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hundredacres
Jul. 1, 2012, 03:08 PM
Max is an 11 year old Lab, he's at the clinic now on IV's.....he started vomiting this morning clear and it progressed to bloody and foamy. We called the vet and got him there within an hour - he was vomiting every 15 minutes by then. He was not dehydrated or bloated and only had a 1 degree temp so the vet gave him some antibiotics, an anti-nausea shot, and was ready to send us home with charcoal and anti-b's but when we stood Max up to leave he was in a pool of blood that came from his rectum. At that point he put him on a catheter and started an IV and gave him some potassium. He's staying at the clinic, but we have no idea what it could be :(. The vet is leaning toward poisoning. My daughter saw an exterminator at our neighbors a couple of days ago but they've left town and we can't reach them to ask.

Any experiences with anything like this? We just put our 15 year old dog down a couple of weeks ago...:(. Our 11 year old Husky isn't doing too well right now either (she's got no cartilage left in one knee). This is too much :(.

prairiewind2
Jul. 1, 2012, 03:14 PM
I am so so sorry.

Could it be hemorrhagic gastroenteritis? Or an hemangiosarcoma?

I've seen dogs vomit blood and have severe bloody diarrhea with both. (Not a vet here, just a longtime dog owner.)

Jingles coming your oldster's way...

Liz

Laurierace
Jul. 1, 2012, 03:21 PM
Rat poison? Jingles whatever the cause.

JanM
Jul. 1, 2012, 03:24 PM
My dog had pancreatitis and the symptoms matched. Apparently she at the berries off of a Virginia Creeper plant (I didn't realize the stupid plant had berries until then). Another dog had the same symptoms with some kind of virus or something too. With the second dog all they did was treat the symptoms, and the said a liver disease was the culprit.

And it might not be the exterminator in the neighborhood, but someone who put out rat poison and the rat ran outside to die.

hundredacres
Jul. 1, 2012, 03:24 PM
Thanks Liz.....I read about HGE and fortunately, from what I read, the vet is treated it for that already. Thanks for the jingles. He's the best old guy and was so well behaved, even when he told us the shot would burn he sat stoically. I hate that he's all alone there.

Sorry Jan, I was posting at the same time. How did your dogs do?

kookicat
Jul. 1, 2012, 03:26 PM
Sending massive jingles.

Bluey
Jul. 1, 2012, 03:34 PM
The worst is having to leave them there, sick and alone, is it.:cry:

But, that is their best chance, that is what our vets say ... :confused:

Wishing they find what it is and can help.:yes:

hundredacres
Jul. 1, 2012, 03:34 PM
Well the vet just called and said that he's alert and bright eyed. He hasn't vomited again but there was a little more blood. Keep jingling please - I greatly appreciate it!

Burbank
Jul. 1, 2012, 03:45 PM
many jingles

hope he continues to recover

stolen virtue
Jul. 1, 2012, 04:01 PM
I had that happen years ago with a young dog. The culprit was the park and the use of herbicides at the park. Hope all is well.

hundredacres
Jul. 1, 2012, 04:18 PM
Thanks SV....we haven't used anything like that in our own yards, BUT we are on a farm and we do have crops in every direction around us. From what I know, our crops are already so far behind the farmers haven't used anything on them because they don't want to waste the money (our tenant farmer is going to mow our fields and cut his losses....another sad subject).

We also live on the lake and wonder if he got a bacteria. The vet says this is possible too - and again, the anti b's he's prescribed should cover any e coli, salmonella or giardia(sp?). The HGE can present from a bacterial infection as well. This is so frustrating and feel so terrible for him.

stolen virtue
Jul. 1, 2012, 04:39 PM
I forgot to add that our dog was fine after the treatment at the vets. We just were much more cautious about where he went after that. It does sound that you caught things in time. Best wishes to you and your sweet lab.

lovey1121
Jul. 1, 2012, 04:41 PM
Big big jingles for your Labberdawggie Max. Good to hear that he was alert! Fingers crossed he's through the worst of it and comes home soon.

walknsound
Jul. 1, 2012, 05:00 PM
Hope he's ok, sounds like you caught it in time. Jingles!

Lynnwood
Jul. 1, 2012, 05:02 PM
My guess would be Wafarin a common ingredient in rat poison. Has your vet run a clotting profile on him if not I would and get him started on Vitamin K.

hundredacres
Jul. 1, 2012, 05:18 PM
He's not clotting, but on the vit K already......thanks!

