it necessary to note that good riding is good riding, and the bad riding is generally percieved to be worse than it is, no matter what discipline we're talkign about. Hunter horses don't know the course, now can they get themselves to a fence (with the very very rare exception) and staying on an XC course is quite difficult...

GAEqGirl
Aug. 10, 2006, 07:56 PM
I do the equitation, and all I have to say is that i have the upmost respect for yall event riders. I wish that I had the guts to do what yall do!! While equitation is challenging, eventing is a whole other story. I don't think it is very fair to compare them TOO much because they are SOO different! I do know there are extremely rude hunter riders, but most of the ones that I know are really really nice! I just wish hunters weren't so subjective...I think thats what I admire most about eventing, it doesn't matter how fancy your horse is, its about how yall work together. So please don't generalize us in the 'hunter world'!

Sebastian
Aug. 10, 2006, 08:18 PM
I think it's time to quit whining and "retire our drugged out event horses on XC..." :winkgrin:

Throw some cold water on yourselves and let this die...
Seb :cool:

Renn/aissance
Aug. 10, 2006, 08:47 PM
Frankly I'd like to see an A rated WHatever try to take my horse around a preliminary course...at preliminary speed, and not come back white as a ghost (if they come back at all) Wouldn't do that to my horse though!

My gut impulse was to ask you to put your money where your mouth is and let me borrow your horse.

Really, this thread amuses me more than anything just because of the hypocrisy.

AreYouKidding
Aug. 10, 2006, 09:02 PM
Heyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy there. I'll borrow your horse too! I have a damn good hunter eq horse( 6th in the country for large juniors) and we can get around the novice course easily at our barn. And do a good dressage test. And jump a hunter eq round in the mid 80s consistently. Sadly, haven't tried polo yet so I can't comment on that:)

Seriously, I've really wanted to go to a lower level event just for fun but is everyone there going to be mean to me cuz I'm a hunter??

Lindsay

LUVMYQH
Aug. 10, 2006, 09:18 PM
I was told to come see this on the h/j forum - I'm not ashamed to admit my discipline - I love it! But, I must admit that I'm amazed at the difficulty of eventing. It's not for me - but I respect those who do it.

Another impressive sport - endurance riding! As a teenager (many many years ago) - I competed in four endurance rides with my prize mare. (The same mare that I also rode Western and H/J - she was priceless!) Talk about stamina and hairy courses - go out and race on trails! We would condition our horses for months before the events. Now that's a tough ride!

In summary, it takes guts and stamina to ride in any of these disciplines. I respect anyone who works hard with their horse and competes. I equally respect those who ride simply for pleasure. To me, it's all about our love and respect for our horses - that's all that matters.

Sebastian
Aug. 10, 2006, 09:18 PM
Seriously, I've really wanted to go to a lower level event just for fun but is everyone there going to be mean to me cuz I'm a hunter??

Lindsay
OF COURSE WE WILL. :lol: After all we want you to feel at home... :winkgrin:

Seriously...It's very fun over here on the dark-side...(Has anyone told you about the sumo wrestlers on XC?)
Seb :cool:

3dayeventing
Aug. 10, 2006, 09:26 PM
NeverTime,

If you could refer me to the Us ~vs~ Them thread I would like to read some of the quotes. I am pretty new to The Chronicle. Thank you


Do we really need another "us vs. them" thread?
How is the original post -- or many of these answers -- any different from the looking-down-their-noses that the H/J folks do? Every sport takes skills, and every sport requires actually *doing* it to really appreciate what skill is involved.

bornfreenowexpensive
Aug. 10, 2006, 09:37 PM
NeverTime,

If you could refer me to the Us ~vs~ Them thread I would like to read some of the quotes. I am pretty new to The Chronicle. Thank you

Nevertime will correct me if I'm wrong but I think that was just a reference to all the threads with similar type of topics...as in why are all such and such riders snobs (they occur occassionally). The reality is....there are people out there who are insert choice stuck up, mean, obnoxious, rude, short tempered, timid, crazy.....etc. It has nothing to do with horses or their type of riding but has to do with people being people and when they move in packs as is our nature...and someone runs across one of those packs...it becomes "all" dressage/hunter riders are "snobs" or "timid" etc... or all event riders are crazy instead of realizing that "like" people tend to gather together so if you are at a barn of "snobs" it is because the non-snobs didn't want to hang out there and left and other "snobs" liked to hang out there and has nothing to do with horses but everything to do with human nature.

ok...wow...that was a lot longer then I intended but you get the drift.

Gnep
Aug. 11, 2006, 12:58 AM
This is so bad, mean terrible, we are the crown juwel of equestrian.

3day they should recognize this, those snoby misserable people.

They should worship any eventyer, they should have a shrine in their misserable stables, wre they make daily contribution and sacrificies TO US The GODS and Godesses ( what ever that is and how ever you spell it) of the Equestrian World.

We are the Champions, We are the Champion.

By the way, maybe you have not earned the credits.

3dayeventing
Aug. 11, 2006, 01:05 AM
Please cross over, we welcome that. I think that is great!



Heyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy there. I'll borrow your horse too! I have a damn good hunter eq horse( 6th in the country for large juniors) and we can get around the novice course easily at our barn. And do a good dressage test. And jump a hunter eq round in the mid 80s consistently. Sadly, haven't tried polo yet so I can't comment on that:)

Seriously, I've really wanted to go to a lower level event just for fun but is everyone there going to be mean to me cuz I'm a hunter??

Lindsay

3dayeventing
Aug. 11, 2006, 01:08 AM
Gnep,

I dont think that with the particular individuals it would matter if I had just won Rolex. I have competed through the Advanced National level and they still look down on me. They would be miserable no matter what. I give up and let them run around in their little bubble.



This is so bad, mean terrible, we are the crown juwel of equestrian.

3day they should recognize this, those snoby misserable people.

They should worship any eventyer, they should have a shrine in their misserable stables, wre they make daily contribution and sacrificies TO US The GODS and Godesses ( what ever that is and how ever you spell it) of the Equestrian World.

We are the Champions, We are the Champion.

By the way, maybe you have not earned the credits.

Midge
Aug. 11, 2006, 09:04 AM
I posted this several years ago in yet another 'eventers are great, hunters suck' thread started by Mary In Area 1. I think it bears repeating.


Originally posted by Erin:
Of course it does. Which is why, after the same point had been made in regard to generalizing about h/j riders umpteen times in this thread, I'm rather disappointed to see that the same courtesy wasn't extended to eventers.

Erin, I am struggling with something here. It has never occurred to me to go to the eventing board and post things like, 'Why would you ever do a sport where horses dying on course is a concern?' 'Why would you do a sport where you can fall off and still win?' And after watching at Pinehurst a couple weeks ago, 'Why are you so adamantly against the crest release and counting strides when some of your horses so obviously needed and desperately wished you had these skills?'

I don't do it because just about every horse person I know in every discipline has the important things in common. We love our horses. We love our sport. We love competing. The best moments are not in the show ring. The best moments occur when our individual horses do 'that cute thing'. We are all filled with hope when a new horse comes to the barn. We are all filled with sorrow (or occasionally, 'Good Riddance!' :D) when one goes on to a new home. We have all been angry, hurt and frustrated by our horse's inabilities and awed, humbled and blessed by their abilities.

It's what bonds us together as horse people. I watched dressage tests for the Pam Ams this morning and saw one rider miss a lead change. Oh, how my heart went out to him! I bet he hates that elusive Lead Change Fairy just as much as I do!

Almost every rider in every discipline is trying to forge a bond that makes the sum greater than the parts, whether one is a backyard eventer, a DQ, a hunter princess or a cowgirl on a peanut roller. We all pick up the reins with hope and expectation, no matter how crappy or disappointed we were with our last experience in the tack.

magnolia73
Aug. 11, 2006, 09:44 AM
We all pick up the reins with hope and expectation, no matter how crappy or disappointed we were with our last experience in the tack.


So well said.

onthebit
Aug. 11, 2006, 10:20 AM
Great post Midge.

3dayeventing
Aug. 11, 2006, 11:44 AM
Midge,

In the 25years I have been eventing, I cant say I have seen the horror you write about???? Wow-that's ok you are entitled to your opinion, have at it. However, eventing is a wonderful sport for those that like a true challenge! My horses all love XC, they thrive on it, so...........how is that cruel? We own Hunters and Polo ponies too! Our hunters go in a circle with cotten in their ears..........hmmmmmm are they having fun?:lol:

PS- my name is NOT Erin, who ever that is? Guess again:no:



I posted this several years ago in yet another 'eventers are great, hunters suck' thread started by Mary In Area 1. I think it bears repeating.



