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Jennasis
Sep. 17, 2001, 01:12 PM
Ok, my boss put out a memo to the entire newsroom saying that there are to be NO flags displayed anywhere in our newsroom (a television newsroom). In addition no flags or the like are to be worn by any "on-air" talent or any personell who might be seen by a member of the public while working for the station.

CAN YOU F-ing BELIEVE THIS???

He claims that it makes us look "BIASED"!!!!! Now I know in the arena of journalism it is necessary to present both sides to every story, but are we seriously saying here that our station is supposed to remain NUETRAL????? That we should not openly support our government, whatever they decide the course of action to be?? Our newsdirector says that by displaying the flag that we would be saying we agree with the notion of war. All the other New York area stations are wearing their pins proudly on air as they report the news.

THIS is why I am quitting. I actually felt nauseous as i read the memo.

Jennasis
Sep. 17, 2001, 01:12 PM
Ok, my boss put out a memo to the entire newsroom saying that there are to be NO flags displayed anywhere in our newsroom (a television newsroom). In addition no flags or the like are to be worn by any "on-air" talent or any personell who might be seen by a member of the public while working for the station.

CAN YOU F-ing BELIEVE THIS???

He claims that it makes us look "BIASED"!!!!! Now I know in the arena of journalism it is necessary to present both sides to every story, but are we seriously saying here that our station is supposed to remain NUETRAL????? That we should not openly support our government, whatever they decide the course of action to be?? Our newsdirector says that by displaying the flag that we would be saying we agree with the notion of war. All the other New York area stations are wearing their pins proudly on air as they report the news.

THIS is why I am quitting. I actually felt nauseous as i read the memo.

tle
Sep. 17, 2001, 01:16 PM
Good for you!! The utter notion that any American is actually banned from supporting their country (whether or not they believe in possible courses of action) is utterly ridiculous. I think I'd be tempted to PIN my resume to his arse with a flag! What a twit.

If Dressage is a Symphony... Eventing is Rock & Roll!

Cactuskate
Sep. 17, 2001, 01:16 PM
Jenn this cannot be happening to YOU. What the H is this person thinking.

I have a job opening for a part time sales person, doesn't pay much, is in the middle of nowhere USA, but it's your if ya want it!

Is this person a direct decendant of a Nazi or what?

Must stop ranting now, it is to no avail.

Oh, oh I just had a brainstrom. Get some flag underwear, bra, undies, tank. Only your closest friends will know. That will show him, and if he gets really obnoxious, drop "trou" and moon him with the flag!!!!

Ok so much for my attempt at humor, but reallllly!

"The older I get, the better I used to be, but who the heck cares!"

Erin
Sep. 17, 2001, 01:19 PM
Hehe... hey, I really like that suggestion, Cactuskate! Go for it Jennasis! /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Charis
Sep. 17, 2001, 01:20 PM
OH OH!!! I love it!!! Moon him with the FLAG!!

Please...let BILL ORiley at FOX know....this
needs to be OUTTED!!!!

Jennasis
Sep. 17, 2001, 01:24 PM
Perhaps when my last day of work arrives, I'll show up with an american flag "do-rag", my leather flag jeans, and an "Uncle Sam wants YOU" tee shirt. Then I'll attach one of the red, white, and blue pins my mother made for me to hand out to everyone at work to my letter of resignation. Or better yet, maybe I'll pin right to his forehead.

I am at work right now...and it is making me ill, just sitting in this place, right outside his office. After I quit I swear I am flodding the internet with copies of the memo. Perhaps people will stop watching, and hurt his precious ratings.

Cactuskate
Sep. 17, 2001, 01:24 PM
Gee what would happen if a copy of that memo somhow, someway leaked it's way out to the internet....hmmmm.......Must be some alter out there able to do that.

"The older I get, the better I used to be, but who the heck cares!"

rocky213
Sep. 17, 2001, 01:31 PM
I would like to see what happens if a flag accidentially appeared? How exactly would they go about firing someone for displaying the flag? I wonder....

SLW
Sep. 17, 2001, 01:35 PM
Jennasis- Please ask your employer who appointed him/she/them the moral athority for L.I.? He/She/They have the luxery to sit back and *think* this policy through because of the efforts and lives American men and women have lost over the years. If this post is true it saddens me becasue it is people like that whom President Bush and his staff will have to overcome. Furthermore, it is attitudes such as your employers which ALLOW this damn terriorist stuff to thrive.

This is worse than the company down in West Palm Beach who issued a similar memo last Friday. They have been bombarded with mail and phone calls today because a employee was kind enough to share the *news*. They reversed their polciy today and distributed flags to all employees.

Send your boss out to Kansas, we *band* the ones who don't have balls out here! /infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

SLW

Dry Clean Only
Sep. 17, 2001, 01:37 PM
LEAK THE MEMO!!
Along with your bosses email/fax/work and home phone #'s!!
The policy won't last for long after that!

Snowbird
Sep. 17, 2001, 01:39 PM
A problem I have never had so I cannot sympathize. Your employer is so anxious to please everyone that he will annoy everyone.

