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View Full Version : Aging Out - New helmet



Princess Lauren
Aug. 12, 2002, 07:57 AM
Since this coming November is my last month as a junior, I won't be wearing my approved in December!! So right now the unapproved I have is the one with the clear harness but I want to get a new one. I'm asking for a new helmet for Christmas and I'm not sure what to ask for. I'm kinda hoping for a custom one but it doesn't matter. What do you guys think I should get? And I know that keeping my approved and wearing that is a good idea for my head and whatever but it hurts my head and it hard to get my hair under... And I'm not gonna wear a pony tail so don't even mention it.

-Lauren-
[Master Of The Game][Imagine That] (http://www.geocities.com/viewpoint_stables/imaginethat.html).
[Come As You Are] (http://www.geocities.com/viewpoint_stables/comeasyouare.html). [Once In A Blue Moon] (http://www.geocities.com/viewpoint_stables/onceinabluemoon.html).

Princess Lauren
Aug. 12, 2002, 07:57 AM
Since this coming November is my last month as a junior, I won't be wearing my approved in December!! So right now the unapproved I have is the one with the clear harness but I want to get a new one. I'm asking for a new helmet for Christmas and I'm not sure what to ask for. I'm kinda hoping for a custom one but it doesn't matter. What do you guys think I should get? And I know that keeping my approved and wearing that is a good idea for my head and whatever but it hurts my head and it hard to get my hair under... And I'm not gonna wear a pony tail so don't even mention it.

-Lauren-
[Master Of The Game][Imagine That] (http://www.geocities.com/viewpoint_stables/imaginethat.html).
[Come As You Are] (http://www.geocities.com/viewpoint_stables/comeasyouare.html). [Once In A Blue Moon] (http://www.geocities.com/viewpoint_stables/onceinabluemoon.html).

VTrider
Aug. 12, 2002, 08:01 AM
Charles Owens Ascot helmet (unapproved - harness velcros in and out) - DEAD RINGER for a Patey /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif But only $95 - I LOVE mine. Everyone always asks me if I got my hat from Margie (the Patey lady /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif ).

Desperate&Depressed
Aug. 12, 2002, 08:02 AM
Well you COULD buy another approved... perhaps a little bigger than your current one, then you wouldn't have a problem with getting your hair up in it... /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif oh well, not my head!!!

Medievalist
Aug. 12, 2002, 08:10 AM
VTRider-
I couldn't get that hat on my head. I looked like such a dork in the tack shop. "No seriously, I really do wear a 7 1/8. How come I can't get this 7 7/8 on my head?" It was one of my finest moments /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

I have a Lock. It makes me look stylin' and I can actually get it on my head. They only picture I have of me where you can see the hat, I look like a total retard, so I'm not going to post it. My eyes are shut, my mouth is open, I'm not releasing enough over the jump, but my hair is perfect /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*
Check out my barn's site:
Centre Equestre de la Houssaye (http://www.eii.fr/club/houssaye)
*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*

VTrider
Aug. 12, 2002, 08:11 AM
Yep - Locks are great too....very pretty hats.

Chanda
Aug. 12, 2002, 08:15 AM
I would seriously consider getting another approved. Many adults out there are wearing them, that way you will fit in AND be safe. It is important as you get older to be smart and protect yourself and be a good roll model for the younger riders.

I like to think of my head as a delicate egg. If broken, there is no way to put it back together, best to strap something on that actually protects it not just looks good. Who cares if you look good with your brains spilling out. Ick!

Bowed tendon: Time to go back to work. Slowly!

Ben and Me
Aug. 12, 2002, 08:30 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>I couldn't get that hat on my head. I looked like such a dork in the tack shop. "No seriously, I really do wear a 7 1/8. How come I can't get this 7 7/8 on my head?" It was one of my finest moments <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>'

The same thing happened to me with my CO Hampton! I went from a 7 1/4 (which is what I wore in my unapproved International) to a 7 1/2! /infopop/emoticons/icon_eek.gif Needless to say, I look like a total mushroom head. Everybody else looks pretty normal in their approveds....Not me!

I agree that the CO Ascot is a BEAUTIFUL helmet.

"Well it's a marvelous night for a moondance" ~Van Morrison

Princess Lauren
Aug. 12, 2002, 09:09 AM
If I were to get another approved I would look into the GPA, because I hear they're really cool and comfy, or Charles Owens Hampton, because I think it looks the best of the approved. I still have to ride in approved for IHSA and at school but for regular shows I'd really like to go back to my normal unapproved self. I hadn't ridden in an approved helmet since I was 11 years old.

-Lauren-
[Master Of The Game][Imagine That] (http://www.geocities.com/viewpoint_stables/imaginethat.html).
[Come As You Are] (http://www.geocities.com/viewpoint_stables/comeasyouare.html). [Once In A Blue Moon] (http://www.geocities.com/viewpoint_stables/onceinabluemoon.html).

pinkhorse
Aug. 12, 2002, 09:23 AM
I've worn a 6-7/8 all my life. When I went to buy a new helmet (different brand) I had to get a 7-1/8!!! If I'd given up at "Oh, the 6-7/8 doesn't fit, I guess I can't wear this helmet" I'd-a been clean out of luck. Now I have a lovely International Royale that looks much better than my older Lexington (which was a 6-7/8). Of course, problem is that I fell with it at a show on Friday and now have to have it checked out. I did have to try 2-3 7-1/8's to find one that actually fit... I dread having International send me a generic 7-1/8 and not having it fit if mine broke.

I love approved helmets. I landed (mostly on my back but did hear that loud, familiar clunk when my head hit) and thanked myself for having just bought a new helmet. (My Lexington had never dropped, I'd never fallen in it, but it is 5 years old and it was time for it to be replaced.)

I know no one can convince you but, don't kid yourself. All but one of my concussions were when I was over 18 (and the first one was on my 18th birthday). Most adults are wearing approved in the shows I've been to this year. Now that juniors are wearing them it looks even wierder than it used to to see someone in an unapproved.

RumoursFollow
Aug. 12, 2002, 09:27 AM
and people who insist on insulting every person who asks about unapproved helmets need to get another hobby. /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

I like the CO Ascots as well. Thats an excellent choice.

-----------------------------
RumoursFollow
Ten Oaks Farm (http://www.geocities.com/tenoakssc/index.html)
-----------------------------

VTrider
Aug. 12, 2002, 09:54 AM
Leave the girl alone people - if you don't have an idea for an unapproved hat that she may like - then you really don't have much to add to this thread, now do you?

Fiction
Aug. 12, 2002, 09:59 AM
I DID NOT POST THIS!!! SOMEONE HAD MY PASSWORD- I JUST CHANGED IT. I'M SORRY TO ANYONE THIS POST BOTHERED. I know who did this and I've spoken to them. Sorry once again- especially to chimaera.
-----
This is not a true story
-----

[This message was edited by Fiction on Aug. 12, 2002 at 05:25 PM.]

Medievalist
Aug. 12, 2002, 10:14 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Princess Lauren:
If I were to get another approved I would look into the GPA, because I hear they're really cool and comfy
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I have one and it makes my head itch like crazy, so I never wear it unless I'm climbing on a 2yo. It is TORTURE for my skin to wear it. I have another friend who has the same problem, and he bought a different size and color from a different dealer 4 months after me. I'm not sure why-they must have treated the fabric with something. Anyone else had this problem or am I just a freak?

*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*
Check out my barn's site:
Centre Equestre de la Houssaye (http://www.eii.fr/club/houssaye)
*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*

SBT
Aug. 12, 2002, 10:32 AM
and I even have an unapproved Lexington, but of all the helmets I've owned and worn, my FAVORITE thus far is my ATH. I went to the tack shop, tried it on for laughs, and it fit so perfectly that I bought it. It is SO comfy!

I think you should definitely go to a tack shop and try on all the different kinds of helmets until you find what fits YOUR head best. If it happens to be approved, so much the better. /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif If you're going to go unapproved, make sure you get the BEST fit possible. Fit is everything, approved or not.

~Sara /infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

"If you stand for nothing, you will fall for anything."
~Member of the "I Know the Secret of the Universe" Clique. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Moesha
Aug. 12, 2002, 11:19 AM
Lauren,
The GPA's are wonderful. I have had one for several years and ..honestly it is the most comfortable hat I have ever had. I really would not want to wear anything else.

People have the right to choose what they do as adults.


VTRider, I and another friend were actually discussing the issues of Approved helmuts at Lexington. We were saying that sadly enough many of the more recently publicized fatalities have been as a result of traumatic injury to the body as a result of a horse landing on the rider....this is not discrediting the vital roll that Approved helmuts have..however, it really is not appropriate to compare binge drinking 21 year olds to an accomplished and dedicated rider who is shopping for a new riding helmut and who is specifically looking for one to show in.

RedEqHunter
Aug. 12, 2002, 11:48 AM
I love my unapproved International. It's very comfy. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif I was wearing my ATH, though, when I took a fall last night. (I'm trying to get used to it as I'll have to wear it in the fall.) I didn't hit my head, actually it never touched the ground...good thing cause I don't want that helmet screwed up so I have to buy a new one, lol. The first words out of my mouth after I fell to my mom were "is my helmet okay?" /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

*Ally*
Aug. 12, 2002, 12:03 PM
You can get killed walking across the street.. And it happened to my dad's best friend and he wasn't wearing an approved helmet..


Lauren- I really like the Ascot...
I would recomend NOT getting a hadfields... I had one and it literally sucked...my head would throb when I took it off..(this could sound really funny /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif)

~*Allison*~

Fallbrook
Aug. 12, 2002, 01:13 PM
Why is it that approved helmets are not considered "cool" unless they happen to cost $300.00?

Dementia 13
Aug. 12, 2002, 01:16 PM
Those cheap-a** ones don't fit as well - it has nothing to do with "cool."

"Fur die toten und die lebenden mussen wir zeugnis ablegen."

LuckyAugust
Aug. 12, 2002, 04:56 PM
I have an International and it fits me really well. I used to have a lot of hair and I could get all of it packed under there, and now that I got my hair cut, it still fits perfectly.

jr
Aug. 12, 2002, 05:03 PM
Charles Owen has some really nice unapproveds, cant remember the name.

But don't throw away your approved, it is only a matter of a year or two before they extend the requirement to adults.

[This message was edited by jr on Aug. 12, 2002 at 08:14 PM.]

VTrider
Aug. 12, 2002, 05:46 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by jr:


But don't throw away your approved, it is only a matter of a year or two before they extend the requirement to adults.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not gonna happen...sorry. Will team ropers, reiners, fox hunters, cutters, ranch workers, farm hands, park carriage drivers, trail riders wear approved hats - I think not - and I don't think law makers can justify only get people who jump to wear them b/c every horse sport has some high level of risk. Not gonna happen.