Erin, I am struggling with something here. It has never occurred to me to go to the eventing board and post things like, 'Why would you ever do a sport where horses dying on course is a concern?' 'Why would you do a sport where you can fall off and still win?' And after watching at Pinehurst a couple weeks ago, 'Why are you so adamantly against the crest release and counting strides when some of your horses so obviously needed and desperately wished you had these skills?'

I don't do it because just about every horse person I know in every discipline has the important things in common. We love our horses. We love our sport. We love competing. The best moments are not in the show ring. The best moments occur when our individual horses do 'that cute thing'. We are all filled with hope when a new horse comes to the barn. We are all filled with sorrow (or occasionally, 'Good Riddance!' :D) when one goes on to a new home. We have all been angry, hurt and frustrated by our horse's inabilities and awed, humbled and blessed by their abilities.

It's what bonds us together as horse people. I watched dressage tests for the Pam Ams this morning and saw one rider miss a lead change. Oh, how my heart went out to him! I bet he hates that elusive Lead Change Fairy just as much as I do!

Almost every rider in every discipline is trying to forge a bond that makes the sum greater than the parts, whether one is a backyard eventer, a DQ, a hunter princess or a cowgirl on a peanut roller. We all pick up the reins with hope and expectation, no matter how crappy or disappointed we were with our last experience in the tack.

PiedPiper
Aug. 11, 2006, 12:44 PM
I believe she was talking to the moderator, Erin.

What bears repeating in this and other threads is if you new to the BB why don't you lay low and learn the lay of the land before coming on and stirring up a trainwreck?

Yes there are discipline "snobs" and yes sometimes you don't get the "respect one deserves" but USUALLY regardless of horses and such, we get the respect we deserve as an individual.

I can think of a few cases of riders who think they should get more respect they do b/c of the level they ride at. The problem is, they don't give others the repect they deserve as well as their personalities are lacking.

Remember you earn respect; it isn't just dished out. If "you" have a personality flaw then it is going to impact everyone's opinion of "you".

I would imagine that your case is more specific in nature than general and has to do with the individuals in question than the sport.

And, while I am commenting, what is "advanced national level"? I know advanced, I know areas, I don't know the above.

Doodle
Aug. 11, 2006, 12:58 PM
It didn't take much to get this train wreck going... from an observer's persepective, that is! I have a really good topic to argue ... what does everyone think of George Bush!? :lol:

B Street Tango
Aug. 11, 2006, 01:33 PM
My goodness...why all the knickers in knots?

Can't we just all agree that we choose the sport in which we, individually, have the most enjoyment? Isn't that why we do it? For the fun? Perhaps we all define fun a little differently but that's what makes life interesting!

Personally, I choose eventing. And I long for the day that I finish my stadium round and someone comments, "That looked like a nice, smooth hunter round." Or to hear someone say, "Sure she looks good, I would too if I were on a packer." To ME, those would both be huge compliments and icing on the cake. :D

I also drive a Chevy, some like Fords. As long as I'm happy with my choice, why do a give a rat's a$$ what someone else chooses? OR, I prefer a slant load, step-up. Others think straighload w/a ramp are the way to go...lets see how derailed we can get this trainwreck. ;)

Lisa Cook
Aug. 11, 2006, 01:42 PM
And I long for the day that I finish my stadium round and someone comments, "That looked like a nice, smooth hunter round."

I agree. If I school a course really well in a lesson with my eventing trainer, the highest compliment she can hand out is "that was as pretty to watch as a hunter round". I don't hear it very often, but I'm thrillled when I do! :)

bip
Aug. 11, 2006, 01:42 PM
It has never occurred to me to go to the eventing board and post things like, 'Why would you ever do a sport where horses dying on course is a concern?' 'Why would you do a sport where you can fall off and still win?' And after watching at Pinehurst a couple weeks ago, 'Why are you so adamantly against the crest release and counting strides when some of your horses so obviously needed and desperately wished you had these skills?'


Didn't you just do that?

Lisa Cook
Aug. 11, 2006, 01:54 PM
In the 25years I have been eventing, I cant say I have seen the horror you write about????

Maybe you've been riding advanced for so long, you haven't been hanging out next to the ring while beginner novice stadium is going on. There are definitely some riders there (not all, but some) who could definitely benefit from 2-point drills and a review of the crest release.

And to just to clarify, I ride in the beginner novice divison. ;)

pinkngreen
Aug. 11, 2006, 01:57 PM
And, while I am commenting, what is "advanced national level"? I know advanced, I know areas, I don't know the above.I think she just means that she only competed in Advanced HT's, no international competitions sanctioned by the FEI. That is what comes to my mind when someone uses the term National to describe their experience. The is a difference in a rider that has ridden advanced at an international level vs at a national level.

B Street Tango
Aug. 11, 2006, 02:04 PM
Maybe you've been riding advanced for so long, you haven't been hanging out next to the ring while beginner novice stadium is going on. There are definitely some riders there (not all, but some) who could definitely benefit from 2-point drills and a review of the crest release.

So you saw my Stadium round at Waredaca, huh? LOL :lol:

Sebastian
Aug. 11, 2006, 02:09 PM
Didn't you just do that?

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Touche'!!
Seb :cool:

p.s. Anyone got any chocolate???

MyGiantPony
Aug. 11, 2006, 02:21 PM
It didn't take much to get this train wreck going... from an observer's persepective, that is! I have a really good topic to argue ... what does everyone think of George Bush!? :lol:

He can't ride for crap.

He'd never survive a Long Stirrup division, much less a Prelim course. :lol:

InVA
Aug. 11, 2006, 02:28 PM
HA! He'd be in Western Displeasure, for sure!

Midge
Aug. 11, 2006, 03:03 PM
Midge,

In the 25years I have been eventing, I cant say I have seen the horror you write about???? Wow-that's ok you are entitled to your opinion, have at it. However, eventing is a wonderful sport for those that like a true challenge! My horses all love XC, they thrive on it, so...........how is that cruel? We own Hunters and Polo ponies too! Our hunters go in a circle with cotten in their ears..........hmmmmmm are they having fun?:lol:

PS- my name is NOT Erin, who ever that is? Guess again:no:

<sigh> If you look at the Very First Words of my post, you will see that it is something I posted before. The original post was addressed to Erin.

What 'horror' have I posted about? Where did I say it was cruel? The point of my post is I never think of slamming eventers for things that are rare occurances or exceptions to the rule. The point of my post, if you would go back and actually read it, is we all want to be the best at what we do, no matter what we do. I have close friends in almost every discipline and hope that they have been able to take away as much from me as I have from them.

I do have a question, though. Why do your hunters only go in circles with cotton in their ears??? Why aren't they out going cross country?

mowgli96
Aug. 11, 2006, 04:07 PM
C'mon guys, is there really a need for this rudeness against hunters? Ok, we all know it takes skill to ride; whether you be on a fiesty prelim event horse or a 3'6 adult packer. Beleive me, no rider can physically 'just sit there and look pretty' -- because the horse cannot do an entire course on his own, with entirely NO help from whoever may be on board...think about it:yes:

Sebastian
Aug. 11, 2006, 04:08 PM
HA! He'd be in Western Displeasure, for sure!
Didn't you know? He's scared of horses...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EkqrI3IibYI

You can fast forward to minute 3 to see the evidence... :winkgrin: But, I do humbly recommend the whole video.

Seb :cool:

lstevenson
Aug. 11, 2006, 04:17 PM
He can't ride for crap.

He'd never survive a Long Stirrup division, much less a Prelim course. :lol:


:lol: :lol: :lol:

InVA
Aug. 11, 2006, 04:40 PM
Let's just hope he can ride better than he governs...

(just my opinion.)

Gnep
Aug. 11, 2006, 05:01 PM
Sebastian,
HE would probably not know were front or rear is, if that little guy behind him would not point it out to him. HE got a horn up his ......... ??

3day, A ( Capital A ) gee they should burn a candle for you every day, at the shrine, in the barn.

ComingAttraction
Aug. 11, 2006, 05:24 PM
I often find that the people with the most insecurities take things personally. I can't ever remember a conversation about any other discipline where I or my students "dissed" their hard work. I would not allow that either. I would take the time to explain the discipline and what they strive for as opposed to what our discipline "Hunters/Jumper/Equitation" look for.

