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fastpace
Jun. 1, 2006, 04:29 PM
So...what are everyone's thoughts about this??

Go to: www.oconnoreventteam.com/o'connor%20signature.html (please copy and paste link)

Lily5453
Jun. 1, 2006, 04:37 PM
not my taste, but hey, to each his own. Personally, I miss the smaller barns with a close knit feel.

Robby Johnson
Jun. 1, 2006, 05:11 PM
I just threw up a little in my mouth.

Robby

royal militron
Jun. 1, 2006, 05:13 PM
Robby you just made me spit my iced tea all over my computer! LOL you're way too funny!

Dezi
Jun. 1, 2006, 05:13 PM
Does that mean you are not clinicing with the OCET soon?

lstevenson
Jun. 1, 2006, 05:14 PM
I just threw up a little in my mouth.

Robby


:lol: :lol: :lol:

tommygirl
Jun. 1, 2006, 05:14 PM
I'm with Robby on this one... except it was more than a little!

BarbB
Jun. 1, 2006, 05:21 PM
O M G
:eek:

with a side note for those in Colorado.....doesn't this just scream Highlands Ranch?????:winkgrin:

Regal Grace
Jun. 1, 2006, 05:27 PM
This has a very "Parelli" like marketing angle to it. I know they did something with him at some point as was noted in a book called "In Service to the Horse". I've met Mr. O'Connor twice and he's a very nice guy but this is not "my cup of tea" but to each his own. I suppose they need to make the money where they can, since they are not getting any younger.

Carried Away
Jun. 1, 2006, 05:27 PM
I'm beginning to wonder if there is anything they *won't* try to stick their name on and sell...

adamsmom
Jun. 1, 2006, 05:28 PM
I just threw up a little in my mouth.

Robby

HAHAHAHAHA!

But on a lighter note.....don't make me snort water through my nose! It's not pretty!!

:no:

:winkgrin: :lol: :lol: :lol:

jn4jenny
Jun. 1, 2006, 05:33 PM
Regardless of whether one finds the concept barfy or not, it sure sounds like a PITA to administrate. Certified instructors? Customized lesson programs? Approved stall hardware, or whatever? Running an eventing barn--even a great one--shouldn't be like administrating the NFL!

Robby Johnson
Jun. 1, 2006, 05:36 PM
Just because I don't want that to seem too harsh ...

When I think "Karen O'Connor" I think many things:

1.) Razor-sharp wit and fun-loving sense of humor.
2.) Ridiculously ballsy-but-backed-up-with-skill riding.
3.) Articulate, smart, quick in her thinking.

What I do not think is ANYTHING related to lifestyle. I mean, I've seriously been trying to get her chunkier, paler highlights and a more ragged/razored short hairstyle for at least the past three years. Sister won't budge. Which reminds me of another word to add to my list - "tenacious."

If these "brands" are more related to standards of horsemanship, then my bulimia was in vain. I'd say they're exceptional horsemen.

Though I fail to see how this would really benefit me as a farm owner and, indeed, might even pigeonhole me.

mcm7780
Jun. 1, 2006, 05:40 PM
I mean, I've seriously been trying to get her chunkier, paler highlights and a more ragged/razored short hairstyle for at least the past three years. Sister won't budge.

LMAO Dude, not nice to make me laugh at the computer while I'm at my internship on the psych unit!!! Too bad the admin blocked the page so I can't see it. But...ummm...wanna help me with my hair, too? :yes: I'm good at taking most suggestions!

Bensmom
Jun. 1, 2006, 05:47 PM
I looked over the plan/concept several weeks ago, pretty throroughly, because I'm a little dim, and several things confused me.

Robby, it would do more than pigeonhole you as a farm owner. As a farm owner, if you wanted to have the signature brand, you couldn't run your own farm at all. In other words, it isn't a situation where you can have your facility meet the standards of the management/development company, pass tests/inspection, hire certified workers etc. and either have a new or old facility with the branding.

If you wanted to do this, you have to turn your barn, whether a new facility or an existing one, completely over to the management company.

I guess if you were the sort of farm owner that wanted to turn over the running of your barn to a company completely, it might be beneficial. Otherwise, I couldn't see where it would be beneficial at all.

I guess I was really interested in how it was going to work, as I have *tremendous* admiration for the way their barn runs, but the way it is actually going to be set up just struck me as odd.

Anyway, anyone know anyone who is actually planning to create one of these facilities?


What I do not think is ANYTHING related to lifestyle. I mean, I've seriously been trying to get her chunkier, paler highlights and a more ragged/razored short hairstyle for at least the past three years. Sister won't budge. Which reminds me of another word to add to my list - "tenacious."


:lol: :lol: :lol:

Tom King
Jun. 1, 2006, 05:56 PM
It will surprise me if there are any takers. Maybe in some super competitive market between money is no object facilities. I've never been to one of those markets though. Too country I guess.

sfir
Jun. 1, 2006, 06:03 PM
First one is already being built several miles from us in Lake City, Florida.
Ruthie

BarbB
Jun. 1, 2006, 06:08 PM
I'm afraid I would run the other way. A barn run by a remote corporation is not my cup of tea.
I think this might be a way for horse admirers with no actual horse experience to own/run an equestrian center. They would rely on the (distant) corporation to make decisions for them.
That may work for McDonalds, but it won't work for most horse owners.

twowillows
Jun. 1, 2006, 06:13 PM
Okay, if they make that work more power to them. But as a farm owner it sounds like a very expensive means to I am not sure what!!! So let me get this straight, you buy the property, build all the buildings to there standard
(complete with approved stall fronts and hardware just to start) and of course that doesn't even include the arenas etc (probably plural!) Then you pay for there staffing services thru there management company and of course if you get clients after they see all the restrictions and then the bill you will be lucky to cover your investment cost (which will take forever considering they will likely take a big cut of what comes in, you don't think they would put there name on something for nothing!) Oh another thing I don't think they will locate these facilities anywhere that isn't posh with reasonably priced land! We are in the real estate development business and this just doesn't even sound like something that would fly! Not unless they tap into so big developers with alot of money and patience for return on there investment. But hey they don't have much to lose because if you read closely they aren't making the investment they are looking for suckers to do it!!! Good luck
Sorry just my two cents Flame suit zipped!!

hamish macbeth
Jun. 1, 2006, 06:29 PM
I am scared to click on the link, what happens, I think I might crawl back to the safe stall crawling at IEA

snoopy
Jun. 1, 2006, 06:47 PM
When I read this...I was worried about posting my reaction....but most seem to share my disbelief at their continued arrogance. Yes they have acheived great results but enough is enough with them. I am frankly sick to death with the way in which they seem to think that all most come on board to their way of thinking. Quite frankly they rub me up the wrong way. Time to let sleeping dogs lie. Or put the oconnors to sleep!!:confused:

YUCK YUCK YUCK!!!!

flutie1
Jun. 1, 2006, 07:20 PM
These things never work. Haven't they done any market research?