How shallow and meaningless a life without convictions or vision must be. I can not imagine why someone would want to be in media publication and not have an opinion. But, especially since this country preserves his first amendment rights why would he not be proud to be a supporter of our beautiful America.

Cactuskate
Sep. 17, 2001, 01:40 PM
Hey Jennasis, maybe we could play a virtual version of the old "What's My Line" TV show.

Are your company's call letters in the first, middle or end of the alphabet?

Would we find your coverage on the mainline networks?

Would I need cable or just an antennae to receive your program?

Would it require a newer TV that gets more than just 36 channels?

Well you get my drift. The fact that you are GOING is a good thing. But as someone else said this deserves to be OUTED!!!!

"The older I get, the better I used to be, but who the heck cares!"

Weatherford
Sep. 17, 2001, 01:43 PM
Yeah, LEAK the memo -

I am SURE AP or Reuters or the DAILY NEWS would print it....

<BEG>

(Erin, we need a BIG EVIL GRIN icon....)

By the way, who DO you work for? TV News MUST have advertisers - THAT'S who you need to leak it to!!!! We want to boycott your station and all your station's advertisers.

Bumpkin
Sep. 17, 2001, 01:44 PM
That is really awful Jen.
Is this a station that I can stop watching all the way out here in Washington?

Beans
Sep. 17, 2001, 02:24 PM
And you'll see a tidal wave of calls, faxes etc. to you employer!!! Put it to the attn of Bill O'Reilly - he lives out on L.I.!!!

stegall
Sep. 17, 2001, 02:41 PM
AHHHHH! WHAT WAS THAT? I would probably have been arrested at that point for profanity that doesn't even exist.

AT my place of employment last year, I stomped all over the maintenance folks for treating the flag in a disrespectful manner. I marched right up to the CEO's office. Everyone laughed at me at the time, they thought I was overreacting. However, the flag was immediately given the credit due.

This year, no one is laughing.

Please let me know the name of the station, I won't watch them anymore.

Taking deep breaths now.......

dublin
Sep. 17, 2001, 02:43 PM
I can't think of a more appropriate subject for his 'Most ridiculous item of the day' feature.

Unbelieveable.

/infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_eek.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

Spunky
Sep. 17, 2001, 02:46 PM
I'm going to be different and disagree with the general sentiment.

There are unfortunately many people out there who, in hatred borne of ignorance and anger, interpret the display of a flag not as a call for unity out of compassion, but a call for unity out of hatred.

I am thinking of the ignorant and misguided people in Texas who murdered an innocent man because he was Muslim and wore a traditional head garment.

I cringe to think that our media has made no attempt to understand the motive behind the attack (granted, this is difficult when we can't identify the perpetrator). We Americans are pretty much ignorant of the Middle East. I think there is a lot more history to the situation than most people understand, including me. I don't appreciate being manipulated to react in anger against a situation that I do not fully comprehend.

Jennasis, go ahead and moon him with your flag undies!! I can understand your feelings in this. Hang a flag at your desk. I can't believe that he is against such personal indications. But I do understand his desire to not display them as what could be interpreted as icons of war on the air.

Let our actions be governed not by hatred or anger or revenge, but by compassion.

hoopoe
Sep. 17, 2001, 02:48 PM
Behind you all the way.

This sounds like a compassionless way of dealing with their employees esp after so much stress, which you told us about last week.

Perhaps a whole change of scene is needed. Are you willing to relocate as well as change jobs.

Is it a local station or a national feed?

Jennasis
Sep. 17, 2001, 02:49 PM
Unless you live ON LONG ISLAND, you can't watch the station. /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

hint hint...PS...be aware that I could get in trouble if they connect me to the leak so no mention of horses or this board or my name (Jennasis). Just say you heard it through the grapevine that a certain news station.

Hmmm...another hint....On the first day of Christmas my tru love gave to me...blah blah blah...it's the LAST day of Christmas that matters.

Orrrrr...I may start drinking seriously after all of this, and then I'll have to enroll in one of them programs with all those STEPS. I forget how many steps are involved....

Cactuskate
Sep. 17, 2001, 03:07 PM
Ohhhh I love a puzzle. Now to the MS Media page to do some research.

Hang in there kiddo, things are going to improve for you I can feel it all the way out here in the Wild West. Speaking of which....

Did ya love Bush when asked about geting bin Laden and he quoted the Old West Dead or Alive posters?

I'm likin' the man more and more.

"The older I get, the better I used to be, but who the heck cares!"

Kirsten
Sep. 17, 2001, 03:30 PM
I have to agree with Spunky on this one.

Harsh as it is, a news journalist's job is to relay the facts. Without any "bias" that may be perceived as, for instance, supporting a massive military strike. There is much brewing of anger at the moment... unity is one thing, but it seems more and more people are taking that to mean "ganging up" and taking things into their own hands. Not good.