We also go cross country with Balls to the wall, practice lower level dressage and have an overall good time enjoying our horses. I don't understand this mentality that is being described. I know damn well that I could get around a prelim course and any one of my students could compete in eventing, dressage, etc and do respectably because they are taught to be equestrian athletes. They most certainly know how to take care of their own horses and do not need me or a groom to do so.

If anything I think it has to do with how certain children are raised; close minded and unaccepting of other people or sports, or open minded to learning everything you can, especially from the last person you would think has something to teach. My favorite saying is that you can learn something from everyone. What a disgrace this thread is.

Sebastian
Aug. 11, 2006, 05:28 PM
Sebastian,
HE would probably not know were front or rear is, if that little guy behind him would not point it out to him. HE got a horn up his ......... ??

3day, A ( Capital A ) gee they should burn a candle for you every day, at the shrine, in the barn.

:lol: :lol: :lol:

I think it's a "Texas Long Horn," too...! :lol:

k, gotta go light my candle in the shrine to all Event/God-Riders... Pray that I don't burn the barn down while I'm at it... :eek:

Seb :cool:

EventingJ
Aug. 11, 2006, 05:37 PM
There are great riders in both the sports. I've ridden both - I started out as a hunter/eq rider. There is definatly many reasons I got out of the hunter thing, i still love love jumpers.

But the first time an event rider looks at my helmet and looks at my black hunt coat and asks why I have a "fake" GPA and what the heck dressage ring I got lost from would be the day I died laughing.


I'm pretty darn sure I've never heard a h/j rider say "well as long as your tack is neat, tidy and fits it doesnt matter WHAT you brand you wear or what color it is!" ;)

Midge
Aug. 11, 2006, 05:49 PM
I'm pretty darn sure I've never heard a h/j rider say "well as long as your tack is neat, tidy and fits it doesnt matter WHAT you brand you wear or what color it is!" ;)

Well then, you haven't been listening. :rolleyes:

3dayeventing
Aug. 11, 2006, 06:15 PM
NATIONAL LEVEL ADVANCED - BN = HORSE TRIALS
INTERNATIONAL = PRELIM- ADVANCED CIC OR CCI

I guess there was some confusion about my last post. "Advanced National level"

Gnep
Aug. 11, 2006, 07:45 PM
sebastian,
because the little guy never told HIM, the little guy is a mean one, Adult Hunter, they are realy mean.
Which proves 3days point.
All Hunter are so mean.

EventingJ
Aug. 11, 2006, 09:21 PM
Well then, you haven't been listening. :rolleyes:

how cute, just the attitude I never miss! cheers :D

BoysNightOut
Aug. 11, 2006, 09:26 PM
Well then, you haven't been listening. :rolleyes:

Funny, I was competing in a Hunter show at my college 2 years ago on my now horse who isn't anything fancy. I wore my white show shirt with a small stock pin, tan State Line Tack breeches, and a Troxel velvet hunt cap. Another student who went to school with me came up to me and told me that "I really shouldn't be wearing my stock pin, my collar should be monogramed....and your shirt and jacket should be light colors" and that my breeches were kinda out of place bc they weren't TS. Funny, me and my plucky horse got 7th out of 14 riders in Hunter Under Saddle.....guess the clothes didn't affect my chances at all.

Also, at that exact same show, I was sitting with some friends, watching classes when a girl walked by with some fake brand GPA.....and not 1 minute later I heard the whispers of "ew, isnt that a fake gpa.....it's so ugly, why doesn't she just get a real one." Complete with rolling eyes and snarly looks towards the girl.

Yeah, real classy attitude.....and that type of attitude is one I have heard over and over from hunter riders in my area.....which is why I got out of that sport for good.

I'm not saying everybody is like that, heck, I'm sure there's lots of nice hunter riders out there.....but I have yet to meet anybody who didn't make such a fuss out of clothing brands and helmet bling.

3dayeventing
Aug. 11, 2006, 09:39 PM
Midge,

That is a very good question. Today I took my daughter to her hunter barn and 80% of the horses had cotten in their ears. I not sure when that all started, I was raised a Pony Club kid! Does anyone know? I will post the question in the H/J Board and let you know.


<sigh> If you look at the Very First Words of my post, you will see that it is something I posted before. The original post was addressed to Erin.

What 'horror' have I posted about? Where did I say it was cruel? The point of my post is I never think of slamming eventers for things that are rare occurances or exceptions to the rule. The point of my post, if you would go back and actually read it, is we all want to be the best at what we do, no matter what we do. I have close friends in almost every discipline and hope that they have been able to take away as much from me as I have from them.

I do have a question, though. Why do your hunters only go in circles with cotton in their ears??? Why aren't they out going cross country?

3dayeventing
Aug. 11, 2006, 10:13 PM
Ok I Posted the question: Why do hunter use cotten in their horses ears? Here is the answer,It's pretty common because some horses will be a little frazzled by all the confusion of a show/schooling ring, so ear plugs/cotton is used to lessen the sound. I use it every now and then on my horse if I feel like there's a lot going on, and she might be confused. It's like ear plugs for people; it just muffles the sound of everything. However I find the answer unacceptable, horses that are accostomed to dealing with noise are easier to ride and show, so I am still confused.


<sigh> If you look at the Very First Words of my post, you will see that it is something I posted before. The original post was addressed to Erin.

What 'horror' have I posted about? Where did I say it was cruel? The point of my post is I never think of slamming eventers for things that are rare occurances or exceptions to the rule. The point of my post, if you would go back and actually read it, is we all want to be the best at what we do, no matter what we do. I have close friends in almost every discipline and hope that they have been able to take away as much from me as I have from them.

I do have a question, though. Why do your hunters only go in circles with cotton in their ears??? Why aren't they out going cross country?

3dayeventing
Aug. 11, 2006, 10:13 PM
Ok I Posted the question: Why do hunter use cotten in their horses ears? Here is the answer,It's pretty common because some horses will be a little frazzled by all the confusion of a show/schooling ring, so ear plugs/cotton is used to lessen the sound. I use it every now and then on my horse if I feel like there's a lot going on, and she might be confused. It's like ear plugs for people; it just muffles the sound of everything. However I find the answer unacceptable, horses that are accostomed to dealing with noise are easier to ride and show, so I am still confused.


<sigh> If you look at the Very First Words of my post, you will see that it is something I posted before. The original post was addressed to Erin.

What 'horror' have I posted about? Where did I say it was cruel? The point of my post is I never think of slamming eventers for things that are rare occurances or exceptions to the rule. The point of my post, if you would go back and actually read it, is we all want to be the best at what we do, no matter what we do. I have close friends in almost every discipline and hope that they have been able to take away as much from me as I have from them.

I do have a question, though. Why do your hunters only go in circles with cotton in their ears??? Why aren't they out going cross country?

Midge
Aug. 11, 2006, 11:48 PM
Originally posted by 3dayeventing
We own Hunters and Polo ponies too! Our hunters go in a circle with cotten in their ears..........hmmmmmm are they having fun?

But they are YOUR horses!!! WHY do you do it??? Mine don't.

Midge
Aug. 11, 2006, 11:50 PM
As far as the clothes, from a thread called 'Okay, does fashion REALLy matter in the hunter show ring?'


I have off the shelf Ariat boots which I bought after braiding all night long, so I knew they would fit even if my legs are swollen from standing up all night. (Last week-end, I pulled them on without boot pulls) My newest coat is five years old, my oldest is about 12.

I won a ribbon in the Monarch Medal at Capital Challenge in said boots and coat, although I was wearing TS's, about four years old. Rudy was wearing his $50 dollar Bobby's bridle. I was third in the Adult Classic At Capital Challenge wearing a borrowed shadbelly at least 15 years old, a borrowed top hat that was too tall (might have been a man's) the same Bobby's Bridle and the same off the shelf boots. I was barely out of the ribbons in the adults out of 46 at CC wearing a ten year old coat and rust breeches. I wore Miller's knock off breeches with the 12 year old coat and was third WCHR week at WEF, the only week I showed in the hunters.

I have four coats, all of them I bought used and only one of which I acquired after 2002. I now have four pairs of breeches, the two pairs of TS's I bought used, the two pairs of knock offs I bought new.

Midge
Aug. 11, 2006, 11:56 PM
how cute, just the attitude I never miss! cheers :D


What?? You just said you'd never heard it. I told you different and you think I have an attitude???

3dayeventing
Aug. 11, 2006, 11:57 PM
Midge,

That is a very difficult question to answer. My daughter only has one that is a hunter. Her father bought it and we are divorced, so I dont have much say, however the other two are being moved as we speak back to an eventing barn and I did not allow them to place cotten in their ears, ever, these ones I am in charge of:) . Sorry for such a vague answer, but that is really the truth!




