FairWeather, feeding sunflower seeds ?

[wnqs]

Bfxlover: There's about 2.5yrs between pics and I feed when I go to the stable, which is every Tues, Thurs, Sat and Sun, so he isn't feed everyday. It took longer to put the weight on him, too, because he was very sick with Strangles the first winter I had him.

-Helen

Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and good with catsup.

[M. O'Connor]

<<BID = Twice a day>>

I don't get it...How does "B"+"I"+"D" = "Twice a day?"

(I think I'm going to start a "huh" or a "duh" clique...)

And back on topic...vet came out yesterday, and was extrememly complimentary about my TB's shiny slick coat, which is WAY more shiny and slick than ever before...he's only been on sunnies (since January), but I've just added flax (aka linseed). I told the vet about this thread when he asked "how on earth..." so maybe he'll be lurking soon...

MCL
'r' H/J/HEq

[Bumpkin]

Bi-daily?

"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies, Mini Horse, Sunnieflax and Horse Boxes Cliques"

[pixminis]

b.i.d. = Latin: bis in die

Many medical abbreviations are Latin-based, coming from someone who has been a medical transcriptionist for 30 long years!

[M. O'Connor]

I hang my head in penitence for having so neglected the classical side of my education... http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

MCL
'r' H/J/HEq

[shadytrake]

My boy came to me already on a diet with BOSS so I stuck with it. Now I have converted at least one other person at the barn.

I haven't added the flax yet as he is just 2 and is only in mild in-hand work. I don't want him to get too fat. We've had lots of rain this year and the grass is really lush.

He is an Anglo-Trake ~700 lbs in April, 14h2". He is on 1 square scoop (3lbs) of Nutrena Compete b.i.d., 1/2 cup BOSS am, and 2 oz of GroStrong (mineral supplement for growing youngsters). He also gets 2 flakes (average quality) hay morning & afternoon and turnout (great grass) from 5pm-6am.

Do you think 1/4 cup of flax will be too much food for him? He is looking a little chubby right now, but that is because his pasture buddy moved to another barn and he is going out solo until we can figure out a new buddy for him. So he just eats when he goes out, no real horsin' around. http://chronicleforums.com/images/custom_smilies/sigh.gif I want him to have a buddy soon. I don't want a tub of lard on my hands.

See the photo. Maybe I am being too an*l.

Remeasured him today and based on the calculations, he is ~750 lbs now. Does anyone know the percentage of fat in flaxseed?

[This message was edited by shadytrake on May. 30, 2003 at 07:12 PM.]

Okay after some hunting around on the web, I found that Flax seed for humans contains 41% fat. So, if I base my nutrition on the 1 lb of fat per 1000 lbs of horse then I come up with the following feeding schedule:

3 lbs of Nutrena Compete = 0.42 lb fat
1/2 lb of BOSS = 0.20 lb fat
1/2 lb of Flax = 0.20 lb fat

Total 0.82 lb fat

Horse weight ~750lb = 0.75 lb fat required

I am really bad with math, so feel free to correct me. The Nutrena is 14%/lb, BOSS is 40%/lb, and Flax is 41%/lb.

Plus his hay, water, grazing, and mineral supplement.

[This message was edited by shadytrake on May. 30, 2003 at 10:20 PM.]

[This message was edited by shadytrake on May. 30, 2003 at 10:24 PM.]

[Bumpkin]

It was rather hot here last weekend, and when hosing off Elliot, I was surprised to see how the water just beaded up on his coat like a waxed car. haha
Must be the Sunnieflax.

"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies, Mini Horse, Sunnieflax and Horse Boxes Cliques"

[AmandaBeQuiet]

OK, does this go to work on horses who have already shed their coats? Or will I not see results until the summer coat sheds? I am very excited to see the results... http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

[Applesauce]

You will start seeing drastic results after 2 weeks. Shedding or not. The really amazing thing is to start a horse during the winter and see the difference it makes on a winter coat.

As one BBer already mentioned, you'll be able to put your lipstick on while looking at your reflection on your horse's coat!

"Ladies and gentlemen, take my advice. Pull down your pants and slide on the ice." quote from the tv series M*A*S*H

[Bumpkin]

For those who know Elliot, look at how much better his tail is looking!!!

"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies, Mini Horse, Sunnieflax and Horse Boxes Cliques"

[NinaL aka Chrissy]

Another convert!

I put my yearling plus both performance horses on sunnies about one month ago. The yearling was a little ribby and still needed to shed his foal coat. Now his ribs are better covered (I don't like real fat foals) and his coat is coming in beautifully - nice and soft with a good shine. In addition, his temperament has improved which is great - I was thinking of gelding him but wanted to wait until the fall (he was born 7/29 so he really is not even a year, yet).

The two performance horses are doing great! Both of them needed a little additional weight. The TB always had a sensational coat but now it is even better. The SWB/Holsteiner had a rather long coat - it is shedding out very well and he is getting more coverage over his ribs and haunches.

People look at me like I am crazy when I pull out the Sunnies - thanks COTH BB'ers for giving me the sunnie edge http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif.

Next step - retirees and pony enter the Sunnie Zone.

Nina

[AmandaBeQuiet]

Alright, I'm going to go for it. Woohoo, get excited!!!

[*jazmataz*]

Our new boarder was a little suspicious of the millions of leafy green plants growing in our manure pile. She was surprised at our explanation that they are from feeding BOSS, she had never heard of it. So far she hasn't converted...but when petting my very soft dog this weekend she asked me if he eats sunnies as well. I laughed and said only in his daily ration of manure! LOL

[jilltx]

Well I too have converted. My horses are now on BOSS and Flax seed. I have to ask though...my BOSS from Purina have alot of "debris" in them. It looks to be stems and such. I've been picking them out. Does anyone else have this problem with their BOSS and if so do you worry about it or just feed it anyway????

[OneonOne]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by jilltx:
Well I too have converted. My horses are now on BOSS and Flax seed. I have to ask though...my BOSS from Purina have alot of "debris" in them. It looks to be stems and such. I've been picking them out. Does anyone else have this problem with their BOSS and if so do you worry about it or just feed it anyway????<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I've had sunflower plant parts in my BOSS from the feed store as well. I just fed it, though I tried to pick out the big pieces. Do you have a "Wild Birds Unlimited" store in your area? They guarantee their seed to be clean, with no fillers. The price is comparable to the BOSS from my feed store, so I'll probably be buying from the bird store next time.

[CTM]

I buy my BOSS at PetSmart in the bird seed dept. It's very inexpensive and I've had no problems with debris in the bags.

[Bumpkin]

I find a bit more debris in the larger bags, but horses eat far worse stuff....than dried Sunflower stems http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies, Mini Horse, Sunnieflax and Horse Boxes Cliques"

[sk_pacer]

Those bits of stem and leaves won't hurt the horse. I read somewhere about the use of sunflower stubble and crop residue as cattle feed as it has some fairly high nutrient values, and, with in reason, a horse can eat what a cow eats and get nutrition.

Since I do not belong to a clique, I am now the founder of the Dyslexic Clique. Dyslexics of the world - UNTIE!!

[jilltx]

Yeah I got to thinking about it and figured that some of the grass in my pasture has bigger stems than the "debris". I just invision the vet doing to colic sugery and bringing out this stem and saying, "this is what caused the blockage...do you know what this IS???" lol Overactive imagination me thinks http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif Thanks for the replys though.

[Bumpkin]

LOL http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies, Mini Horse, Sunnieflax and Horse Boxes Cliques"

[doublete]

I just wanted to say that since starting to feed BOSS this spring, our manure 'field' is now FILLED with Sunflowers!! My mother says they're coming up everywhere.... http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Retraining and rehabbing Off Track TB's.
http://www.geocities.com/doubletefarm

[Risk-Averse Rider]

Prozac Pony has been on sunflower seeds for... um... maybe a month? And on flax seeds a couple weeks less than that.

His coat has always been nice and shiny, but it seems to me to be softer now.

And the seeds are much less messy to deal with (and less expensive) than the extra virgin cold-pressed olive oil I used to give him.

________________
Approved helmet: Every ride; every time.

[nhjules]

Just piping up as a recent convert - my horse has been on daily sunnies for about two months, has a lovely super shiny coat, no more mane dandruff, and you know, it seems way easier to get the dirt out of his coat.