ExtremeChaos
Sep. 17, 2001, 03:44 PM
I know the station you are referring to. Since I don't work for these bafoons, I can sing the 12 days of christmas all I want. I also intend to send these idiots an email!!!! /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif

lilblackhorse
Sep. 17, 2001, 04:06 PM
what really shocks me about all of this whole scenario (and I am sure you all will flame me like you have crucified Velvet for her opinions...)...is that, where was all this patriotism last Monday? I fly my flag every day, I have for the last 16 years, since I was old enough to own my own house. At the risk of sounding evil, why does every one in this nation need to wear their label on their sleeve or shirt or car bumper??? I am not a relious person, though I consider myself a spiritual one, but I don't get why all the christians need to put fish or jesus stickers on their cars-It's wonderful we live in a society where we can worsip whatever God we wish to, but why feel the need to proclaim it, instead of LIVING it? Just a thought...as far as not having a flag in a TV station..or whereever you work, I think that the media does need to be supportive, but not necessarily flag waving and such-I am pleased to see the flags, and the reemergence of patriotism, but feel ashamed that it too something this horrific for people to sudeenly have to flock to walmart to buy a flag....JMHO...and remember everyone, just being the devil's advocate here-there should always be room for any and all opinions and beliefs without prejudice....I accept that most people are very offended by the memo, and I can see why, but I sure there are well thought out reasons why the management felt the way it did. As far as quitting one's job, isn't it wonderful to live in a country where one can speak his mind and live it thru actions..and hopefully have another job in which to go. Good luck.

M. O'Connor
Sep. 17, 2001, 04:29 PM
I am very supprised at the policy you describe---are you sure that this policy is fully supported by your boss's (how do you make that a possessive?!) superiors? I mean, those at the Very, Very Top?

stegall
Sep. 17, 2001, 05:38 PM
Spunky, I am going to have to disagree here. I can also understand trying not to offend someone. Even as a big fan of Christmas, I gave in when our company started the policy of "toning down" all the little Christmas displays everyone had.

However, I don't feel that the flag is something that incites aggression or retaliation. If it were, then people would not be flying it in all these different countries that I've seen the AP press photos of. Flying the flag does not automatically send a message that we want to attack anyone. I belive it says quite the contrary, that we are a united people, who won't be cowed by a terrorist. That we appreciate and respect our freedoms enough to display our flag.

Its true, how another poster indicated that many of these folks have suddenly "come out of the closet" as patriots, and I initially had issues with that myself. As I noted before, I have been a diehard patriot, and have never tolerated disrespect of the flag, and have flown mine since I moved into my house too. My father served in two wars, and was career airforce. I have a very deep
gratitude for those freedoms we possess, and I am not afraid to show it. As for the folks who came late to the patriotic party, I have decided that maybe we became forgetful as a country, but our patriotism never died-it was sleeping. I would rather have them show up late, then not at all.
Face it, these people could be out demanding revenge and running amok, but they are not. What they ARE doing is pulling together.

As for the idiots who feel the need to go around and attack the innocent, a pox on them. They are too small minded to understand their actions. As is with the issue of Bin Lauden and Afghanistan, these handful of American wretches are no more a representative of America than Bin Lauden is of the Muslims. Everyone has their share of vagabonds, its truely the only thing that is universal.

So-I say, fly the flag high. If we were truely
flying it as a symbol of aggression, then you can believe most of the terrorist type countries would have already been vaporized. Do not downplay the
symbol of our nation while we grieve over the wrong that has happened here.


Signed a previous, current, and future patriot.

Jennasis
Sep. 17, 2001, 05:47 PM
Hey guys...somebody called the station to complain. Whoever you are, thank you. I overheard the guy you spoke with claiming it was untrue. Have you seen anyone on air wearing a flag or pin? It IS true, and we all have the memo to back us up.

BTW we are owned by a much larger company. The company has been flying flags at all their locations...so it isn't a company-wide policy. Apparently it only applies to the news division.

Remember, I'd like to leave this place of my own volition and on as good terms as possible. So please do NOT let on where any of your info came from. I don't want to lose this place as a reference since I've spent many years here. Thank you.nullPlease DO NOT let on where any of your info came from.

Calypso
Sep. 17, 2001, 06:15 PM
Displaying the flag does not mean you support war. It stands for patriotism which is something alot of us forgot about until recently. I display the flag on my home 365 days a year and buy a new flag every year. Your boss is an a**hole and tell him if he didn't already have so many sticks up his a** you'd shove another one up there with the ol' red, white and blue on the end of it and tell him to f***off. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

dogchushu
Sep. 17, 2001, 06:31 PM
I agree with Calypso on this one. Since when does displaying the flag mean you support any particular policy decision?

I favor some form of military intervention. My boss, on the other hand, is a strident passivist. But we both showed up today wearing the little flag pins they were selling in the lobby gift shop.

I can see if you showed up with a button reading "nuke 'em all" or some such thing. But displaying the flag only means you love your country and take pride in being American. It says nothing about your stand on any issue.

BarbB
Sep. 17, 2001, 08:02 PM
Hand wringing, spineless, politically correct, wonder child. That station should be proud of him! (NOT!)
Actually I think that businesses who promote people like that get what they deserve!

BarbB

www.tapestry659.50megs.com (http://www.tapestry659.50megs.com)

Cactuskate
Sep. 17, 2001, 10:14 PM
Though not of the media, I will never be able to divulge my source on the basis of confidentiality. /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Suffice it to say and email has been sent to not only the local yokel station /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif , but parent #1 and parent #2.

I would email you Jennasis because I am so gleeful about this coup. But I am so afraid of it backfiring on you. My email is in the profile, so if you have a "secure" email address let me know, I will cc: you the email sent.

Let us know how this guy looks with a new A$$hole. If this doesn't do it, maybe I need to go back to the website and spot a few advertisers. They always love hearing about these fiascos.

"The older I get, the better I used to be, but who the heck cares!"

Jane
Sep. 17, 2001, 10:18 PM
Sorry to hear about all the trouble you've been having. I'm wondering...which boss issue this..the news boss or the big wig "D.D."?

Jennasis
Sep. 18, 2001, 04:18 AM
Jane: This edict came from the "news boss", who coincidentally is the son of the "big boss". I don't know if his dad knows about the memo or supports it.

Cactuskate: The company does not have any kind of access to or control of my yahoo e-mail which is on my profile.

Thank you all for the support.

pinkhorse
Sep. 18, 2001, 04:47 AM
I keep wondering why I'm seeing so many flags and red white and blue balloons (that really bugs me - is this a party or what?) and not black arm bands, black ribbons, etc as is appropriate for mourning in this culture (white for others, I believe). I must admit to being somewhat offended by the Rah-Rah-ness that I associate with the American flag. This is not a hockey game. I also admit to associating the Americna flag with war - after all, that's what the national anthem is about and that's the most usual association with the flag that I have. I also (just one more) have a very hard time with flags which are not being flown at half mast. I did see one car that had a flag that the person had thoughtfully figured out a way to put it half mast. It's the only flag I've actually appreciated seeing. I was thinking yesterday what it would be like to fly the flag at half mast for one day for each person who was killed. That's a long long time.

Putting on my flame suit, I'll say now, to anyone who feels that the quick response by our government to "rid the world of evil" through military means may not be the most appropriate action in the world - YOU ARE NOT ALONE. One of the beauties of this board is that people can find support for their opinions even if they are not the most popular. I'd be glad to help anyone find a community of like-minded people on the web. I felt this way about the gulf war and don't want anyone to feel that way now. Feel free to slam me for being "unpatriotic" or some such, you're welcome to the last word.

Jennasis
Sep. 18, 2001, 05:15 AM
I've seen lots of cars with carefully "half-masted" flags. I am touched at their thoughtfulness. Anyflag that is being "flown" should be at half-mast (though I think the president declared the flag to fly at half mast only until Yesterday 9/17).

I do disagree with your assessment that the national anthem is about war. It is about our ability to overcome. How our flag still stands despite being attacked and bombed. It is about perseverence, and the triumph of the American spirit...rather appropriate doncha think?

Today I saw a car with red white and blue streamers on the antenna, and attached to the very tip of the antenna was a black bow. As far as everyone wearing the red, white and blue, I explained it thussly in a thread about what kind of ribbone to where...:

Red= the blood that has been shed, and the lives that have been lost

White= The rescue efforts, the volunteers, the doctors, nurses, emts, firefighters, police et al...

Blue= our government, and the notion that justice will be served.

The only balloons I've seen so far were at a car wash that the cheerleaders from my local high school were running. All proceeds were going to the relief and rescue efforts. But I agree, in just about any other situation, the balloons would be innapropriate and even tasteless.

While the country IS in mourning (I have seen so much black lately...remember, MANY of the missing are from my neck o'the woods), we are banding together to support one another, our government etcc as Americans. By displaying our strength and solidarity we are sending a strong and clear message to the terrorists (I hope)...

msj
Sep. 18, 2001, 05:50 AM
www.visionxtreme.net/images/unclesam.jpg (http://www.visionxtreme.net/images/unclesam.jpg)

I found this on another bb and split my sides laughing. While certainly not politically correct, it does get the point across!

msj /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

SLW
Sep. 18, 2001, 07:22 AM
The Flag is not limited to representing war, in fact it does not represent war. It represents a nation and a people united. We have it on the MOON, in our ball fields, at our schools, at our churches and at our horse shows. It represents 50 states united, one nation, under God with liberty and justice for all.

To view it only as a *symbol of war, aggression or being divisive* is, IMO, a modern PC view.

Happy riding,
SLW

Velvet
Sep. 18, 2001, 08:42 AM
I couldn't agree with you more.

And, lilblackhorse, I also think it is sad that it takes an event such as this to bring people to church, and to an understanding of what does make this country great.

It really has altered our perceptions lately to what is truly important. Maybe people will not be so quick to run out and complain, or file suit, about a co-worker displaying a flag in their cube, or having a sign quoting our motto "In God we trust." It's about time we moved on to the important issues. Being allowed to display our individuality and even put up another countries flag in our cube, or wear it on our lapel, is only one of our freedoms.

Also, lets not be too quick to give away our privacy in pursuit of these terrorists. Think about it before you tell your representatives to go ahead and spy on everything in your life or hand out too much information. Other countries have actively participated in giving up their rights in the hopes that they will find greater security in their daily lives, and later they discovered they no longer had private lives...or freedom to pursue happiness.

dublin
Sep. 18, 2001, 08:45 AM
that O'Reilly's 'Most Ridiculous Item of the Day' last night concerned a company in Florida that had instituted a no flag policy for its employees which they quickly reversed once it got publicized.

Maybe a certain newsroom will be next! /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Jennasis
Sep. 18, 2001, 10:16 AM
Now now...let's not sling mud at the innocent. We should be saving our mud for the news station. /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Incidentally, everyone at the station is seething over this policy. Not a happy bunch of underpaid, overworked, and underappreciated peeps over here. There is ZERO moral in this place. Don't try to take away our patriotic moral too.

Erin
Sep. 18, 2001, 10:22 AM
Since I think we all have more than enough crap to deal with in the real world, I have taken the liberty of removing the mud-slinging post and those that referenced it. I can't do anything about the Taliban or Afghanistan, but at least I can keep the BB a civil place. /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

EarthTo, if you'd like to phrase your difference of opinion in a constructive manner, feel free. If you can't muster anything better than the post I just deleted, I'd say just keep it to yourself.

Charis
Sep. 18, 2001, 10:50 AM
Erin I find this response inconsistent with your response on the Ariat issue. In other words YOU are free to define freedom of expression!!!!?????

Is not that the censorship you were so strongly decrying???????

Jennasis
Sep. 18, 2001, 10:51 AM
She meant no name calling. The threads were getting personal...again. /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

Erin
Sep. 18, 2001, 11:01 AM
BB Rule #1: Be nice, be respectful, be polite. Disagreement and discussion are fine; flaming and personal attacks are not.

I have absolutely no problem removing posts that don't comply with that rule. You can disagree all you want, you just have to do it respectfully. The deleted post fell outside those boundaries.

And yes, I do define freedom of expression on this BB, through the well-publicized rules. If, in my opinion, a post violates those rules, it's gone.

However, if you'll take the time to notice, posts are generally not deleted because of WHAT they say... it's HOW they say it. And as I said, EarthTo is welcome to repost his disagreement. He just has to do it in a civil, respectful manner, without resorting to playground name-calling.

Charis
Sep. 18, 2001, 11:05 AM
So, Firerider's ADJECTIVE of Ariat's response as unpatriotic was warranted and NOT prejorative???
(As quoted from the original spamming which still stands on this board).

Erin
Sep. 18, 2001, 11:10 AM
Yes. That was Firerider's opinion. A very critical opinion, but an opinion nonetheless.

I have ALWAYS discouraged posters here from making personal attacks against other posters. This is a community, and the only way a community can function is with respect. People have to feel free to air their views without fear of being called names.

Insulting the intelligence of another member of the board is not going to be allowed.

If you have a problem with this, you're welcome to email me privately.

Jennasis
Sep. 18, 2001, 11:11 AM
Seriously Charis. I like you. Please don't fill up my nice job-bashing post with semantics, and tangents. /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

While in real life I would have to tell Erin "you're not the boss of me"...in this forum, she actually is. /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Charis
Sep. 18, 2001, 11:26 AM
Jennasis...

Sorry, did not mean to step on your thread.

Just trying to see the logic of what is allowed and what is not. I am of the "question authority" generation, and proud of it.

Jo
Sep. 18, 2001, 12:11 PM
This weekend, my sister and I went to buy ribbons for my car, her car, and my dad's mailbox. We had two bows made up (one for my front door and one for my dad's mailbox) in red, white, and blue, and then my sister and I both bought ribbons in red, white, and blue... but also in yellow (for the missing), purple (for the courage), and black (for those who have been lost). My sister put hers on her car antenna and mine are going on my backpack when I find some pins.

Leesa
Sep. 18, 2001, 05:21 PM
I work on the trading floor of the NYSE. We have a very strict dress code and the eyes of the world on us, especially this week.
I don't know of a person that has not shown the US colors in some way this week. Not only am I proud of the USA, but also proud of every person I work with at the stock exchange.
I don't understand your bosses' thoughts at all.

HSM
Sep. 19, 2001, 08:38 AM
JMHO here, but this is why I feel compelled to display red, white and blue in whatever way I can right now:

~ to signify support and unity as a nation in this time of crisis. What better symbol of these things than the red, white and blue?

~ to help me remember and reflect on what has happened, even as I am trying to return to my *normal* (which will never be normal again) life. I find myself going through my day and, distracted by the task at hand, forgetting for a moment what haened to all of those people last week, and what continues as the ongoing aftermath. I do not want to forget. Not even for a short time.

Why are people using ribbons and balloons and the like? The little hardware store in my neighborhood sold 20,000 flags in 3 days - 8,000 on Sat. alone. If I didn't have a flag to fly right now, damn straight would I be displaying the colors in whatever way I could.

Again, JMHO.

EarthTo?
Sep. 19, 2001, 08:40 AM
As you know, I totally disagree with your characterizations of my postings. But this is your BB, you control the content, so it doesn't matter what I think, only what you think. But I won't be revisiting it anytime soon, so it doesn't matter at all.

And speaking of attitudes, some might characterize yours as excessively patronizing. But on this BB, they would, by definition, be wrong, of course.

Erin
Sep. 19, 2001, 08:46 AM
Your choice... I stand by my decision.

Brookes
Sep. 19, 2001, 10:37 AM
I just saw the article on Newsmax.com! "New York's Cablevision Bans American Flag". Gee Jennasis, could this possible be who we think it is? Looks like somebody was doing their homework. Boy are they nailed in the article. See, good things come to those who wait!

Lions and Tigers and Bears, oh my!!

Jo
Sep. 19, 2001, 10:47 AM
I've seen the red, white, and blue balloons, and while at first I was a little like "hey what?" I remembered that it is nearly impossible to buy a flag here... I have seen ones sell on Ebay for about $100 a piece. I went with my sisters to MJDesigns on Saturday and they were running out of red, white, and blue ribbon. I'm proud to have the red, white, and blue bow on my front door, and if they had run out of ribbon, I might have resorted to balloons too. /infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

jparkes
Sep. 19, 2001, 10:47 AM
Here it is!
While most Americans can't get enough of Old Glory in the wake of last week's terrorist attacks on the World Trade Center and Pentagon, Cable News Channel 12 on New York's Long Island has actually banned the American flag from its airwaves.
"Our office is a newsroom and news people are committed to supplying objective information on events here and around the world," wrote Pat Dolan, News 12 news director, in a memo banning on-air-flag displays distributed to employees Sunday.
Dolan became concerned when American flags began popping up in his newsroom and -- horrors -- even on the lapels of some of his anchors. Meanwhile all the other networks, both broadcast and cable, drench themselves in red, white and blue.
"We have to avoid giving a false impression that we lean one way or the other," said the news director, who's apparently trying to strike a balance between his fellow Americans and the terrorists who have vowed to kill them.
In an interview with Long Island's Newsday, which reported News 12's flag ban in print editions only, Dolan admitted the move has angered some of his employees.
"We've had a few heated discussions."
But he stuck to his guns. "What we're trying to do is make clear that our guys can express their patriotism, but we don't want the flag to be associated with their daily activities as electronic journalists."
Dolan called the on-air flag waving "a real problem when war breaks out," explaining that he doesn't want his viewers to get the impression that "we may subtly endorse what the government is doing."
Subscribers to New York media giant Cablevision, which owns News 12 along with The Wiz, Radio City Music Hall, Madison Square Garden, the Knicks and the Rangers, will undoubtedly be interested to learn of Dolan's position.
To share your views on News 12's American flag ban, call Cablevision headquarters at (516) 803-2300.

Weatherford
Sep. 19, 2001, 11:01 AM
I think EVERYONE in your newsroom shoud wear and carry the flag tomorrow. WHEN (if) your boss fires them all, start a class action suit.

Better yet, organize a sit down strike in front of the cameras.

Paloma
Sep. 19, 2001, 11:08 AM
So this f[censored]ing idiot, is also a hypocrite. Afterall, the news media could not function without the First Amendment in the U.S. Bill of Rights. You know, the one that guarantees freedom of the press ???? . This same First Amendment also guarantees Freedom of Expression/Speech.

You cannot abide by one part and not the other when it's convenient. For him to say, "You cannot wear a flag" is a violation of your First Amendment rights. The same rights that provide this low-life with a job /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif Speaking of which, I'd wear the flag proudly. I'd also make it very clear that you would bring a civil suit against both him and his station for violating your civil rights should you suffer any repercussions from expressing your patriotic spirit. As a member of the press, he should be very sensitive to civil rights. If not, then he should be fired as incompetent.

Is there an e-mail address?????? PLEASE?!

~*~ He who dies with the most tack wins! /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif ~*~

Smart Alec
Sep. 19, 2001, 11:19 AM
so people can't display their patriotism? Fascist!!!! How can he call himself an American if he takes away a basic right his employees are entitled to? If he chooses not to display the flag on his own self or carry it fine, but there is something wrong with not allowing it for his workers should they feel the need to express their love for this country. What is he thinking....HONESTLY!!!???
Anyone with an email or link to an email....send it this way...I would love to give them my sentiments! /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif

Paloma
Sep. 19, 2001, 11:33 AM
go to:

http://www.cablevision.com/customer/resource/contactus.html

and let them know your opinion of the expatriot in their employ, Mr. Pat Dolan.

~*~ He who dies with the most tack wins! /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif ~*~

SLW
Sep. 19, 2001, 11:40 AM
I second Weatherfords idea. Be sure and use red, white and blue face paint!!!