Originally posted by 3dayeventing

But they are YOUR horses!!! WHY do you do it??? Mine don't.

Gnep
Aug. 12, 2006, 12:26 AM
Gee it is geting interesting, now we even got an divorce story.

lets get the chips, the dip, and the beer out.

3dayeventing
Aug. 12, 2006, 12:30 AM
Despirate housewife's or ex-wives club!


:)
Originally posted by 3dayeventing

But they are YOUR horses!!! WHY do you do it??? Mine don't.

Sebastian
Aug. 12, 2006, 01:47 AM
Hey Gnep...

I'll make some popcorn and dry martinis. I lit my Eventer/God candle this afternoon (only burned out the tack room -- WOO HOO!!). Then I made a wiccan safety circle out of more candles...jumped up and down 17 times and spun around til I was dizzy. So, really, how did these mean hunters get in here?

I'm so confused... :confused:
Seb :(

p.s. Tell Reed to start a thread about mean DQs, then maybe they'll all come over here and teach HIM a thing or two... :yes:

EventingJ
Aug. 12, 2006, 09:35 AM
What?? You just said you'd never heard it. I told you different and you think I have an attitude???


I've never heard it because its never been said in my presence - not because I'm not listening.

The rolling of the eyes smiley, and the unseen hand on the hip twirling the hair is what sparked my comment.

Again, cute though. And things is STILL don't miss. :D Thanks for TELLING me what I'm obviously TOO IGNORANT to know on my own haha!

kkj
Aug. 12, 2006, 10:43 AM
It goes both ways. I remember an event where at the party they sang a song ripping on wimpy boring HJ riders.

Dressage clinicians and others I have known have made comments on how ghastly bad eventing dressage is.

HJ trainers and riders I know have said this and that horse is so badly trained because it came from the eventing world. "Eventers don't ride they just run and hang on" or "they are crazy" That kind of thing.

Everyone likes to think they are better than everyone else.

I think there are good riders everywhere. There are some very ballsy dressage and HJ riders. There are some very hunter precise event riders.

What I love about the eventers in general is the more fun relaxed attitude. I have always had a great time at an event and I cannot say that so emphatically about HJ shows or dressage. The eventers overall are more friendly and relaxed, and have more fun with it. Of course there are HJ and dressage riders that fit this bill as well, but the overall attitude at the shows is not as welcoming and fun as at an event.

Jazzy Lady
Aug. 12, 2006, 10:53 AM
I get goosebumps when I watch the Rolex, or any other ride around a top course.

I get goosebumps when I watch a gorgeous horse in the working hunter that is absolutely flawless.

I get goosebumps when I watch a Grand Prix rider enter the ring down the centerline to perform their test.

I get goosebumps (and a little nervous) when I watch an eq rider in the finals jump around a tough and big course with no stirrups.

A good ride is a good ride.

There are those in every sport who would rather ride on Daddy's purse strings than learn to ride a horse. You know who your friends are, and you learn to know who to avoid. But you smile and continue on knowing that there are catty and snooty people in life everyday and you aren't one of them ;)

Heck, I went to Jackastors for dinner the other night after my show. I was tired, had another horse to do the next day. I went in a clean tank top, my breeches (also not TOO dirty considering I was coming from a show, my bootsocks and my danskos. The hostess sat us in the bar immediately even though the main dining room had PLENTY of available seats.

Briaffer
Aug. 12, 2006, 10:59 AM
this is not for you eventers who have respect for my (H/J) dicipline and all others, but to those of you who dont, I have lost all the respect that i did have for you.

Eventing always seems so carefree in a fun kinda way i wouldnt have thought that many of you would be so low as to diss a dicipline that many of you have never tried. Thats just low and if anything is giving us a reason to think less of you. Once again this is not aimed at everyone who has posted on this.

jetsmom
Aug. 12, 2006, 11:34 AM
The eventers I've met were a friendly bunch that I think are really gutsy. I'm sure there are some snobs out there, but I didn't go looking for it, and admit to being somewhat oblivious to interacting with people when there are horses to enjoy watching.

InVA- Maybe the hunter people that you said wouldn't speak to you, got the impression that you are disdainfull of their discipline and think they can't ride. Doesn't exactly make someone want to go be friendly with that person. Your disdain for H/J comes through loud and clear on your posts so I can only imagine what it is like in person. And if I was at a show and 2 people were talking with each other and looking over at me, and made a big production out of screaming "Good Morning", I would wonder if they were somehow being sarcastic or trying to cover up their badmouthing of me.

I'm really glad that the eventers I've met were so friendly and welcoming to me, and encouraging me to try eventing. I'd hate to think that secretly they were all thinking that because I do H/J, I just pose, and have a groom do everything for me...which couldn't be farther from the truth. Eventing looks like a blast, and I am determined to go play on the CC course this Fall.

RISHlover
Aug. 12, 2006, 11:59 AM
At my daughters local "A" Hunter/Jumper barn they look down on me as an event rider. Almost like we are "lower class." I feel we deserve more credit in the equestrian world! After all we compete in three sports over a few days on one horse. What are your thoughts? Has anyone else gone through this?

Question for OP?
Who is "they" at your daughter's "A" H/J Barn?

Celebrity
Aug. 12, 2006, 01:37 PM
Myself being a hunter/jumper rider (more jumper), I think that eventers are great and have a good set of you know whats. To ride a horse in three different disciplines and be successful is an amazing feat, and no one should be looked down upon anyone for persuing what they love whether that be hunter, jumper, dressage, cross country or a mix of all of them. Many events in my area are all run on the same day, sometimes two, and in my opinion to be able to bring a horse back into a dressage work ethic after galloping a cross country course or doing a stadium event shows a) A great horse and b) a great ride.
We often have younger folks (kids) who start riding and show that they are agressive and love to have fun while working their tails off at the same time, and many of these kids we talk to about eventing to explore the world of showing in different disciplines as opposed to restricting them to hunters.
I know some hunter riders that are definitely a tad snooty, but the large majority I've dealt with are great people who just love horses and have found their strengths and comfort zone in the hunter ring.

Irish2theKore
Aug. 12, 2006, 03:14 PM
I don't know why some of you guys say we don't talk to anyone else. I remember at the merrill lynch (a big rated show in ohio) sitting down at a trainer's area and I didn't know him but my friend worked with him and he was very nice to me as were all of his students even though they didn't know me and for all they knew I could have been a western rider! I think people at hunter shows are very nice for the most part and if you get into trouble they are always willing to help out.

RoyalTRider
Aug. 12, 2006, 03:44 PM
I haven't read beyond page two yet, so forgive me if this has already been addressed, and I did see a commen on pg 2 about the pot meeting the kettle:

I noticed a few comments about people in golf carts accompanying posts about how H/J riders were stuck-up. I can only hope those posts were a joke. How can you judge someone ELSE like that, calling them lesser horsepeople (I did see a comment almost directly suggesting that), and then call THEM stuck-up?

Think what you will about people who don't "do as much work" on the ground as you do (or go read a thread about it in the H/J forum) but IMO it's a bit rich to call someone a snob and then in the same breath mock the way they work with their own horses. Because goodness forbid someone have a groom and ride around in a golf cart :eek:.

If it bothers you that much... buy your own darn golf cart. :grin:

Just my opinion.

shmeg<33
Aug. 12, 2006, 04:04 PM
jeez people...all i have to say is HOW RUDE to have this whole thread about how stuck up and rude and bratty hunters are. i am a hunter rider, and true i probably wouldnt do too well on your eventing horse , but who said that you guys would win everything flawlessly on our hunters?! we are not saying eventing is easy, imho i think it is hard as hell ,and i think all eventers are AMAZING riders, but we are all taught differently as to help us do well in our discipline. so us hunter riders would end up looking like idiots doing your eventing stuff, and you guys proably wouldnt look too hott at a hunter show either(although you would look a hell of alot better on our horses then we would on yours!!;) )

OHHHH ERIN?!? this thread is going NOWHERE.

gubbyz
Aug. 13, 2006, 12:57 AM
Wow, what a kooky thread! H/J riders do not need to apologize or praise anybody on this thread. It was started by someone who obviously has decided based on one barn, what her opinion will be about other riders. Shame on all of you who feel you must be rude to other styles. To each thier own, and every type of riding has its beauty and difficulty. So shut up and ride!!!!