Also, do you think sunnies help fend off rain rot? (Knock on wood.) With all the rain, a lot of the horses at our barn have rain rot, but so far mine has escaped it. Wonder if the sunnies help the skin stay healthy?

[Zephyr'sMom]

Zephyr rolls in the dirt and still comes up shiny. http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif It hurts to look at him on a sunny day! http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif There should be a warning on the bag... WARNING: if you're feeding this to a horse, wear sunglasses at all times!

Gotta get a picture on here sometime soon...

http://www.ZEGifts.com
http://community.webshots.com/user/sharon_kenney1359

[royal militron]

http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif My babies tail is growing like crazy! I love my sunnies and flax!

"He moves like a dancer, which is not surprising: a horse is a beautiful animal, but it is perhaps most remarkable because it moves as if it always hears music."

[katarine]

my guys have been on BOSS only for 3+ months- and both have rain rot. Of course, it has rained and rained and RAINED for what, 2 months now? It's not as bad as it has been, though, with less rain, so I guess that's all I can ask for...

"Shoot me now! Shoot me now!"
Bugs Bunny

[Applesauce]

I have to disagree with the rain rot thing. It's been raining cats and dogs here too for about 2 months and my three horses (knock on wood) haven't shown any signs of rain rot. But I do keep them in part of the time so who knows?

"Ladies and gentlemen, take my advice. Pull down your pants and slide on the ice." quote from the tv series M*A*S*H

[JustJump]

I do not believe that sunnies or flax would predispose horses to rainrot-especially not after 27 pages! (I confess, I have joined the group; I am converted!)

[Daydream Believer]

I've got four horses on it here in North Carolina where it never stops raining... and no one has rain rot or any other problem. That is some tough stuff to deal with once it gets into the soil...it's sort of like a fungus and I think spores get in the soil from it. I would turn them out in a rain sheet if you can to keep them dry and hopefully it will go away. Iodine helps too and sometimes antibiotics. Another great help is the Eqyss Spray especially for skin conditions.

"No hour of life is lost that is spent in the saddle..." Winston Churchill

[katarine]

I didn't mean to infer that it was causing them to get rain rot, I was stating that despite BOSS&lt; they had it anyway. Not nearly as bad as I've seen on these two beasties before, but they did get some nonetheless.

One thing I have noticed: Jake's nose has sunburned this summer for the first time in 5 fives of owning him. Wonder if it's caused increased light sensitivity? He's always been out 24/7, always been here in Central AL, so I was surprised to see his nose all burnt and crispy. My only other horse is solid-headed so he's no help gaging Jake's situation.

No biggie, I'm still feeding them.

"Shoot me now! Shoot me now!"
Bugs Bunny

[*jazmataz*]

Update...I converted the new boarder, she's been here less than a month- and showed up at the barn with sunnies on Saturday. Her horse loves them! She's been jealous of our horses' shiny coats, I knew it! LOL http://chronicleforums.com/images/custom_smilies/lol.gif

[BfxLover]

I have an observation. Y'all tell me if you see this too and if it is the sunnieflax

I rinsed Denmark off after a ride last week and also gave him a bath last week for a show and he is like...silanized. Water just drips off, doesn't sink in - pretty amazing!

do you think the sunnieflax is silanizing his coat? or the sunnies? of the flax?

"If you have seen nothing but the beauty of their markings and limbs, their true beauty is hidden from you."
- Al Matannabbi

[ladybug01]

My horse has been on sunnie-flax since the fall. He was only off for a few weeks in the spring (ran out/changing barns)
He is very shiny, except for when he did not have them and was shedding right then too. His coat was a mess, he will not be off it again.
Yes he had some sort of fungas thing happening.eeww
I find that I now have alot of sunflowers growing in the manure pile.
I now grind the seeds the same time as I grind the flax seeds, its opefully easier to digest, and no more manure pile garden.

"prejudice is ugly in any form.
There is not one breed of horse that is better than others, or one best breed.
Each one has been bred for specific characteristics."
~John Lyons~

[Bandit.]

Ladybug where do you buy your flax seeds? I was just in Brantford today & its not that far from me. I bought a beautiful jacket at Pleasant Ridge.

[bewitchedarabians]

...a much belated update on my sunnie experiment...started my 'kids' on just sunnies mid-March...wasn't really doing anything for my blacks, so put them back on their paprika & voila! black as night in 3 weeks as always and that super wet shine and tangle free manes...Unfortuantely I haven't kept up with their paprika and alas they are fading/bleaching once again, as well as "mild tangles", but at least are still shiny---so, I'd say "no" to sunnie's helping to prevent blacks from fading...but anyhow, at least they still shine. My bays look INCREDIBLE! super-shine glow in the dark, have the "easy clean" effect whether grooming or a bath...and, no more crud...I DO beleive sunnies help prevent the "creeping crud"...feeding 2 cups daily (MOST of the time), 4 cups to the ones who/when need more weight. Oh also---my young mare, right before I started on sunnies, I had to cut out a total rat's nest wad out of her tail about 3 inches below end of tail bone---it has now grown out about 8 plus inches--that since early March! So she is DEFINITE proof of sunnie tail effects!

Tabatha
http://bewitchedarabians.homestead.com

[piaffeprincess]

Ok- so all you sunnie fans! You sold me on them. Now- I jsut want to make sure thast this is right- I bought some from Wlamart- the BOSS- now- how much do I start him off on? And how mcuh should he stay on for best results? Also- i thougth everyone was saying that they had no reactions. Has anyone had any probs with horses getting hot ect? I DO NOT WANT THAT!! lol- my guy is a 4 y/o-that acts 2- sometimes- ok most of the times! Anyways- how mcuh, how many tiems a day, and will there be any bad attitude coming fro mthis. Thanks so mcuh! for all the great info!

[ladybug01]

Has anyone had any luck with sunnieflax and greys, I notice no difference no matter what I feed. http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif
Bandit, I buy my flax seeds at Quick Feeds in Copetown. I am outside Jerseyville, so its not far. I believe the Lynden Co-op might have them as well. I will have to check into that soon.
You are in the area ? There is a get together at Freds on Friday, are you going?

"prejudice is ugly in any form.
There is not one breed of horse that is better than others, or one best breed.
Each one has been bred for specific characteristics."
~John Lyons~

[*jazmataz*]

What's this about feeding paprika to blacks?????? Does it prevent fading? How much do you feed? Do tell, or start a paprika thread... http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

[katamount]

Greys & Blacks

I have been feeding 1 grey/2 blacks BOSS/flax (whole seeds) for about 2 months.

The grey is gorgeous...dappled and her coat almost sparkles. Feels incredibly soft.

One black...unbelievable. So shiny and black...yes, he almost looks wet. Coat is also incredibly soft.

The other black ? ? ? It just doesn't seem to be working as well. Yes, he's shiny (not as much as other black, but coat is fading. Resorted to trying the paprika - has been about a month...some improvement. Am feeding him 1 cup BOSS, 1/4 cup flax, 1 tbs paprika 2x day.

Any ideas? I'm thinking of switching to ground flax from Horsetech to see if it makes difference.

(Yes, a paprika thread would be good too!)

[katamount]

Update to above:

Is anyone feeding product called Glanzen3 with BOSS?

I called for NutraFlax explaining situation with black not showing the best results. I was guided toward Glanzen 3 (feed 6oz daily/4oz of which is flax). I have a sample on the way to try...just don't know if I should continue with BOSS as well. HELP!

P.S. Horsetech was fabulous to deal with!

[jilltx]

I used Glanzen3 for my mare for about three months. I had a very difficult time getting her to eat it even at the smaller four ounce dosage(and she's not a picky eater). I LOVED it and my vet and farrier both thought it was an excellent product. To bad my mare didn't agree ... http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif Even on a smaller amount(she got about 2 ounces daily)her coat gleamed. Horsetech is SUPER. I'm going to order some MSM from them asap. I've heard it's good poop.

On a side note...picky mare LOVES the sunnieflax...go figure.