SLW

Paloma
Sep. 19, 2001, 11:51 AM
Since you know that Bill O'Reilly loves this sort of thing, be sure to e-mail him letting him know that you think Mr. Dolan is the Pinhead of ALL pinheads.

oreilly@foxnews.com

~*~ He who dies with the most tack wins! /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif ~*~

Cactuskate
Sep. 19, 2001, 12:06 PM
This is a copy of an email I sent on 9/17 to News12. I also sent an exact copy to their parent company Rainbow-Media and to Cablevision. As of yet no one has acknowledged the emails. But hey it sounds like maybe they are a little busy fielding calls from more important people than some little ol' pissed off broad in the desert. /infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

So I am glad they are being held accountable, that was my only intention.

Never underestimate the wrath of a fellow BB'er scorned!! /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

********************************
Subject: What on earth have I just heard????
To: news12li@news12.com


I just heard somewhere today that a supervisor at a Long Island TV studio sent a memo that FORBADE any member of the staff to publicly display any
representation of an AMERICAN FLAG. Do I have the
right station here?

Tell me this is untrue!!!! That it might indicate
support of a military response to our situation???

What side are you on anyway? At a time when we most need to rally and feel like we are contributing in anyway to the solution, you choose to take away the freedom to display a simple red, white and blue banner? The symbol of our FREEDOM!!!!

Lord have mercy on your soul.
************************
Their web site is www.news12.com (http://www.news12.com), feel free to visit!!

"The older I get, the better I used to be, but who the heck cares!"

Coreene
Sep. 19, 2001, 12:18 PM
Oh I know for a fact that Mr Bill had this a few days go.

Cactuskate
Sep. 19, 2001, 12:20 PM
Well Mr Bill is getting another one as we speak. /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

"The older I get, the better I used to be, but who the heck cares!"

Coreene
Sep. 19, 2001, 12:47 PM
Has someone sent this to Tom Lyekis as well? Now that would be a real thing for him to sink his teeth into. And Howard.

AAJumper
Sep. 19, 2001, 01:22 PM
Speaking of Howard, did anyone listen to him the day of the attack? I wake up to him every morning, and that is how I heard of the attack. At first I thought they were re-running an old show, from when the WTC was bombed. His running commentary over what was going on as it happened (his studio is in Manhattan) was really excellent.

Calypso
Sep. 19, 2001, 04:07 PM
I found out about the attack thru Howard. At first I thought it was a bit but then I realized it was real and had to call my friend in NYC to find out what was going on. Howard should receive some recognition for his show on that day.

Jennasis
Sep. 19, 2001, 05:07 PM
WOW, have things been stirring round here! Somebody leaked a copy of the memo (wasn't me) to Newsday which is THE Long Island paper and read justas widely in NYC. There is a tastily scathing article in there, and WBLI a local radio station has been blasting the news station all day. Then to add to my glee, the parent company Cablevision sent out a press release to try to quell the disturbance. They say they DO NOT support the policy of News 12 but are respecting their right to make their own decisions. Sounds a little wimpy to me. But Cablevision is run by the news director's dad and brother who pretty much said "Your on your own with this one kiddo".

I got to my barn this morning and they knew all about the flag issue, and I hadn't even mentioned it to them yet! Apparently there is a widespread boycott of the channel in progress, and the other local media were slamming News 12 all day.

Sounds like some employee was angrier than me and leaked it all out...wish i knew who it was so i could give him/her a hug!

SLW
Sep. 19, 2001, 07:24 PM
Nothing like a group of patriotic insomniacs with time on their hands to get the word out!! Let us know if you need help again. Hope things continue to improve at work for you and that the policy changes!

Is this the same Charles Dolan family which owns Madison Square Garden, The Wix, Radio City Music Hall, the Knicks and Rangers? I also read that he has, or a child of his has, a couple race horses, true/false, anyone know???

SM

[This message was edited by SLW on Sep. 19, 2001 at 10:40 PM.]

Cactuskate
Sep. 19, 2001, 07:57 PM
See the website for cablevison.com

Bet "family dinners" will be interesting for awhile.

"The older I get, the better I used to be, but who the heck cares!"

SLW
Sep. 19, 2001, 08:07 PM
Which website? I only know of this one, http://www.news12.com/CDA/0,2033,5,00.html .

I have to giggle because on the main page it says "As local as news gets" when in fact they are experiencing news "As global as news gets". On another board I frequent this morning someone posted the story newsmax.com ran on the station and that group is "not being delicate" about sharing their concerns with the station owner.

SLW

Sannois
Sep. 20, 2001, 06:02 AM
Late to the topic but I just read the story from News Max .com that I get an email for everyday. Your awesome, I was so outraged that anyone would ban the american during this time of crisis that I nearly went ballistic. I was born on Long Island many moons ago, and that really got my panties in a bunch. Thatns for being a great American, I know they outnumber the ones like your ex?? boss. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Cactuskate
Sep. 20, 2001, 06:34 AM
SLW, if you go to News12.com then to the Long Island page and go to the bottom, I think, it has links to Rainbow Media and Cablevision.