3dayeventing
Aug. 13, 2006, 01:26 AM
The Thread was originally started as a question not a "Bashing session"! Who cares really! I am the one that asked the question and started the thread. I was simply asking if others had experienced any of the similar issues I had. Never once was a stereo type ment to be placed on ANYONE's sport!


Wow, what a kooky thread! H/J riders do not need to apologize or praise anybody on this thread. It was started by someone who obviously has decided based on one barn, what her opinion will be about other riders. Shame on all of you who feel you must be rude to other styles. To each thier own, and every type of riding has its beauty and difficulty. So shut up and ride!!!!

AtLHuNtErJuMpEr
Aug. 13, 2006, 02:11 AM
thank you.
theres no point in each disicipline bashing against eachother, i know i get bashed on enough just for riding! and now riders calling other disiciplines stuck up/snotty etc...? we all ride. we all have a love for the sport. we all have a love for these beautiful animals. whether it be hunters, jumpers, eq, eventing, dressage, western, or whatever. we all are riders and we need to respect eachother for what we do.

Judi
Aug. 13, 2006, 04:30 AM
Well just got back from a cruise... so I'm really sorry to keep this thread going but I just wanted to respond.

The eventers on this board know I was a H/J Eq/Medal rider who came over to the dark side because my horse really started hating his job in H/J land. He was really really bored doing the same course over and over again. (Jumpers were fun for him for about a year but even that got old) Luckily for me he loved Cross Country and we've now found a discipline that makes him HAPPY HAPPY HAPPY to the point he drags me onto the trailer to go anywhere.

I spent 10 years in the H/J world and I have ENORMOUS respect for Hunter riders who can put in that "perfect" ride as I know how difficult it is. I'm grateful for my years of riding to the perfect take off spot... knowing how to take the inside track/roll back to win the jump off.... etc. Jumper riders... you know what I mean...

I now have spent 2 years in the Eventing world and have ENORMOUS respect for event riders as I personally know how much cross training across disciplines we must do.. as stadium is a different ride than X-C and don't get me started on dressage... it humbles me EVERY SINGLE DAY. We must condition our horses and know thier base pulse rates, recovery times... etc. We know every bump and base temperture of our horses legs and these skills go along way in making us COMPLETE horsemen. I am a far better rider than I was two years ago and have the utmost respect for the folks who overcome thier fear to find the thrill of that perfect union of horse and rider FLYING on X-C. I love the supportive atomosphere of the Eventers... if you forget your dressage coat... someone is going to lend you there's.

BUT....

I have observed BAD RIDING in ALL disclipines. Mainly in the lower levels of each discipline which can be tracked back to bad trainers who allow thier riders to ride WAY above thier ability. I believe in the upper levels (higher fences) of the sport people start to get into trouble so you see less of this kind of thing at Prelim or 3'6" jumpers/hunters and above.

BUT... Can I be honest with both sides for a moment?

There is some truth to both sides negative feelings and perceptions about one another.

EVENTERS.. at the lower levels we can see some SCARY SCARY riders who have been allowed to compete WAY above thier ability. Somehow this becomes most evident in the Stadium round as that's what the H/J rider has to compare us with. When they see us ride Stadium (at the lower levels) they want to gasp most times at the bad distances, riders getting left and pulling on their horses mouths etc. There is many a time that I have thought that a lower level event rider's horse sure could benefit from that rider doing a crest release to let go of thier horses mouth and balance their upper body. Unfortunately I've seen too many Training level riders who I felt moved up to soon... (Especially in Stadium)


HUNTERS: has become a "rich persons sport" at the top circuit levels. Indio costs about $3,000/week to compete and at the HITS shows the horses seem to sweat money. When I was riding the Hunters on the A circuit the very same horses won year after year and they were 6 figure beautiful animals. I believe thier riders were good... but I saw the same horse win with various A/A riders as they were leased back and forth. This doesn't mean they don't deserve the ribbons... (they are beautiful animals) but at the 3 foot level it gives the "perception" that it is more about the expensive horse flesh then the tactful ride (as it would be with an OTTB). Also as the levels go up the crest release remains... when it's intended useage has passed (George now bemoans this fact) Also the business of the A/A Hunters and Ponies at the big A circuit barns has created a group of riders who have not learned the basic horsemanship skills neccesary to make good solid decisions for their animals. They rely 100% on their trainers opinion which gives the rest of the horse world a perception that they are weekend warriors... who are Pretending to be horseman. (Again.. I'm not accusing.. just speaking about perception... because of course for every full service A/A rider there is a rider who is doing thier own work.) It's just in the Eventing world this is a rare occurance so you can see where the perception can come from.

JUMPERS: Wow! Before I moved to eventing two years ago I saw just as many scary rides in the lower level jumpers as I do in the lower level stadium event ring. The only difference is in the jumpers the bad riders do a jump off and ask thier horses to do dangerous crazy roll backs and are rewarded with a blue ribbon if they are lucky enough not to take down a rail. I've been beaten by many a dangerous rider when the fences were small enough for them to not get hurt.

BUT FOLKS....

We must look beyond our differences and see what we have in common. We all love our horses.. We all seem to want to better ourselves... our horses. Some love the perfection of hunters... Some love the thrill of jumpers... Some love the thrill of X-C combined with the perfection of dressage and stadium. But we all want the same thing... to be better... to bond with our horses...

So really... can't we all just admit that each of our disciplines has their bad eggs, thier good citizens and call it a day.

Oh and Jumper folks... you'll still see me playing over in your world... And you can bet I'll give you plenty of respect.

: )

judi and rainier

kkj
Aug. 13, 2006, 10:13 AM
Judi that was a great post!

3dayeventing
Aug. 13, 2006, 12:03 PM
Judi,

You are right, respect is given in life to those that give it! I think I have just come across a very interesting group of individuals. There is really only a few in particular!


Well just got back from a cruise... so I'm really sorry to keep this thread going but I just wanted to respond.

The eventers on this board know I was a H/J Eq/Medal rider who came over to the dark side because my horse really started hating his job in H/J land. He was really really bored doing the same course over and over again. (Jumpers were fun for him for about a year but even that got old) Luckily for me he loved Cross Country and we've now found a discipline that makes him HAPPY HAPPY HAPPY to the point he drags me onto the trailer to go anywhere.

I spent 10 years in the H/J world and I have ENORMOUS respect for Hunter riders who can put in that "perfect" ride as I know how difficult it is. I'm grateful for my years of riding to the perfect take off spot... knowing how to take the inside track/roll back to win the jump off.... etc. Jumper riders... you know what I mean...

I now have spent 2 years in the Eventing world and have ENORMOUS respect for event riders as I personally know how much cross training across disciplines we must do.. as stadium is a different ride than X-C and don't get me started on dressage... it humbles me EVERY SINGLE DAY. We must condition our horses and know thier base pulse rates, recovery times... etc. We know every bump and base temperture of our horses legs and these skills go along way in making us COMPLETE horsemen. I am a far better rider than I was two years ago and have the utmost respect for the folks who overcome thier fear to find the thrill of that perfect union of horse and rider FLYING on X-C. I love the supportive atomosphere of the Eventers... if you forget your dressage coat... someone is going to lend you there's.

BUT....

I have observed BAD RIDING in ALL disclipines. Mainly in the lower levels of each discipline which can be tracked back to bad trainers who allow thier riders to ride WAY above thier ability. I believe in the upper levels (higher fences) of the sport people start to get into trouble so you see less of this kind of thing at Prelim or 3'6" jumpers/hunters and above.

BUT... Can I be honest with both sides for a moment?

There is some truth to both sides negative feelings and perceptions about one another.

EVENTERS.. at the lower levels we can see some SCARY SCARY riders who have been allowed to compete WAY above thier ability. Somehow this becomes most evident in the Stadium round as that's what the H/J rider has to compare us with. When they see us ride Stadium (at the lower levels) they want to gasp most times at the bad distances, riders getting left and pulling on their horses mouths etc. There is many a time that I have thought that a lower level event rider's horse sure could benefit from that rider doing a crest release to let go of thier horses mouth and balance their upper body. Unfortunately I've seen too many Training level riders who I felt moved up to soon... (Especially in Stadium)


HUNTERS: has become a "rich persons sport" at the top circuit levels. Indio costs about $3,000/week to compete and at the HITS shows the horses seem to sweat money. When I was riding the Hunters on the A circuit the very same horses won year after year and they were 6 figure beautiful animals. I believe thier riders were good... but I saw the same horse win with various A/A riders as they were leased back and forth. This doesn't mean they don't deserve the ribbons... (they are beautiful animals) but at the 3 foot level it gives the "perception" that it is more about the expensive horse flesh then the tactful ride (as it would be with an OTTB). Also as the levels go up the crest release remains... when it's intended useage has passed (George now bemoans this fact) Also the business of the A/A Hunters and Ponies at the big A circuit barns has created a group of riders who have not learned the basic horsemanship skills neccesary to make good solid decisions for their animals. They rely 100% on their trainers opinion which gives the rest of the horse world a perception that they are weekend warriors... who are Pretending to be horseman. (Again.. I'm not accusing.. just speaking about perception... because of course for every full service A/A rider there is a rider who is doing thier own work.) It's just in the Eventing world this is a rare occurance so you can see where the perception can come from.