[bewitchedarabians]

jazmataz-
re paprika. Paprika is one of the main ingredients in the supplement 'Black As Knight'...that stuff isn't exactly cheap, so a friend of mine told me about it and we both tried it. It does help! Why, I don't kow? Think maybe vitamin A?? as paprika is in pepper family, and peppers are high in Vit A...? Last year was the first time I used it, and within 3 weeks my boys were shed out and shiny wet black. They're out pretty much 24/7, so sun and sweat takes it's terrible toll on thier coats, but the paprika helps prevent the worst fading...I do get slack and when I run out of my 'supply' tend to forget to buy more, and they'll start fading. Feed at LEAST 2 teaspoons a day, I lean more towards and I give 2 tablespoons for better results. Suppose could do more if had to? Once they've faded/burnt, nothing is going to help much...and like I said, sun & sweat are a coat's --esp. a black--worst enemy...If you try it, don't buy it at the grocery store--too expensive!--I get mine at a "Dollar Store", 2 for $1...

Tabatha
http://bewitchedarabians.homestead.com

[M. O'Connor]

Had to go to page FOUR to find this...

OK, so my bay guy is fading quickly to yellowish brown--so in addition to the sunnies and flax, now, paprika?

MCL

[Bumpkin]

What about Red Bays? Will Paprika make him even Redder? http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif

"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies, Mini Horse, Sunnieflax and Horse Boxes Cliques"

[AmandaBeQuiet]

Another sunnieflax success!! I went out to feed in the dark the other night (barn has no electricity http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif) after a HUGE rainstorm. I thought that the horses were soaking, dripping wet because they had that wet shine. I went to pet a pony and he had the most sleek, dry coat imaginable! Thank you, sunnieflax!

[GuelphGurl]

So these oiled black sunflower seeds are better than corn or veggie oil? My gelding desperately needs to put on weight, so if that's the case, then I better pick up a pail of them at work!

I work at a Home & Garden Ctr, & we've got the bird feed on for half price - huge pail for $10 CDN http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

[Bumpkin]

Much better than oils.
On the wt I would suggest adding flax.

"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies, Mini Horse, Sunnieflax and Horse Boxes Cliques"

[AmandaBeQuiet]

There's an article about sunflower seeds in the Horse Journal this month! http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

[Bumpkin]

Without printing the article on here, a nono I would imagine, what does the article say?
http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies, Mini Horse, Sunnieflax and Horse Boxes Cliques"

[AmandaBeQuiet]

I would like to share the article, but I don't subscribe to the Horse Journal. I found it on that site while researching something else, but they don't let anyone read the entire article unless you have a subscription. Maybe someone with a subscription would like to share?? I think we'd all really like to know what they have to say...http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

[AmandaBeQuiet]

Sorry Bumpkin, I misread your post. Anyone else like to share what it says?

[rubytoo]

Hi Pony15...send me a PT...I'll get the article.

Cheers http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Buy/Sell/Share/Learn
www.competitivehorse.com (http://www.competitivehorse.com)

[Badger]

Okay guys, I just found a chunk of time and read the ENTIRE thread, all 28-pages. And of course, I have questions that haven't been answered:

Have any of you converted an EPSM diet to sunnieflax? Do you still use some oil to make up the fat requirements? Or are you eliminating the oil completely and getting all the "2 cups oil per 1,000 pounds of horse" from sunnieflax? How many cups of BOSS = 2-1/2 pounds? Someone here quoted Beth Valentine as saying 2-1/2 pounds BOSS = 1 pound of fat, so I'm trying to calculait how many CUPS of BOSS would equal one pound of fat.

For those of you who have fed this for a year or so: any downside?

-----
*Preparation is one of the natural aids.*

[Oldenburg Mom]

Ohhhhhh Badger. You BRAVE BUNNY you.

ALL 28 pages. OMGiH. You deserve a year's free supply of BOSS.

Goodness.

Well, I've been feeding for over one year. Nope, no downside. Everyone loffs their sunnies!

The adventure has begun...
KT

[Badger]

You buying? A year's supply of BOSS for six horses would be, what, a ton of sunflower seeds?

-----
*Preparation is one of the natural aids.*

[slb]

Badger...
Yes I feed BOSS to my EPSM horse. I wanted to convert the entire oil amount to BOSS but couldn't. I mineral balance and the phos ratio would be too high if I added enough BOSS to replace two cups of oil. So, I used the highest amount that I could - 1 lb. - and supplement the rest in oil. Initially I did feed 2 lbs to the EPSM horse, but when I found the mineral profile, I realised that this was not good. But, I did that for around 4-5 months with no adverse effects.

I have another borderline EPSM mare that needs fat also. She normally needs around 1 cup of vegtable oil/day. I now feed her 2 cups seeds and 1/4 cup oil. Several other EPSM owners noted that they felt the horse got more out of the higher quality sunflower oils and therefore used a 1:1 ratio when replacing oils (1 lb seed:1 cup oil). While I agree with them that you can replace with less BOSS, I am not sure if I trust that ratio. I still feed 1 1/4 cup oil and 1 lbs. seed to the horse that got 2 cups oil. I have to go to the barn soon...I will post later what the weight of a cup of seeds is.

Proud member of the * Hoof Fetish Clique *

[Halfpasser11]

Well I've read it all. Every last post. Now I feel that I must post to this insanely long thread.

All the hype about just the sunnie, sunnie and flax, and the new one, paprika. When this thread was revived in May I did go out and buy a bag of sunnies. Not until yesterday did I actually feed them to my horse.

Not to my suprise, he loved them. So I put in an order of flax, (and yes, the manager called it linseed) to make the change complete. And I'm going to take a before and after picture, just for proof.

So the almighty Fairweather has spurred a change in me. I have to say, none of my barn friends where fond of this. As we are over populated with birds, and this will only attract more. Also, not only was I scorned but I was also the only one in the barn, but one or two seemed interested. http://chronicleforums.com/images/custom_smilies/yes.gif I will make them change there ways yet!

Tolkien is already quite shiny from being on Equi-Shine and oil every day, but he has gained the weight he needed to and just needs a bit of maintenance weight.

So I thank you almighty Fairweather for this new insight on Equine nutrition.

I think, therefore I am single

[slb]

OK- I weighed the BOSS. Approximately 4 cups to 1 lb.

Proud member of the * Hoof Fetish Clique *

[Badger]

Thank yous so much for weighing them, slb.

My EPSM mare needs 2-1/2 to 3 cups oil per day, and I don't like adding too much extra volume to her feed (she takes longer to eat than the others, and won't finish if given too much). Doing the math, I'm not sure that BOSS is going to work well in my situation.

You said you are feeding 2 cups seeds and 1/4 cup oil. And 2 cups seeds = 1/2 pound of seeds, which is less than 50% fat; so 2 cups seeds = less than 1/4 pound of fat. Versus oil where 2 cups oil = 1 pound of fat. Therefore 2 cups of BOSS woud replace 1/2 cup oil in an EPSM diet. If you are feeding 2 cups BOSS plus 1/4 cup oil, then you are only feeding the equivalent of 3/4 cup oil???? That does not sound like nearly enough for an EPSM horse. Did I figure something wrong? Or are you feeding the above mix twice a day, for a total equivalent of 1-1/2 cup oil, which is still less than what's recommended even for a small (1,000 pound horse needs at least 2 cups oil per day) EPSM horse?

For my own horses, I need to feed 2-1/2 to 3 cups of oil per day. Say I figure it at 2-1/2 cups: 2 cups BOSS plus 2 cups oil would total 1-1/4 pounds of fat, which is the equivalent of 2-1/2 cups of oil.

But you also said above that you figured the phos ration okay when feeding 1 pound BOSS (4 cups) and supplementing the rest with oil. So if I fed 4 cups BOSS (4 BOSS cups would replace the fat calories of 1 cup oil) plus at least 1-1/2 cups oil, that would work. But I'm adding a lot more volume to get the fat in the form of BOSS and I'm STILL having to feed quite a bit of oil.

Am I figuring all this right, or am I missing something? http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif

-----
*Preparation is one of the natural aids.*

[Badger]

Okay, somewhere else on this thread Dr. Beth Valentine was quoted saying:

2.5 lbs BOSS equals 1 lb fat

And since 4 cups BOSS = 1 pound of BOSS then:
10 cups BOSS = 1 pound fat = 2 cups oil

Boy, that is a lot of seeds! I think this is NOT going to be a better breadbox in my situation. I would need to feed 3/4 oil and 5 cups BOSS at each feeding. http://chronicleforums.com/images/custom_smilies/sigh.gif

-----
*Preparation is one of the natural aids.*

[Bumpkin]

Has anyone written to the Horse Journal about the BOSS compared to the striped Sunnies?

"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies, Mini Horse, Sunnieflax and Horse Boxes Cliques"

[katamount]

Too lazy today to read this thread AGAIN! http://chronicleforums.com/images/custom_smilies/sleepy.gif
I'm hoping someone can give me the quick answer:

What is the nutritional breakdown of BOSS? (One cup fed 2xday)

[jester1113]

Ooh Ooh I know this! Only 'cause I bought a bag last night (so caveat, my memory can be like swiss cheese).

My bag is 14% protein, 25% fat and I think 30-something % fiber. Got it at home depot! I'm positive on the fat and protein, fuzzy on fiber.

Only connect...

[nhwr]

Just want to point out re: Badger's post that 10 cups of BOSS = 1 pound fat = 2 cups of oil.

You can't make the comparison this way. 2 cups is 16 oz of liquid measure or measure of volume. This does not equal 1 pound (16 oz) of weight, a dry measure.

[scotchdun]

This is probably appropros to nothing, but after feeding the birds last winter, I noticed this spring that a lot of little sunflowers were sprouting in my garden around the feeder. So, I let them grow. I probably have about 2 dozen volunteer plants, but there are very distinct types - some very tall, some shorter and more branchy. Could this be BOSS and striped varieties? Also, as I was leading my horse by the garden one day, she bit off one of the shorter ones and thoroughly enjoyed the stalk, leaves, flowers and all. I'm starting her on the seeds tomorrow! Fun thread.

"She's called Lucy because she often has some 'splaining to do."

[nappingonthejob]

here's my "silly sunnie" question...i finally bought some today, at my local feed store, since i've been meaning to start them on it all summer and hadn't quite gotten around to it. i ask for BOSS, they say yes they have it, it gets put in my car, i get home and read the ingredients on the bag and find that what they gave me contains striped sunnies and some other stuff - corn & millet ?!?! the bag might not have been the original one, though...since i asked for 25# they may have measured out the BOSS and just thrown it into an available bag. since when i examined a handful, the BOSS were pretty much the only thing. there were some striped seeds in there, but not too many.

so for paranoia's sake i'm wondering if those "extra goodies" are something that my ponies should not be getting. thanks.

signatures are lame.

[Scar Face]

Okay, here's another question that may have been discussed earlier but I just got cross eyed reading all the pages of this thread. I bought the BOSS, started feeding and immediately saw great results. My question is, do the seeds go bad???? I keep them in a sealed container in the back of my car to feed when I go to the barn daily. They have started to smell a bit rancid. Could the heat from the hot Texas summer be causing them to go bad??? I don't want to poison my poor big guy.

You can run with the big dogs or sit on the porch and bark.

[Ladybug Hill]

All feeds should be stored in a cool dry place to minimize rancidity, mold, and to retain nutritional content.

I even get nervous leaving grain in my trunk for an hour or two while finishing my shopping.

Chris

Ladybug Hill--Hunters and Ponies
Specializing in Palomino TBs

ladybughillfarm.vaix.net (http://ladybughillfarm.vaix.net)

[Scar Face]

Lady Bug Hill: I felt the same about leaving anything in the heat. The feed store keeps their's out in their hot warehouse so I may have started out with a faulty bag. From now on I'll go to PetsMart or Walmart and get it from the AC.

You can run with the big dogs or sit on the porch and bark.

[itsallgood]

OK, I haven't read all of the thread so forgive me if it has already been stated...

Does this mixture of BOSS and flax affect your horse's energy level? I certainly don't need anymore energy than I already have.

From what I have read, I am thinking of working up to 1 cup BOSS and 1/2 cup flax seed and then seeing how we are doing and then adjust accordingly.

[Bumpkin]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by itsallgood:
OK, I haven't read all of the thread so forgive me if it has already been stated...

Does this mixture of BOSS and flax affect your horse's energy level? I certainly don't need anymore energy than I already have.

From what I have read, I am thinking of working up to 1 cup BOSS and 1/2 cup flax seed and then seeing how we are doing and then adjust accordingly.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

But SOY!!!!
Yikes, that made him nuts.

"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies, Mini Horse, Sunnieflax and Horse Boxes Cliques"

[Scar Face]

I'm a bit late but FWIW I started with the plain BOSS because I use Tract Guard regularly which contains some of the Omegas and flax seed. I have to say I had my doubts about the whole idea, but I could not believe the results. I only feed about a cup a day and with two weeks my poor sun bleached bay glowed.

You can run with the big dogs or sit on the porch and bark.

[FairWeather]

wow! Talk about need for bumpkining up http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif
haha
This was on Page 9!! thats a record!

[Bumpkin]

Thank you Fairweather http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies, Mini Horse, Sunnieflax and Horse Boxes Cliques"

[RugBug]

I just read an article in a little publication that said to feed the striped variety and to avoid the BOSS because they may be hard to chew.

Hard to chew (which I don't agree with) vs. processed, salted, etc. Hrmmm...I think I'll take hard to chew. http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

[CrowneDragon]

For those of you looking for a convenient and balanced way to get BOSS into your horse, LMF feeds carries a new product called Race that has high amounts of BOSS in it. I have ben feeding it for a few weeks and love it. Very high quality ingredients.
LMF is carries in the west....sorry you easterners........

*CrowneDragon*
As Peter, Paul, and Mary say, a dragon lives forever.

[Everythingbutwings]

Don't forget to ask if your feed store has a Wild Bird program. Booth Feeds here in Northern VA does and, each time I buy my sunflower seeds, they mark my Wild Bird Club card. When the card is full, I get an award. http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Friendship is Love without his wings
-Lord Byron

[Justice]

I'm in!

Justice and one of the black horses at our barn are about to go on the COTH BOSS, flax & Paprika blend... I can't wait to see what happens http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

[ESG]

I have all my guys on BOSS, and have just started the now-faded liver chestnut on paprika as well. I'll let you all know how that comes out ( he's a Donnerhall grandson and has LOTS of black in his coat), but all four of my guys are so shiny, it looks like I've taken up horse polishing as a hobby. http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif Even the two greys have a silvery sheen to their coats that I've never seen before. If I wasn't a believer in BOSS before, I sure am now.

Also, FWIW, I fed the striped variety and didn't notice nearly the difference in their coats as with the BOSS. It DOES make a difference................. http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

[Entwife]

&gt;&gt; I just read an article in a little publication that said ... to avoid the BOSS because they may be hard to chew.

We recently started feeding BOSS to our four, and I have noticed that my husband's horse will make a bit of a face when he gets some, as if he doesn't like the texture. But even our 24 year-old does fine with them, and we're waiting to see some positive effects.

[Bumpkin]

Welcome to the COTH BB Entwife http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies, Mini Horse, Sunnieflax and Horse Boxes Cliques"
"Remember: You're A Customer In A Service Industry."

[Entwife]

Hi Bumpkin (and all!)

Thanks for the welcome. This board was recommended by folks on a Yahoo list I'm on, thought I'd give it a look-see.

So, how do I lose the "greenie" designation?

http://chronicleforums.com/images/custom_smilies/winkgrin.gif

Entwife

[okggo]

Thought you all might get amusement out of this story-
Took my mare into the vet clinic last night where she is going to be laid up for several months. I brought along all her goodies and was speaking with the "care taker" about her feed amounts, etc.
First, when told how much she is fed I thought the lady was going to die of shock. I said- geez, this is 1/2 of what she was getting fed on the track 2 months ago! Then I gave her my containers of flax and sunflowerseeds! YOU SHOULD HAVE SEEN THE LOOK ON HER FACE http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif Priceless- she said (in a thick accent) Miss, this is birdseed!!?? The vet looked at me a little wierd too and I said, ehhh blame it on FairWeather! I wonder if they will actually feed it to her??? I hope so, her coat was looking soo much better!

[ESG]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Entwife:
Hi Bumpkin (and all!)

Thanks for the welcome. This board was recommended by folks on a Yahoo list I'm on, thought I'd give it a look-see.

So, how do I lose the "greenie" designation?

http://chronicleforums.com/images/custom_smilies/winkgrin.gif

Entwife<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You gotta post like crazy. Don't worry, though; if you're anything like the rest of us, you'll be Advanced before you know it. http://chronicleforums.com/images/custom_smilies/yes.gif

[Everythingbutwings]

The side effects of feeding BOSS - autumn sunflowers in bloom in my paddock! http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Friendship is Love without his wings
-Lord Byron

[Policy of Truth]

I am THRILLED with the results of feeding about a 1/4 to a 1/3 cup of black oil sunflower seeds to my mare! http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

I was in shock when I went away for a week and came back to find a VERY shiny and in better-weight mare! She loves them, too! She eats 'em like candy! I even took her off that rediculously expensive (and messy) stuff, Body Builder...now its just Synovicre MSM, sunflower seeds and a bit of oil, plus 5 lbs of pelleted feed am and pm! And mare looks FABULOUS!!

Thank you, Fairweather! As soon as I find flax seed, I'll be feeding that as well!

[Blinky]

My horse (of three months) is looking great though everyone at the barn thinks I'm crazy!

[Everythingbutwings]

Winter coats are coming in and my bay Wings absolutely glows! http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Friendship is Love without his wings
-Lord Byron

[baileygreyhorse]

My grey (really white) has an unbelievable shine. I didn't think you could get a grey shiney. Wow!
Thanks Sunnieflax!

http://community.webshots.com/user/pnekman

[Bumpkin]

My Mini's although hairy little horses, have those shiney long hairs that glisten in the sunlight.
Gotta love Sunnieflax. http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies, Mini Horse, Sunnieflax and Horse Boxes Cliques"
"Remember: You're A Customer In A Service Industry."

[horselips]

I just stumbled across this thread today, and just spent the last 6 hours reading all 30 pages; I must say, it probably would have been only 25 pages if "everyone"&lt;ahem&gt; had done likewise. http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Of course, today I had the time; it was raining too hard to go play with the horsies, and it's their "day off" and my laundry day anyways.


More than a year ago, I started adding 1/2c, 2xday flax (ground, at first) totheir pellets. I also feed about 1/2 - 1 cup 2x a day of pure (non-processed) vege oil.

Fall and late winter/early spring, I also feed Source; last year, they also got Stride at these times, but not this year.

My Mixture:
October through May, They get Neutrena Prime (8yo horse) and Neutrena Senior (23yo horse), a little shredded beetpulp (no molassas and not soaked), half of the RDA of Source with "BossFlax", vege oil to keep the dust down, and almost all the hay they wish. They are out 24/7, with a half of a barn as run-in shelter; they get tied twice a day for "pellet mix feedings", or brought into a box stall.

A 3# coffee can 2x daily of my "special feed mix" is what they get in the coldest part of winter (10F to -10F is common). They'll get less pellet mix if it's warmer, and should it drop down below -15F, they will get extra hay and oil. Warmed water 2x daily at least.

You would not believe the dapples and sheen on them - glossy black horse and a metallic/coppery chestnut. Winter, spring and much of the summer.

The 23yo Arab finally grew a mane like his momma's - down to his elbow.

Since the black is a genetic "fading black" (AKA black-bay in some breeds), I will start him on paprika probably in December, before the spring coat starts.

I was told by a parrot-breeder YEARS ago to feed paprika to parrots to keep their feathers iridescent.


To be sure, a diet deficient in protein, oil, AWA some minerals can give a drab, washed-out colour to the coat, but in general you are not going to change any genetically set coat colour with food additives (now feathers: Who knows??). Still, I'm going to try it anyway.

I ride at least 3x a week, as my health permits, all winter, in mud and snow. Yes I am insane. http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

After the grass comes in, I gradually cut pellet mix and hay back to pasture only, and start feeding them just as gradual in the fall.

About 3 weeks ago, I also started BOSS-with-flax (whole, these days), and will continue this, at least until next May or-?


My boys are in great shape, excellent (shoeless) feet.




- 'lips
(the "original" barn fairy)

"The horse; he is stamping,
his warm breath a'clouding:
But the Master of the house is far away..."

[AmandaBeQuiet]

Horselips, do you see any change when you cut back on Source? I feed it, but it's one of those things where you're not sure if it's doing anything, but you're scared to take them off of ithttp://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

[horselips]

Pony, that's hard to say.

I only put them on it going into fall and spring...Kind of a "loading period" for their systems.

I can say that nobody believes my 23yo is that old; he can run circles around the big 8yo, and that he recovered fully from WNV he contracted July/Aug 2002

And last year, the grass came in so good, all they did for weeks on end was gallop around and eat. http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif Wow, they were muscled-up nice!

I'm one that believes to go lighter on the supplements: I only feed 1/2 of the recommended dosage, I start off slowly, and taper off to about 1/4, then 1/8 of the RD. December is the only month they get no Source at all; I taper off to 0 about the 2nd - 3rd week in November, and start off with a pinch about the middle of January.

In retrospect, I probably should feed the Source all through the "grass only" months, as they get "complete" feed with the pellets. And I did notice them dropping off condition end of July to mid September; I thought it was heat and flies but, who knows?

I'll probably go that route this coming summer; start it in late May, feed through October.

My farrier says thier feet have never been better, but the 24/7 turnout coupled with frequent riding on every surface imaginable could be the reason also.




- 'lips
(the "original" barn fairy)

"The horse; he is stamping, his warm breath a'clouding:
But the Master of the house is far away..."

[SarMoniet]

Wow, what a thread! http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif I've, of course, avoided work for the last hour to read through all of the pages. I found it while doing a search on the UDBB, believe it or not.

My BM informed me last night that I was out of oil. I've been thinking about switching over to BOSS for a while now, but never knew that much about it. I guess I can't say that now, after reading this whole thread. http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

I'll be picking up a bag of BOSS when I go to pick up treats at the feed store tonight. The guy I talked to on the phone said they didn't have flax, though, so I guess we'll start on the BOSS and go from there.

I'm so looking forward to not having to deal with frozen, gelatinous oil this winter!! And this will be a cost-effective way to put the calories into my old guy, too -- There was no way I could afford to put two horses on oil at $7.00 a gallon lately.

Proud member of the draft cross clique!!! Mum to Normandy & Sar.
http://hometown.aol.com/sarmoniet/index.html

[Bumpkin]

Bumpkining up http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies, Mini Horse, Sunnieflax and Horse Boxes Cliques"
"Remember: You're A Customer In A Service Industry."

[INoMrEd]

Hey there - Has anyone else noticed that the quality of the winter coat this year is great. I don't think I'll body shave Knowzy this year. That is if he doesn't get much more furry. His coat was very thick last year and I wasn't doing sunnie flax. This year it's amazing how sleek he is.

There is a very fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness." - DAVE BARRY

[claire]

YES!!! My guy has a little fuzzy winter coat...so I don't clip But what a shiny,smooth winter coat he has this year!

I have been asked if I spray him with Showsheen!

[Claudius]

Six months now on 1/2 cup each of black sunflower seeds and flaxseeds once a day.....just clipped my porky-for-the-first-time in his life wb/tb and his bay coat is so dark and full of dapples. What would I need paprika for? Thanks so much for this information....my horse looks amazing!!!!

[Bumpkin]

Why Miss Dog, we want some photographs please!!!

"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies, Mini Horse, Sunnieflax and Horse Boxes Cliques"
"Remember: You're A Customer In A Service Industry."

[srochettee]

where and how much , I can't find it anywhere

[srochettee]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Bumpkin:
Ok bought some Flax today.
10 pounds @.65 per pound made 32 baggies with Black Oil Sunflower Seeds.

1 cup Flax & 1 cup Sunflower Seeds.
Is this okay?

Does this mean I do not need to feed Corn Oil? http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

[ML]

I been using flax seed for over 2 years, love the results. Giving shelled sun flower seeds to my older horse 1/4 a cup per meal. Since he is 27 was worried about not beable to chew and digest the seeds. Swear he will eat any thing but "butte" or applesauce that I feed him.

Save a horse swat a mosquito.

[OLD A/O]

Okay, I have been following this for awhile now and I went out and bought the BOSS and Flax. I am going to give it a try!!!! I just hope they do not get sick but I plan to start it very slowly.

[Bumpkin]

Don't worry A/O, your horses are going to LOVE Sunnieflax.

Remember to give us an update in 3 or 4 weeks. http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies, Mini Horse, Sunnieflax and Horse Boxes Cliques"
"Remember: You're A Customer In A Service Industry."

[OLD A/O]

So far they love the new stuff and I will let you know how they are doing in 3-4 weeks. Thanks!!!

[Claudius]

Bumpkin....sorry, do not have the know how or equipment to send pictures. But, come to Florida for WEF and you will see him!!!

[Bumpkin]

I am starting this over at Ultimate Dressage....

"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies, Mini Horse, Sunnieflax and Horse Boxes Cliques"
"Remember: You're A Customer In A Service Industry."

[OLD A/O]

Results from feeding Sunnieflax for 3.5 weeks. I really can see a big difference. The ones at home look great!! The boys at the stable do not look as good yet but they are about 2 weeks behind the ones at home.

Frankly, I am very pleased.

[Bumpkin]

Elliot moved to a new barn last night, and I have not dropped off his supplements yet, other than his Smartpak.
It will interesting to see what they think of the Sunnieflax mixture.
hehe
http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

"Remember: You're A Customer In A Service Industry."
"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies,and SunnieFlax Cliques"

[slb]

Bumpkin....
Does this mean that you will be converting a whole other barn to the sunnie/flax club!!! http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Proud member of the * Hoof Fetish Clique *

[relocatedTXjumpr]

Ok...I have been tinking about his for a while. Rudy's coat is pretty rough...the lack of care really took a toll on it. I started paprika about 2 weeks ago, he gets 1 tablespoon a day. May I add the sun flower seeds together with the paprika? His winter coat is in, and im not counting on really seeing a huge chance until he starts to shed out...but if you look at his pictures he looks like a dun color..hes supposed to be a dark bay. his hair is course and looks "fried"...although it does look better than it did a month ago!

So...can i add the sun flowers with the paprika with no bad affects?

B & B Sport Horses
Albums updated! New pictures or Rudy and Taylor!

http://community.webshots.com/user/ga_jumpr

Dont put the cart before the horse, unless he knows how to push it of course. ~~ Pat Green

[HFSH]

I just wanted everyone to know I only have 2 on the flax right now, a 6 month colt and his 18 month sister. They both have the shiniest winter coats.

My mares are all fat enough right now, but once the temps truely drop for winter I'll be reintroducing the sunny-flax again.

Any connection between your reality and mine is purely coincidental. | WBNA (http://www.warmbloodbreedersna.com) | MBG SSA! (http://www.breedersgroup.com)

[nhwr]

relocatedTXjumpr,

My guys are on sunnies plus flax plus paprika - works for me! They look dazzling http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

[Bumpkin]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by slb:
Bumpkin....
Does this mean that you will be converting a whole other barn to the sunnie/flax club!!! http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Proud member of the _* Hoof Fetish Clique *_<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Wish us luck http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

"Remember: You're A Customer In A Service Industry."
"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies,and SunnieFlax Cliques"

[SarMoniet]

My two boys have been on BOSS for almost two months now -- You should see Norman's coat! He's blanketed this year so he's staying black, but you should see the high-gloss shine his hair has! http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif Everyone is commenting on it and asking what I'm doing. I know it's not my grooming technique because now that he's blanketed I really only brush him after I ride. He's slick like an eel.

Sar is harder to tell -- He's got about 8" of wooly winter hair at the moment. It will be easier to see a shine on him once he sheds out. The BOSS is definitely helping him keep his weight up, though!

I asked about Flax at my feed store and got a blank look....

Proud member of the draft cross clique!!! Mum to Normandy & Sar.
http://hometown.aol.com/sarmoniet/index.html

[sophie]

Hi guys!
Since my mare is back on her daily ration of sunnies (2 cups) she has gained weight and her coat looks great. I've had people comment on how soft her coat is.
I had stopped the sunnies for a while because of a BIG chipmunk problem, and because I couldn't be sure she was getting the seeds (I board). Now that I can make it to the barn everyday to give them to her, I am starting to notice a change. Yay!
SARMONIET, your name sounds familiar...were you on Agrimall/Horsenet eons ago??

[SarMoniet]

Sophie -- Yes indeedy I did spend a lot of time on Horsenet years ago! http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif That was before UDBB came along (my main hangout now, as evidenced by the insane amount of posts I have over there http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif ).

Is there even still a forum over at Agrimall? I remember that it all fell apart when they took over and the forums never worked right after that... I think that's when I moved on to the USDF forums, which of course no longer exist either. It's nice to have these places (COTH & UDBB) that stick around through the years!

Was this your name back then or did you change it?

Proud member of the draft cross clique!!! Mum to Normandy & Sar.
http://hometown.aol.com/sarmoniet/index.html

[sophie]

[Off Topic: Hi Sar! I have a vague memory of Horsenet. I strated posting on it when I lost my Morgan mare...I think my user name then was Niaru. I think some of the old Horsenet/Agrimall posters are on clipclop.com now. I lurk on too many forums as it is, but this one is one of my favorites for horse health/nutrition!]

I have another question pertaining to this thread: does anyone know the protein level in BOSS?

[Back Yard Quarter Horse]

sophie

I dont recall the exact amount but it is high in protien i think i posted the info on or around page 28 29 of the thread

Happy reading

If you are lucky enough to own a horse you are lucky enough

Thunder 13 year old sorrel / Kiowa 8 year old bay / Dakota 4 year old amber champagne
http://community.webshots.com/user/keith_lori_kids

[sophie]

Thanks Quarter Horse. I did read the whole thread quite a while ago but I had forgotten where that info was...!

Found it on page 29: 14% protein, 25% fat .

The reason I ask is that a question was raised about the 11% protein, 10% fat feed I want to switch my mare to being too low in protein... but I figure with the 2 cups sunnies and the hoof supplement I already give her (20% protein per serving), her protein intake should be ok, as she's not in heavy work.

Ack this nutrition thing is mind boggling.

[relocatedTXjumpr]

Ok...you guys talked me into it! I went to WalMart and got a 50 pound bag. Now, how about giving me a good amount to start them on...and to work them up to. Whats a good regimine to start?

B & B Sport Horses
Albums updated! New pictures or Rudy and Taylor!

http://community.webshots.com/user/ga_jumpr

Dont put the cart before the horse, unless he knows how to push it of course. ~~ Pat Green

[baileygreyhorse]

I started mine with about 1/2 cup and worked two up to a full cup. The fattest fatso only gets 1/2 still. All three are QH types and now that it's winter they are all in very light work.

Founder of the Packrats Anonymous Clique
Proud Member of the Dirty Grey Horse Clique
http://community.webshots.com/user/pnekman

[Bumpkin]

I need to Bumpkin this up for a fellow BBer who is considering changing over to BOSS and Sunnieflax..... http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

"Remember: You're A Customer In A Service Industry."
"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies,and SunnieFlax Cliques"

[Back Yard Quarter Horse]

this needed to get bumpkined

If you are lucky enough to own a horse you are lucky enough

Thunder 13 year old sorrel / Kiowa 8 year old bay / Dakota 4 year old amber champagne
http://community.webshots.com/user/keith_lori_kids

[Wayward Wind~]

Okay, after watching this thread for more than a year ( I know I am a little slow to catch on )I started my beasties in the SunnieFlax mixture. My hubby says he thinks I am nuts for feeding them bird food, but he is such a dear and does it anyway. I wanted to only put three on it to begin with so I could compare them to the others. But when we was feeding a couple of nights ago hubby was dishing the sunnies out to all of them. http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
My son rides a 23 yr old Molly mule and all he talks about is how shiny she is going to be on her sunflower and flax seeds.
So my whole family has been convinced. I even have my mom trying them. She has 2 OLD horses on them, a 33 yr. old and a 25+ yr. old.
Thank you for the advice and I will keep you updated on my brood. As I read SEVERAL pages back my pasture this spring will have a good crop of flowers if the chickens don't get all the seeds.

Thanks again,
WW~

[OhioColleen]

I can't let something this good die... http://chronicleforums.com/images/custom_smilies/lol.gif

I have been feeding BOSS for probably 6 months. I didn't really notice a difference.

I added flax as well about a month ago, and NOW I can really see a difference in her coat. She is a giant, rotund, glossy creature. Now that I'm riding her everyday I'm hoping the rotund part will go away, and just leave her large and lovely.

I also wanted to ask if anyone else that boards has had to deal with the "Questions" that others have? The BO has been gently trying to get me to stop my silly supplements. Today he told me that there is "absolutely no nutritional value to sunflower seeds". http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif I just printed out 3 different pages from websites that offer differing opinions. I'll give them to him tomorrow... http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

To you, she's a horse. To me, she's a family member who is big, hairy, walks on all fours and is easily startled.
~Colleen

[CTM]

OhioCollen,

My BO rolls her eyes at all my supplements too, but half the horses in the barn have taken up BOSS after I started feeding them. I just politely ignore any comments and go about my business.

[FairWeather]

The proof is in the puddin' as they say http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

My little experiment (http://www.fairweather-farm.com/randompics/winniecompare.jpg)
I took these pics before and after 10 days of using sunnies http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

[relocatedTXjumpr]

Ok, I have been feeding just the BOSS for a few months. Didnt really notice a change. I bought a 50 pound bag of the ground flax seed and started it about 2 weeks ago. I cant say that I have noticed a difference yet...but its been so muddy here and cold that I dont know if I would. Rudy's coat was bad when he came, and its better, but still rough looking...maybe its just his color. Taylor is a little mud ball, it seems I spend an hour to get the mud off of her, still dusty afterward of course...then she goes right back and lays in it!
It might be the summer before I notice anything!

Ive read the thread and another one about this...one says to buy the whole and feed them whole, another says to grind them because the horses just pass them otherwise. I bought ground and feed a half up a day. After spending $30 on the bag, im not about to just chunk it and go buy whole..with the winter cold and the wet weather, will it keep? I have it stored, still in the bag, in a trash can.
How much SHOULD I be feeding?

HELP!

B & B Sport Horses at Second Chance Farms

Member of the Paint Hunter Clique

http://community.webshots.com/user/ga_jumpr
Dont put the cart before the horse, unless he knows how to push it of course. ~~ Pat Green

[hansiska]

http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_redface.gif &lt;hanging head in shame, because I know I should know this by now...&gt;

&lt;...and because I'm too lazy to read this whole thread!&gt; http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

Is it ok to feed BOSS without flax seed? Is there some sort of chemical/nutrient reason for feeding them together, or do people just get good results using them both?

&lt;crawling back under my rock now&gt; http://chronicleforums.com/images/custom_smilies/uhoh.gif

[SarMoniet]

Some people think that the Flax gives better results. There is no reason (medically) that you cannot feed sunnies alone. I do. None of the feed stores in this area seem to be familiar with flaxseed and I'm too lazy to order it. Mine are doing just fine with the sunflower seeds.

Proud member of the draft cross clique!!! Mum to Normandy & Sar.
http://hometown.aol.com/sarmoniet/index.html

[Bumpkin]

..... Any news on how the Horses are looking yet?

Now that Elliot is at a new barn, his Sunnies are in a garbage can, and they feed him that way, nice to get away from bagging those also.

Still feeding the www.horsetech.com (http://www.horsetech.com) TriFlex with Flax though. http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

"Remember: You're A Customer In A Service Industry."
"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies,and SunnieFlax Cliques"

[slb]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by relocatedTXjumpr:
Ive read the thread and another one about this...one says to buy the whole and feed them whole, another says to grind them because the horses just pass them otherwise. I bought ground and feed a half up a day. After spending $30 on the bag, im not about to just chunk it and go buy whole..with the winter cold and the wet weather, will it keep? I have it stored, still in the bag, in a trash can.
How much SHOULD I be feeding?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

If it is not stabilized, then it will not last long. It should be stored in a freezer, however, in the winter cold, it should be ok for a couple of weeks. For the price you paid, I am guessing tht you got stabilized...that will last about six months. If it gets rancid, it will smell fishy.

Flax can affect thyroid, so the recommended amount is 2-4 oz/day. That is about 1/2 - 1 cup/day (either whole or ground).

Proud member of the * Hoof Fetish Clique *

[sophie]

I feed just the sunnies (about 3 cups a day) and I get comments on the softness of my mare's coat. SHe is shedding very well, and the coat underneath is very shiny, even tho I don't use a lot of elbow grease on her and she's turned out half the day.
I feed the sunnies myself, at lunch time. I haven't had a lot of questions because I don't think many people know my mare is on them, since she eats every single one of them, and the sunnies are stashed away in a metal garbage can in the feed room http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

[AilleXWest]

Flax can affect thyroid, so the recommended amount is 2-4 oz/day. That is about 1/2 - 1 cup/day (either whole or ground).

Proud member of the _* Hoof Fetish Clique *_[/QUOTE]

How can it affect the thyroid. Both of my horses have thyrid proublems so I do not wont to mess them up more. Dose BOSS do anything to the thyroid I just started it tonight and relly would like to keep doing it but not if it can mess then up.

AilleXWest

[Kellie in OR]

My boys have been on the sunnyflax for about 9 months now. They all have thick & soft winter coats. The hair is shorter but denser than years past and they seem to repel dirt and water better than ever. I did a clinic in December and in the arena lights my guy just glowed. This is with NO bath & NO coat spray or anything just straight from the muddy field then a good brushing . I had 4 people ask what I was doing to make him shine so much. When I told them they looked at me like I'd lost my mind. LOL!

I'm feeding 1 cup of BOSS, 1/2 cup of flax & 1 cup Omelene 200 2 X per day along with their Vit E and Selenium.

They are shedding already! YaHooooo!!!!!

Riding Tennessee Walkers in the Wet Valley of Oregon.

[zygotica]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>How can it affect the thyroid. Both of my horses have thyroid problems so I do not wont to mess them up more. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

From the Omega Fields FAQ (http://www.omegafields.com):
Is the relationship between the supposed suppression of thyroid function and cyanogenic glycosides in flax a valid concern in supplementing a 1,200 pound horse with 1/2 cup ground flax seed (Omega Horseshine) per day?

Flax contains cyanogenic glycosides. Under extreme conditions (pH1 or less), cyanide can be produced – but has never been reported to happen in mammals. Instead, cyanate is produced which is non-toxic. The US FDA did a study in which they fed 10, 20, and 40% of the diet as flax and found no harmful effects of any sort.

Within the context of everything else a 1200 pound horse would be eating, there is very little likelihood 1/2 cup of ground flax seed will have any significant effect on thyroid function. Even less likely if the diet is properly fortified with selenium, which is required to detoxify the antithyroid factors. Frankly, if suppression from a dietary factor is suggested, you should be much more suspicious of soy

If you are still concerned, would simply suggest that you monitor thyroid function tests before starting and six weeks after starting, with no other dietary or management changes in between.

[Bumpkin]

http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

"Remember: You're A Customer In A Service Industry."
"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies,and SunnieFlax Cliques"

[AilleXWest]

Thank you. I think I will jsut stick with the BOSS for now ans see how they look in a few weeks.

So far they are eating it right up so I hope this will work. Thanks for giving me something new to try.

AilleXWest

[Bumpkin]

Here is a photo of Elliot, unshaved, with his Sunnieflax winter coat.

"Remember: You're A Customer In A Service Industry."
"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies,and SunnieFlax Cliques"

[Applesauce]

Can ya'll believe this thread is almost 2 years old???

*A fool and his money are soon partying!*

[in_the_zone]

Bought my first bag of sunnies. YUM! I didn't even get a funny look from my trainer when I proposed the idea. She simply said "Bird seed?"

http://chronicleforums.com/images/custom_smilies/lol.gif

Well, it seems I ran out of honey. Have some vinegar!

[Weebonilass]

I really should add flax to my guy's BOSS, but he's doing really well on just the BOSS. Everyone at the barn remarks on how pretty his coat is... but so far I haven't convinced anyone to add it to theirs.

[paintgirl]

Bought sunnies and paprika today! My husband thinks I am a wacko! All 3 horses ate it readily-will be interesting to see how their hair coats look a month from now!

[LuckyMe]

I've been watching this thread for a LONG time too, but I guess I'm also one of the ones that's a bit slow to catch on.... Bumpkin, Elliot's winter coat looks SO soft and LOVELY!

The BM at the barn where I keep my mare is always skeptical of supplements, and thinks we're nuts to be feeding them. Half the time I wasn't sure they were actually making it to her feed bucket.

Anyway, my mare is coming off of treatment for EPM and I've been mixing up baggies of Vitamin E and probiotics to go in her morning feed. Thankfully the BM has been good about feeding them, cause she knows how sick she was all winter. I'm thinking of tossing some Sunnies in there once we're done with all the antibiotics-- don't want to put too much into her system at once. She's always had a great, shiney coat and I groom her a ton, but with the EPM affecting her system her coat has gotten a bit dull and it doesn't have its usual sheen. Maybe the Sunnies will brighten it up a bit.

[vxf111]

I am a sunniflax convert! It's official!!!

See the results so far... (http://www.angelfire.com/home/vxf111/supps.html)

~Veronica

"The Son Dee Times"
"Sustained"

[PURPLE~TB!]

http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif YIPPI! My really picky gelding is eating his BOSS!!!!! He loves in fact!!!!! Thank goodness. I finally found something he will eat!!! Haven't added the flax yet, I wanted to mah=ke sure he would eat the BOSS first. I will add that the next time I head to the grain store!!!! So now I have another question about the BOSS/flax. Can you feed this to a pregnant mare? She is on Omolene 200 and mare plus right now. Just want to make sure before I tried it with her!!!! OH! By the way, the people at the grain store think I am losing my mind!!!!!!! http://chronicleforums.com/images/custom_smilies/lol.gif

[iamfcygrl]

If you haven't tried Premium Black oil Sunflower seeds you should! It puts such a shine on the horses coat, not only that but it is great in clearing the stomach, so you won't have too many worries on Colic, I am serious, I used to have a really colicy older mare and a friend told me to trie this. I did and now I have no problems with colic.
It is great! TRY IT! http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

[Bumpkin]

Now that we are moving barns, I hope that the new barn will feed it to Elliot straight from the garbage can I provided to store it in, rather than having to baggie up again... haha

"Remember: You're A Customer In A Service Industry."
"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies,and SunnieFlax Cliques"

[payok]

After repeatedly reading threads on Sunnieflax, I broke down and began my OTTB on it about a month ago. The first benefit was that my slow picking eater can't get enough of the BOSS - he really seems to like it. And his coat - its gorgeous. It has a wonderful different feeling than it did before, and shines like crazy. I can't wait until he finishes shedding out so I can see what he looks like underneath! He is on Bioflax (Horsetech) and I worked him up to a cup of BOSS a day.

[Montanas_Girl]

Add me to the Sunnieflax clique! I even convinced my BO to give it a try after I emailed her a link to this thread. Montana and her two show horses started on 1/2 cup of BOSS and 1/2 cup whole flaxseed last week. I would like to have him on a cup of each eventually, but so far he seems to like it. I'm still waiting on the results, though. Since I only see him on the weekends right now, the results should be pretty easy to see once they start.

"This time, like all times, is a very good one, if we but know what to do with it." - Ralph Waldo Emerson

[Lord Helpus]

I was also able to get Equijewel as recommended by someone on P1 of this thread. Fortunately, my feed mill makes it. They are partners with KER -- Kentucky Equine Research -- who created the formula.

So, tonight, we do away with oil and move on to 50 lbs of Equijewel. It can't work any less well than the oil.

We shall see if I am smarter than George.....

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

SIGH... I tried to block my P-I-N number for my bank acct from being uploaded. Instead, I seem to have blocked the letters P,I,N. So, anytime you see *** put in p-i-n until further notice. SIGH...

[LMH]

LH rice bran is a good start-just keep in mind it is 20% fat vs. oil at 100% fat. It also has some added starches and sugars that oil does not.

When you find yourself on the edge of a cliff, a step backward is progress

[fisher4]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Marimee:
I have a 23 year old TB gelding My old guy can't digest oats and corn, never could. They both come out in the same form that they went in. Does anyone think that he would have similar problems with sunnies? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


I have 2 older (30+ yo) horses. Both are on Blue Seal Haystetcher and a Senior feed. I give both BOSS twice a day. (planning to add flax now that I've read this thread) Haven't seen any problems with the 30+ mare who's been getting sunnies (1 1/2c twice a day) for over 6 months. The gelding (30 in May) that came in Feb just started on them. He's getting 1/2 c twice a day now. Not noticed problems with them "coming out as they went in".

Also feed them to my 9yo gelding and 22 yo mare. All my horses (and llama and donk) love them.

With my 30+ mare, she was drastically underweight when she came and her coat was in horrible shape from being malnurished. Now her coat is incredibly soft and looking much better, esp since starting the sunnies.

Starting all of mine on flax this weekend.

[Bumpkin]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Lord Helpus:
I was also able to get Equijewel as recommended by someone on P1 of this thread. Fortunately, my feed mill makes it. They are partners with KER -- Kentucky Equine Research -- who created the formula.

So, tonight, we do away with oil and move on to 50 lbs of Equijewel. It can't work any less well than the oil.

We shall see if I am smarter than George.....

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

SIGH... I tried to block my P-I-N number for my bank acct from being uploaded. Instead, I seem to have blocked the letters P,I,N. So, anytime you see *** put in p-i-n until further notice. SIGH...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

"Remember: You're A Customer In A Service Industry."
"Proud Member Of The I Love Dublin, Starman Babies,and SunnieFlax Cliques"

[Pocket Pony]

Miles loves his BOSS!

He had a horrible winter clip job when I bought him, and he started growing in wiry "piggy hairs". I wasn't sure how his spring coat would grow in and I didn't think it would be very pretty. But he has the most gorgeous dark liver chestnut coat. You can see some pictures of him by clicking on his name in my sig line. I need to get more recent pictures - he's darkened in the few weeks since those were taken!

Check out Miles (http://community.webshots.com/album/106154542OSmOQC?813), the real Pocket Pony!

[Bumpkin]

My friend's private barn, where Elliot has been the past few weeks has now started feeding the other two horses BOSS.
She told me last weekend she has noticed the baby Sunflower plants are starting to peek up around the pasture.
http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

[Bumpkin]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Pocket Pony:
Miles loves his BOSS!

He had a horrible winter clip job when I bought him, and he started growing in wiry "piggy hairs". I wasn't sure how his spring coat would grow in and I didn't think it would be very pretty. But he has the most gorgeous dark liver chestnut coat. You can see some pictures of him by clicking on his name in my sig line. I need to get more recent pictures - he's darkened in the few weeks since those were taken!

Check out http://community.webshots.com/album/106154542OSmOQC?813, the real Pocket Pony!

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Great to hear.
How is the new home? Are Mile's and the Dog's happy?

[Speedy Alice]

I've been reading this thread (!) to try to find out more info on BOSS vs white-striped sunflower seeds. I thought I'd read somewhere that the white striped seeds were bad to feed to horses - toxic? In any case, I've only read of BOSS being fed.

Anyway, in the Aug 2003 Horse Journal, an article on feeding sunflower seeds states "...only choose the large, striped seeds. Avoid the small, black, high-oil sunflower seeds, which the horse may not chew as well as the striped seeds."

Another article in the May 2004 Horse Journal re-states the "do not use BOSS" due to the horse not chewing them as well as the larger ones, and also because the regulations for the small seeds (not intended for human consumption) are not as stringent as they are for the striped seeds and therefore pesticides, fungicides, etc. might be on the smaller seeds.

Anyone know anything about this - either a toxicity with the white-striped seeds or not feeding the BOSS because they're harder to chew? (PS I've been feeding BOSS and flaxseed for one month - horse loves them, coat looks great http://chronicleforums.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif )

[hoopoe]

There are web sites for sunflower seeds and growing ( industrial)

BO sunflowers meet the same stringent growth regulation as striped.

They are used for human consumption in oil production as well as feed additives for livestock. Your average hay feed and fruit and veg crop has pesticides and fungicides. The BO producers know some of their crop is going to feed some of the most delicate and protected of natures creatures; the birds.

The Horse Journal makes some odd pronouncements at times, I have never been overly impressed with them. I find it hard to fathom the concern over the horse "chewing" an item as small as a sun flower seed, BO or striped. Their relative size difference ( to each other)is negligible. This is particularly true when compared with the size of the fiber and length of typical hay.

Will not even mention the granule size of BO when compared to conventional pellets COB or other "grain" product. Horses and other grazers are not good chewers by their nature. Some species have special adaptations ( rumination and others) horses, not so much. Roughage is an important aspect of horse digestion. Choak can happen with hay or "grain" product.

I feed 1 to 2 cups of BO a day and have very little waste seed in the manure. My horse produced 3 flowers in his paddock this season. He ate them.