A friend said she had 2 dogs with this last year and it was from a mold toxin from digging in the compost pile. Gosh, it sounds like it could be anything!

tradewind
Jul. 1, 2012, 05:24 PM
Jingles for you.

Lynnwood
Jul. 1, 2012, 05:26 PM
My other suggestions to look into would into be the immune disorders like Thromobocytopenia and IMHA (Immune mediated henolytic anemia) maybe an abdominal ultrasound to take a peak at his spleen see what its up too.

judybigredpony
Jul. 1, 2012, 05:28 PM
Jingles..my 2 HGE this week only had blood in vomit.

But his symptoms sound so much like my old Lab's when he ingested poision!!!!!

SAcres
Jul. 1, 2012, 05:42 PM
Major jingles from PA!

My Two Cents
Jul. 1, 2012, 05:48 PM
Awww. Poor guy. Hope all goes well for him.

shireluver
Jul. 1, 2012, 06:17 PM
Hope he gets to feeling better soon. I had a dog who got into rat poison many years ago and she presented with the same symptoms. She spent two days at the vet and had a blood transfusion. She came out of it just fine and lived a long, happy life.

hundredacres
Jul. 1, 2012, 06:31 PM
Oh, shirelover, I was hoping to hear something like that. I'm glad your dog pulled through.

I'm so sad for the poor dog. He has his night time ritual and sleeps next to my bed :(. I hope he's not out of sorts. I don't think he's ever stayed the night anywhere else in his whole life.

We still can't figure out what's caused this. I have foxglove in the garden and had brought some in the house in an arrangement. I found a few dried bloods on the floor after we got home and wondered if he ate some. I found mixed reports on it's toxicity all over the internet. My vet said he's not aware that it's toxic. I've seen nothing official that states it's toxic but there are anecdotal posts all over that state otherwise.

I had a bucket that a horse pooped in soaking for a day and dumped it yesterday. I'd dumped the solids out then was soaking for the sticky bits and had also dumped a bit of pine sol in it. I wonder if the bucket had e coli or salmonella......?? Or goose poop at the beach....?

Calvincrowe
Jul. 1, 2012, 07:33 PM
Jingles for you poor pup! Foxglove is also known as digitalis isn't it? and that is a heart medicine or something, right?

You'll drive yourself crazy trying to find the answer. Let's hope the vets "wide net" of treatment catches the reason and he's is old goofy Lab self by morning.

crosscreeksh
Jul. 1, 2012, 08:45 PM
Jingles for your pup. It's so hard to deal with such a problem when you are searching for causes. Just concentrate on good cures. JB

Whitfield Farm Hanoverians
Jul. 2, 2012, 12:58 AM
Praying & jingling that he does well & is 100% soon. (For you also)

BasqueMom
Jul. 2, 2012, 01:34 AM
More jingles!

SquishTheBunny
Jul. 2, 2012, 01:49 AM
Jingles!

Often "Nothing" causes HGE,and hopefully thats all it was. We aways have clients assume poisoning, where in reality just like in people, HGE just happens.

He would have had to eaten a lot of rat poison to cause this amount of bleeding...possible but unlikely if you dont have any around. ITP and IMHA are also possible, however in most cases they effect younger dogs (but not always).

If he is responding well to IV support, then theres a good chance HGE was the problem. It can take 4-5 days, if not more.

If abdominal ultrasound (to rule out tumors, GI diseases etc) is a possibility, go for it. Blood tests such as coagulation profiles, ACT's and platelet counts will also help rule out ITP/IMHA/rat poison.

A True HGE is treatable, and the best disease to have as its not neoplastic or autoimmune. We will keep jingling for you!

Guin
Jul. 2, 2012, 07:43 AM
I hope your dog is doing much better today. So scary - for both you and doggie! :no:

buck22
Jul. 2, 2012, 09:18 AM
Jingles for you and your pup!!

hundredacres
Jul. 2, 2012, 09:43 AM
I just talked to the office -- the woman who answered said she doesn't know the details but he gets to go home! My husband is going to get him (I'm at work). Thank you for all of the powerful Coth jingles!

Zu Zu
Jul. 2, 2012, 09:52 AM
WONDERFUL NEWS ! :yes:

JINGLES & AO for a complete and quick recovery ~

Welcome Home ((HUGS)) for your dog and you ~

Happy Holiday Week ~

pinkpony321
Jul. 2, 2012, 11:32 AM
I am so so sorry.

Could it be hemorrhagic gastroenteritis?
Liz

my 16 year old JRT has had this twice and it was the scariest thing. Vomiting blood and basically hemorraging out of her rear....sounds similar to your dude. it's dangerous, but when attended to by a vet early on, not usually fatal. Miss thing JRT is still going strong.

Jingles!!

Edited to add: just finished reading the thread and happy for a good update!

hundredacres
Jul. 2, 2012, 02:04 PM
I went home for lunch to see him and he looks really good. The vet said his belly looks good, so no sarcomas, tumors, blood looked good and that it's just one of those things like Squish said earlier. He's on a limited diet of only a tablespoon at a time for 2 days, then he'll get a little more for a few more days after that. He seems so glad to be home, but very tired. I swear the poor boy thought he was in trouble for throwing up all over....he is such a good boy and never gets in trouble and always does his best to get outside, even when he has a tummy ache :(.

Again, thanks so much for the jingles and for sharing your experiences. This is what I love most about this forum - it's hard to feel alone when something scary like this comes up because you all are so willing to share and support. Thank you!

islgrl
Jul. 2, 2012, 02:18 PM
I have been through three episodes of HGE in my heeler/corgi cross. The first was exactly as you described. I came hom from work and the house looked like there had been a murder. It was terrifying. The next times I caught it early. Curiously, I now can tell when its coming on, because his face swells up a little bit like an allergic reaction. If I start him on benadryl and antibiotics immediately it stops it from becoming much, much worse. Vet has no idea why the correlation between the allergy symptoms and the HGE, but I am glad to be able to catch it early, I never want to go through another full blown episode.

Mtn trails
Jul. 2, 2012, 02:39 PM
That's so great he's better. Labs are the best and try so hard to do the right thing. Wonderful news :)

Brigit
Jul. 4, 2012, 05:45 PM
It could be a ton of different things. My first thought was Parvo virus. It usually affects puppies the most but the symptoms match. Hopefully it's not that though! Jingles that your puppy keeps improving!

Guin
Jul. 4, 2012, 06:00 PM
I'm so glad he's feeling better! What a crummy experience. He will be so much better now that he's home, too.

CVPeg
Jul. 4, 2012, 08:40 PM
Just read through this thread. So glad your labbydabby is better...!:yes:

ptownevt
Jul. 4, 2012, 08:53 PM
I just saw this thread. I'm so glad he's better. He sounds like a great dog.

hundredacres
Jul. 4, 2012, 10:47 PM
He still pooped out....it's very hot out so it's hard to tell if he's not feeling well. To me, he seems a little melancholy - if that's possible.

Earlier, our other dog came in with a bloody ear. I took her out on the porch to tend to her because she was shaking blood all over. I lost track of Max, and he trotted off. I only noticed it about 15 minutes later....by then he'd gone to the edge of the farm where I found him in a ditch, eating something dead. Now my husband and I are kind of freaking out.....maybe that's is what got him sick in the first place and that's why he went there again :(. We're watching him very closely now!

BTW, it looks like Sunny scratched the inside of her ear on the cartilidge and it keeps bleeding *sigh*.

ManyDogs
Jul. 4, 2012, 11:27 PM
Hmmm, our JRT (RIP Button) did that once. The amount of fluid that came out of both ends of her was unbelievable. DH took her to the vet and the towel in the carrying kennel was covered with fluid/blood, too. Never did find out what it was but at least we got her to the vet ASAP. I don't remember what he said but there was nothing she could have gotten into.. She was outside and confined.
So strange. Glad your pooch is OK!

lovey1121
Jul. 6, 2012, 06:20 AM
How is Max??

hundredacres
Jul. 6, 2012, 07:54 AM
Thanks for asking! He's doing well *knock wood*.....I called the vet and told him he'd found a "snack" and he said to watch him closely and bring him in at any sign of tummy trouble. Fortunately I'm home this week so I can watch his every move (well as long as I don't get distracted!).

Zu Zu
Jul. 6, 2012, 10:12 AM
GREAT ! SO glad your boy is recovering nicely !~ :D


Thanks for asking! He's doing well *knock wood*.....I called the vet and told him he'd found a "snack" and he said to watch him closely and bring him in at any sign of tummy trouble. Fortunately I'm home this week so I can watch his every move (well as long as I don't get distracted!).

Somermist
Jul. 6, 2012, 10:15 AM
Glad your boy is doing so much better.