Flutie

Jeannette, formerly ponygyrl
Jun. 1, 2006, 10:43 PM
How many threads do we see where barn owners are stressing over finding and keeping good barn managers and barn help?

How many threads do we see where boarders are stressing over finding good care for their horses?

And that's even before we get to the threads about finding good instruction...

Dunno 'bout the custom stall fronts, but if I heard there was a barn going in nearby w/a barn manager who had spent time at OCET, and was vouched for by them? Sounds interesting.

I agree, if it's tied to a "horse community" I haven't heard great things about those working out long term, but it doesn't necessarily need to be tied in, does it?

I would love to see what the required design elements are... And the financial projections/board rates...

hb
Jun. 1, 2006, 11:24 PM
At first thought it made me queasy also.

But, then I read through it and realized, I'm not their target market! This isn't a cookie-cutter approach for eventers. It is designed to develop:

"An inclusive environment that attracts new equestrians of all disciplines "

It's to set standards for entry-level lesson/boarding programs.

Let's say you have a kid that loves horses. Or let's say you had a backyard horse as a kid but haven't ridden since, and your youngest child just moved out and now it's time to go back to something for YOU. And you have enough money to spring for lessons and possibly a horse if the interest sticks.

You look around and find a dozen boarding/training stables in your area. How do you know which ones have a good beginners lesson program? How do you know which ones take proper care of the horses?

If you aren't currently connected to the equestrian community, it might be difficult to figure out. Even if you are connected, it can be difficult. There are a lot of barns out there that look great on the surface but don't take great care of the horses. And you can't always tell by price either.

There are a lot of trainers and instructors who have a busy lesson program and yet are weak in the basics, or don't teach the basics well, and their students hit a plateau and then get frustrated.

This might be a good idea for the target market.

But I'll just keep my horse at home, in a non-branded environment!

oreo
Jun. 1, 2006, 11:31 PM
Preferably green puke.

That's all I can say.

Mary in Area 1
Jun. 1, 2006, 11:41 PM
Wait! I want my new farm to be a ROBBY JOHNSON approved center! What do y'all think of THAT???

tannaman
Jun. 1, 2006, 11:42 PM
what makes the OCET/facility great, is having Karen & David run it personally and being involved in the everyday operations and training. even if K&D ran one of these facilites remotely, it still wouldn't be the same. its one thing to have a horse van just like the OCET, but a whole operation and facility is a little over the top.

in my opinion, when professionals commercialize at this level, they start to lose their personal appeal to the majority of people they would normally appeal too. sorry, but this is just way to familiar to the Parelli way of thinking and marketing and I already stay clear of anyone who tells me what Parelli level they are.

what next? OCET certified instructors?

Bensmom
Jun. 2, 2006, 12:23 AM
Jeanette -- your points are what made me keep reading the info -- I am impossible as a boarder, which is why I lease and run a small facility of my own. So, I was curious as to whether something that is supposed to be run to their standards would work.

I decided, after reading through it, that it wouldn't, for me, anyway.

I realized, as hb said, that people like me aren't the target audience for this sort of setup. I am so much too much of a control freak for a setup such as this planned one.

It will, however, be interesting to see how it plays out.

And, I would be VERY interested in a signature RBJ barn. I might be willing to totally switch careers and get trained and certified to run such a wonderous place! :D Would the managers hired to run RBJ signature barns get compulsory makeovers once a quarter? :D :lol: I LOVE this idea! :yes:

lstevenson
Jun. 2, 2006, 12:35 AM
what next? OCET certified instructors?


I think they are already working on that.:uhoh:

Judi
Jun. 2, 2006, 12:39 AM
I just threw up a little in my mouth.

Robby

OMG... Robby... I did... I really did... just a little....

ick

Judi
Jun. 2, 2006, 01:19 AM
At first thought it made me queasy also.

But, then I read through it and realized, I'm not their target market! This isn't a cookie-cutter approach for eventers. It is designed to develop:

"An inclusive environment that attracts new equestrians of all disciplines "

It's to set standards for entry-level lesson/boarding programs.
!

But really I can't imagine how much this would have to cost to make up for the above the line costs beyond just feeding and caring for your horses. I'm with Robby regarding respecting the O'Connors as horse people... but I just think this is an idea that doesn't have a good business case or ROI attached to it. And I can only imagine the bad press this could eventually create for the O'Connors when people lose thier shirts on the investment. I wouldn't do it if I were them.... but of course I'm not them. I'm just a Marketing Executive... what do I know.

Glimmerglass
Jun. 2, 2006, 01:41 AM
From a designer perspective isn't this just going to the next level of doing what IED/Robert Jolicoeur (http://www.iedsopra.com/ourprofile.htm) does with branding a facility as having a Jolicoeur course and other IED designed facilities?

"A cross country course designed by David O'Connor"
I'll concur however that its rather ungainly to use the "name" in such a brash, loud and repetitive sense on so many elements. As if its almost an Austin Powers spoof on some mega-corporation slapping its name on everything.

AppJumpr08
Jun. 2, 2006, 03:13 AM
"An inclusive environment that attracts new equestrians of all disciplines "

It's to set standards for entry-level lesson/boarding programs.

Let's say you have a kid that loves horses. Or let's say you had a backyard horse as a kid but haven't ridden since, and your youngest child just moved out and now it's time to go back to something for YOU. And you have enough money to spring for lessons and possibly a horse if the interest sticks.

You look around and find a dozen boarding/training stables in your area. How do you know which ones have a good beginners lesson program? How do you know which ones take proper care of the horses?

If you aren't currently connected to the equestrian community, it might be difficult to figure out. Even if you are connected, it can be difficult. There are a lot of barns out there that look great on the surface but don't take great care of the horses. And you can't always tell by price either.