JUMPERS: Wow! Before I moved to eventing two years ago I saw just as many scary rides in the lower level jumpers as I do in the lower level stadium event ring. The only difference is in the jumpers the bad riders do a jump off and ask thier horses to do dangerous crazy roll backs and are rewarded with a blue ribbon if they are lucky enough not to take down a rail. I've been beaten by many a dangerous rider when the fences were small enough for them to not get hurt.

BUT FOLKS....

We must look beyond our differences and see what we have in common. We all love our horses.. We all seem to want to better ourselves... our horses. Some love the perfection of hunters... Some love the thrill of jumpers... Some love the thrill of X-C combined with the perfection of dressage and stadium. But we all want the same thing... to be better... to bond with our horses...

So really... can't we all just admit that each of our disciplines has their bad eggs, thier good citizens and call it a day.

Oh and Jumper folks... you'll still see me playing over in your world... And you can bet I'll give you plenty of respect.

: )

judi and rainier

ottb dressage
Aug. 13, 2006, 03:44 PM
well, i have an ottb, but only do dressage, so what do i know. but, having taken lessons from dressage, hunter and event riders i have to say that event riders are the least snobby and most open minded. in my opinion, judging from what i have seen and experienced myself. eventers are the only ones left riding and handling all the different horses, all the breeds at all different levels of the eventing sport. eventers seem to be more honest than the other professionals, willing to get dirt under their nails without acting like they have been put out of their way. they like all the breeds of horses, ride all the horses, and can ride the tough horses. eventers are able to work with that most elusive of all combination the green rider/green horse, mostly because not much scares them and they have a lot of confidence in their abilities as well rounded horseman to help someone else learn to be a well rounded horseman. besides, bucking, rearing, bolting galloping ottbs are their passion, so who worries about that stuff anyways!!!! i do all of my training on my horse myself, but when i do seek help, i find an event rider, my second choice, a very old school hunter rider. dressage instruction in my opinion is generally pretty awful.

3dayeventing
Aug. 13, 2006, 11:38 PM
It's funny that you mentioned "Event riders will and can ride about anything." It reminds me of a Buck Davidson clinic I was in last year. At the beginning of the clinic he asked everyone to tell him their horses name, breed, experience etc. One gal was riding a horse she was unsure of the breeding etc. He said, fair enough, does it jump?

Everyone in the clinic was treated with the same respect. Of all the clinics I have done with Upper level riders, he is the best!!!! Hands down. You are right, eventing is really a tough sport. There are tons and tons of top level jumpers and hunters. When someone says, "name the most memoriable horse in eventing, the same name is repeated. Winsome Adante, Little Tricky. There are maybe a handful of great all around four star horses. :yes:





well, i have an ottb, but only do dressage, so what do i know. but, having taken lessons from dressage, hunter and event riders i have to say that event riders are the least snobby and most open minded. in my opinion, judging from what i have seen and experienced myself. eventers are the only ones left riding and handling all the different horses, all the breeds at all different levels of the eventing sport. eventers seem to be more honest than the other professionals, willing to get dirt under their nails without acting like they have been put out of their way. they like all the breeds of horses, ride all the horses, and can ride the tough horses. eventers are able to work with that most elusive of all combination the green rider/green horse, mostly because not much scares them and they have a lot of confidence in their abilities as well rounded horseman to help someone else learn to be a well rounded horseman. besides, bucking, rearing, bolting galloping ottbs are their passion, so who worries about that stuff anyways!!!! i do all of my training on my horse myself, but when i do seek help, i find an event rider, my second choice, a very old school hunter rider. dressage instruction in my opinion is generally pretty awful.

Irish2theKore
Aug. 13, 2006, 11:49 PM
It's funny that you mentioned "Event riders will and can ride about anything." It reminds me of a Buck Davidson clinic I was in last year. At the beginning of the clinic he asked everyone to tell him their horses name, breed, experience etc. One gal was riding a horse she was unsure of the breeding etc. He said, fair enough, does it jump?

Everyone in the clinic was treated with the same respect. Of all the clinics I have done with Upper level riders, he is the best!!!! Hands down. You are right, eventing is really a tough sport. There are tons and tons of top level jumpers and hunters. When someone says, "name the most memoriable horse in eventing, the same name is repeated. Winsome Adante, Little Tricky. There are maybe a handful of great all around four star horses. :yes:

there are also only a handful of great jumpers and hunters. they have to have the heart to win. in any sport it comes to heart.

hb
Aug. 14, 2006, 01:13 AM
At my daughters local "A" Hunter/Jumper barn they look down on me as an event rider. Almost like we are "lower class." I feel we deserve more credit in the equestrian world! After all we compete in three sports over a few days on one horse. What are your thoughts? Has anyone else gone through this?


Are you sure it is because you are an eventer that they act in a way that you interpret as "looking down" on you?

From what you have posted on this thread, you seem to like to stir things up. You seem to expect undue respect from H/J riders because you feel your discipline is more difficult than theirs. Could "they" be not warming up to you for these reasons instead of your eventing?

ottb dressage
Aug. 14, 2006, 11:37 AM
in general, i just find event riders to be very honest and in general to really put the horse first. which i'm sure is not easy especially when you are competing at the big shows. what i really like about the eventers is that they are able to bring their horses back from extensive injury. i never like seeing a horse hurt, but watching someone bring a horse back to the top after serious injury is awe inspiring. i have been in all the discipline barns, eventers have the biggest, most open hearts for the horse. i have never been in an event barn where i heard screaming, saw horses getting hit, can't say that about other discipline barns i have been in. i keep my horses at home now and handle all my own training, but when i had to take my horses out for training, event instructors were my favorite. they always seemed to be up to their elbows in muck and loving it!

Irish2theKore
Aug. 14, 2006, 04:35 PM
in general, i just find event riders to be very honest and in general to really put the horse first. which i'm sure is not easy especially when you are competing at the big shows. what i really like about the eventers is that they are able to bring their horses back from extensive injury. i never like seeing a horse hurt, but watching someone bring a horse back to the top after serious injury is awe inspiring. i have been in all the discipline barns, eventers have the biggest, most open hearts for the horse. i have never been in an event barn where i heard screaming, saw horses getting hit, can't say that about other discipline barns i have been in. i keep my horses at home now and handle all my own training, but when i had to take my horses out for training, event instructors were my favorite. they always seemed to be up to their elbows in muck and loving it!

one event barn that I was at all the trainer ever did was yell and hit her horses which is one of the reasons I left. another event trainer around here would never hit his horses. I think you're going to find mean people in any sport, including any horse discipline. I don't think it's right to stereotype whether it's in a good way or a bad way.

showmom07
Aug. 14, 2006, 05:31 PM
I think you're going to find mean people in any sport, including any horse discipline. I don't think it's right to stereotype whether it's in a good way or a bad way.

This is true in every aspect of life. There are good and bad people in every walk of life. There are also the stereotypes: Dressage Queens, Hunter Princesses, Eventer Adreneline Junkies. Have met them all. Have also met others that didn't fit any of these.

When my daughter was 14, her 'hunter' was a 5 yo homebred hot OTTB that she won Champion Baby Green on. She also schooled him XC. Her hunter clothes were all second hand.

At 16, her event horse was another hot OTTB older horse that was a seasoned jumper. WOW getting him over the water obstacle was VERY EXCITING! Dressage was interesting, too. But she could get him around a training level course.

Her other mounts were academy horses from a local college, all with 'issues.'
These included QHs, Saddlebreds, Connemaras, WBs, and TBs.

She now does the jumpers on a 6 yo hot homebred OTTB mare and a 5 yo warmblood. Likes the jumpers because judging is more objective.

It was the big eventer kid in our Pony Club that had the GPA helmet, fancy tailored dressage coat with buttons on the vents, the Tadd Coffin saddle, the high-dollar horses, etc, etc. And got to be home-schooled so she could school with BNRs and go to events.