RumoursFollow
Aug. 12, 2002, 05:53 PM
that the approved helmet crusade gets a little out of hand sometimes. Its a choice you make, just like any other choice. Those of you who launch on a crusade any time someone says the word unapproved need to relax. I think it has been said and resaid and resaid enough times that EVERYONE knows that you think that we should all wear approved helmets. Some of us choose to ignore you. Its a free world- and as someone said the other day, if we "want to die" - then let us. Its really none of your business either way.

-----------------------------
RumoursFollow
Ten Oaks Farm (http://www.geocities.com/tenoakssc/index.html)
-----------------------------

VTrider
Aug. 12, 2002, 05:57 PM
This is different from wearing seatbelts, or wearing helmets when driving motorcycles or riding bikes - when you are driving - your actions can put others at risk. When I am jumping my 8 jumps by myself - hundres of yards from other living beings - the only person I am putting at risk is my trainer when he has a near heart attack after seeing PK leave from Japan over an oxer LOL!

Robby Johnson
Aug. 12, 2002, 06:06 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by VTrider:
Leave the girl alone people - if you don't have an idea for an unapproved hat that she may like - then you really don't have much to add to this thread, now do you?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

If she winds up in the brain injury rehabilitation facility I work for? I'd feel pretty guilty.

Slobber and colostomy bags - with one's biggest accomplishment being able to remember their ABC's - aren't my idea of glamour.

To each his own, though. Does Christie's still do apparel helmets?

Robby

You may be only one person in the world, but you may also be the world to one person.

Box-of-Rox
Aug. 12, 2002, 07:00 PM
first of all--GET A GPA. i'm sorry, but a) they look HOT. b) you can paint the stripe pretty colors with nail polish (oh just wait till my trainer sees me a monmouth!) c) they crumble when your horse steps on your head...as opposed to your head (and yes I bought the video).

if you're going unapproved, my international saved my butt (and head) a bunch of times. the harness snaps out too. Lexingtons are classics and very pretty and they go brown nicely.



and to whomever said that people only bought GPA's b/c they're cool and go get the cheaper ATH, well, think about this: If your head is not long and oval, you cannot wear the long oval ATH or whatever the one that comes in sizes is. Therefore, if your head is round, you can only buy small, medium, and large. So the ATH only fits four heads shapes: any long oval, small, medium, and large round. Well, that's all very well and jolly that those four types of heads get to save $200, but the rest of the population will be safer in their unapproveds than in a poorly fitting approved.

BUY A GPA!

BoR--resident Stupid Child

Willem FAN CLUB!

Jess
Aug. 12, 2002, 07:06 PM
I love the ascot.. its muy pretty, its the one I want when Dec 1st rolls around. And for an unapproved helmet I must say they are sturdier. I won't claim to there safeness because I don't know but I love bending helmets and those do not bend. My unapproved that I school in is so flexible..

I have the GPA but it makes me break out since its thicker it makes me sweat and its just a bad thing..

~Jess~
www.catchride.com (http://www.catchride.com)

ride2hounds
Aug. 12, 2002, 10:11 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by RumoursFollow:
that the approved helmet crusade gets a little out of hand sometimes. Its a choice you make, just like any other choice. Its a free world- and as someone said the other day, if we "want to die" - then let us. Its really none of your business either way. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Actually, since it was posted on a public BB, it is our business.

And yes, we live in America, where everyone is entitled to make stupid decisions, and does so to the limit. That is why we have the annual Darwin Awards. /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif But just because one chooses to make a poor decision, does not mean one should encourage a younger person to make the same mistake in judgement.

Fortunately, this same free country allows me to crusade about protecting one's brain, just as much as it allows you to announce to it that you don't feel your brain is valuable enough to protect. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

The approved vs unapproved arguement is the same one of "appearances". People bemoan society for being too hung-up on physical appearances being over-rated, yet you unapproved advocates use this very arguement as the reason why you WON'T wear one. Well, if this appearance thing is so much the case, then maybe GM is right and fat people shouldn't bother to show, much less ride. Unless you are a super model, don't even bother showing up. /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif "Oh, wait. That's different!" Really? How so?

~*~Tally Hoooooooo!~*~

*SERAPH*
Aug. 12, 2002, 11:06 PM
You are too cool! Darwin Awards??? Talk radio???
Thank you for sharing your two cents worth...I agree 100%.

"The world needs Dreamers and the world needs Doers;
But above all, the world needs Dreamer's who Do."

Elghund2
Aug. 13, 2002, 03:38 AM
Actually, if you do crash and end up in a long term care facility, it may effect me. The day you no longer can pay your bills, the government will and those are my tax dollars.

As far as the government not being able to legislate helmet wearing, check the states that have already put in laws on motorcyclists and bicyclists that require helmets.

"Mooses look into your window at night,
They look to the left and they look to the right,
The mooses are smiling they think its a zoo,
and thats why the mooses like looking at you."

second chance
Aug. 13, 2002, 05:57 AM
I can say I love my International unapproved... but I took a fall and it hit the ground so it's on retirement hanging up, worn for 1/3 of the summer last year.It fit my head like a glove... it was a 7 1/4 and I was like a 7 7/8 in a regular international which I disliked. So, now I have a International ATH and love it, it fit like a glove and was the lightest one that didn't give me a headache or rub my forehead.

I'm not getting started with this topic so here are a few things I do urge you to read and keep it in mind, as I'm not trying to make you and others change your mind:

informational link 1 (http://www.neurosurgery.org/health/patient/answers.asp?DisorderID=50)

informational link 2 (http://www.troxelhelmets.com/safety/meddata.php)

informational link 3 (http://www.lifestyleblock.co.nz/articles/412_equine_related_injuries.htm)

week one of 4 of stall rest, only 3 more months until she can be ridden.

jr
Aug. 13, 2002, 06:07 AM
VTrider,

Would you like to make a friendly wager? /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

HSM
Aug. 13, 2002, 06:34 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Moesha:
We were saying that sadly enough many of the more recently publicized fatalities have been as a result of traumatic injury to the body as a result of a horse landing on the rider...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Maybe that's because the increased use of approved helmets has decreased the number of head injuries in the sport, leaving other types of injuries as the main way people are getting hurt?

Just a thought.

thecowboyway
Aug. 13, 2002, 07:44 AM
I went to a horse show 2 weeks ago and I saw lots of chinstraps but only one approved in the AA's. Like VT said its our choice, and you'll never ever get the cowboys to wear any kind of hat other than the cowboy variety.(heck even the youths are quick to take off the chinstraps for the flat classes)

creseida
Aug. 13, 2002, 08:01 AM
I watched a GP on OLN the other day. I was pleased to notice that every single rider I saw was wearing an approved helmet. Beezie, Rodrigo, Schuyler, Leslie. All wearing an approved helmet.

Folks, these people are the best in the business. They realise that bad falls can and do happen even to the best. If an approved helmet is good enough for a pro, it should be good enough for you.

BTW, Ride2Hounds; love your post, especially about the Darwin Awards! /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

~<>~ Remember, the Ark was built by a rank amateur; the Titanic was built by a team of experts~<>~

Moesha
Aug. 13, 2002, 08:02 AM
HSM, good point

Medievalist
Aug. 13, 2002, 09:03 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by creseida:
I watched a GP on OLN the other day. I was pleased to notice that every single rider I saw was wearing an approved helmet. Beezie, Rodrigo, Schuyler, Leslie. All wearing an approved helmet.

Folks, these people are the best in the business. They realise that bad falls can and do happen even to the best. If an approved helmet is good enough for a pro, it should be good enough for you.

BTW, Ride2Hounds; love your post, especially about the Darwin Awards! /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

~<>~ Remember, the Ark was built by a rank amateur; the Titanic was built by a team of experts~<>~<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm not fighting here, but pointing out that a good portion of these riders just wear the GPAs because they're "in" and makes them look cool in their pics /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif Not that there is anything wrong with that as it sets a good example for the young'uns, but I know tons of GP riders here that wear the GPAs to show, and I cant think of one who wears his hat at home. I'm sure there exists someone, somewhere who rides in an approved at home too, but I sure haven't seen it. Stupid? Of course, but who am I to tell them what to do.

Of course, I'm a fat flaming hypocrite with the whole approved helmet thing /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif I do wear mine at home, but only on the naughties and the youngsters and when I jump.

*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*
Check out my barn's site:
Centre Equestre de la Houssaye (http://www.eii.fr/club/houssaye)
*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*

woudn'tYOUliketoknow?
Aug. 13, 2002, 09:05 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by creseida:
I watched a GP on OLN the other day. I was pleased to notice that every single rider I saw was wearing an approved helmet. Beezie, Rodrigo, Schuyler, Leslie. All wearing an approved helmet.

Folks, these people are the best in the business. They realise that bad falls can and do happen even to the best. If an approved helmet is good enough for a pro, it should be good enough for you.

BTW, Ride2Hounds; love your post, especially about the Darwin Awards! /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

~<>~ Remember, the Ark was built by a rank amateur; the Titanic was built by a team of experts~<>~<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


FYI...most of them are being paid big bucks to wear those helmets---well at least some are.

VTrider
Aug. 13, 2002, 09:15 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by woudn'tYOUliketoknow?:

FYI...most of them are being paid big bucks to wear those helmets---well at least some are.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You beat me to it. Thanks.

pinkhorse
Aug. 13, 2002, 09:25 AM
I don't care WHY anyone wears an approved. I'm just glad they do.

creseida
Aug. 13, 2002, 09:31 AM
Thanks Pinkhorse.

~<>~ Remember, the Ark was built by a rank amateur; the Titanic was built by a team of experts~<>~

timedjumpoff
Aug. 13, 2002, 10:45 AM
The event riders (all) have been required to wear approved helmets for quite some time and I haven't noticed any complaining.

GPA vs. ATH? I don't think it's a matter of money or "being cool", but rather of fit. It appears that no one has the right head shape for both.

Either look good on most riders. Be glad we don't have to wear anything as ugly as the bicycle helmets today.

lmlacross
Aug. 13, 2002, 10:59 AM
This young lady asked for suggestions of an unapproved helmet to buy, not a diatribe on why she should NOT buy one. She is now an adult, and can now decide for herself what she chooses to wear on her head, whether the safety-conscious think it's a good idea or not.

Princess Lauren, I trust you know that you will not be wearing the most protective headgear on the market. I assume that you have evaluated the risks associated with this choice, and that you are comfortable with it.

I ride in an International Hunter (unapproved), long oval shape, and I love the look and fit. I purchased a Beval deerskin harness, but do keep the clear harness in case they're ever back in fashion. I have never found an approved hat that offers the same snug fit, all the way around.

It seems like every unapproved discussion ends up in either a lecture or a lynching. I think we can safely assume that an 18-19 year old knows the difference between the two helmets, and has evaluated the facts before making this personal choice.

LML

*MidWest/Chicago Clique*
*Cripple Clique*

Robby Johnson
Aug. 13, 2002, 11:42 AM
Just two or three years ago I saw MGE split her face open in a speed class. Her little apparel helmet went flying off like a duck on a june bug.

I have often wondered if these riders school in their helmets at home. I pretty much suspected they did not.

Robby

You may be only one person in the world, but you may also be the world to one person.

Paloma
Aug. 13, 2002, 11:47 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by lmlacross:
I think we can safely assume that an 18-19 year old knows the difference between the two helmets, and has evaluated the facts before making this personal choice.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not to offend any one under the age of 21, but I doubt seriously that she has "evaluated the facts". Most decisions made by teenagers (and eighTEEN and nineTEEN year olds are teenagers) are driven by looks, what is "cool", risque', etc., not by what is "safe". Teenagers have the "I'm immortal; it won't happen to me" mentality. I'm not trying to be insulting, but they just think that way. I was one and I thought that way. But after one wake-up call, I also had the sense to wear what passed for an approved helmet back then.

Lauren asked us what kind of helmet we think she should get. She was looking for opinions. My opinion is that she should find an approved helmet that fits better than the one she has since her arguement against that particular one was that it didn't fit well.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>If I were to get another approved I would look into the GPA, because I hear they're really cool and comfy, or Charles Owens Hampton, because I think it looks the best of the approved.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

To myself and to other approved advocate posters, that means she wasn't completely dismissing the approved helmet idea...and so we made suggestions.

>> If Noah had been Truly Wise,
He would have swatted Those Two Flies... /infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif <<

Sparky Boy
Aug. 13, 2002, 12:06 PM
I too have the CO Ascot. Very comfy hat. Sort of gives me a pointy head though. I school around in an old Circuit, not comfy at all.
I've considered getting an approved but I just don't like the look for hunters and damn they're expensive. Just my opinion though /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

lmlacross
Aug. 13, 2002, 01:29 PM
What kind of "unapproved" helmet she should get. Kind of like asking "what kind of dress boots should I get" and having people respond with "get field boots"-- minus the safety concern.

Since we seem to think an 18-19 year old is incapable of making a well-resoned personal decision, at what age are humans capable of making personal decisions? 21? 25? I say each individual is different- to say that all young adults are motivated by cookie-cutter fashion is a little too broad an assumption, I think.

I do see, though, that safety concerns motivate these arguments, and I can't fault anyone for that.

LML

LML

*MidWest/Chicago Clique*
*Cripple Clique*

woudn'tYOUliketoknow?
Aug. 13, 2002, 02:58 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by VTrider:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by woudn'tYOUliketoknow?:

FYI...most of them are being paid big bucks to wear those helmets---well at least some are.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You beat me to it. Thanks.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Anytime. LOL. I haven't gotten involved in this argument, seeing as how I think it's beating a dead horse- but I do have just two things to say.
1) before Juniors had to wear approved helmets, I kinda...err...dove off my Junior Hunter in the Classic one time, and landed right in front of her, causing her to graze the top of my head with her front foot. People were like screaming and yelling "call the medic call the medic" and I sat up and was completely 100% fine. That was a NON-approved international. It fit properly and didn't budge when I fell.
2) We have a pony kid that rides at our barn and rides quite WELL. She had the International APPROVED helmet- and she had it fitted and everything and it looked fine on her and we thought that it was the perfect approved helmet. She still wore her unapproved at home however. Anyways, she was schooling her usually dead quiet medium pony at a show when some horses got loose and everything went crazy, and she ended up falling off her pony- her helmet- the APPROVED one- slipped and caused her to have a black eye and actually pulled OUT some of her HAIR.
So I think it should be a personal choice. Some people feel safer wearing approved helmets- some don't. Me personally? I turn 18 Sept. 10th and will no longer be sporting my "bubble" as of Dec. 1 this year. Nothing anyone says on this MB is gonna change my mind about THAT /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

creseida
Aug. 13, 2002, 06:52 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Sparky Boy:

I've considered getting an approved but I just don't like the look for hunters and damn they're expensive. Just my opinion though /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hmm...$300 for a GPA that will protect you in a fall vs. $500+ for a Lock or a Patey that offers no protection... Pardon the pun, but this is a no brainer. /infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

~<>~ Remember, the Ark was built by a rank amateur; the Titanic was built by a team of experts~<>~

Bored*
Aug. 13, 2002, 07:20 PM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Box-of-Rox:
b) you can paint the stripe pretty colors with nail polish (oh just wait till my trainer sees me a monmouth!)
QUOTE]

ORRRRR You can put various cartoon stickers (my personal choice was Spongebob /infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif) on the stripe. It's very cool. But I did get some death stares while walking to the ring at one (quite large A) show... /infopop/emoticons/icon_eek.gif Ah, well, I like it.

My advice to Princess Lauren: Buy a helmet that YOU like. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

It takes a big man to cry, but it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man.

Proud member and co-founder of the Children's Jumper Clique.
Proud member (and founder /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif ) of the Draw Reins Are Not A Torture Device Clique.
VERY proud member of The Future Famous Song Re-writers of America Clique!

SBT
Aug. 13, 2002, 08:46 PM
...Bored, thank heavens I am NOT the only person older than 10 who likes Spongebob. /infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif A town called "Bikini Bottom?" A snail named Gary that purrs and meows like a cat? How is that NOT hilarious? /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

~Sara /infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

"If you stand for nothing, you will fall for anything."
~Member of the "I Know the Secret of the Universe" Clique. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Aug. 13, 2002, 08:49 PM
I love SB...but not as much as my dad....he has spongebob pj pants!

*Belen*
Proud Stalker of Reiners, Cutters, any hot cowboy with a cute horse /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif
Proud Member (Cult-like follower?) of the AQHA Clique / Founder of the Plain Bay TB Clique!
If riding were all bright lights, big arenas and blue ribbons, I would have quit a long time ago." -George Morris

So Intent
Aug. 13, 2002, 09:56 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> The event riders (all) have been required to wear approved helmets for quite some time and I haven't noticed any complaining. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Have you seen the stuff we jump? I'll admit, I often go hatless at home, but when me and the pony are jumping off cliffs and over logs, you can bet I've got the approved and a safety vest on. When I'm in the hunter ring, i am often in an unapproved. I do like that hat. and the fences aren't nearly as intimidating as cross country. you hit 'em, they break.

Sparky Boy
Aug. 14, 2002, 05:59 AM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by creseida:

Hmm...$300 for a GPA that will protect you in a fall vs. $500+ for a Lock or a Patey that offers no protection... Pardon the pun, but this is a no brainer. /infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif
----------------------------------------------

My Ascot was just under $100. Not in this lifetime would I pay $500. for an unapproved hat.

hedgehog
Aug. 14, 2002, 06:11 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Hmm...$300 for a GPA that will protect you in a fall vs. $500+ for a Lock or a Patey that offers no protection... Pardon the pun, but this is a no brainer. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

My guess is that the stores see someone looking at the unapproved helmet, figure their already brain damaged and won't notice that they are paying a higher price for a piece o'crap that offers no protection.

Elghund2
Aug. 14, 2002, 08:44 AM
While everyone is free to make their own choices (as long as their willing to live with the consequences), I am amazed at the poor example shown by adults on this board. A teenager may or may not know any better, but for an adult to advocate choosing an unapproved helmet is irresponsible in my book.

"Mooses look into your window at night,
They look to the left and they look to the right,
The mooses are smiling they think its a zoo,
and thats why the mooses like looking at you."

CuteHunter
Aug. 14, 2002, 10:16 AM
I have had mine for several years and have never had a problem. I know, i know, i should wear an approved but i love my internatianl, with the tan harness. I have an approved but it hurts my head, makes my forehead bright red and almost strangled me when i fell off. The international has been perfect.

No i am not a junior and it is up to me to take my own life into my hands. Since you,Princess Lauren, asked what UNAPPROVED hats people recommend, i woudl say the international with the tan leather harness.

lmlacross
Aug. 14, 2002, 10:32 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Elghund2:
A teenager may or may not know any better, but for an adult to advocate choosing an unapproved helmet is irresponsible in my book.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I have not advocated for others to wear unapproved helmets. When a fellow BBer, and adult, asks for recommendations for unapproved hats, I recommend the one I have. She didn't ask for safety do's and don'ts, she asked for a product recommendation. As an adult, she seems to be well aware of the choice she is making.

It is not my job to role model here-- I simply answered the question being asked. If someone asked for my recommendation for a non-waterproof turnout blanket, I wouldn't read her the riot act about why waterproof rugs are better. I'd assume she has made her own considered choice about which rug to buy, and was asking for suggestions for the type of rug she WANTED.

By the same token, for those of you who think we "advocate", when was the last time you saw an adult on this board reply to a "Which approved helmet should I buy?" query with "None-- go unapproved!". That's an advocate. We simply respond to the question being asked.

LML

*MidWest/Chicago Clique*
*Cripple Clique*

AAJumper
Aug. 14, 2002, 10:39 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by RandomTexasHunter:
I love SB...but not as much as my dad....he has spongebob pj pants!

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I have Spongebob boxer shorts that I wear to bed!

visit www.victorianfarms.com (http://www.victorianfarms.com)

Moesha
Aug. 14, 2002, 12:11 PM
A/A jumper....I am having an affair with Spongebob Square pants! We are actually going to a reception at the Turkish Embassy next week, He is a little concerned about the Burberry's suit I picked out for him but I think he looks dashing in it. He is so considerate, he is coming to Culpeper this week to wathc me ride, we have had to face a lot of criticism inn our relationship but things are going well now and he is so helpful in cleaning up spills around the house.

achcosuva
Aug. 14, 2002, 01:48 PM
/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

-Anne, the sister of a PrettyFilly and searching for the PerfectHorse-
"Change is inevitable...except from a vending machine."

Moesha
Aug. 14, 2002, 02:00 PM
I live in a WigWam off Rt. 50

AAJumper
Aug. 14, 2002, 02:04 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Moesha:
A/A jumper....I am having an affair with Spongebob Square pants! We are actually going to a reception at the Turkish Embassy next week, He is a little concerned about the Burberry's suit I picked out for him but I think he looks dashing in it. He is so considerate, he is coming to Culpeper this week to wathc me ride, we have had to face a lot of criticism inn our relationship but things are going well now and he is so helpful in cleaning up spills around the house.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Wait...so are you telling me that you are Patrick??? /infopop/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

visit www.victorianfarms.com (http://www.victorianfarms.com)

eikcaj
Aug. 14, 2002, 02:07 PM
My old trainer had a great way to explain approved VS. unapproved.
Think of the approveds as those old cars people used to drive around in the 20s. Extremely hard, and unbendable, right?
Think of UNapproveds as the cars we drive now, being easier smashed and a little bendable.
When cars USED to get into accidents, the cars would be hardly damaged, but often the people inside would be badly injured, or even killed.
Now when cars get into accidents, the cars is usually smashed up the people inside are OK unless it was a horrible accident or the got impaled on something, etc.

So, now, moral of the story: Hold an approved in one hand and an unapproved in the other. See if you can bend the approved. Now, see if you can bend the unapproved.
When you fall off, lets say on a trail, and hit your head on a rock which one is going to conform to your head and protect it more?
The UNapproved.
When my mom rode her horse (not showing or anything, just trails and stuff) in the 70's (waaaay before I was born)
She wore an unapproved (I'm not sure if they had approveds back then, but I know for a fact that SHE rode in an UNapproved) she fell off on her head many times, one time even having a huge gash in her helemet, while her head was till fine. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

This is getting really long, so let me just make MY belief clear: Approveds are not all they are cracked up to be. On December 1, 2008 (when my show age turns 18) I will go back to wearing my unapproveds like I did before the rule took effect /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://www.mistyvalley.com/thehorseroom

~Gitter Clique~Willem Fan Club~Thoroughbred Clique~Do-It-YOURSELF Clique

Heineken
Aug. 14, 2002, 02:11 PM
I am laughing so hard about Sponge Bob and your date!!! The Burberry suit will look smashing...

Aqha Clique

Moesha
Aug. 14, 2002, 02:12 PM
Who is Patrick? Does he live in the Teepee down by the river?

Lisamarie8
Aug. 14, 2002, 02:14 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by WRKohl (formerly horsegrrl3889):So, now, moral of the story: Hold an approved in one hand and an unapproved in the other. See if you can bend the approved. Now, see if you can bend the unapproved.

When you fall off, lets say on a trail, and hit your head on a rock which one is going to conform to your head and protect it more?
The UNapproved.

...

This is getting really long, so let me just make MY belief clear: Approveds are not all they are cracked up to be. On December 1, 2008 (when my show age turns 18) I will go back to wearing my unapproveds like I did before the rule took effect /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://www.mistyvalley.com/thehorseroom

~Gitter Clique~Willem Fan Club~Thoroughbred Clique~Do-It-YOURSELF Clique
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That is some scary justification. Have you taken Physics? I could go on to explain a million ways WHY that is the silliest thing I've ever read, but I'm just plain lazy.

That's all I've got to say about that

-Lisa
Someone who doesn't give a D@MN what you put on your head...it's your head...but must speak up when ridiuclousness runs amuck /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

-- Why don't they pass a constitutional amendment prohibiting anybody from learning anything? If it works as well as prohibition did, in five years Americans would be the smartest race of people on Earth.

Moesha
Aug. 14, 2002, 02:17 PM
Heiniken,
The best part is that Spongy is interested in learning to ride..he is so wonderful..sometimes at night in the giant clam we sleep in I lay awake for hours thinking how lucky I am!!


"I feel pretty oh so pretty I feel witty and giddy and light...cau'se I'm loved by a pretty wonderful sponge."

Robby Johnson
Aug. 14, 2002, 02:18 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by WRKohl (formerly horsegrrl3889):
My old trainer had a great way to explain approved VS. unapproved.
Think of the approveds as those old cars people used to drive around in the 20s. Extremely hard, and unbendable, right?
Think of UNapproveds as the cars we drive now, being easier smashed and a little bendable.
When cars USED to get into accidents, the cars would be hardly damaged, but often the people inside would be badly injured, or even killed.
Now when cars get into accidents, the cars is usually smashed up the people inside are OK unless it was a horrible accident or the got impaled on something, etc.

So, now, moral of the story: Hold an approved in one hand and an unapproved in the other. See if you can bend the approved. Now, see if you can bend the unapproved.
When you fall off, lets say on a trail, and hit your head on a rock which one is going to conform to your head and protect it more?
The UNapproved.
When my mom rode her horse (not showing or anything, just trails and stuff) in the 70's (waaaay before I was born)
She wore an unapproved (I'm not sure if they had approveds back then, but I know for a fact that SHE rode in an UNapproved) she fell off on her head many times, one time even having a huge gash in her helemet, while her head was till fine. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

This is getting really long, so let me just make MY belief clear: Approveds are not all they are cracked up to be. On December 1, 2008 (when my show age turns 18) I will go back to wearing my unapproveds like I did before the rule took effect /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://www.mistyvalley.com/thehorseroom

~Gitter Clique~Willem Fan Club~Thoroughbred Clique~Do-It-YOURSELF Clique
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Since so much has been done to prove the protection value of an approved vs. an unapproved.

You may be only one person in the world, but you may also be the world to one person.

ride2hounds
Aug. 14, 2002, 02:19 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by WRKohl (formerly horsegrrl3889):
My old trainer had a great way to explain approved VS. unapproved.
Think of the approveds as those old cars people used to drive around in the 20s. Extremely hard, and unbendable, right? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Wrong. The outer shell is harder, but the inner liner is the "crumple zone" that does "give" and absorb the impact like "new" cars. This inner liner is what absorbs the brain-damaging concussion forces.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Think of UNapproveds as the cars we drive now, being easier smashed and a little bendable. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Again, this is inaccurate. The approved shell is a bit more flexible, mostly because it has no supportive structure behind the flimsy shell. It is lacking the "airbag" and the "crumple zones" of the modern approved helmets, which, again, is the inner liner. Any concussive forced inflicted upon an unapproved helmet is transmitted directly to your cranium to inflict wanton damage upon your precious grey-matter.

And BTW, just like an airbag, once deployed, an approved should be replaced. Also, many unapproveds are worn san harness or "seatbelts" so they can and do eject their passenger, namely your skull.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>When cars USED to get into accidents, the cars would be hardly damaged, but often the people inside would be badly injured, or even killed.
Now when cars get into accidents, the cars is usually smashed up the people inside are OK unless it was a horrible accident or the got impaled on something, etc.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Your trainer also forgot to mention things like cars in the 20's didn't travel as fast as cars of the modern era, they lacked seatbelts, collapsible steering columns, pop-out windshields, padded interior surfaces and recessed control knobs, safety glass, "crumple" zones, improved (radial) tires and suspension systems, antilock brakes, air bags, traction control...need I go on? None of which existed in the 1920's, and much of which only came available in the last 15-20 years.

Right now, you are only 12, if my math is correct; maybe when you turn 18, you will realize that you are definitely safer in a modern safety helmet.

~*~Tally Hoooooooo!~*~

AAJumper
Aug. 14, 2002, 02:21 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by WRKohl (formerly horsegrrl3889):
My old trainer had a great way to explain approved VS. unapproved.
Think of the approveds as those old cars people used to drive around in the 20s. Extremely hard, and unbendable, right?
Think of UNapproveds as the cars we drive now, being easier smashed and a little bendable.
When cars USED to get into accidents, the cars would be hardly damaged, but often the people inside would be badly injured, or even killed.
Now when cars get into accidents, the cars is usually smashed up the people inside are OK unless it was a horrible accident or the got impaled on something, etc.

So, now, moral of the story: Hold an approved in one hand and an unapproved in the other. See if you can bend the approved. Now, see if you can bend the unapproved.
When you fall off, lets say on a trail, and hit your head on a rock which one is going to conform to your head and protect it more?
The UNapproved.
When my mom rode her horse (not showing or anything, just trails and stuff) in the 70's (waaaay before I was born)
She wore an unapproved (I'm not sure if they had approveds back then, but I know for a fact that SHE rode in an UNapproved) she fell off on her head many times, one time even having a huge gash in her helemet, while her head was till fine. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

This is getting really long, so let me just make MY belief clear: Approveds are not all they are cracked up to be. On December 1, 2008 (when my show age turns 18) I will go back to wearing my unapproveds like I did before the rule took effect /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://www.mistyvalley.com/thehorseroom

~Gitter Clique~Willem Fan Club~Thoroughbred Clique~Do-It-YOURSELF Clique
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That is the ridiculous...your trainer has the theory totally backwards. Why is it that people actually believe that some crazy theory they have concocted in their heads is correct, and the engineers don't know what they are talking about?

FYI...the approved helmets have a styrofoam (or similar material) liner inside that crumples so to speak, thus absorping the impact so that your brain is not subjected to as much force. It is just like the new cars that crumple and absorb the shock. Old helmets are like old cars that don't crumple, and transmit the force to the inside (your head in the case of a helmet).

visit www.victorianfarms.com (http://www.victorianfarms.com)

AAJumper
Aug. 14, 2002, 02:22 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Moesha:
Who is Patrick? Does he live in the Teepee down by the river?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You surely MUST know who Patrick is!!! Starfish...friend of Spongebob....I think he lives in a teepee, but I can't be sure!

visit www.victorianfarms.com (http://www.victorianfarms.com)

Fiction
Aug. 14, 2002, 02:56 PM
I'm w/t the long post....If I hold my Royale or my skunk, and try to shape them it just doesn't work. If I take my smashed up old International unnaproved hat, it bends easily. I'd be happier falling in a hat that sticks to my head than something that doesn't fit.

Also(totally different subject) the different brands & types of hats are wayy different. My Royale is huge & bulky, and comes way far down on my forehead. Its a pain- litterally.
My skunk hat actually FITS my head, and doesn't hurt.

Although when I turn 18 I'm going and buying a Patey, I really don't mind my skunk hat /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

-----
This is not a true story
-----

AAJumper
Aug. 14, 2002, 04:23 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Fiction:
I'm w/t the long post....If I hold my Royale or my skunk, and try to shape them it just doesn't work. If I take my smashed up old International unnaproved hat, it bends easily. I'd be happier falling in a hat that sticks to my head than something that doesn't fit.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Don't fool yourself....that is not going to save you from a concussion. There has been plenty of research done on this subject and it has been found that an unapproved does not offer any better protection than a baseball hat, in terms of brain damage.

visit www.victorianfarms.com (http://www.victorianfarms.com)

eikcaj
Aug. 14, 2002, 04:28 PM
Really, if you have an approved that doesn't fit and an unapproved that does, the unapproved will protect your head more. Also vice-versa.

Can someone point me to a link that has information about these studies? Although I have and always will think unapproveds are better, I would like to see some scientific documentation about the studies on approved VS. unapproveds. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://www.mistyvalley.com/thehorseroom

~Gitter Clique~Willem Fan Club~Thoroughbred Clique~Do-It-YOURSELF Clique

Heineken
Aug. 14, 2002, 04:34 PM
WRKohl, while I think you are wrong about unapproveds I commend you for asking for studies to become more educated! I don't know any but search the archives under "helmets" and I'm sure you'll have PLENTY to read /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Aqha Clique

PaintedWhisper
Aug. 14, 2002, 05:09 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by PrettyFilly:
Who lives in a pineapple under the sea? /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

-Anne, the sister of a PrettyFilly and searching for the PerfectHorse-
"Change is inevitable...except from a vending machine."<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

SPONGEBOB SQUAREPANTS!!

Btw, I saw i small child Carrying a stuffed spongebob bigger than she was last week..

-Emily-
Ride Hard-you can SLEEP when you'are dead.

SBT
Aug. 14, 2002, 06:36 PM
Patrick Star is a starfish who walks around in a bathing suit and is Spongebob's best friend. /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

You can join the Spongebob Clique IF you can answer this question: Who (and what) is Mrs. Puff? /infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

(I agree this is getting rather silly, but it IS lightening the mood in this topic!)

~Sara /infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

"If you stand for nothing, you will fall for anything."
~Member of the "I Know the Secret of the Universe" Clique. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

PinkPonie
Aug. 14, 2002, 07:00 PM
One of the pony riders at my barn dressed up as spongebob for Halloween last year, wearing a yellow cardboard box. I had my horse in the cross ties while she walked by and needless to say he freaked out!!! It was funny.

And about the helmet issue... I normally like to stay out of this debate but thought I would add my two cents. I have both an unapproved and an approved. If you ask me, when I compare them I would much rather be wearing my approved in a fall, it's much softer and comfortable, where as my unapproved is rock hard. OUCH that would hurt if I landed on my head in that thing. So I will stick with my approved, but for all the people who like their unapproveds that's fine with me, I don't see why we have to give them such a hard time about it.... oh well.

~*Steff-O-Knee*~

EBroadhurst
Aug. 14, 2002, 07:02 PM
How on earth will SpongeBob ever find a helmet (approved or otherwise) to fit his square head?

Although, on second thought, if your head is already a sponge, does it really matter?

creseida
Aug. 14, 2002, 07:24 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by WRKohl (formerly horsegrrl3889):

Can someone point me to a link that has information about these studies? Although I have and always will think unapproveds are better, I would like to see some scientific documentation about the studies on approved VS. unapproveds. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Here are sites from all around the world.
Not all of these sites give statistics, butthey all share the common stated fact that ASTM/SEI or other "approved safety helmets" reduce the number and severity of closed head injuries.

Australian Site about Horses and Helmets (http://www.sport.vic.gov.au/dir017/srvsite.nsf/pages/research_injury_horse?OpenDocument)

An example of what happens when you ride without a helmet (http://www.capecodonline.com/cctimes/archives/2000/sep/5/girl115.htm)

Closed Head Injury Victim on disability 5 years after head injury while riding (http://www.tell-us-your-story.com/_disc58b/0000000b.htm)

Info about what repeated concussions do to the brain (http://www.clinicalsportsmedicine.com/chapters/10.htm)

Another site, this one from Canada (http://www.cha.ab.ca/healthsite/pk4049sh.asp)

this one from the U.S. shows statistics that 73% of all horse-related deaths are due to head injury (http://www.law.utexas.edu/dawson/amea/aug94nws.htm#helmet)

New Zealand site (http://www.horsetalk.co.nz/horsehelp/riding-injuries.shtml) (states that the highest percentage of injuries to any one part of the body was 37% for the head. Also describes an approved helmet as, "an airbag for your brain".)

These will get you started. There is a lady who posts on these BB's (Dru) who's career is in the realm of protection from head injuries. Perhaps she can give some more extensive statistics.

Also, just for some "casual" reading, let me direct you to a post that I made exactly one year ago. It is titled, "A painful reminder about approved helmets". Had I not been wearing my ASTM/SEI Showjumper 2000, on August 14, 2001, there is no doubt whatsoever that I would be dead. There was NO question in the doctor's mind that the helmet saved my life.

A Painful Reminder About Approved Helmets (http://chronofhorse.infopop.net/2/OpenTopic?a=tpc&s=691099205&f=1970907951&m=5153039162)

~<>~ Remember, the Ark was built by a rank amateur; the Titanic was built by a team of experts~<>~

Aug. 14, 2002, 07:31 PM
I know everyone is just trying to be helpful, but really! I mean, basically everyone is just saying the exact same thing, over and over! And it happens in every helmet thread! So, I really think that what should be said HAS been. I don't think any new, important info and facts on approved (or unapproved helmets) has come out recently. Everyone KNOWS approved helmets are safer. Yes, we all know it. However, that doesn't mean that someone over 18 needs to wear the safer one. It's their choice! Yes, it may not be smart. But it's still a choice USAEq (or whatever) gives to everyone over 18. So since the poster will be able to make that choice soon, even if it seems like the wrong one, it's still her decision. She asked for opinions on unapproveds, not wether she should get an approved or not. So unless you can give her advice, why bother repeating the same basic message that EVERYONE knows???

*Belen*
Proud Stalker of Reiners, Cutters, any hot cowboy with a cute horse /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif
Proud Member (Cult-like follower?) of the AQHA Clique / Founder of the Plain Bay TB Clique!
If riding were all bright lights, big arenas and blue ribbons, I would have quit a long time ago." -George Morris

Xanthoria
Aug. 14, 2002, 07:38 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by lmlacross:
It is not my job to role model here-- I simply answered the question being asked. If someone asked for my recommendation for a non-waterproof turnout blanket, I wouldn't read her the riot act about why waterproof rugs are better. I'd assume she has made her own considered choice about which rug to buy, and was asking for suggestions for the type of rug she WANTED.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Poor choice of metaphor. In one scenario her horse gets a litle damp if she chooses wrong. In the other she could die.

And regarding role model-ing: people learn and make choices through the advice and actions of those they associate with. If you post on public BB you are adding to the tally of pieces of advice from which many others will act - many of them young and impressionable.

If you don't want to add to the concensus of opinions, or role model, then don't post. /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

creseida
Aug. 14, 2002, 07:45 PM
There is also the Literary Classic, Mr. Bumpkin's Helmet Theory (http://chronofhorse.infopop.net/2/OpenTopic?a=tpc&s=691099205&f=4703057034&m=7653077573&r=1953017656#1953017656)



~<>~ Remember, the Ark was built by a rank amateur; the Titanic was built by a team of experts~<>~

Paloma
Aug. 14, 2002, 07:50 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by RandomTexasHunter:
Everyone KNOWS approved helmets are safer. Yes, we all know it. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Apparently not...

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> by WRKohl: let me just make MY belief clear: Approveds are not all they are cracked up to be. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

BUT, she asked for more info which has been provided. /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

>> If Noah had been Truly Wise,
He would have swatted Those Two Flies... /infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif <<

AAJumper
Aug. 14, 2002, 08:09 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by RandomTexasHunter:
Everyone KNOWS approved helmets are safer. Yes, we all know it. However, that doesn't mean that someone over 18 needs to wear the safer one. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Apparently you missed a few posts, particulary the ones spouting theories about how unapproved are safer. It's nonsense like that which really ticks me off. It's pure B.S. invented by the minds of those who want to rationalize their choice to wear unapproved and has absolutely no truth to it whatsoever. It is doing a serious disservice to people who are not better informed...and there are plenty of people like that out there.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>So unless you can give her advice, why bother repeating the same basic message that EVERYONE knows???<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Again, apparently not everyone appears to understand the message. If someone feels that they truely understand the consequences of a head injury and understands the difference between approved and unapproved, then fine. But I am not going to sit back and listen to this total b.s. about unapproveds being better than approveds without saying something. That whole notion is utterly ridiculous.

visit www.victorianfarms.com (http://www.victorianfarms.com)

AAJumper
Aug. 14, 2002, 08:20 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by WRKohl (formerly horsegrrl3889):
Can someone point me to a link that has information about these studies? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Where is Dru when we need her? I read an article she wrote a while back on Towerheads I believe, before it was a subscription site. It had tons on information on testing, etc. Hopefully she will see this thread and be able to post that article.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Although I have and always will think unapproveds are better, I would like to see some scientific documentation about the studies on approved VS. unapproveds. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Think whatever you want...too bad you'll always be WRONG.

visit www.victorianfarms.com (http://www.victorianfarms.com)

bucksnort
Aug. 14, 2002, 08:28 PM
That is a total cop out. I work at a tack store and I almost ALWAYS find an approved that fits. With so many different brands/styles/sizes to try I have a really hard time believing people that claim they cannot find ONE approved that fits. Give me a break!!! /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

fleur
Aug. 14, 2002, 08:33 PM
I agree... isn't that why everyone buys the GPA, because it is the easiest to fit?
I personally have never had an issue fitting an approved - funny how it's always the unapproved lovers who can't seem to find an approved that fits... /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_confused.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

WRKohl - Well DUH if you have one helmet that fits and one that doesn't, the fitted one is -probably- safer. BUT, if you can manage with all the helmets on the market to find one that fits, then the safer of the two WILL be the approved. No questions asked.
IMHO your "trainer" needs to go back to trainer school and learn about approved helmets!

*EMMA*

AAJumper
Aug. 14, 2002, 08:38 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by bucksnort:
That is a total cop out. I work at a tack store and I almost ALWAYS find an approved that fits. With so many different brands/styles/sizes to try I have a really hard time believing people that claim they cannot find ONE approved that fits. Give me a break!!! /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I agree. It takes work to find one that fits well, but it CAN be done. I went as far as to order 4 helmets from Dover (they have a very large selection) and I returned the 3 that didn't fit. They were so quick processing the refund on those 3 that both the charge and the credit ended up on the same Visa statement, so I wasn't out any extra cash for any length of time.

The other thing I find annoying is the tradition of wearing the hair up. It would be a lot easier to find a helmet that fits well if we didn't have to worry about stuffing hair up inside of it, IMO.

visit www.victorianfarms.com (http://www.victorianfarms.com)

JER
Aug. 14, 2002, 09:14 PM
Around here, nobody wears anything but GPAs at the A shows. Princess Lauren, you must be quite the individualist.

But, Your Highness, take this to heart: as a direct result of invoking your right to wear an unapproved hat while riding, you may be limiting the choices you can make for yourself in all aspects of your life in the future.

Bumpkin
Aug. 14, 2002, 11:24 PM
I also wear a GPA /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Bumpkin
Aug. 14, 2002, 11:28 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by WRKohl (formerly horsegrrl3889):
My old trainer had a great way to explain approved VS. unapproved.
Think of the approveds as those old cars people used to drive around in the 20s. Extremely hard, and unbendable, right?
Think of UNapproveds as the cars we drive now, being easier smashed and a little bendable.
When cars USED to get into accidents, the cars would be hardly damaged, but often the people inside would be badly injured, or even killed.
Now when cars get into accidents, the cars is usually smashed up the people inside are OK unless it was a horrible accident or the got impaled on something, etc.

So, now, moral of the story: Hold an approved in one hand and an unapproved in the other. See if you can bend the approved. Now, see if you can bend the unapproved.
When you fall off, lets say on a trail, and hit your head on a rock which one is going to conform to your head and protect it more?
The UNapproved.
When my mom rode her horse (not showing or anything, just trails and stuff) in the 70's (waaaay before I was born)
She wore an unapproved (I'm not sure if they had approveds back then, but I know for a fact that SHE rode in an UNapproved) she fell off on her head many times, one time even having a huge gash in her helemet, while her head was till fine. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

This is getting really long, so let me just make MY belief clear: Approveds are not all they are cracked up to be. On December 1, 2008 (when my show age turns 18) I will go back to wearing my unapproveds like I did before the rule took effect /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://www.mistyvalley.com/thehorseroom

~Gitter Clique~Willem Fan Club~Thoroughbred Clique~Do-It-YOURSELF Clique
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Dru calls him her hero.
/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

pinkhorse
Aug. 15, 2002, 06:33 AM
Ya'know, you're right. All that's being said has been said before. But, ya'know what? We're going to keep on having these threads every so often. And there's a few reasons for that.

One is that there's a 12 year old - 12!!! who feels she has made up her mind that she will, in 6 years run back to an unapproved - no matter what. The little glimmer of hope for this child is that she did ask for information. Proves she has a brain worth protecting. So, there's 6 years of hope for this girl to allow her life-loving spirit to continue.

Another is that every so often, not directly related to these threads, someone posts about how they decided (on their own, not due to rules or laws) to start wearing an approved helmet. Sometimes it's because they had a fall and it jarred some sense into their still working brains. Sometimes because a friend had a bad accident, whatever. I figure if we can plant a seed in someone's self-preservation center at a quiet time it'll come in handy some day in the future.

Thirdly, and important to me, is that I've been there, done that. I've had 4 concussions. The first, on my 18th birthday wearing an unapproved (of course, there weren't approveds 18 years ago!!! - OK, see what I mean? It was 28 years ago - not 18!) "hard hat", second in a caliente, and the next 2 in approveds (one may have been busted from a previous fall before I realized that any light fall can cause these babies to do their jobs and break and that they need to be replaced after ANY fall that your head hits the ground). I know I wouldn't be here if it wasn't for the approveds since the last one was pretty bad. I know my memory and concentration isn't what it used to be. (As you can tell by my telling this same story over and over and over on this bulletin board! /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif ) I know my balance isn't what it used to be. But, I am incredibly thankful that I'm in as good shape as I am considering I've had 4 fairly serious head injuries. It is important to me to help anyone I can avoid the hell that is the consequence of serious head injuries. There's many of us here. We will not be quiet.

The princess and any of her ilk have the choice whether or not to read any of these posts with whatever defense mechanisms they may choose to use. However, if you choose to come into debate with those of us that support the use of approved helmets you can be sure we will be here.

In all respect....

[This message was edited by pinkhorse on Aug. 15, 2002 at 03:58 PM.]

Posting Trot
Aug. 15, 2002, 06:57 AM
For the record, I wear (now) a CO John Whitaker (approved), and before that an International Olympian (approved). Before that I wore "hard Hats" because that's what you could get.

All of these posts waxing nostagic for the supposed safety provided by the unapproved helmets made me think about an article written by an economist (only an economist could write such an article) about how cars could be made to make drivers drive more safely. The gist was that, instead of putting all the fancy airbags, seatbelts and other safety equipment in, manufacturers should install in the steering columns sharp knives that would be deployed towards the driver should the car get into an accident. The rationale was that if the car has a lot of safety devices in it, then drivers will drive more rashly, making it more likely that they will get into an accident. But, if you installed the knives then *all* accidents would be fatal; therefore drivers would take far more care in manipulating the 2400 lb machines down the highway. Moreover, those who didn't take more care would die.

Maybe there's a similar rationale as to what makes the unapproved helmets more safe.

Tongue firmly in cheek.

second chance
Aug. 15, 2002, 07:55 AM
Here is a great link for info... please check it out and take the time to read... very interesting and factual.

Here it is: interesting link (http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=www.health.adelaide.edu.au/paed-neuro/HeadInjury/MVC-001X.JPG&imgrefurl=http://www.health.adelaide.edu.au/paed-neuro/HeadInjury/injury.html&h=768&w=1024&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dhead%2Binjury%26svnum%3D10%26hl%3Den% 26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8)

week 2 of 4 of stall rest, only 3 more months until she can be ridden.

*Ally*
Aug. 15, 2002, 08:04 AM
You guys are sooo funny! Lauren probably isn't reading any of this! You guys are just repeating yourselves... /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

~*Allison*~

Bumpkin
Aug. 15, 2002, 08:25 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by *Ally*:
You guys are sooo funny! Lauren probably isn't reading any of this! You guys are just repeating yourselves... /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

~*Allison*~<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

If helping one more person, who may not even be Lauren, wear an approved helmet. I am certain most of us will be quite happy
/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

bucksnort
Aug. 15, 2002, 08:43 AM
You guys helped to convince me that I should wear my approved everyride and not just when jumping. On our island the GPA fad has not hit yet. You are actually being quite the exhibitionist(sp?)if you choose to wear a GPA or the knockoff. You guys gave me a nudge in the right direction. I love my GPA and I feel so much safer when riding.

I also didn't realize before how often I should replace my helmet. The approved Troxel I was wearing was 8 years old and really did not fit my head.

So yes, maybe these helmet threads are repetative and yes, certain people will not change thier minds, but there are so many people that read these threads that have a little more to think about when it comes to approved/unapproveds.

pinkhorse
Aug. 15, 2002, 01:00 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by *Ally*:
You guys are sooo funny! Lauren probably isn't reading any of this! You guys are just repeating yourselves... /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

~*Allison*~<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Exactly my point Allison - you are.

flypony74
Aug. 15, 2002, 01:13 PM
"Mushroom head" is much more attractive than a head injury. I would shop for another approved helmet.

"Dream as if you'll live forever, and live as if you'll die tomorrow." -- James Dean

RedEqHunter
Aug. 15, 2002, 02:06 PM
I tried on every single approved helmet in two different tack stores. All of them were either uncomfortable or didn't fit correctly. Most of them kind of perched on my head. I did buy the ATH, which still presses against my forehead, but with lots of extra padding on the sides I can't fit my hand up there anymore. My unapproved International fits like a glove.

The GPA absolutely did NOT fit, I was advised by two places not to get it. Too much space from side to side and WAY too tight front to back. Besides, there's no way I could ever afford a $300 helmet.

My point is...the helmet companies need to come up with a better way to fit approved helmets, if they want everyone to start cheerfully buying and wearing them.

creseida
Aug. 15, 2002, 02:12 PM
RedEq... it sounds like you have a long-oval head. Have you tried any of the Charles Owens? I have a long oval head, and it (sj2000 model) fits me very well.

~<>~ Remember, the Ark was built by a rank amateur; the Titanic was built by a team of experts~<>~

[This message was edited by creseida on Aug. 15, 2002 at 05:22 PM.]

RedEqHunter
Aug. 15, 2002, 02:19 PM
I did try them. They kind of just sat on the top of my head. I couldn't really pull them down snugly. The next sizes up were far too big. My mother decided they didn't look safe or attractive so we decided against either one of them. The lady at the tack store said they didn't seem to be right for my head either. /infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

starlight
Aug. 15, 2002, 06:32 PM
Just a quick thought...the same people who can not find an approved that fits *perfectly* are the same people who are most likely wearing overly-snug custom boots, made to order 3 inches too tight! What is my point??? They wear the boots because it has that "look", though the helmet does not. They can not find a helmet that fits because they really DON'T want to wear it.
(Like people who who just can't quit smoking, because they really don't want to!)

Sorry to make my first post on this board a little cranky-sounding...:) i'm usually nice!

starlight

Elghund2
Aug. 16, 2002, 05:21 AM
Just a thought from redeqhuntes post. The problem may be that you are trying to get the same look/fit as your old unapproved. I don't think that the approved hemets are meant to sit down as low on your head as the unapproved. Also, since there is a difference in the weight distribution of the helmet it will feel a little more top heavy than your unapproved.

I just went through this in replacing my previous approved helmet. With the changes in technology in the past four years, how the new helmet fit and felt was different than the old. After wearing it for a while, I don't notice the change anymore.

So fit the helmet based upon the manufacturer's instructions and ride in it for a while. The change in feel will go a way.

Here is another benefit of the new approved: much cooler, termperature wise, on those hot sunny days. I'd wear them just for that reason.

"Mooses look into your window at night,
They look to the left and they look to the right,
The mooses are smiling they think its a zoo,
and thats why the mooses like looking at you."

lmlacross
Aug. 16, 2002, 06:27 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Xanthoria:

And regarding role model-ing: people learn and make choices through the advice and actions of those they associate with. If you post on public BB you are adding to the tally of pieces of advice from which many others will act - many of them young and impressionable.

If you don't want to add to the concensus of opinions, or role model, then don't post. /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Okay- the few of us who have responded to the poster's original question "What unapproved hat do you recommend?" have undoubtedly added to her mental bank of information-- I'll give you that. However, I think we've been more than cancelled out here by the myriad of BBers who have posted, beateing the drum for approved helmets. Again, I did not encourage her to wear an unapproved hat, I simply responded to the question I was being asked.

I don't know why this particular thread has even turned into a debate. The poster had already decided t obuy an unapproved hat- she just wanted suggestions of which one to buy. We haven't pulled her over to the "dark side", she's already there. So, if you'd all like, you can continue about the business of attempting t owin her back over the the ways of the light.

Sigh.

LML

*MidWest/Chicago Clique*
*Cripple Clique*

lmlacross
Aug. 16, 2002, 06:29 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by starlight:
Just a quick thought...the same people who can not find an approved that fits *perfectly* are the same people who are most likely wearing overly-snug custom boots, made to order 3 inches too tight! What is my point??? They wear the boots because it has that "look", though the helmet does not. They can not find a helmet that fits because they really DON'T want to wear it.
(Like people who who just can't quit smoking, because they really don't want to!)

Sorry to make my first post on this board a little cranky-sounding...:) i'm usually nice!

starlight<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

For the record, my boots are Effingham Semi-customs, and fit perfectly. I also ride in an unapproved. I don't think anyone could really ride properly in boots that are, as you suggested, 3" too small in the calf.,

LML

*MidWest/Chicago Clique*
*Cripple Clique*

Meshach
Aug. 16, 2002, 07:44 AM
Somebody wrote "The event riders (all) have been required to wear approved helmets for quite some time and I haven't noticed any complaining."

That's actually incorrect. ASTM-SEI helmets are encouraged in the jumping phases but not required. What is required for jumping is that the helmet must be permanently attached in at least three points, meaning no snap-out harnesses.

See the rulebook:

PROTECTIVE HEADGEAR. Upon arrival, wearing a hard hat is compulsory for anyone riding a horse on the flat. Protective headgear, specifically designed for equestrian use, secured by a permanently fitted, non-detachable retaining harness, secured to the shell at more than two points, is compulsory for anyone jumping an obstacle. Failure to wear a hard hat while riding on the flat or jumping any obstacle without headgear or with an incorrect or unfastened retention harness shall be penalized by elimination, at the discretion of the Ground Jury. The Federation strongly encourages all competitors to wear protective headgear passing or surpassing current American Society for Testing and Materials (ASTM) Standards.

I think all event riders do use approved helmets whether british approved or ASTM approved. I wear a Charles Owen Ventura skullcap which surpasses all british approval ratings. It has the same thickness and sturdiness as the ASTM helmets that I tried on but for me, the fit was far superior.

Some might say that the British approves aren't as safe as the American ones but at least it stays on my head and doesn't move around.

Medievalist
Aug. 16, 2002, 08:23 AM
The dark side?! Excellent. I always wanted to have one of those cool light sabers /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*
Check out my barn's site:
Centre Equestre de la Houssaye (http://www.eii.fr/club/houssaye)
*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*_*

lmlacross
Aug. 16, 2002, 09:27 AM
/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

*MidWest/Chicago Clique*
*Cripple Clique*

Backstage
Aug. 16, 2002, 10:06 AM
I wasn't going to say anything, I really wasn't...but so many people are referring to specific incidences that a unapproved did protect the head...Without a doubt, an unapproved helmet will protect you head better than no helmet. But
when push comes to shove, the approved helmet is even more likely to protect your head from injury. have never ridden in an unapproved. Even before the hype over approved helmets, my mother would check to make sure that every helmet we bought was approved. No cost is too high when it comes to your head, and while nothing is a guarantee, I'd rather stack the deck in my favour.

And I didn't have to get a Skunk to find a comfy one, but thats just me.

God creates dinosaurs, god destroys dinosaurs. God creates man, man destroys god, man creates dinosaurs.'
'Dinosaurs eat man, woman inherits the earth.'
- Jurassic Park

AAJumper
Aug. 16, 2002, 02:42 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Backstage Pass:
I wasn't going to say anything, I really wasn't...but so many people are referring to specific incidences that a unapproved did protect the head...Without a doubt, an unapproved helmet will protect you head better than no helmet<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That is not necessarily true...I read an article a while ago where they actually tested unapproved helmets in terms of their ability to absorb the impact of a fall, and how the force was transmitted to the contents of the helmet. It was found that the unapproved helmets did not absorb any of the force at all...all the force exerted on the helmet was transmitted directly to the brain. Unapproveds are just a hard shell and some foam lining...they don't absorb the force at all. Yes, they make protect you from an abrasion or injury of that sort (like a puncture injury or a severe cut to the head), but will not protect you from a concussion any more than a baseball hat, according to what I had read.

Annecdotal evidence, as presented here when referring to accidents in an unapproved is just that...annecdotal. It does not prove that unapproved helmets offer any protection whatsoever. There is no way to prove that the person would have suffered a more serious brain injury if they were wearing nothing at all. However, approveds HAVE been scientifically proven to reduce the amount of force transimitted to the head.

I wish I had access to that article...grrrr.

visit www.victorianfarms.com (http://www.victorianfarms.com)

wondrlnd77
Aug. 16, 2002, 05:32 PM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Elghund2:


As far as the government not being able to legislate helmet wearing, check the states that have already put in laws on motorcyclists and bicyclists that require helmets.


Just an FYI-
Florida revoked its motorcycle helmet law. Guess I am still safe to hack without my helmet too for awhile.

Starmite
Aug. 16, 2002, 06:11 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by sbt78lw:
Patrick Star is a starfish who walks around in a bathing suit and is Spongebob's best friend. /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

You can join the Spongebob Clique IF you can answer this question: Who (and what) is Mrs. Puff? /infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

(I agree this is getting rather silly, but it IS lightening the mood in this topic!)

~Sara /infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

"If you stand for nothing, you will fall for anything."
~Member of the "I Know the Secret of the Universe" Clique. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

MRS PUFF IS THE DRIVERS ED TEACHER!!! and she's a blowfish!!! I'm right aren't I??? (I best go read the posts following yours cuz I haven't yet.)

~MP

*Co Founder: Children's Jumper Clique!!! Member of the GA clique, the WB clique, and the Future Famous Song Re-writers of America clique*

Flawless
Aug. 16, 2002, 06:15 PM
There are a lot of people, all with different opinions, ideas, and beliefs. LET everyone who CHOOSES those opinions/ideas/beliefs choose them. Instead of getting into a fight of which is or isn't better- or why it is or isn't - JUST LET PEOPLE MAKE UP THEIR OWN MINDS.... They already know all the specs on the approved vs unapproved, they've made their choice.... I think that the more people tell an individual (NOT pointing fingers at ANYONE here!) what NOT to do, the more they choose to do it. Though this may not speak for all, I do know that many people resist JUST because everyone is telling them to do something. They DO NOT LIKE to be told what to do......
(Hey Look at this = YOU could post saying that what I am saying is what I am telling you not to do!!! Ha ha.... and see how well it works...:rolleyes: /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif )


I'm fairly sure that everyone here REALLY deep down KNOWS that an approved riding helmet with ASTM/SEI standards IS safer. I know this! Unapproveds are NOT safer than an approved helmets. You can tell this fairly quickly with your own self-test by taking the sides of the helmet (NOT the front and back... the SIDES) and pushing them towards each other (the result is that the helmet flexes inwards (sp?)). You have to know that if you're hands can do that, a fall is definately going to do more than that. It's easy to see. There may not be an justification for using an unapproved - and I DO NOT claim to have a reason for it, but it is their god given right to make that decision!

I'm just going to say that no matter what you are wearing on your head (even if it be nothing) if you are AROUND or ON a horse you have a high risk of life-threatening injuries regardless..... Approved helmets up your chances when on the horses back IF you hit your head - they don't prevent broken necks, or other internal injuries from falls/impalements as result of falls NOR do unapproved or baseball caps. So no matter what you have on you could still end up dying because of OTHER injuries. But YES approveds ARE safer then unapproveds!

I'm sure I WILL be flamed - however I stand here (or sit at my computer) admiting that I too wear an unapproved riding helmet - for no justifiable reason. I JUST DO. And I will end this post saying that I am using my RIGHT, even if it is stupid and senseless and selfish and ignorant and silly and idiotic and (call it whatever you want to)but I choose to make that choice.

Ironically I am very seriously considering investing in an approved riding helmet, and I will be looking around for an alternative to my unapproved. I will not however deny that I do like my unapproved even with all the drawbacks and dangers it possesses.......

And that is just my personal opinion. /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Life is a one time journey, so make the most of it!

Starmite
Aug. 16, 2002, 06:24 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by AAJumper:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Moesha:
Who is Patrick? Does he live in the Teepee down by the river?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You surely MUST know who Patrick is!!! Starfish...friend of Spongebob....I think he lives in a teepee, but I can't be sure!

visit http://www.victorianfarms.com<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I don't believe my eyes! Patrick lives under a ROCK!!! come on ya'll!!
~MP

*Co Founder: Children's Jumper Clique!!! Member of the GA clique, the WB clique, and the Future Famous Song Re-writers of America clique*

Bored*
Aug. 16, 2002, 06:25 PM
But she's right. Mrs. Puff is spongebob's boating teacher, and she's a blow fish. She does not loff Spongebob. But who couldn't? /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

So can I join the Spongebob cleek now? /infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

It takes a big man to cry, but it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man.

Proud member and co-founder of the Children's Jumper Clique.
Proud member (and founder /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif ) of the Draw Reins Are Not A Torture Device Clique.
VERY proud member of The Future Famous Song Re-writers of America Clique!

Starmite
Aug. 16, 2002, 06:32 PM
I will definately join the Spongebob CLICK.

and to make this related, I wear an approved helmet. /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif even when I'm schooling! /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

~MP

*Co Founder: Children's Jumper Clique!!! Member of the GA clique, the WB clique, and the Future Famous Song Re-writers of America clique*

Backstage
Aug. 16, 2002, 07:04 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by AAJumper:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Backstage Pass:
I wasn't going to say anything, I really wasn't...but so many people are referring to specific incidences that a unapproved did protect the head...Without a doubt, an unapproved helmet will protect you head better than no helmet<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That is not necessarily true...I read an article a while ago where they actually tested unapproved helmets in terms of their ability to absorb the impact of a fall, and how the force was transmitted to the contents of the helmet. It was found that the unapproved helmets did not absorb any of the force at all...all the force exerted on the helmet was transmitted directly to the brain. Unapproveds are just a hard shell and some foam lining...they don't absorb the force at all. Yes, they make protect you from an abrasion or injury of that sort (like a puncture injury or a severe cut to the head), but will not protect you from a concussion any more than a baseball hat, according to what I had read.

Annecdotal evidence, as presented here when referring to accidents in an unapproved is just that...annecdotal. It does not prove that unapproved helmets offer any protection whatsoever. There is no way to prove that the person would have suffered a more serious brain injury if they were wearing nothing at all. However, approveds HAVE been scientifically proven to reduce the amount of force transimitted to the head.

I wish I had access to that article...grrrr.

visit http://www.victorianfarms.com<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


I think you may have misunderstood my post...could you reread it please...cause I most certainly NOT endorsing unapproved, I've never even had one on my head!

God creates dinosaurs, god destroys dinosaurs. God creates man, man destroys god, man creates dinosaurs.'
'Dinosaurs eat man, woman inherits the earth.'
- Jurassic Park

AAJumper
Aug. 16, 2002, 08:09 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Flawless:
They already know all the specs on the approved vs unapproved, they've made their choice.... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Apparently not....based on earlier posts....

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>I'm fairly sure that everyone here REALLY deep down KNOWS that an approved riding helmet with ASTM/SEI standards IS safer. I know this! Unapproveds are NOT safer than an approved helmets. You can tell this fairly quickly with your own self-test by taking the sides of the helmet (NOT the front and back... the SIDES) and pushing them towards each other (the result is that the helmet flexes inwards (sp?)). You have to know that if you're hands can do that, a fall is definately going to do more than that. It's easy to see. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

But that is just it...a few people have made the claim (in this thread!!!) that what you just said it proof that the unapproved is SAFER! Like I said before, I simply cannot sit here an read misinformation that was posted by a few people earlier without saying something. It is just wrong to float theories around that have NO foundation and give people a false sense of security.

visit www.victorianfarms.com (http://www.victorianfarms.com)

AAJumper
Aug. 16, 2002, 08:15 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Backstage Pass:
I think you may have misunderstood my post...could you reread it please...cause I most certainly NOT endorsing unapproved, I've never even had one on my head!
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I realize that you are not endorsing unapproveds, but you did say that based on what others have said, an unapproved does offer more protection than nothing at all. What I was saying is that I remember reading somewhere that an unapproved does NOT offer more protection than nothing at all. I only wanted to point this out because people seem to have a false sense of security (not you, but the others that you were referring to) about unapproveds...that they offer SOME protection from brain injuries.

visit www.victorianfarms.com (http://www.victorianfarms.com)

[This message was edited by AAJumper on Aug. 16, 2002 at 11:36 PM.]