Bacardi1
Jul. 6, 2012, 07:18 PM
Maybe with all this stuff going on, you should be keeping your dogs INSIDE except for "business" walks. Every time one of my dogs has been ill for any reason, it's been vet-prescribed "indoors only; leash walks only". I certainly wouldn't want an ill dog wandering around outdoors. And sick & finding/eating carrion? Good grief.

hundredacres
Jul. 6, 2012, 08:09 PM
I was tending to the bloody ear and was distracted when he got out. We're doing the best we can. Your post looks pretty condescending....hope I'm interpreting it wrong.

Bacardi1
Jul. 6, 2012, 08:14 PM
I truly apologize if I did sound condescending.

It just gets tiresome to read all of the folks posting here asking for "jingles" & posting about horrid things that happen to their "dearly beloved" pets because the "dearly beloved" pets live outside. If that's the life you chose for them - so be it. But don't get all "OMG" when they disappear, get killed by coyotes or cars, or whatever. This is a CHOICE you made for the animal (cat, dog, whatever), & that choice has consequences.

Yes - it's VERY sad, when any animal dies for any reason; but again, animals that are allowed loose outdoors have a much higher rate of early death. Proven statistics - look 'em up.

hundredacres
Jul. 6, 2012, 08:17 PM
My dogs, all of them, live inside. :)....I have no use for people who keep their dogs outside all of the time. I get more exercise bowing to their needs (in out in out in out) than cleaning 6 stalls!

We have no idea how he got sick, but we are on 260 acres and we also have a lake. He'll run down to the lake with us to swim (he's a lab!) and he will find stuff but we really don't know what it was or recall him getting into anything recently (accept for the other day). He does chores with me every day too - it could have been anything. Our fear about the neighbor was perhaps a poisoned animal came on to this property....but that was not likely the case since they are home now and said they didn't use any poison, but traps.

We just had to put our 15 year old lab down as her arthritis was really bad, hearing gone and vision failing. I think we take pretty good care of our animals if I don't say so myself ;).

skippy60
Jul. 6, 2012, 08:32 PM
Poisoning from phenylbutazone (bute), possibly? if you keep horses on your property and have to feed them bute, could your dog have possibly gotten into it? (They do come yummyish smells...)

hundredacres
Jul. 6, 2012, 08:35 PM
Hmmmm, Skippy I hadn't thought of that. I do have a mare on bute and her feed pan gets removed from her stall after breakfast and I usually clean them before dinner. It would have been just a light dusting on the bottom of the pan though. You're right, it smells delicious!

Zu Zu
Jul. 7, 2012, 07:16 PM
hundredacres ~ your love for Max shines through each of your posts ~ no need to worry about a rude poster ~

Hoping today was a good day for Max ~

hundredacres
Jul. 7, 2012, 07:28 PM
Zu Zu...you are so kind! Thank you! And he had a GREAT day - he was allowed to go for a swim :). Nothing makes a lab happier!

SLW
Jul. 7, 2012, 11:37 PM
Thanks SV....we haven't used anything like that in our own yards, BUT we are on a farm and we do have crops in every direction around us. From what I know, our crops are already so far behind the farmers haven't used anything on them because they don't want to waste the money (our tenant farmer is going to mow our fields and cut his losses....another sad subject).

We also live on the lake and wonder if he got a bacteria. The vet says this is possible too - and again, the anti b's he's prescribed should cover any e coli, salmonella or giardia(sp?). The HGE can present from a bacterial infection as well. This is so frustrating and feel so terrible for him.

Do you all ever deal with the deadly blue/green algae in the water/ponds around there?? Here in eastern Kansas we are having that problem again to the extent that back in June, 22 cattle out of a herd of 60 some odd number dropped dead in a field from drinking the pond water. I don't know how it affects dogs but the state is advising owners to keep dogs out of the lakes.

Here is a link on the algae:http://www.petpoisonhelpline.com/poison/blue-green-algae/

hundredacres
Jul. 8, 2012, 12:05 AM
Wow SLW, that's terrible! No, we don't have a big algae problem, this year anyway. Some years is worse than others but I've never heard of that strain from the link. My husband is diligent about keeping our lake balanced and we recently had a biologist come out to help us keep it healthy. It's crystal clear right now but not always. I'm going to have him read read about it. Thanks for the information.

SquishTheBunny
Jul. 8, 2012, 05:40 PM
A lab has no life if its inside all the time with exception of bathroom breaks. You sound like you are giving your lab a wonderful life!!!

HGE happens, like I said, for no reason sometimes. Youve done nothing wrong, but allow your dog to get better and give him a great life :)

Zu Zu
Jul. 8, 2012, 06:26 PM
Max got to swim ! :cool: NICE !!!

((Hug)) that handsome boy ~