I do think Hunters sometimes attracts snotty teenagers. Many of these are urban kids who ride because it's cool or mom and dad want them to (status symbol). They like to ride OK, but what they REALLY like to do is shop. For these girls it really is all about looking pretty and wearing the latest fashion (and saying catty things about anyone else who doesn't; makes them feel superior and in the clique.) Some of the DQs might be tempted to do this, too, except "fashion" in dressage is pretty rigid.

ottb dressage
Aug. 14, 2006, 05:44 PM
i think it's great that your daughter is able to ride all types of horses, it's a great education and builds character!!!!!!! there is some fashion in dressage, my horse wears a browband and a purple pad with a tb breed logo sewn on. oh well, what do i know anyways, i ride dressage on an ottb and get my instruction from event riders. maybe i should sign up for the white trash dressage classes:)

Trixie
Aug. 14, 2006, 06:05 PM
Hey, I like to shop. ESPECIALLY for my horse. Doesn't make me a princess, just makes me someone that likes to shop. I buy the best quality that I can afford on the thought that it will last for years, half the time it is used but looks new. And damn if it's not clean and pressed.
If that's a stylish brand, that's fine. Lord knows the shirt I'm wearing now came from Target.

Besides, I sit behind my desk to earn money, so it doesn't seem fair that someone should call me a princess because I have this, that, or the next. I like to ride more then I like to shop, but I've got the right to do both without the commentary of other people on how "devoted" or "real" I am. I do the work. Who are you to comment?

I'm hating on the generalizations in this thread. It's just unbelieveable. You don't know me, or my horse, or my situation, nor who pays my bills or how much work I've done to get there.

showmom07
Aug. 14, 2006, 06:23 PM
Hey, I like to shop. ESPECIALLY for my horse. Doesn't make me a princess, just makes me someone that likes to shop. ................ I like to ride more then I like to shop.

No offense intended. That is the salilent point...you like to ride more than shop. No prob w/shopping. It just seems like the be-all, end-all for the true "princesses." Also, their shopping seems to more for themselves, as well as their horse.

You don't sound like you are one of those.

Judi
Aug. 14, 2006, 09:46 PM
Hey, I like to shop. ESPECIALLY for my horse. Doesn't make me a princess, just makes me someone that likes to shop. I buy the best quality that I can afford on the thought that it will last for years, half the time it is used but looks new. And damn if it's not clean and pressed.
If that's a stylish brand, that's fine. Lord knows the shirt I'm wearing now came from Target.

Besides, I sit behind my desk to earn money, so it doesn't seem fair that someone should call me a princess because I have this, that, or the next. I like to ride more then I like to shop, but I've got the right to do both without the commentary of other people on how "devoted" or "real" I am. I do the work. Who are you to comment?

I'm hating on the generalizations in this thread. It's just unbelieveable. You don't know me, or my horse, or my situation, nor who pays my bills or how much work I've done to get there.

Now Trixie. I don't know what thread got you upset... but take it from me... Most eventers in general do NOT spend their time JUDGING anyone if they are fortunate enough to make a good living. There are perceptions of one another that happen from both sides... A good majority of eventers are folks (like myself) who got a bit bored in the Hunter ring and were looking for more of a challenge... to continue to grow. Most of us enjoy shopping JUST as much as you do. And if we can afford it would make the same purchasing choices as you.

BUT

Having been in both worlds... I believe that what we might be seeing here is an "ecomomic cultural" difference. I make a good living as you do... and was able to afford the costs on the "A" circuit. When I moved to eventing I was THRILLED to find that a Horse Trial cost about 1/2 of a 3 day Weekend H/J show and only 1/3 of an AA "HITS" type show.

Many times I will see competitors sleeping in tents or in their trailers at a 3 day/Horse Trial to keep costs down. A good majority of eventers aren't at their trainers barn but trailer in for lessons 2 to 4 times a month, or clinic when they can. This makes a very self reliant type of competitor. They have a hard time understanding the Jumper rider who holds up a ring to wait for their busy trainer before they'll do their course. (Not judging those who do... I know you've paid for thier expertise) If thier X-C saddle rips they'll put duct tape on it until it can be fixed. They have no problem lending tack, gloves, bits or even a dressage coat to someone who has ribbed or busted something. Most competitors cheer one another on very vocally and tell one another how the course rides and give Atta-boy/girls to a great round. It's a very very different world then the one I left.

Perhaps I love eventers because of their fearless spirit.
Perhaps I love eventers because of their versatility.
Perhaps I love eventers because of their generosity.
Perhaps I love eventers because they are resourceful.
Perhaps I love eventers because of thier horsemanship.
Perhaps I love eventers because a horse trial is more than just a ribbon.
Perhaps I love evneters because of the sense of community.

Perhaps I love eventing because ANYONE with the will (not just the pocket book) CAN compete at the top level of the sport right along side the BNR's and they will be encouraged and welcomed into the community.

So H/J riders... please understand the OP's true meaning behind her question. She was in an actual situation where she was "looked down" upon by some silly H/J riders. She's not saying all H/J riders are bad She just felt the need to come on to this board to her "community" and say...

"Hey... why do they look down on us? Can't they see how hard this sport is? Shouldn't they respect us?

The answer from many an understanding and confident H/J rider posts on this thread were a resonding....

YES! WE RESPECT YOU!

Now that's cool.

judi

ottb dressage
Aug. 14, 2006, 10:07 PM
good response, judi.

sidepasser
Aug. 14, 2006, 10:25 PM
Well I tell you what -- I gots da custom Vogels, the Grand Prix jackets, the Essex shirts, the Ariat Pro Circuits, my little GPA knock off and trust me, I know for a fact that ain't gonna win me no ribbons, honey.

Even the purty, expensive horse won't do it for you. When its all said and done, we all, regardless of discipline, still have to sit up there and ride the things.

Hate to say it but you guys sound like you have inferiority complexes over here. Why beat on the H/J people? Like I said, I haven't heard conversation #1 of you guys.

My personal regard for eventing is very high. I cannot imagine having to buy all the equipment. I cannot imagine galloping down to a big jump with a freaking ditch on either side of it without watching my life pass before my eyes. I cannot imagine having to train for three different events. I cannot imagine having to condition for that so that your horse is sound enough to move on to the next phase. My list goes on.

I don't know any H/J people who belittle what you do. I know I would never do it because I'd be scared sh*tless and certainly don't have the stamina for that kind of competition. Give me my three little 2 minute classes and a comfy bed that night and I'm happy.

I don't think you can find a majority in the H/J world that look down on you. Definitely not fair to make blanket statements. We're all horse people -- I think for the most part, we have a strong respect for what it takes to win ANYTHING.

When I saw your temporarytails, I thought "Ah Ha! I have a friend looking for a white tail for her show horse"...lol...I clicked and found "tails of a different variety" altogether. But if you had "temporary tails of a horsey type" I would have sent my friend your way to buy one..she needs white and everyone keeps trying to sell her "cream"..not going to match, alas.

ooh I might add, just to really mix things up, this is for a paint horse in Western Pleasure!

Takes all kinds to keep the horse world interesting, wouldn't it be a boring place if all of us did one discipline? on one type of horse, in one type of clothing, under one type of circumstances?

I like eventing, but I also appreciate a good hunter, and I adore mule shows..ok - so I am STRANGE, but I feel that Ms. Pumpkin is outnumbered 3 to one around here, so I go to a mule show once a year...lol..I also like dressage because I think that discipline is like poetry - the type that flows along and doesn't have harsh stops or overt gestures.

I like eventing's "hell bent for leather" x-c and the absolute friendliness of the people I've met and their down to earthiness. Maybe it's southern eventers, but I'd like to think that even those California eventers are just as down to earth.

I think what it boils down to is I just plain love horses. I know there are snots and brats out there in every discipline, it is the same in the corporate world - but why let it ruin things for you? It is their problem and one day someone will call them on it (I've seen a few VPs call subs on their lack of tact and graciousness).

Enjoy the horses - no matter the sport. I do, I just happen to be embarking on x-c as I like the "daredevil" of it..lol, I guess...I've always been so careful about things, "must be exactly right or I'm toast", so I think if I did hunters I would end up shooting myself cause I can never get things so precise. If I did dressage only, I would be up at odd hours studying obscure horsemen and taking notes (I could really be anal if I let myself).

Oh and I come from a halter and western pleasure background...perfection in large doses there...so I really do enjoy all the "englishy" disciplines. I think I would like foxhunting too, just for the sheer thrill of getting out of the arena and seeing something new. and endurance - WOW, I long to just ride and not be stopped by arena rails or fences..