I too got a giggle out of the "local" reference. This seems to give new meaning to the World Wide WEB....as in "oh the tangled webs we weave".

"The older I get, the better I used to be, but who the heck cares!"

Coreene
Sep. 20, 2001, 09:30 AM
Read it, laughed and thought "So THERE!"

Bumpkin
Sep. 20, 2001, 09:33 AM
Can you show us Coreene dear????

dublin
Sep. 20, 2001, 10:00 AM
The more heat Channel 12 takes, the better as far as I'm concerned.... /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

LA Times article (http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-000075582sep20.story?coll=la%2Dheadlines%2Dnation)

Snowbird
Sep. 20, 2001, 11:09 AM
One person can make a difference and it's so much more pleasant than just complaining isn't it? What a great accomplishment, if you find out give them a hug for me too, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if you're just a lot more important than you think.

Improvise!
Sep. 20, 2001, 03:05 PM
DJs Scott and Todd of NYC radio station WPLJ 95.5 FM really ripped Pat "Pinhead," [sic] to shreds this morning! They fielded calls from furious listeners and a few from Cablevision or News 12 employees attempting to explain Mr. Dolan's reasoning. One caller was parked on the shoulder of the LIE near the headquarters of Computer Associates and he said there was a giant American flag hanging from their building. If they can display the flag, what is WRONG with News 12!

Then the DJs did a very funny sketch portraying P.D. trying to make his video announcement, while constantly being nagged by his mother and scared witless trying to avoid his father's phone calls. I laughed because all I could think of was Jennasis and this board!
P.D. has gotten himself into a public relations nightmare. What a self-serving loser.
/infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif

-------------------------
"You will do foolish things, but do them with enthusiasm."
--Colette
-------------------------

SLW
Sep. 20, 2001, 03:18 PM
Here is a statement issued by the station today regarding the flag.

SLW

http://www.news12.com/CDA/Articles/View/0,2049,5-5-20817-284,00.html

Coreene
Sep. 20, 2001, 05:15 PM
It is okay to make it work for them, but not okay for their employees?

Kryswyn
Sep. 20, 2001, 05:25 PM
Lovely CYA article, don'tcha think?

Now, when I start seeing little flags on the lapels of the talent, then I'll stop emailing them /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

He's worried about appearing biased????. Helloooooo. They are an AMERICAN TV station. OF COURSE THEY'RE BIASED. It's when the French, Italian, and British on air talent start wearing American flags that I'd start worrying about BIAS Mr.Dolan.

What a Richard Cranium!

~Kryswyn~
"Always look on the bright side of life, de doo, de doo de doo de doo"

aahunterjumper
Sep. 20, 2001, 09:11 PM
Good job! Believing that wearing/ not wearing a flag compromises journalistic integrity??? More proof for the adage about someone being promoted to his/ her level of incompetency. The story was on Yahoo! headlines, but is still available...

http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/ap/20010920/us/attacks_tv_flags_1.html

brilyntrip
Sep. 21, 2001, 03:25 AM
Richard Cranium I am ROFLMAOPIMP!

JustJump
Sep. 21, 2001, 02:08 PM
are pretty scathing.....

Jennasis
Sep. 22, 2001, 04:45 AM
Ok just a reminder to you local Long Islanders. If you are angry at the news station that's fine...PLEASE don't take that anger out on us poor helpless employees. In the past few days I have been called countless names, given countless nasty gestures and such. All because I work for the guy who made those comments. It's not just me who is being assaulted. My fellow coworkers have been spit on, yelled at, run off the road etc...

WE DIDN'T make the policy...WE DON'T agree with or support the policy. Please stop beating the employees up.

Supposedly there is a protest tomorrow in front of our building...I'm afraid to go to work.

Reginapony
Sep. 22, 2001, 07:05 PM
How can I ban channel 12 news, if we can't afford cable?

Jennasis, if things get tough, you can come to my house. I live around the corner from the industial park.

Spunky
Sep. 24, 2001, 12:44 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jennasis:
Ok just a reminder to you local Long Islanders. If you are angry at the news station that's fine...PLEASE don't take that anger out on us poor helpless employees. In the past few days I have been called countless names, given countless nasty gestures and such. All because I work for the guy who made those comments. It's not just me who is being assaulted. My fellow coworkers have been spit on, yelled at, run off the road etc...

WE DIDN'T make the policy...WE DON'T agree with or support the policy. Please stop beating the employees up.

Supposedly there is a protest tomorrow in front of our building...I'm afraid to go to work.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Jennasis, I'm sorry that people are taking this issue and turning it into personal attacks. What a bizarre twist. /infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

One gripe I have with the American media (generally speaking of course) is that the presentation of issues tends to cause a reaction that is not objective. Instead of reacting objectively, we frequently react emotionally -- and injure innocent people in the process.

Most other nations (Canada, Germany, etc.) are able to present news objectively without inciting emotions that overpower reason. News should be dispassionate.