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TKR
May. 10, 2012, 08:43 AM
I am just looking for something to worry about -- but, I have recently bred my girl and want to be sure she is getting what she needs if she is pregnant. I usually feed TOTW with some rice and meat and she loves carrots for treats. She is getting Avoderm right now since the recall. Is there a specific one to feed or a vitamin she needs? She is 26 months and extremely healthy, active, up to date on everything - lives inside but loves being out around the barn - with me all the time. Thanks!
PennyG

Pcostx
May. 10, 2012, 12:03 PM
Wouldn't the best source of information be your vet? Or the owner of the stud dog (assuming they are reputable, ethical and knowledgeable breeders).

I would think that BEFORE you bred your bitch you would have educated yourself on breeding, whelping and the nutritional needs of a pregnant bitch.

jetsmom
May. 10, 2012, 12:36 PM
Wouldn't the best source of information be your vet? Or the owner of the stud dog (assuming they are reputable, ethical and knowledgeable breeders).

I would think that BEFORE you bred your bitch you would have educated yourself on breeding, whelping and the nutritional needs of a pregnant bitch.

This^^^

TKR
May. 10, 2012, 12:38 PM
Could REALLY do without your smart-assed remarks. I owned the stud dog and I have consulted with my vets and done research. This entire event has been carefully planned as the male is deceased and I used his frozen semen, working with a highly reputable reproduction vet, Missy! They designed a protocol for this breeding months ago. We checked her progesterone levels by drawing blood daily for over a week, etc. so it would be timed just right. This was hardly a breeding done on a whim. My male was my heart dog and I searched for the right pedigree in a female for months before buying a puppy to be sure I had what I wanted as a companion and that would possibly be a good match with this semen, should all pan out. She has been OFA'd (hips and elbows), so - guess what -- I'm hardly ignorant or breeding inferior animals. Both my GSD's are from titled, imported stock and I have researched their bloodlines back 7 generations and worked with other sources. I grew up around GSD breeders who trained and showed CDX/tracking/protection, etc. I have bred horses for 30+ years so I KNOW the importance of all the details and planning ahead. My vets feel what I am doing is fine -- just checking to see if any other breeders have some thoughts or recommendations regarding supplements for a possibly pregnant bitch. It's very important to me that all bases are covered and I have bought my GSD's until now. If you have no thoughts or knowledge of what I am asking, take your snippy/unwelcome remarks and go elsewhere!

PennyG

cowboymom
May. 10, 2012, 12:40 PM
OP you are likely to get lambasted here-you're going to have a much better day if you forget you posted this and google instead. Trust me. :yes:

dang, I was too late!

jetsmom
May. 10, 2012, 01:14 PM
You really need to find a mentor to help you. Their experience with breeding and whelping will be invaluable.
Glad to hear you didn't breed on a whim. Do you have homes already lined up for the puppies?

TKR
May. 10, 2012, 01:20 PM
Yes, I probably have more that want a puppy than she will have. Everyone loved Norman and this female has alot of fans as well. Nevermind on the rest of it -- I'll figure it out!
PennyG

veetiepony
May. 10, 2012, 03:25 PM
Oh, come on.. with the wealth of combined knoweldge on this board, no one has any advice for her? You can research all you want and discuss all you want with your vet, but it never hurts to ask. I was the same way breeding my horse.

Simkie
May. 10, 2012, 03:33 PM
I think what's frustrated people is that it seems like TKR has done zero research prior to this. Perhaps she has asked her vet, googled, and gotten her mentor's opinion, but she doesn't state that.

After the bitch is bred is not really the time to find out what you should be feeding her, you know?

TKR, I believe most people feed their bred bitches like puppies--extra portions and a high quality puppy food. You may also want to supplement with a good omega 3 source.

Houndhill
May. 10, 2012, 04:13 PM
I supplement the pregnant bitches with a human prenatal vitamin...plus fish oil capsules. Used to give extra selenium (thought at one time to prevent FCE in the puppies) but no longer do that as I'm sure they get enough.

If you don't do prenatal vitamins, make sure she is getting plenty of folic acid, supplement if necessary. Ridgeback folk have found it helps prevent dermoid sinus and lots of human research supports its use during pregnancy to prevent various neural tube defects.

Don't do extra calcium assuming diet is OK calcium wise, you can predispose them to eclampsia. But during the whelping itself, I do feed a little Breyers vanilla ice cream.

Some people feed a little liver, not too much. Some bitches don't eat too well in early pregnancy, but they usually will pick up. I do cater to them. I feed pregnant bitches sardines, eggs, generally balanced diet, high quality, easily digestible, you may need to go to three meals a day if she is carrying a large litter later in pregnancy.

TKR
May. 10, 2012, 06:35 PM
Actually, I have looked into the nutrition and supplements -- but there is very little if any product that is marketed for expectant bitches. Yes, I have discussed this with my vets and some others who are fairly knowledgeable. I just wanted to be sure I wasn't missing anything since so many on this board are good sources and have bred dogs more than I have. I don't make any decisions such as this without appropriate research -- my question on this board was just another part of that. Didn't think I needed to provide so much information just to get a few ideas of what others do that I might not know about. I have bred horses for a very long time and get phone calls, emails, etc. inquiring about such things and try to answer without being so judgemental or assuming the person asking is totally ignorant and embarking on a course of action without any thought or information. Thanks to anyone who just provided some useful information.
PennyG

cowboymom
May. 10, 2012, 08:17 PM
Unfortunately this board doesn't seem to be in the interests of providing useful information so much as it is a means to smack-down pet owners for not passing muster with the Chosen Few.

Valid question from a valid breeder and it gets a warning, a few snide comments, and one valid response on nutrition. nice.

DoubleClick
May. 10, 2012, 08:19 PM
We've never supplemented our pregnant bitches at the recommendation of our vet, who is probably the foremost reproductive specialist in the area. If the bitch goes off her food, then we cook this and that and give canned to keep her eating. We feed an all life stages food, so there's no need to switch foods or anything. Good luck!

Mara
May. 10, 2012, 08:48 PM
Unfortunately this board doesn't seem to be in the interests of providing useful information so much as it is a means to smack-down pet owners for not passing muster with the Chosen Few.

Valid question from a valid breeder and it gets a warning, a few snide comments, and one valid response on nutrition. nice.

And the Chosen Few never return to apologize for jumping to ill-informed conclusions.

OP, I hope your bitch caught, has a healthy and easy pregnancy, and whelps a nice litter of happy healthy pups. Of course we (some of us, anyway) will want PICTURES!:yes:

Pcostx
May. 10, 2012, 08:50 PM
Unfortunately this board doesn't seem to be in the interests of providing useful information so much as it is a means to smack-down pet owners for not passing muster with the Chosen Few.

Valid question from a valid breeder and it gets a warning, a few snide comments, and one valid response on nutrition. nice.

:confused: :confused:

Her initial question said nothing that would indicate she was a 'valid breeder'.

Her post sounded like a classic case of shutting the barn door after the horse has escaped.

Perhaps if the OP had rephrased her original question it wouldn't have raised so many hackles.

She could have said, "I've already done a lot of research but I know there are some experienced breeders here on COTH, so I'd like to pick their brains.

I've recently bred my GSD bitch for the first time and I'm looking for any advice on the best way to feed her so that she and her pups are as healthy as they can be."

Marshfield
May. 11, 2012, 03:19 AM
The most recent recommendation I've read (from a few canine repro vets) is to up the nutritional plane when the bitch comes in to heat as this will maximize litter size. I keep all of our dogs (I was in to corgis when I married a GSP breeder) routinely on a grain free kibble that is high in fat and protein. So, I don't change food but after first trimest, I do increase amounts. TOTW, if I remember correctly is pretty modest in fat and protein levels compared to some other options. You might look at Canidae or Acana for her. Gale ate Acana as that's what she decided was tasty after some early pregnancy inappetance, which seems to happen commonly to the girls in her family.

And yes, for those who would ask. Everybody is titled and fully health screened. I still work closely with my breed mentor and DH still works closely with his. We average less than 2 litters per year, typically one of each breed every 18 months or so.

TKR
May. 11, 2012, 09:12 AM
I should know for sure around the 28th or 29th of this month. I'm not going to make any changes for now as it looks like for the first month anyway there is not alot more that is required. If she does check (I still want to say "in foal", LOL!) as pregnant, I will put her on a high fat puppy food as some of you have recommeneded and look into prenatal vitamins. She is a fussy eater so I have to be sure she likes whatever it is. I mix in some brown rice and seared steak pieces and she gets a bit of raw and carrots. She is very precious to me and I intend to continue to do all that I can to insure she is given the optimum in every way, pregnant or not. As I have posted a great deal on this board, I didn't think my entire resume on this endeavor was necessary to gain some insight about others' dog breeding experience. My nature is to research and ask to the max. Thanks for the good advice and good wishes - I take my animals seriously and respond in kind if anyone assumes otherwise. However, I think ASKING a few questions prior to assuming anything might be worth considering before responding in a negative way to the questions of a poster who doesn't give a biography. My first post certainly indicated I was interested in her care and she was living well, on good food and with someone who wanted to do it all right.
PennyG

cowboymom
May. 11, 2012, 12:07 PM
:confused: :confused:

Her initial question said nothing that would indicate she was a 'valid breeder'.

Her post sounded like a classic case of shutting the barn door after the horse has escaped.

Perhaps if the OP had rephrased her original question it wouldn't have raised so many hackles.

She could have said, "I've already done a lot of research but I know there are some experienced breeders here on COTH, so I'd like to pick their brains.

I've recently bred my GSD bitch for the first time and I'm looking for any advice on the best way to feed her so that she and her pups are as healthy as they can be."

That's not true. I've mentioned this here before, that someone has to flash their credentials, (apparently include a caboose-kissing) and meet requirements before they are spoken to with any degree of respect here. (Maybe that should be a sticky :lol:)

What did she say that indicated she was NOT responsible?

You could have given her the benefit of the doubt and some good advice but you chose to jump her case instead. What she did or did not present in her initial post doesn't change the question. You jumped to conclusions, passed an (incorrect) judgement, and were useless as far as advice. Not the first time this has happened here.

OP enjoy the next few weeks-having pups is an amazing experience and I'm sure you're going to do great with her. She may go through a spell of "morning sickness" behavior, off her feed, so don't be surprised when you see that. She will rebound when that phase passes. :)