That is the key my friends to staying young - new things, new ideas, improvement on old things and always staying active and NOT being afraid to learn...

I'm going to be 50 soon..and it's taken me this long to figure out that it really doesn't matter one fig what anyone thinks about me or my horse, it is what I love, what I think, what I am willing to work for, and what I am willing to sacrifice to achieve..that is what matters. Oh and a big dose of having fun.
It's no fun to constantly worry about what others think - that's why I have a honie and she's half arab - she suits me. I also have a mule - Yeeeah, and I have draft belgian, and my TB. None may be your cup of tea, but they are all perfectly suitable for their purpose in my life. They make me happy. What more could I want?

Sidepasser

oreo
Aug. 15, 2006, 12:12 AM
there are eventers who cannot rider their way out of paper bag, completely miss the horsemanship and riding skill part of riding and make you cringe when you see them go,

I really don't want to get embroiled in this (except why am I posting :confused: ) but I would ask, show me an eventer rider that can't ride out of a paper bag and doesn't understand horsemanship, and I'll eat both your and my hat. Maybe I'll make an exception for BN riders but above that - NO WAY :)

Eventers are the best horse people out there - they have to be as their horses actually have to be fit and sound!

I guess I find it a little offensive to hear comments like this. Having switched from the Hunters many years ago, I would never go back. Way too unnatural.

mowgli96
Aug. 15, 2006, 01:49 AM
Ok, I think this thread just needs to die. Face it -- it's going NOWHERE; so get on with your lives:)

Judi
Aug. 15, 2006, 03:18 AM
When I saw your temporarytails, I thought "Ah Ha! I have a friend looking for a white tail for her show horse"...lol...I clicked and found "tails of a different variety" altogether. But if you had "temporary tails of a horsey type" I would have sent my friend your way to buy one..she needs white and everyone keeps trying to sell her "cream"..not going to match, alas.

ooh I might add, just to really mix things up, this is for a paint horse in Western Pleasure!

Takes all kinds to keep the horse world interesting, wouldn't it be a boring place if all of us did one discipline? on one type of horse, in one type of clothing, under one type of circumstances?

I like eventing, but I also appreciate a good hunter, and I adore mule shows..ok - so I am STRANGE, but I feel that Ms. Pumpkin is outnumbered 3 to one around here, so I go to a mule show once a year...lol..I also like dressage because I think that discipline is like poetry - the type that flows along and doesn't have harsh stops or overt gestures.

I like eventing's "hell bent for leather" x-c and the absolute friendliness of the people I've met and their down to earthiness. Maybe it's southern eventers, but I'd like to think that even those California eventers are just as down to earth.

I think what it boils down to is I just plain love horses. I know there are snots and brats out there in every discipline, it is the same in the corporate world - but why let it ruin things for you? It is their problem and one day someone will call them on it (I've seen a few VPs call subs on their lack of tact and graciousness).

Enjoy the horses - no matter the sport. I do, I just happen to be embarking on x-c as I like the "daredevil" of it..lol, I guess...I've always been so careful about things, "must be exactly right or I'm toast", so I think if I did hunters I would end up shooting myself cause I can never get things so precise. If I did dressage only, I would be up at odd hours studying obscure horsemen and taking notes (I could really be anal if I let myself).

Oh and I come from a halter and western pleasure background...perfection in large doses there...so I really do enjoy all the "englishy" disciplines. I think I would like foxhunting too, just for the sheer thrill of getting out of the arena and seeing something new. and endurance - WOW, I long to just ride and not be stopped by arena rails or fences..

That is the key my friends to staying young - new things, new ideas, improvement on old things and always staying active and NOT being afraid to learn...

I'm going to be 50 soon..and it's taken me this long to figure out that it really doesn't matter one fig what anyone thinks about me or my horse, it is what I love, what I think, what I am willing to work for, and what I am willing to sacrifice to achieve..that is what matters. Oh and a big dose of having fun.
It's no fun to constantly worry about what others think - that's why I have a honie and she's half arab - she suits me. I also have a mule - Yeeeah, and I have draft belgian, and my TB. None may be your cup of tea, but they are all perfectly suitable for their purpose in my life. They make me happy. What more could I want?

Sidepasser

Oh Sidepasser... I'm right there with you in coming to eventing later in my "eh-hem" career. And I love the fact that no matter how much I work at it... there will always be something to learn... every day I'm challenged AND humbled... just LOVE IT!

Can you event your mule? Now that would be so AWESOME!.... You'd have a fan club for sure....

good luck.

judi

Irish2theKore
Aug. 15, 2006, 04:34 AM
I really don't want to get embroiled in this (except why am I posting :confused: ) but I would ask, show me an eventer rider that can't ride out of a paper bag and doesn't understand horsemanship, and I'll eat both your and my hat. Maybe I'll make an exception for BN riders but above that - NO WAY :)

Eventers are the best horse people out there - they have to be as their horses actually have to be fit and sound!

I guess I find it a little offensive to hear comments like this. Having switched from the Hunters many years ago, I would never go back. Way too unnatural.

my old event trainer was HORRIBLE to her horses, she treated them and her students like dirt.

I think to ride period you have to be in good physical shape because riding any horse is work. I'd LOVE to see someone out of shape get on my hunter. they wouldn't last 15 minutes without being completely winded.

sidepasser
Aug. 15, 2006, 07:27 AM
Well Ms. Pumpkin could do the jumping part as she can jump four feet cleanly and was shown in open shows before I got her, and she does have a bit of dressage training, but overall, she'd make a better foxhunter type as she is very catty and surefooted. I've trail ridden her all over the place and she loves a good outing, will go over and through almost anything as long as she feels it's safe. I don't think she would make a good eventer as she doesn't have the gracefulness needed for dressage (I tell her she got that from her daddy - a huge mammoth jack that was conformationally challenged). But for a confidence builder and all around safe mount, she is wonderful. I've not seen a mule as an eventer, but the way they are breeding them these days, some mules just look like long eared horses (very refined and good movers). I'm sure eventually I will see one out there, but Pumpkin is semi retired now at age 24..course mules do live a long time so she will likely be toting the grandchildren around for the next ten years..lol.

pinkngreen
Aug. 15, 2006, 08:01 AM
Sidepasser, you should take her up to Big Bear and ride her in a schooling show!

sidepasser
Aug. 16, 2006, 03:51 PM
Hey Pinkngreen - how's that new horse doing? I bet you've been busy with him! I don't know that Ms. Pumpkin would want to see all the horses who have never heard a mule bray running away from her - lol...she might get a complex and think no one loffs her! lol.

It took my Tb a few weeks to get used to her, but now he likes her very much, mainly because she lets him have his way all the time. Same with the belgian mare.

Are you eventing at Poplar Place's next show? I'm going to go watch, so if you are there, maybe I'll be able to see the new horse.

sidepasser
Aug. 16, 2006, 03:54 PM
Hey Pinkngreen - how's that new horse doing? I bet you've been busy with him! I don't know that Pumpkin would want to see the horses who have never heard a mule bray running away from her - lol...she might get a complex and think no one loffs her! lol.

It took my Tb a few weeks to get used to her, but now he likes her very much, mainly because she lets him have his way all the time. Same with the belgian mare.

Are you eventing at Poplar Place's next show? I'm going to go watch, so if you are there, maybe I'll be able to see the you and your new horse.

sidepasser
Aug. 16, 2006, 03:54 PM
Hey Pinkngreen - how's that new horse doing? I bet you've been busy with him! I don't know that Ms. Pumpkin would want to see all the horses who have never heard a mule bray running away from her - lol...she might get a complex and think no one loffs her! lol.

It took my Tb a few weeks to get used to her, but now he likes her very much, mainly because she lets him have his way all the time. Same with the belgian mare.

Are you eventing at Poplar Place's next show? I'm going to go watch, so if you are there, maybe I'll be able to see the new horse.

Janet
Aug. 16, 2006, 04:37 PM
Eventers are NECESSARILY Jacks of All Trades, Masters of None.

Even Olympic eventers do not do dressage to the same level as Olympic dressage riders.

Even Olympic eventers do not jump as high as Olympic show jumpers.

Very few eventers can produce a winning hunter round in top company.

But, by the same token, few dressage specailists or show jumping specialists can ride a safe, clear and fast upper level cross country round.

Big deal. Different skills, but no need for anyone to "look down on".

I have found very little "looking down on". Lots of "not understanding what is involved".

Doodle
Aug. 16, 2006, 04:59 PM
THanks Janet.
Can this thread die now? :yes: