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Velvet
Oct. 3, 2011, 02:37 PM
So, I'm at a tack store the other day and I finally drop my backside in the "new" Wintec Pro design.

Used to be that the Pro was the one with a narrow twist and the Isabell was the one with the wide twist. It gave riders options.

I recall meeting a rep once and they said that the Isabell could fit EVERYONE. I should have heeded that warning. They think once size fits all shapes.

I'm now officially running away from all things Wintec and Bates. I plunked in that thing and it was WIDER than the Isabell! Felt like my hips were going to pop out at the joint. I've never had a saddle that I couldn't at least sit in for a few minutes, let alone endure riding in it to help a student with their horse. I dropped in it and immediately hopped off in pain.

Why do they think the world is now only filled with riders who need a wide twist? Why did they abandon the rest of us who need a narrow twist?

Oh well...back to Passier and Stubben, among others. There are more options out there. I just enjoyed having the Wintecs for breaking young horses and not having to do a lot of tack cleaning or worry if the saddle was in a more humid environment.

I'm done. So long Wintec! (I wonder how many otheres there really are that are also disappointed and running away.)

Miichelle
Oct. 3, 2011, 03:12 PM
Well so much for "up grading" to the new Pro. I hate the Isabella. I like my Pro but wanted to get one with the big flexiblock knee rolls.

Velvet
Oct. 3, 2011, 04:35 PM
Well so much for "up grading" to the new Pro. I hate the Isabella. I like my Pro but wanted to get one with the big flexiblock knee rolls.

Yep. Runaway! Runaway!

TheHorseProblem
Oct. 3, 2011, 04:40 PM
"Wintec Officially Sucks"

What are you, 12?

Velvet
Oct. 3, 2011, 04:59 PM
"Wintec Officially Sucks"

What are you, 12?

:yes: I hopped in Mr Peabody's Way Back Machine the other day. :lol:

netg
Oct. 3, 2011, 07:27 PM
I swear the snarkiness on this thread is NOT just in my inner ear.

I think it's a good heads-up to receive. I've discovered I do better with a narrower twist, and were the "new" Stubben not working, Wintec would be a brand I would try. Now I know not to bother, at least with any brand new ones.

So thanks for sharing, V!

CHT
Oct. 3, 2011, 07:34 PM
I ride two new Wintec Pro on two different horses; one is the smooth material and the other has the fake suede. I like them both and find them both to allow my legs to hang nicely and i have narrow hips, and one of the horses is WIDE. I prefer them to my older Wintec Pro that I have since sold.

In fact we chose the Wintec Pro because it was so narrow in the twist as the owner's are older and have stiffer hips.

Melissa.Van Doren
Oct. 3, 2011, 07:43 PM
I agree the NEW Wintec Pro has a wide twist, and is now wider in the twist than the NEW Wintec Isabell. It's not for everyone, but it's still a well-made saddle for the price and will work for plenty of folks who prefer that build. And even though it will never break in like a leather saddle, it does "relax" in the twist somewhat with use.

dwblover
Oct. 3, 2011, 08:40 PM
I loved my new Wintec Pro. I had to sell it since the panels are for a flat-backed horse unlike the older Pros. But the saddle itself was nice. It does have a wider twist but I would not say that Wintec sucks now because of that.

Miichelle
Oct. 3, 2011, 08:44 PM
My old Pro (BTW only the "Pros" are the fake suede) fits my wide Arab/Percheron about as well as any off the rack saddle is going to. I used it on my Appy with a narrower gullet when I first got it & I like how it fits ME better with the wide gullet.

Petstorejunkie
Oct. 3, 2011, 09:28 PM
Hater of wintec since day 1.
I semi hate my bates isabell but my resale horse likes it... so I tolerate it.

Beentheredonethat
Oct. 3, 2011, 10:26 PM
I love Wintec. I've had Pros from way back, and have a "new" one a few years old. They're one of the few saddles I can afford and fit all horses. They were the only thing I found to fit TB type withers. I haven't tried the others and don't have the money to try expensive "good" saddles, so maybe I'm clueless, but they've always done well for me.

PS--They've not made any horses sore, from narrow, high withered type to wide now withers, and I've ridden in them from training through GP, so I'm pretty dressage specific, not general. I've never had a "hard time" riding in them.

LEL
Oct. 3, 2011, 10:33 PM
I love Wintec, too. I've had a Wintec2000 for over ten years. It's still going strong. I just purchased the Wintec pro dressage with contourblocs a few years ago. It's another winner. Both fit my horse and fit me. Not only that, but the company is amazing to work with (see my old thread about the damaged pro.)

I wouldn't say the entire company "sucks" just because the saddle doesn't suit you.

Dressage_Diva333
Oct. 3, 2011, 11:53 PM
I also am anti-Wintec. I tried to like them, I really did. They are cheap and versatile. I had a hard time riding in them, and more times than not, even when the saddle looked like it was a very good fit, I had a sore horse...

I've ridden in several different models of the Dressage saddles, and the AP/jumping saddles. I just couldn't do it.

GonnaFlyNow
Oct. 4, 2011, 12:54 AM
I bought the new Pro because I liked the older model so much, thinking the new features could only make the saddle better ... and ended up sending it back and buying the old model on clearance. Not only did the new Pro feel weird to me, but it seemed like a really weird fit for the horses, too. I was really, really disappointed with the new model :no: But I'm glad I snatched up one of the old ones; it's a decent saddle for the price!

luchiamae
Oct. 4, 2011, 03:56 AM
I have never liked Bates and I HATE the new Isabel Werth saddle. It's horrible! The CAIR system bounces you back out of the saddle when you try to sit the trot, the saddle is hugely wide and to top it all off it is bloody ugly.

Not my saddle.

kande04
Oct. 4, 2011, 05:40 AM
Well so much for "up grading" to the new Pro. I hate the Isabella. I like my Pro but wanted to get one with the big flexiblock knee rolls.

I just did that but haven't gotten it yet. Don't know if it'll work because I ordered a 17" and the pro I have is a 17.5", but the 17.5" seemed like there was too much room in the seat so I decided to try the 17.

What I'm looking forward to trying is the bigger thigh blocks, as I've never ridden in a saddle with big thigh blocks before.

Miichelle
Oct. 4, 2011, 06:18 AM
My older Pro has reasonably flat panels that with a wide gullet fit my draft cross (& myself) well. Do the older (when they first came out) saddles with the contourblocks fit (both horse & rider) the same?

WBLover
Oct. 4, 2011, 08:49 AM
Forget about how it fits the rider--how about the horse? YUCK! Unless you have a horse with a completely FLAT back (front to back), those awful gussets in the panels DIG into their loins! The seams of the gussets are HARD AS A ROCK. I wouldn't even sit on it with it on my horse, I truly was afraid he'd buck me to the moon!

Velvet
Oct. 4, 2011, 10:23 AM
I love Wintec. I've had Pros from way back, and have a "new" one a few years old. They're one of the few saddles I can afford and fit all horses. They were the only thing I found to fit TB type withers. I haven't tried the others and don't have the money to try expensive "good" saddles, so maybe I'm clueless, but they've always done well for me.

PS--They've not made any horses sore, from narrow, high withered type to wide now withers, and I've ridden in them from training through GP, so I'm pretty dressage specific, not general. I've never had a "hard time" riding in them.

Yep, I like the old ones too. The new design changes from last year are what now make Wintec suck--and only because they no longer offer the old option that worked for so many of us and our horses! They've gone for the wide only and that sucks. :yes:

Velvet
Oct. 4, 2011, 10:25 AM
Forget about how it fits the rider--how about the horse? YUCK! Unless you have a horse with a completely FLAT back (front to back), those awful gussets in the panels DIG into their loins! The seams of the gussets are HARD AS A ROCK. I wouldn't even sit on it with it on my horse, I truly was afraid he'd buck me to the moon!

I missed that. I didn't look at any of the other changes. I noted the giant blocks (which I loath) and the wider seat (as I've noted), but didn't see that change. I'll have to go back and look at that.

The introduction of the CAIR panels on jumping saddles was okay. Not so much on dressage saddles. Guess that was the beginning of the end. ;)

Sparkybella
Oct. 4, 2011, 11:34 AM
The whole Wintec thing is pretty funny. I had one around 2001 and hated it. Swore I'd never buy one again.

This spring I was fitting a straight-backed warmblood with a big wither. Of all the saddles we tried on him (including Hennig, Albion, and Passier), he LOVED the Wintec. I couldn't believe it.

So, now I'm in a new Wintec Pro, and I have to say, I am impressed. I like the seat position it gives me, my legs fall in the correct position. Horse is happy. I like the fact I can get it soaking wet and it's not big deal. I then bought the Pro AP for trail rides, and it's the most comfortable saddle ever.

But, sometimes horses put you in saddles you would never expect to ride in. And I can't believe I like it as much as I do! Weird!

monstrpony
Oct. 4, 2011, 11:39 AM
So who died and put you in charge of deciding that the new Pro won't work for anyone? I got a flocked one, had it reflocked to fit my horse's back. It works well for me, as well. But I'm required to hate it just because you say so? Don't think so.

pryme_thyme
Oct. 4, 2011, 11:44 AM
I swear the snarkiness on this thread is NOT just in my inner ear.

I think it's a good heads-up to receive. I've discovered I do better with a narrower twist, and were the "new" Stubben not working, Wintec would be a brand I would try. Now I know not to bother, at least with any brand new ones.

So thanks for sharing, V!

Agreed!!!
I always love horse people. :D

Velvet
Oct. 4, 2011, 11:52 AM
So who died and put you in charge of deciding that the new Pro won't work for anyone? I got a flocked one, had it reflocked to fit my horse's back. It works well for me, as well. But I'm required to hate it just because you say so? Don't think so.

Who said YOU had to hate it or everyone did? I only dislike that they took away any options for those who need a narrow twist. That's why they suck. They don't have anything for anyone who likes a narrow twist. Now BOTH the Isabell and Pro are wide and extra wide in the twist. They stopped selling the narrow twist Pro, so I think they suck. That was the gist of my OP.

TheHorseProblem
Oct. 4, 2011, 12:22 PM
Who said YOU had to hate it or everyone did? I only dislike that they took away any options for those who need a narrow twist. That's why they suck. They don't have anything for anyone who likes a narrow twist. Now BOTH the Isabell and Pro are wide and extra wide in the twist. They stopped selling the narrow twist Pro, so I think they suck. That was the gist of my OP.

You know, like them or not, this company makes a product that suits some people, doesn't suit others. So what? It didn't fit your ass, so you go online and basically smear them? Are they out to cheat people? Does Wintec deserve such inflammatory language aimed at them?

Potential saddle buyers are going to do a search and see WINTEC SUCKS. Is that responsible?

Or are you just bored again?

Wellspotted
Oct. 4, 2011, 12:35 PM
Trolls are easily bored. ;)

I like a wide twist myself. I am not however built for an Isabell. I have only ridden in a Pro once. I found it very comfortable.

About half the dressage riders I know ride in the Isabell. The other half can afford Bates saddles--what they actually ride in, I don't know. Depends on their horses' conformation mostly, I think, e.g., Passier for a cutback.

Were I on the lookout for a new dressage saddle I would try the new Pro (if I could find one locally to try) and also look for a used older model.

I would not run away from Wintec--unless it were one of their westerns, and even those may have improved (hope so).

Velvet
Oct. 4, 2011, 12:55 PM
You know, like them or not, this company makes a product that suits some people, doesn't suit others. So what? It didn't fit your ass, so you go online and basically smear them? Are they out to cheat people? Does Wintec deserve such inflammatory language aimed at them?

Potential saddle buyers are going to do a search and see WINTEC SUCKS. Is that responsible?

Or are you just bored again?

*shrug* Wintec does suck for changing their saddle design and dropping those of us who bought their saddles with a narrow twist.

My opinion. I'm entitled to it. Just as you are entitled to yours. Using the term "suck" fit best. :yes: When you're frustrated and disappointed, it "sucks."

monstrpony
Oct. 4, 2011, 01:03 PM
If it doesn't work for you, you say you're disappointed that they changed it and you won't be able to use the new one. You don't condemn the whole company just because you're unhappy.

BTW, did you sit in the new Isabell before issuing your blanket condemnation? I'd heard it has a narrower twist than the old one.

Alexie
Oct. 4, 2011, 01:08 PM
are monstr pony and the horse problem indulging in a spot of team work here?

so i think stubbens suck, who cares?

Alexie
Oct. 4, 2011, 01:09 PM
ps i bet stubben don't give a flying hoot, i'd wager my last pound that they haven't even heard of me ;)

Velvet
Oct. 4, 2011, 01:13 PM
ps i bet stubben don't give a flying hoot, i'd wager my last pound that they haven't even heard of me ;)

:lol: :lol:

If they did, they'd probably be groveling at your feet and throwing big checks your way to convince you to say otherwise. :eek:

Equibrit
Oct. 4, 2011, 01:19 PM
What do you expect for $1.98. It would probably suit wide folks like me. I don't think I'd ever go there though.

WBLover
Oct. 4, 2011, 04:36 PM
Wow people, if you like Wintec's, don't read a thread that says they suck! End of story!

Sure, not every saddle fits every horse, but it was just a big red flag to me at how rock hard that gusset seam is, and it could really hurt a horse with a curvier back. And Velvet is disappointed that they changed the twist on the saddles.

Really, just giving some opinions about tack is certainly not new on this board, nor disallowed last time I checked!

Arizona DQ
Oct. 4, 2011, 05:04 PM
I love my Wintec Pro. I had an older one and then I tried the new one with the Contour Blocs. I cannot believe how much it has helped my position! It is perfect for me!!! It fits my horse to a tee as well. (My passier is just sitting around collecting dust - sigh).

I tried the Isabella and felt too locked in.

It is great that we all have so many different saddles to choose from....:winkgrin:

katarine
Oct. 4, 2011, 06:04 PM
Perfectly happy in my Wintec dressage saddle. Had it flocked, life is good, horse is happy.

Miichelle
Oct. 4, 2011, 06:37 PM
Perfectly happy in my Wintec dressage saddle. Had it flocked, life is good, horse is happy. Where can you get a saddle flocked (NOT in Idaho, that's for sure!)? And what did it cost? THANKS! :)

katarine
Oct. 4, 2011, 06:39 PM
My saddle fitter did it, cost about 150 that included a farm call to evaluate the fit.

Heinz 57
Oct. 4, 2011, 06:49 PM
I call troll.

:lol: I never thought I'd see the day when someone called VELVET a troll. :lol: At least not by it's generally accepted definition on COTH.

It has been approximately 13 years since I sat in a Wintec, and that was one of the first ones!

TheHorseProblem
Oct. 4, 2011, 09:59 PM
:lol: I never thought I'd see the day when someone called VELVET a troll. :lol: At least not by it's generally accepted definition on COTH.


You are correct! We need a new term for someone who enjoys provoking. Trollette? :D

HenryisBlaisin'
Oct. 5, 2011, 12:09 AM
I love my old Wintec AP and have a newer Wintec Western that's ok for Western. They're great for trail riding and fits my horse well. I haven't tried the new ones, but not every saddle is for every person. Just because a saddle doesn't work for some people doesn't mean it sucks. It might suck FOR YOU, but that doesn't mean it sucks in general.

Incidentally, I opened the thread to see if it was something about the company or its service that was a problem that I hadn't heard about with them. Glad to see it's just a rider complaining that the saddle doesn't fit them personally.

dragonharte8
Oct. 5, 2011, 12:20 AM
Glad to see it's just a rider complaining that the saddle doesn't fit them personally.

FYI
In my business I have seen several clients who own Wintec dressage saddles and whom have changed the gullet and still the saddles 'really' did not fit their horses. Two of my clients removed the knee rolls and removed the paneling up to just under the tree points. These changes helped both horse and rider.
The saddles are a good production saddle, however, rider and horse combination fit is not by any means perfect.

monstrpony
Oct. 5, 2011, 08:34 AM
You are correct! We need a new term for someone who enjoys provoking. Trollette? :D

Nah, she's just in SLC withdrawal.

Velvet
Oct. 5, 2011, 12:35 PM
:lol: I never thought I'd see the day when someone called VELVET a troll. :lol: At least not by it's generally accepted definition on COTH.


:D :D

Velvet
Oct. 5, 2011, 12:36 PM
Incidentally, I opened the thread to see if it was something about the company or its service that was a problem that I hadn't heard about with them. Glad to see it's just a rider complaining that the saddle doesn't fit them personally.

Actually, I'm complaining about the fact that they changed their dressage Pro design and decided to stop making dressage saddles for those who like a narrow twist. :yes:

Heinz 57
Oct. 5, 2011, 12:38 PM
Considering it was a post by you, my dear, that brought me here way back when (ten years ago...) I figured it was worth noting. As I recall, it was about scallop braids.

I ran across a post by SLC in re-reading the 'greatest of COTH' thread on Off Course, and, well...

I do not miss her.

Velvet
Oct. 5, 2011, 02:54 PM
Considering it was a post by you, my dear, that brought me here way back when (ten years ago...) I figured it was worth noting. As I recall, it was about scallop braids.

I ran across a post by SLC in re-reading the 'greatest of COTH' thread on Off Course, and, well...

I do not miss her.

Oh man, that takes me back! I've taught a few people how to make scallop braids. Even did it WAY back on the old CDS board. :D

I do like looking at those classic threads. I'm glad they've kept a lot of them. I'd forgotten the "nevermind" thread. That one was hysterical! It was an accident to start and a very interesting thread filled with a lot of good old COTH humor. :yes:

hrsmstr
Oct. 5, 2011, 08:42 PM
During my saddle hunt, I tried a Wintec. I liked the idea of how easy they are to care for, but I could feel the buckles of the leathers, so much so that they put bruises on my thighs.

Otherwise, I can't imagine slamming a company for one bad experience.

Miichelle, go to Paula Helm's website

http://www.helmsaddles.com

Paula is a certified saddle fitter and re-flocks them on site. She's based in Redmond, WA, but I know she goes to Idaho quite often, she just had a clinic in Boise, I believe. Give her a call or an email. Paula is great to work with and will do your saddle right.

netg
Oct. 6, 2011, 01:55 AM
It was hyperbole.

The hyperbole was used to emphasize one individual's displeasure with a choice made by a company, not to claim that the company uses child labor and steals meals from the poor.

The hyperbole was followed by an explanation of exactly what caused displeasure.

To me, it was an informative post which gave me useful information, and had an amusing exaggeration in it as well. No one is going to read the OP and believe that the company sucks from it, unless they believe moving to wider twists makes a company sucks. They are instead more likely to agree that it was a poor decision, or be glad because they use wider twist saddles.