AAJumper
Aug. 16, 2002, 08:16 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Starmite:

I don't believe my eyes! Patrick lives under a ROCK!!! come on ya'll!!
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

LOL...I guess I do not watch as much as I should!

visit www.victorianfarms.com (http://www.victorianfarms.com)

ride2hounds
Aug. 16, 2002, 08:35 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by wondrlnd77:
Guess I am still safe to hack without my helmet too for awhile.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You are NOT safe. /infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif You ARE making a choice, which is your right, albeit a less-than-intelligent one.

~*~Tally Hoooooooo!~*~

Flawless
Aug. 17, 2002, 07:45 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by AAJumper:

But that is just it...a few people have made the claim (in this thread!!!) that what you just said it proof that the unapproved is SAFER! Like I said before, I simply cannot sit here an read misinformation that was posted by a few people earlier without saying something. It is just wrong to float theories around that have NO foundation and give people a false sense of security.

visit http://www.victorianfarms.com<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I agree with you completely, and most definately do not have a problem with your reply! It's funny though - that "Give" in the unapproved helmets is what causes the concussion..... ("If you are heading towards ground at a fairly fast speed, and with the momentum of your body weight following behind (your head) if the helmet makes contact directly with the ground and flexes. The impact will be transfered to your head rather than the helmet ("ground hits" the helmet, the helmet flexes, and that same amount of force is administered to the head through the flex of the helmet!).... The unapproved, fitted properly, doesn't allow for that flex, and thus the impact is not carried on to the wearer....)


/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Life is a one time journey, so make the most of it!

Bumpkin
Aug. 17, 2002, 08:23 AM
http://chronofhorse.infopop.net/2/OpenTopic?a=tpc&s=691099205&f=4703057034&m=7653077573

Or just read this part....

What Happens When You Fall Without a Helmet:
If you were to take a fall from your horse and land on your head without a helmet, your head which would contain a great deal of kinetic (in motion) energy would strike the hard ground and a good deal of that energy would then transfer back to your head in a great shock to your brain. Hard ground is a poor energy shock absorber, but rather more of a shock reflector.

This would be like hitting a telephone pole with a baseball bat. The pole can't absorb the kinetic energy of the moving bat, so the pole reflects the energy back into the bat and back up your arms. This is what you don't want to happen when trying to prevent a head injury. You want the energy to leave your head and move into the ground at a rate that the ground can absorb it at.

Neither your head or the ground compress very well and therefore the impact energy is transferred from your head to the ground over a very small amount of physical displacement, or movement. This rapid deceleration of your skull hitting the ground means that your brain which is floating in a fluid can slam into the inside of your skull and become bruised, resulting in a concussion.

How a Helmet Works:

Helmets are made up of a hard outer shell and a firm, but compressible inner liner normally made from polystyrene. The outer shell is designed to stay in shape in a fall and not deform upon impact. This causes the energy of the helmet contacting the ground not to be focused on a small local area of the helmet, but to be spread out over the entire surface of the helmet where it contacts the ground.

Between your head and the hard outer shell is a polystyrene foam layer. This layer is designed to compress at a predetermined rate when the helmet strikes the ground. This compression rate is designed to decelerate (slow) your head at a rate that doesn't cause your brain to strike the inside of your skull. This is similar to an airbag in your car. It inflates just before you hit it and then deinflates as your body presses into it, thereby slowing your forward motion so you don't slam into the steering wheel. Additionally, the force of your head upon the foam compresses the foam and this converts the kinetic energy of your head into mechanical energy (compressing foam) and then into heat which is quickly dissipated.

Accidents:

Once a helmet has been used in an accident and the inner liner of foam has become compressed in even a small amount it must be replaced or rebuilt with a new foam liner, or next time there will be less non-compressed foam to absorb the energy and the shock to your head will be greater.

Aging:

The materials that make up a helmet over time can become compromised due to daily use, ozone and other environmental forces causing them to become weakened. Old helmets should be replaced, or they could fail when called upon.

SBT
Aug. 17, 2002, 02:27 PM
You may now join the Spongebob Clique. /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Oddly enough, the first time I saw Spongebob was in the ER waiting room last January after I got bucked off by a rank 4 y/o OTTB and fell on my APPROVED-HELMETED head. Lost all vision for a few seconds (partial blackout), then had a pretty halo in my left eye (the side I landed on), so I went to the ER to get checked out.

So I'm sitting in the waiting room for eons with a splitting headache, and what was on the TV but Spongebob. Some little kids had gotten hold of the remote. I was THOROUGHLY annoyed, but the TV was loud enough that everyone was at least forced to LISTEN to Spongebob. Lo and behold, before too long I was LAUGHING my butt off at the program. I have been a fan ever since!

As it turned out, I did have a mild concussion, and suffered from awful migranes for 2 weeks. I went home and pulled my helmet apart, and saw where the foam shell had been literally SQUISHED DOWN by the impact of the fall. My doctor told me that without a doubt, had I not been wearing that helmet, I would have been in pretty bad shape.

So, for me, Spongebob and approved helmets will be forever linked! /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

~Sara /infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

"If you stand for nothing, you will fall for anything."
~Member of the "I Know the Secret of the Universe" Clique. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Starmite
Aug. 17, 2002, 04:32 PM
wow how scary! luckily so far I have never fallen and hit my head...no concussions for me! /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif plus, even if I do I have my trusty approved helmet to protect me!
~MP

*Co Founder: Children's Jumper Clique!!! Member of the GA clique, the WB clique, and the Future Famous Song Re-writers of America clique, AND the Spongebob CLICK*

Bored*
Aug. 17, 2002, 06:44 PM
Do I get to join the Spongebob Cleek? I answered the question, and I'm a lot cooler than Starmite because I can actually pronounce clique, so... can I join now?? /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

It takes a big man to cry, but it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man.

co-founder: Children's Jumper Clique.
founder: Draw Reins Are Not A Torture Device Clique.
VERY proud member of The Future Famous Song Re-writers of America Clique!

Starmite
Aug. 17, 2002, 08:39 PM
Don't let her join until she pronounces it right!!!
lol j/k...I must learn to accept our differences, Bored*
/infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif
~MP

*Co Founder: Children's Jumper Clique!!! Member of the GA clique, the WB clique, and the Future Famous Song Re-writers of America clique, AND the Spongebob CLICK*

SBT
Aug. 17, 2002, 08:41 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Bored*:
Do I get to join the Spongebob Cleek? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes, of course. /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif Everyone who loves Spongebob can join. But I think Moesha should be the president of the clique, since she's actually dating him. /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

~Sara /infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

"If you stand for nothing, you will fall for anything."
~Member of the "I Know the Secret of the Universe" Clique. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Britney
Aug. 17, 2002, 09:09 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by sbt78lw:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Bored*:
Do I get to join the Spongebob Cleek? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes, of course. /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif Everyone who loves Spongebob can join. But I think Moesha should be the president of the clique, since she's actually dating him. /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

~Sara

"If you stand for nothing, you will fall for anything."
~Member of the "I Know the Secret of the Universe" Clique. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

LOL, I agree. And I too, am joining!
/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif How anyone can not see this as the most entertaining show on earth, is beyond me. /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif Today, I bought a pair of spongebob slippers. /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif They are like the sweetest things ever. THey are square and in the shape of spongebob, basically looks like a stuffed animal of him with a hole for your feet. /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

--------------------
Britney L. Pelletier
~*Rush Hour*~

"The Greatest thing you'll ever learn, is just to love, and be loved in return."

*Children's Jumper Clique*Thoroughbred Clique*NH Clique*Proud Member Of The Draw Reins Are Not A Torture Device Clique*

achcosuva
Aug. 18, 2002, 08:15 AM
FlyingChange: don't you think it would be mighty uncomfy to be a sponge and have someone's feet stuck in you??

BTW, I love SB's eyes. /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif They're the coolest. He can take them out, squish them back in, roll them all the way back and look at the inside of his head , etc. /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif Heehee.

sbt78lw: That's a scary introductions to Spongebob! /infopop/emoticons/icon_eek.gif I've always, always worn an approved and the only concussion I've had was a mild one where I slipped on a rock and cracked my head on another one. In Italy. /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

-Anne, the sister of a PrettyFilly and searching for the PerfectHorse-
"Change is inevitable...except from a vending machine."

Kryswyn
Aug. 18, 2002, 05:23 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by sbt78lw:

But I think Moesha should be the president of the clique, since she's actually dating him. /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I may not know who Spongebob is (tho I've heard of him) but I do know that Moesha (our Moesha here on the board) is a guy. Knowing him however, he'd probably think dating Spongebob would be cool /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

~Kryswyn~
"Always look on the bright side of life, de doo, de doo de doo de doo"

Carol Ames
Aug. 18, 2002, 10:13 PM
ANYONE THINKING OF NOT WEARING AN APPROVED HELMET, NEEDS TO SEE A Tbi, TRAUMATIC BRAIN INJURY," UP CLOSE AND PERSONAL."IS INVITEDTO COME TO THENURSING HOME TO SEE ME; ALHOUGH MINE IS NOT THE RESULT OF A FALL; THE RESULTS AND EFFECTS ARE MUCH THE SAME.I'LL BE GLAD TO TELL YOU ABOUT LOSING ALL MY ANIMALS, TWO CATS PLUS MY BELOVED MARE AND HER FOAL 'MERCURY' FEATURED ON A THREADHERE LASTSUMMER.; I'MSURE YOU WILL FORGIVE ME WHEN I BREAK DOWN IN TEARS; AS MY PSYCH SAID, MY GRIEF IS UNDERSTANDABLE.bRAINS DO HEAL,THOUGH SLOWY AND, THE CELLSWHICH AREDESTROYED ARE NOT REPLACED. it IS NOT LIKE A BROKEN BONE OR CONCUSSION;THE AFTER EFFECTS LINGER FOR YEARS;AND, AS ANGRY AS I BECAME, WITH THE THERAPIST WHO TOLD ME THAT MY LIFE WITH ANIMALS AND HORSES WAS OVER;i'M AFRAID THAT HE WAS RIGHT. I WILL CERTAINLY NEVERAGAIN BE IN THE SITUATION WHERE IWILL BE ABLE TO CARE FOR MY OWN HORSES;OR RIDEGREENIES, OR JUMP OR EVER SIT ON MERCURY, THE HORSE I BRED , FOALED OUT AND SAW EVERY MORNING AND NIGHT OF HIS LIFE UNTIL dEC. 10, 1999; I WAS NEVER ABLE TO SAY GOODBY TO HIM OR HIS MOTHER,WHO DIED THIS PAST YEAR.YES, IT'S TRUE THATS****T HAPPENS; BUT WHY HELP IT? weAR THEHELMET! /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif

[This message was edited by CAROL AMES on Aug. 19, 2002 at 01:24 AM.]

creseida
Aug. 19, 2002, 08:39 AM
I agree with Carol. Any of you who "choose" to wear an unapproved, should make that visit.

~<>~ Remember, the Ark was built by a rank amateur; the Titanic was built by a team of experts~<>~