There are a lot of trainers and instructors who have a busy lesson program and yet are weak in the basics, or don't teach the basics well, and their students hit a plateau and then get frustrated.

This might be a good idea for the target market.

But I'll just keep my horse at home, in a non-branded environment!



All inclusive if you are a billionaire. Seriously, I can't see your average entry level rider being able to afford an O'C Signature Facility....!!!!
I'm not a fan of the O'Cs in general anyway...so I'm not really the one to express an opinion without bias... But I agree with Robby and several others... I definately did throw up in my mouth a bit!!!

Dale Area 1
Jun. 2, 2006, 08:47 AM
Speechless! My mouth is still open. Is there anything that they won't try to put their name on and sell?

Muck r us
Jun. 2, 2006, 09:02 AM
Wait! I want my new farm to be a ROBBY JOHNSON approved center! What do y'all think of THAT???

Will someone please get Karen something from the Robby Johnson signature line of helmet covers? Her old blue one is so faded it is looking grey now. :)

snoopy
Jun. 2, 2006, 09:37 AM
Didn't Hitler come up with a similar plan some years ago...!!!!!:no:

Dezi
Jun. 2, 2006, 10:12 AM
Since RBJ is traveling today, here are some manditory requirements:

1. Tack must be cleaned after each ride (I would be kicked out immediately)
2. Horse must be groomed, mane pulled, hooves at least picked out (again, I am a gonner)
3. Owner must not be thinner, cuter, or have whiter teeth than RBJ! (OK, I could stay if this was not the only requirement).

OTOH, there would be an onsite facial, mani/pedi, and massage day spa!!!

isheventer
Jun. 2, 2006, 10:22 AM
It's a bit nauseating, but I have a lot of respect for the O'Connors and the first thing the website says is that the O'Connor Signature Series is akin to a Palmer of Nicklaus golf course. It's also akin, albeit on a much lesser scale to any rider who's name is attached to saddles and tack i.e. Pessoa. Looks to me like this is a marketing tool used by Equestrian LLC to sell their services to Real Estate developers who are planning equestrian resort type living communities. They are setting a standard (or brand) so that say Toll Brothers might decided to add an equestrian theme to one of their communities - who would they turn to design it - So a business like this offers a "brand" which is designed to set a certain standard. Much like Anchor stores at malls do you want Nordstrom or K-Mart - or hotels. When you check into a Holiday Inn or Four Seasons you pretty much know what to expect.

Think what you want but it's actually a pretty good idea and hey if it helps develop more riding spaces and less McMansions I'm all for it

InVA
Jun. 2, 2006, 10:40 AM
They will stop at nothing! Isn't their 15 minutes over??

I saw David at Magpies (maxwell's) friday night so I assume it is an Oconnor endorsed bar?? WHEW!

I guess they are just trying to provide for their future but I though that was jackie and vita's job... (ouch!) ;-)

flypony74
Jun. 2, 2006, 10:45 AM
My first thought was "hokey!" Although I do have a great amount of respect for the O'Connors and their vast accomplishments, this is a little much.

I think this program must be targeted at the wealthy land owner who wants to do something horsey with their property, but prefers a hands-off approach. They write the checks and never have to touch a horse. I don't see how this could appeal to some of the nice facilities that exist, and are run by people who put the blood, sweat, and tears into providing excellent care for their horses.

HelenC
Jun. 2, 2006, 10:49 AM
Didn't Hitler come up with a similar plan some years ago...!!!!!:no:

Ouch!...that seems a bit harsh.

magnolia73
Jun. 2, 2006, 10:54 AM
You know, it's not a bad idea, especially for a stable targeted to more novice riders. Look at all the people who now knowing any better, hook up with bad trainers. Here's a chance to have a competent facility marketed in a way that makes sense to people who may not be that knowledgeable (think non-horsey parents). Plus, they can know that there is a set standard at the facility which was determined by people at the top level of the sport.

JSwan
Jun. 2, 2006, 10:54 AM
These folks are a bit behind the times - I just read in the Chronicle that a robot has been developed to teach a person to ride a horse. It costs about 56K - much cheaper than a fancy facility and you don't actually have to bother with a real horse at all!

Eclectic Horseman
Jun. 2, 2006, 10:57 AM
Good for them! Give the Parelli's and other NH marketers a run for their money! If you can't beat 'em, join 'em. It's about time. :cool:

InVA
Jun. 2, 2006, 10:58 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoopy
Didn't Hitler come up with a similar plan some years ago...!!!!!

Ouch!...that seems a bit harsh.


Does it? I guess you've never worked for the "team"?! haha!

Fence2Fence
Jun. 2, 2006, 11:00 AM
I agree with Isheventer's train of thought on this one--it's targeted for real estate developers. I think the certified instructors the webpage refers to is the USEA's program. Just a guess.

I would much rather see the O'Connors slap their namebrand on this and help preserve and create a niche for the equine heritage in our rapidly developing neighborhoods.

I just bought a turn key horse farm, barely ten acres, and I can't believe how much I'm shelling out for it. It doesn't even have a McMansion on it and the place needs work. It's unbelievable!

We are quickly losing our riding spaces, land is prohibitive due to development, and while this appears like the O'Connors are brand slapping, I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt on this--they are thinking about the long term success of the eventing community.

Mariequi
Jun. 2, 2006, 11:00 AM
"I just threw up a little in my mouth.

Robby"

I love you even more. TenaciousK - that be Karen.

InVA
Jun. 2, 2006, 11:04 AM
Quote: "--they are thinking about the long term success of the eventing community."


RIIIGGGHHT! THat's IT! they're thinking about THE REST OF US!!

RIIIGGGGHHHTTTT!!!! You keep thinking that if it makes you happy!

fernie fox
Jun. 2, 2006, 11:12 AM
:eek: This is going in 5 miles up the road from me.

When they joined up with Parellis that did it for me.

No site plans available yet,24 stall barn is supposed to be going on the property,they are right on top of the Springs Area,so their run off and muck management had better be good.

The land is being cleared now.

I cant see it taking off.

UNLESS all the pareli guys move in?Which they may well.:lol:

snoopy
Jun. 2, 2006, 11:19 AM
I guess they are just trying to provide for their future but I though that was jackie and vita's job... (ouch!) ;-)[/QUOTE]


HA!!! I LOVE this comment...very brave of you to write it but OH HOW TRUE!!!;)

Must be nice to have a sugar mama worth 33 BILLION dollars at the time she RECEIVED her inheritance. Honest to god, that is what EACH of the "Mars" children recieved!:eek: !

ZELLA
Jun. 2, 2006, 11:20 AM
I also agree with Isheventer. It looks to me that this concept is geared towards large resorts and/or to high-end real estate developments--not so much to existing barns. I would go further to guess that their model might be the the Gleneagles golf resort in Scotland. The equestrian facility there began its life as the Mark Phillips Equestrian Centre. I did a working student stint there to prep for BHS exams. All the stable work was done by us working students. They had a manager, efficient office staff, and a well-qualified head instructor who in turn taught the other instructors, all of whom were working their way up the BHS certification ladder. The clientele was mostly resort guests with a few boarders and local customers--but you had to be a member, as if in a country club. Needless to say, it wasn't cheap.

Of course, the O'Connors could have learned much about this from Captain My Captain...but another big player in the early days of Gleneagles Equestrian Centre was Willliam Micklem, the Irish agent for many of their great horses.

grzywinskia
Jun. 2, 2006, 11:55 AM
First off,
Robby I have read many of your posts and you are ABSOLUTELY hysterical!!! (and right...) I think this is the OCET's way of wrangling in as much dough as they can while people will pay for it. I personally think it's ludacris. I am with those of you who jumped off board when the Parelli thing started. I am not taking anything away from these gifted athletes but I don't think they have managed themselves in the best way :( I took a clinic with David before he won his gold medal (and pre-Parelli) and it was great and insightful. I took another clinic with him post-gold medal and Parelli and was very disappointed... Just my two cents.

FrittSkritt
Jun. 2, 2006, 11:56 AM
They should put some of that barn-building profit money into revamping their website... :dead:

As much as I respect the O'Connors for their riding skills, etc, etc, this is pretty bad... really, what's next? Horses being freeze branded with the OCET logo?

DizzyMagic
Jun. 2, 2006, 01:16 PM
...doesn't this thread seem pointlessly snarky?

Looking4Trouble
Jun. 2, 2006, 01:21 PM
One of these are supposed to be coming to property right down the road from me and I am very excited! As of this point I am like one of the only english riders in this area and it will be nice to drawn in some other people!

BarbB
Jun. 2, 2006, 01:28 PM
If this is supposed to develop equestrian communities, as someone already said, those don't work. There are several gated communities in the Denver area with an empty (nice) barns, arenas and trails, boarded up, fenced off as an attractive nuisance because it just never took off.
And this is Colorado where everybody claims to be able to ride. (or at least wear a cowboy hat).
My biggest concern would be inexperienced horse people dabbling in this.
Well intentioned but with no background.
I board at a barn with two owners, currently in a legal dispute over ownership. One owner is experienced with horses, the other thinks the place should be a financial gold mine :lol: .....it has turned into a nightmare for the boarders who have to fight on a daily basis for the financially motivated owner to buy decent feed, decent hay, fix broken fences etc.
Boarding looks profitable from the outside, but it takes business and horse savy to make a go of it. Knowledge that you can't get over the phone or by reading some instructions.

isheventer
Jun. 2, 2006, 01:49 PM
If you look at the Equestrian Services LLC website you'll see its a marketing tool. I'm sure one of the other riders/trainers/FEI course designer who has also lent his expertise/testimonial to their website is wishing HE had a signature series.

It's really no different than Krya K clothes, Pessoa, Nona Garson & other "signature" saddles, Air "Jordan" nikes, King Ranch Ford Truck series etc.
K-Mart and Martha Stewart ! ha ha ha.

If some business asked me to attach my name, expertise, and reputation to a product - and get paid for it - I'm there !

fernie fox
Jun. 2, 2006, 01:57 PM
:eek: The real estate owner is known as ""Big D "".:yes: Or Big D plantation.

I have to stop I am about to get a serious fit of the giggles.

InVA
Jun. 2, 2006, 01:59 PM
[QUOTE=BarbB]My biggest concern would be inexperienced horse people dabbling in this.
Well intentioned but with no background.

That's the thing - you don't have to be able to RIDE...you just need to have a CHECKBOOK!!!

farmgirl88
Jun. 2, 2006, 02:09 PM
So what is this? A bunch of new barns ging up with their name tagged on it? if so I think it'd be great. exclusively designed barns and such and the O'conners are wonderful people who take great pride in what they do. If they want to do it, let them. We all have our own little adventures in life and if this is something they have the ability to do and are interested in going forth with it, WHY NOT? Who are we t say their decision is wrong? So far I think their methods have paid off in the end along with their decisions regarding horses. If they are just making products for the horse industry, i say GOOD FOR THEM. Hey if they have the money and the ability to do something like this...GOOD FOR THEM.I nornally dont venture onto this part of COTH, but for crying out loud could you people be respectful of the O'Conners. They have done what many of you might never do in a lifetime and they have given so much to both the USEF and the eventing, and the olympic scene and I just can't fathom that you people are bad mouthing them and their decisions. If you think its a bad idea, fine...keep your mouth shut and be respectful. We are all individuals with our own individual decisions. If they are rich and can ride....good for them...if they want to spend their money doing this...good for them...its none of your concern. If you think its a bad idea...alrighty then..dont buy any of the products

fernie fox
Jun. 2, 2006, 02:16 PM
I live very close to this
'developement.

there is no mention of a cross country course,or competitions of any sort...yet..

All I have been told is there will be a Number of homes built on this tract of land,with 24 stall barn and small arena,for people to stable their horses.

When I hear more I will let you know.

BigRuss1996
Jun. 2, 2006, 02:30 PM
LMAO............what a crock! Thanks....I needed a laugh today!!




So...what are everyone's thoughts about this??

Go to: www.oconnoreventteam.com/o'connor%20signature.html (please copy and paste link)

farmgirl88
Jun. 2, 2006, 02:31 PM
rude and obnoxious....

BarbB
Jun. 2, 2006, 02:39 PM
If they want to do it, let them. We all have our own little adventures in life and if this is something they have the ability to do and are interested in going forth with it, WHY NOT? Who are we t say their decision is wrong?

I hardly think that a discussion about this sort of venture on COTH will affect them in any way. It's a public sort of discussion in a public place about a marketing tactic.

farmgirl88
Jun. 2, 2006, 02:42 PM
You people are being RUDE AND OBNOXIOUS with the most unbelievable comments I have ever heard. Honestly..is there any need to bash and make fun of these great proffessionals for wanting to do such a thing. Im sure it doesnt matter to them, I'm sure if they're reading, they're laughing their ass off at how immature you all are

cyberbay
Jun. 2, 2006, 02:43 PM
Well, on one hand, there is never-endin' talk about making equestrian sport 'more like' the big 4. So, the O'Connors are making $ off endorsements, which is what this barn/facility management sounds like to me...and something elite and famous athletes do in their own sports, like Tiger Woods, etc.

On the other hand, is it just me or does any one else see the 'cult of the O'connors' ? David's regular brow-beating of the COTH btwn the rounds readership, using such terms as (I had Robby's alimentary reversal here myself when reading this) "Do you believe?" when talking about,I think it was about getting good horses under good riders or something like that; and his active, through his passivity, role in the demise of the traditional 3-day? I see their horses, or at least their students' horses going around with all this Parelli stuff hanging off their bridles... It's just weird, cultish stuff to me, other accomplishments aside...

fernie fox
Jun. 2, 2006, 02:46 PM
Well,now I have looked at their site,I see they are planning the following.

Us locals obviously are not in the loop here.

Looks like fun,but that is an awful lot of houses to put on that land.

I like the idea of a crosscountry course that close to home.

Wow,this is what they are planning,start in 2007.


[1,222 rolling acres filled with mature oak trees
240 one to five-acre lots
A 24+ stall barn
Competition-quality riding arenas
A cross country course designed by David O'Connor
O'Connor-specified covered round-pen
More than 15 miles of looped riding trails
Multiple park-like open spaces associated with each neighborhood within the community.

Judi
Jun. 2, 2006, 07:59 PM
Well,now I have looked at their site,I see they are planning the following.

Us locals obviously are not in the loop here.

Looks like fun,but that is an awful lot of houses to put on that land.

I like the idea of a crosscountry course that close to home.

Wow,this is what they are planning,start in 2007.


[1,222 rolling acres filled with mature oak trees
240 one to five-acre lots
A 24+ stall barn
Competition-quality riding arenas
A cross country course designed by David O'Connor
O'Connor-specified covered round-pen
More than 15 miles of looped riding trails
Multiple park-like open spaces associated with each neighborhood within the community.

Wow! Any pricing listed on the site?

pwynnnorman
Jun. 3, 2006, 10:11 PM
I too am really stunned by the tone of some of these posts. Where exactly do YOU find the leadership in our horse sports? Where do YOU find the "thinking out of the box" progressiveness that will keep horse sports--especially English seats--sufficiently supported in this day of strained budgets and fierce competition?

Not every idea or venture or even "gimmick" works, but I gotta tell you folks something: I have a LOT more admiration for those who at least TRY to advance the industry than for those who do little but moan and whine about "how things used to be" and stubbornly refuse to address, anticipate and/or compensate for how things are changing, including how to finance the sport. (Why do resent someone's need to make a living, especially when so much of that need involves staying at the forefront of the sport? It's not like they're out there buying condos in Monaco with what their efforts earn them.)

Look around you, folks. "Packaging" your pleasures is increasingly becoming the norm. The most popular equestrian sports are those neatly "packaged" so that even busy, ignorant, talentless, timid, distracted--whatever--people can participate and enjoy. And the same situation applies to planned communities, some of which--in spite of the silly anecdotal evidence some have provided--have been very successful for years. The Villages is a great example, in fact, and there are quite a few similar examples in Florida. What they offer are the assurances one gets when dealing wtih PROFESSIONALS.

[My goodness, I just thought of an even better example: Lende shipping boots! My word, now there's a product illustrates exactly I mean about leadership, innovation, thinking out of the box, applying professional experience in constructive ways, cooperative ventures, etc., etc., etc.!]

That's not saying that all pros are perfect. However, I have no doubt that even you high critics recognize how much easier and less frustrating it is to to just hand things over to someone else and rely on their guarentee (of satisfaction). Doesn't matter whether it's training a horse or building a barn, buying real estate or protecting a horse's legs while shipping it. (How many of you can wrap a horse's leg well enough to protect it as well as the Lende design?) Come on, folks. You KNOW (I just know you do) that, increasingly, we live in a "do it for me" era. Heck, eventing is a comparatively tiny sport probably specifically because someone CAN'T do it for you (unlike cutters and hunters, for example).

Eventers, yours is often an admirable, independent, do-it-yourself approach to life. It distinguishes you (some of you) distinctly from other types of riders. But, gee whiz, are you really as simplistically narrow minded as to be incapable of seeing other viewpoints, other lifestyles, other needs and desires as your posts imply? Your ridicule-it, knee-jerk reaction to this idea is incredibly negative and even a little sad. How about a little "Yeah, go for it--it's worth a try" spirit here?

Lookout
Jun. 4, 2006, 01:18 AM
Well,now I have looked at their site,I see they are planning the following.

Looks like fun,but that is an awful lot of houses to put on that land.

[1,222 rolling acres filled with mature oak trees
240 one to five-acre lots
A 24+ stall barn
Competition-quality riding arenas
A cross country course designed by David O'Connor
O'Connor-specified covered round-pen
More than 15 miles of looped riding trails
Multiple park-like open spaces associated with each neighborhood within the community.

Five acres per house is a pretty decent sized lot. One horse per ten houses, that doesn't sound like a lot of horsepeople.
What is the big deal? Doesn't sound like there's a whole lot that can be done to "customize" something like this, especially if they have to talk about minor details like stallguards :rolleyes:

Robby Johnson
Jun. 4, 2006, 09:32 AM
(How many of you can wrap a horse's leg well enough to protect it as well as the Lende design?)

Me. And I'm not even a C-3 Pony Clubber.


Your ridicule-it, knee-jerk reaction to this idea is incredibly negative and even a little sad. How about a little "Yeah, go for it--it's worth a try" spirit here?

Are you freaking kidding me? Show us some numbers, pwynn, on how much this is going to cost an average consumer, and then relate it back to one of your lengthy diatribes on fairness/equality/efficiency.

The difference here, as I see it, is that a golfer going to a JN-Signature course has the means to make that happen whereas an "entry-level eventer" may not. Or, worse, may, and may not know that there is a much more practical, cost-efficient way to manage a horse and enjoy this sport.

At the USEA level, there is a huge undertone of keeping this sport accessible, and bringing in the larger population of eventers who participate at even lower/unrecognized levels and competitions. What standard or expectation does this set for them?

But you're right, this isn't the cross OCET should have to bear - they're not responsible for making USEA and eventing accessible and user-friendly. So I respect and support their right to launch this initiative. I am all for laissez faire business environments and certainly wish them well in their endeavor.

As a communications professional, however, I'd echo back to flutie's honest question about market research ... what sort of research did they do? Granted this is a minor, minor population, but it would appear to me the majority of the impressions has been "not favorable." Maybe they did other market research that focuses on their demographic and had reason to believe this would be wildly successful. If not, I certainly wouldn't want to be faced with selling this product or concept to anyone.

There comes a time in everyone's life, regardless of what we're doing, where we must recognize our "have" or "have not" status. I am proud to admit I would fall into the "have not" category here, and think even if I "had," I probably wouldn't see the need to align myself in an operation like this. Maybe if I were prelim+ and had really specific upper-level competitive goals, but even then I'd want to be in the barn with OCET, not at a satellite location.

Robby

p.s. The RBJ Signature Barn criteria list are:

1.) Fully-stocked bar, with mandatory red wine at 5 p.m. daily.
2.) Clean clean and more clean and, oh yeah, clean.
3.) Sense of humor. You'll need it when forced to dance on the stripper pole, which must be regulation size and height.
4.) Barn aisle walk-offs. If you cannot walk, you will learn.
5.) Book club. You must learn to enjoy reading.
6.) Divorce club. It seems they're inevitable. And so we embrace the ritual of laying hands upon the wounded and lifting up their spirit through the equine experience.
7.) Fashion advice. If you slip into "too much horseperson" you will be admonished and placed on probation. Upon integration of cute clothing, you'll be back in. No hard feelings.
8.) Hair/makeup/spa. Ditto.
9.) No whining, no wimps. (OK, you can be wimpy but, again, the laying of hands upon your wimpiness must commence until you at least adopt the "try it once before you wimp out" philosophy ... thank you Ralph Hill!)
10.) Absolutely positively under no circumstances are black breeches allowed.

BarbB
Jun. 4, 2006, 09:43 AM
Not every idea or venture or even "gimmick" works, but I gotta tell you folks something: I have a LOT more admiration for those who at least TRY to advance the industry

Personally, I think this sport has already suffered enough recently at the hands of those who "try to advance the industry."

And it had more appeal as a sport than an industry.

flutie1
Jun. 4, 2006, 11:31 AM
Robby - where do I sign up for your Signature Barn? Do I have to bring a horse or can I just drink red wine, read books, overtly manifest total intolerance toward whiners, and laugh a whole lot?
Have dachshunds, will travel!

Flutie

Looking4Trouble
Jun. 4, 2006, 11:37 AM
:eek: The real estate owner is known as ""Big D "".:yes: Or Big D plantation.

I have to stop I am about to get a serious fit of the giggles.


Wow~ We are not far from each other. Now I can add another english riding person to the list of a few!

Paks
Jun. 4, 2006, 12:10 PM
First thing to hit my mind was gee just what the horse industry needs royalty payments on horse facilities.

The other one in the far extreme can see O'Conner selected and trained event horses in O'Conner boarding facilities with O'Conner equipment on O'Conner designed cross country courses. I perfer diversity.

lstevenson
Jun. 4, 2006, 12:15 PM
Personally, I think this sport has already suffered enough recently at the hands of those who "try to advance the industry."

And it had more appeal as a sport than an industry.


Well said.:yes:

dianad
Jun. 4, 2006, 12:25 PM
Personally, I don't see the big deal. It doesn't sound like anything that too many on this board would do as we are all pretty independent and educated anyway. I don't want to board anywhere, but that's me.

But, I can certainly see some good things about it in general, as it seems to me these 'developers' are developing a lot of equestrian communities with very little equestrian knowledge. There is a HUGE one (western) not far from me here, very expensive, growing all the time. I took the Open House tour a couple weeks ago... I was amazed at the footing. Dirt. With some rocks. They already tried and failed a 'rental horse' riding program, for people in the development to be able to rent a trail horse and ride their private trails. Sounded pretty disasterous to me.

I guess I just don't understand all the negativity.

Robby Johnson
Jun. 4, 2006, 01:16 PM
Robby - where do I sign up for your Signature Barn? Do I have to bring a horse or can I just drink red wine, read books, overtly manifest total intolerance toward whiners, and laugh a whole lot?
Have dachshunds, will travel!

Flutie

No horse necessary! Saturdays are champagne day!

colliemom
Jun. 4, 2006, 02:00 PM
Eventers, yours is often an admirable, independent, do-it-yourself approach to life. It distinguishes you (some of you) distinctly from other types of riders.

And this is precisely why I don't like this whole thing, as many have stated. To me, it is less about thinking outside the box for the good of the entire sport, and more about "do it our way because we are the only ones who know anything."

Eventers ARE independent people. And in horse sports and horse care, there are many "right answers" and many "right methods" of training. But with this sort of thing, that independent outlook and diversity is being discouraged (and I have come to that conclusion from other things I've seen and heard at national meetings and such.)

It also smacks of encouraging the ever widening chasm between the rich horse industry and the shoe-string do it yourself-ers. Another way this sport is changing for the worse, in my opinion.

Nope. Don't like it.

Bensmom
Jun. 4, 2006, 02:06 PM
p.s. The RBJ Signature Barn criteria list are:

1.) Fully-stocked bar, with mandatory red wine at 5 p.m. daily.
2.) Clean clean and more clean and, oh yeah, clean.
3.) Sense of humor. You'll need it when forced to dance on the stripper pole, which must be regulation size and height.
4.) Barn aisle walk-offs. If you cannot walk, you will learn.
5.) Book club. You must learn to enjoy reading.
6.) Divorce club. It seems they're inevitable. And so we embrace the ritual of laying hands upon the wounded and lifting up their spirit through the equine experience.
7.) Fashion advice. If you slip into "too much horseperson" you will be admonished and placed on probation. Upon integration of cute clothing, you'll be back in. No hard feelings.
8.) Hair/makeup/spa. Ditto.
9.) No whining, no wimps. (OK, you can be wimpy but, again, the laying of hands upon your wimpiness must commence until you at least adopt the "try it once before you wimp out" philosophy ... thank you Ralph Hill!)
10.) Absolutely positively under no circumstances are black breeches allowed.

Robby,

I will even give up my beloved black schooling breeches for this opportunity. Since you will now be in Area III, as I move forward into the world of the about-to-be-divorced and will have my own place soon, when I get ready to do the design, will RBJ services provide the consulting and approve, yet allow me to run the facility as long as I follow the 10 commandments as set out above?

This could be just what I need to get kick started into a wonderful new life! :D

Can I install the old sign from my dad's hunting camp that said "kwityurbellyachin" above the door for a cute, retro junk style touch? Or would that be going too far? :lol:

Libby (who also likes the nowhiners idea)

bigdreamer
Jun. 4, 2006, 02:49 PM
robby-

you should not be allowed to make posts while i am taking a drink. I'm not sure my computer can take much more spraying! :lol:

and I will try not to take offense to the "Big D" comment ;)

fergie
Jun. 4, 2006, 03:20 PM
I wonder what it takes to be an OConnor certified stall mucker? I mean, who's on poop patrol taking a poop poll? That could be a real job opportunity. What do you think their cut would be from the poop picker salary?

fergie
Jun. 4, 2006, 03:20 PM
I wonder what it takes to be an OConnor certified stall mucker? I mean, who's on poop patrol taking a poop poll? That could be a real job opportunity. What do you think their cut would be from the poop picker salary?

flbay
Jun. 4, 2006, 03:55 PM
I read this thread sitting here in my black breeches...I guess I am out.

fergie
Jun. 4, 2006, 04:02 PM
I read this thread sitting here in my black breeches...I guess I am out.

Holy crap! And it is now past Memorial Day! You are going to have to wait til after Labor Day to wear those puppies again!

fastpace
Jun. 4, 2006, 04:15 PM
I wonder what it takes to be an OConnor certified stall mucker? I mean, who's on poop patrol taking a poop poll? That could be a real job opportunity. What do you think their cut would be from the poop picker salary?

hahaha!!! :lol:

oskaar
Jun. 5, 2006, 02:26 AM
No horse necessary! Saturdays are champagne day!


can i drink champagne every day?

and will there be goat cheese?

BigRuss1996
Jun. 5, 2006, 07:44 AM
Fergie you are too funny......LMAO....... that is a very good question.





I wonder what it takes to be an OConnor certified stall mucker? I mean, who's on poop patrol taking a poop poll? That could be a real job opportunity. What do you think their cut would be from the poop picker salary?

imissvixen
Jun. 6, 2006, 08:30 PM
I am not sure that the O'Connor imprimatur holds as much value as this plan implies. Good luck to them in their endeavors but if I were them I wouldn't put all my eggs in this basket. The market opportunity is not nearly as sizable as golf and their name is not nearly as recognizable or prestigious as Arnold Palmer or Jack Nicklas (sp?).

I think there are probably any number of ways that these guys could make some money but I really don't think this is it. And, it's one thing running one facility well and another making sure that multiple geographically diverse facilities run well. It is very easy to wreck your brand if your management model isn't firmly in place. As an example, Dunkin Donuts had serious problems when its franchisees didn't perform up to par. Why do I get the feeling that this hasn't been totally thought out? Anyone need a consultant?

For all those young and aspiring trainers out there I think there is a good object lesson in this. The question is how are you going to support yourself when you start reaching the age where you can't or don't want to put in the level of riding that is necessary to support yourself? Unless you are independently wealthy I have consistently seen that there comes an age where one has to deal with this reality.

Anyhow, just my thoughts. I hope the O'Connors are successful in their venture and prove me wrong.

Judi
Jun. 7, 2006, 12:29 AM
Come on, folks. You KNOW (I just know you do) that, increasingly, we live in a "do it for me" era. Heck, eventing is a comparatively tiny sport probably specifically because someone CAN'T do it for you (unlike cutters and hunters, for example).

Eventers, yours is often an admirable, independent, do-it-yourself approach to life. It distinguishes you (some of you) distinctly from other types of riders. But, gee whiz, are you really as simplistically narrow minded as to be incapable of seeing other viewpoints, other lifestyles, other needs and desires as your posts imply? Your ridicule-it, knee-jerk reaction to this idea is incredibly negative and even a little sad. How about a little "Yeah, go for it--it's worth a try" spirit here?

Hmmm.... I don't think the posters here are being "narrow minded" we are being realistic. I moved to the eventing world for exactly the reason you state below...

"eventing is a comparatively tiny sport probably specifically because someone CAN'T do it for you (unlike cutters and hunters, for example)."

Why in the world do we want to make cookie cutter barns and riders just like the Hunter/Jumpers do? Pretty soon we'll be going to horse trials and each barn aisle will have matching colored trunks and stall guards and manicured landscaped "client area's" with competitions between the barns as to who can landscape and present the best tent display. There will be the "in" colors for cross country and riders will start to look down their noses at the pony clubber in their rainbow colored sparkled vest, hat, boots and pad.

Uggg... I left that world with it's hunter princesses and controlling trainers to become a true horsewoman who knows how to care for my horse.. knows every inch of his legs and body and can make my own decisions for my horses care and schedule. I have become empowered by being an eventer. I no longer panic if my trainer can't see my ride (At Galway she couldn't see any of my rides as she had two other horses to get ready).

I see something like this and it sort of starts to feel like that rich snobby world I left. Okay... maybe I'm reacting out of FEAR. Yep... I'll admit it. So... I guess I'm happy with keeping eventing a "relatively tiny sport" if I don't have to wear tailored sportsmen breeches and compete against 6 figure warmbloods who pack thier princess mommies around a course.

Hey wait.. maybe I am comparatively tiny minded afterall.... yep.. guilty as charged.

: )

fergie
Jun. 7, 2006, 12:59 AM
Pretty soon we'll be going to horse trials and each barn aisle will have matching colored trunks and stall guards and manicured landscaped "client area's" with competitions between the barns as to who can landscape and present the best tent display. There will be the "in" colors for cross country and riders will start to look down their noses at the pony clubber in their rainbow colored sparkled vest, hat, boots and pad.

I don't have to wear tailored sportsmen breeches and compete against 6 figure warmbloods who pack thier princess mommies around a course.


: )[/QUOTE]

I really hate to rain on your parade, but you are a little late - this is already happening. You need to walk through the barns at a three day.... you will see matchy matchy everything and ultra expensive tack (except around my horse, of course...). The horse off the track is also giving way to the sport horses with a numbers on their shoulders - that number doesn't come cheap!

Robby Johnson
Jun. 7, 2006, 07:36 AM
I really hate to rain on your parade, but you are a little late - this is already happening. You need to walk through the barns at a three day.... you will see matchy matchy everything and ultra expensive tack (except around my horse, of course...). The horse off the track is also giving way to the sport horses with a numbers on their shoulders - that number doesn't come cheap!

True dat.

I really cannot stand the trainers (in eventing) who constantly talk about "our customers/clients." It drives me insane. Why not just call them students?

I, however, am all for the matchy-match, but only because I'm an organizer at heart.

Robby

FlightCheck
Jun. 7, 2006, 09:27 AM
I'm all about signing up for the Robby Johnson barn at Bensmoms - except that (gasp) I don't drink red wine.

How 'bout a nice reisling? Would that be acceptable?

Bensmom
Jun. 7, 2006, 10:19 AM
How about it, RBJ? Is variation in the 5 pm cocktail hour acceptable?

Like Robby, I like matchy stuff too, but so far, am glad that we don't actually have landscaping, etc. I can't see that happening in our sport, because rarely do we go to a show venue and set up for five weeks . . .

And, a couple of questions -- one is even on topic!

Is the OC endorsed barn going where the Suwanee eventing facility/development was planned at one time?

And, RBJ, if one is decorating the home that will be on the same property as the planned RBJ signature barn, how much of a faux pas is it to not use the barn colors in the house? Or would too much matchy stuff be over the top?

libby

Robby Johnson
Jun. 7, 2006, 03:51 PM
First, you can really drink whatever you want, as long as there is always ample red on hand for me. In actuality, I prefer white (I love Sauvignon Blanc, particularly Dashwood from NZ) but the sugar/calories are too high. I am always on a mission to lose more weight. One of my major life aims is to starve to death, but my body always wins that battle.

As far as I'm concerned, horses happen at the barn. Your life as a horseperson should be there. Your house should be about your other interests. This means saddle stands in your living room are not acceptable decor.

There should be a cohesive aesthetic, of course, but matching isn't necessary at all. I'd rather tie the area together with landscaping and really great fencing.

Robby

Bensmom
Jun. 7, 2006, 04:06 PM
Ah, you've made me feel much better then. I am really branching out with color in this house. Must be that impending divorce desire to make changes -- after all, just because I've never seen a 110 year old farmhouse with a Tiffany blue room doesn't mean it won't be Fabulous :D

There will be no saddle stands in the living room. I promise. Though the neighborhood will be perfect for a RBJ Signature Barn == small, but charming, and just on the verge of being discovered. :yes: :lol:

2ndyrgal
Jun. 8, 2006, 11:30 AM
I do not have saddle stands in my living room, those are in the den (lovingly referred to as "the room with the green carpet"uckk) however, the new custom saddle for the "big horse" is in the living room, on the back of the armchair. I know the decor might suffer, but it SMELLS so good!! It also cost more than the sum total of the furniture in the room, so I thought it might lend an air of class to the place. I must simply get a lock for the tack room door I suppose.

2ndyrgal
Jun. 8, 2006, 11:32 AM
I also think that being in northern ky, I should get an automatic "hillbilly/redneck exemption from some of the apparel regulations. After all, if it weren't for spandex and sweatpants, half the women in my county would be naked. (trust me, that is not as appealing as it may sound!!)

Mariequi
Jun. 8, 2006, 11:33 AM
Hmm. No hope for me. I moved into a place at an eventing boarding barn and am keeping my screened in porch as a tack room. And items do creep into the house. 3 saddles are out in the big tack box finally, but there's always some fly spray in the living room on the way out to the barn or a Farrier's Formula container that I need to figure out if it's FF or bird seed...

hightech
May. 15, 2007, 04:51 PM
Hmmm.... I don't think the posters here are being "narrow minded" we are being realistic. I moved to the eventing world for exactly the reason you state below...

"eventing is a comparatively tiny sport probably specifically because someone CAN'T do it for you (unlike cutters and hunters, for example)."

Why in the world do we want to make cookie cutter barns and riders just like the Hunter/Jumpers do? Pretty soon we'll be going to horse trials and each barn aisle will have matching colored trunks and stall guards and manicured landscaped "client area's" with competitions between the barns as to who can landscape and present the best tent display. There will be the "in" colors for cross country and riders will start to look down their noses at the pony clubber in their rainbow colored sparkled vest, hat, boots and pad.

Uggg... I left that world with it's hunter princesses and controlling trainers to become a true horsewoman who knows how to care for my horse.. knows every inch of his legs and body and can make my own decisions for my horses care and schedule. I have become empowered by being an eventer. I no longer panic if my trainer can't see my ride (At Galway she couldn't see any of my rides as she had two other horses to get ready).

I see something like this and it sort of starts to feel like that rich snobby world I left. Okay... maybe I'm reacting out of FEAR. Yep... I'll admit it. So... I guess I'm happy with keeping eventing a "relatively tiny sport" if I don't have to wear tailored sportsmen breeches and compete against 6 figure warmbloods who pack thier princess mommies around a course.

Hey wait.. maybe I am comparatively tiny minded afterall.... yep.. guilty as charged.

: )


you don't think there already is " in" colors in eventing?? the upper levels are all about not being too colorful!

hightech
May. 15, 2007, 04:52 PM
and this endevor- all about the money...

deltawave
May. 15, 2007, 05:05 PM
and this endevor- all about the money...

Something wrong with making money? If one has "something" that others are willing to pay for, why not give people what they want? ;) This kind of "signature" thing is not MY cup of tea, but can you blame anyone for wanting to turn a profit on a business endeavor? :confused: That IS what business endeavors are for, no?

hightech
May. 15, 2007, 05:06 PM
of course not-- make all the money you can! wish I could!!!

FrittSkritt
May. 15, 2007, 05:35 PM
dear god, this thread is OLD!